Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

[Dog Doc]

This may be stupid question but figured I would ask. I have done a full load development with Varget and Sierra 175gr. HPBT bullets. I settled on what everybody already said was a great load: 44gr of Varget. I also did OAL testing and settled with 2.800-2.810, as this seemed the most accurate in my rifle(REM 700AAC).
I am happy with the load but was wondering. If I want to try the Hornady's, is it recommended to start over from the beginning(load low to high, OCW or ladder)?
I am assuming the answer will be to start from scratch but thought I would ask anyway.

 

[avidflyer]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

a lot of people use either one with the same load. I use 44.3 grns of varget over a 178 amax and get around 2700 fps. never chrono'd the 175's but should be about the same. you might notice a slight change in zero but they should be fine.

 

[sandwarrior]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

No, I would drop a couple grains and work up from there. There probably won't much if any difference in the amount of powder you find works best.

If it was a bullet of 15 or more grains difference, then I'd say start over. But, this one is so close it won't matter for pressures.

I do say work up, so that you can find the accuracy nodes. Varget runs way higher for max pressure.

 

[LawnMM]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

Just use the same load, those projectiles are basically interchangeable.

 

[DamnDave]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

I use the same load for mine.

 

[Dog Doc]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

So Sandwarrior mentioned it..Accuracy nodes. I wonder if anyone has done an OCW side to side between the Amax and Sierra, to see if there are different nodes of accuracy?

 

[doc76251]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dog Doc</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So Sandwarrior mentioned it..Accuracy nodes. I wonder if anyone has done an OCW side to side between the Amax and Sierra, to see if there are different nodes of accuracy? </div></div> Yep, Nope. I load them to the same ogive length and the same powder charge. The only thing I notice is that the 178's group a bit better at distance.

Cheers,

Doc

 

[Rob01]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

No need to start over completely. You might drop a half grain and work up to an past, if safe, what your SMK load was to see if you find a better load but you will probably end up very close to the SMK load.

You should also look at the Hornady 178 BTHP if you want to try some Hornady bullets. .530 BC and shoots great with 44grns of Varget in my rifle.

 

[Dog Doc]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

Thanks alot guys!
You have no idea how "depressed" I was with the thought that I should start from scratch... I may just drop a 0.5gr as mentioned above and make a few variations to compare, but to not have to start over is a really good feeling!
Excited to see if there will be any improvement!
I will look for some of the Hornady HPBT 178's as well!
Thanks again

 

[colt933]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

So on the 44gr of Varget load that everybody talks about, what brass and primers are you guys using?

I'm at 42.8gr in LC Match cases with CCI 200 and am probably about where you guys are with Win cases and 44gr.

 

[Dog Doc]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

My favorite brass so far has been Lapua. I also recently got a ton of Fed brass from my brother who was buying cheap WalMart stuff. Processed that and it worked really well for the first reload. I will see how long it lasts but free brass is always good!
Oh, for primers I use Fed210M... Haven't tried anything else.

 

[tomcatfan]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

I know its already been said, but I use 175 smk's and 178 Amax's interchangably. Before I started measureing from the ogive, I did have quite a POI change between the two. Now I measure from the ogive and they are basically the same. Well I guess the Amax's do have a red tip...

 

[Dog Doc]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage 10fp</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know its already been said, but I use 175 smk's and 178 Amax's interchangably. Before I started measureing from the ogive, I did have quite a POI change between the two. Now I measure from the ogive and they are basically the same. Well I guess the Amax's do have a red tip... </div></div>

How much variation did you see in OAL compared to ogive OAL? Was there a significant difference? I would assume the Hornady finishes out with a longer OAL for the same ogive measurement. (Haven't loaded any yet to know)

 

[sandwarrior]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

Dog Doc,

Good deal on the brass. If it's free by all means use it. Federal is consistent, if not hard headed enough to take top-end pressures. Lapua runs circles around it.

Also, someone mention LC and Winchester. Both good brass, but LC typically builds up to what the military wants and that is a 180 gr. case. Winchester cases usually run down around 165. So you might expect to see a load difference. I don't know why so light, but they are. In the past I've always preferred Winchester, because it is good brass and much less expensive than Lapua. However, in the last few years (since the year before the New Haven shutdown) I've come across brass that has been poor quality by them. I'm talking several different calibers, 7mm Mauser, .257 Rob. +p, 25 WSSM, all my 6.5 Swede was good, .300 Win Mag, .308, and 6mm Rem.

All of the bad stuff I've had to pick out has been bulk stuff, not boxed. I sure wish it went back to the way it was with them.

 

[Huckleberry75]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: avidflyer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">a lot of people use either one with the same load. <span style="font-weight: bold">I use 44.3 grns of varget over a 178 amax</span> and get around 2700 fps. never chrono'd the 175's but should be about the same. you might notice a slight change in zero but they should be fine. </div></div>

How do you get the 44.3gns of Varget to balance on top of the 178 AMAX??

Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[Dog Doc]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

Thought I would post an update...
I tried loading some of the 178gr Amax bullets. Fist thing I noticed is that it seems I have to seat them much deeper to get to the same ogive length as the Sierra 175gr. I dropped the charge some just to be safe and worked up to 44.0, and actually over to 44.5gr. The 44.5gr load did give some primer cratering but not severe.
The results weren't great. Now granted, I also wasn't shooting my "go to" load well either so it could have just been a bad day.
I think my concerns are this...I loaded to the same ogive depth but OAL was about max for my AICS mags. I dont have the numbers with me but OAL with Hornadys was long!!
Do you guys ever seat the Hor 178gr Amax to 2.800"? I would worry this would compress a 44.0gr charge!

 

[cooper_257]

Re: Using Hornady 178gr. Amax in place of Sierra 175gr

I seat the 178 Amax and the 178 match BTHP to 2.800" with 44.5 varget, Winchester brass. it compresses some but not to much.