Rifle Scopes USO Dual Foca Plane

[dogman]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

Appreciate the pics...looks good.

 

[handym3000]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

holy mother of 3 gun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i see my new optic!!!!!!!!


this is so going to be bought for christmas

 

[Singlestack_Wonder]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

JBW#3:

The previous photo's were taken from inside a dimly lit car either in the early morning light or late evening light. Any possibility to see some illuminated reticle pictures taken with the scope outside in bright sunlight? This would clear up the questions resulting from the 1st post stating "daylight visible reticle".

Thanks!

 

[JBW3]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

Absolutely, as soon as the bodies get back from anodize I will build another one up so we can get you guys some more pictures.
John III

 

[shootist~]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JBW#3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Absolutely, as soon as the bodies get back from anodize I will build another one up so we can get you guys some more pictures.
John III </div></div>

Or...you could build the 1.5-6 DFP I have on order; take some pics and send it on. (hint hint, wink wink).

 

[Singlestack_Wonder]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shootist~</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JBW#3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Absolutely, as soon as the bodies get back from anodize I will build another one up so we can get you guys some more pictures.
John III </div></div>

Or...you could build the 1.5-6 DFP I have on order; take some pics and send it on. (hint hint, wink wink).

</div></div>

I agree! That way we could get a quick review of the illumination and the 1.5-6.

 

[DP425]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: One-Eyed Jack</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is there anyone with a 1.5-6x SN-4 and C2 reticle who is interested in a DFP conversion? I might be interested in a 1 MOA dot in the SFP at 6x. The central cross hairs are 1 mil (or ~3.4 MOA) long in the FFP, so a 1 MOA SFP dot at 6x would be same size as the cross hairs at ~1.7x. At 6x, the diameter of the SFP would be about 1/3 the length of the FFP central cross hairs. I think a DFP conversion of this scope is possible only if the existing FFP reticle is not changed (due to the cost and difficulty of doing so). It should be mentioned that illumination of the FFP C2 reticle would be eliminated and only the SFP dot would light up.

Here's a table with the relative subtensions of the FFP cross hairs (FFP CH) and the SFP dot at various magnifications:

<span style="font-weight: bold">Mag---FFP CH--------SFP 1 MOA Dot</span>
6x------1 mil--------0.3 mil (1 MOA by design)
5x------1 mil--------0.35 mil (1.17 MOA)
4x------1 mil--------0.44 mil (1.5 MOA)
3x------1 mil--------0.59 mil (2 MOA)
2x------1 mil--------0.88 mil (3 MOA)
1.5-----1 mil--------1.17mil (4 MOA) </div></div>


I have the SN4 1.5-6 w/C2 and I want a conversion so bad I can taste it!

 

[weazer]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

Anymore info on these? I'm in the market for a couple and these look like just the one's I need, although a 1 to 8x would be even better.

 

[Rafael]

USO Dual Focal Plane

I am interested in the 1-8 as well......but it could be a while before they bring out that new scope.

The 1-4 and 1.5-6 can be oredered now.....as I understand it.

 

[Singlestack_Wonder]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shootist~</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JBW#3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Absolutely, as soon as the bodies get back from anodize I will build another one up so we can get you guys some more pictures.
John III </div></div>

Or...you could build the 1.5-6 DFP I have on order; take some pics and send it on. (hint hint, wink wink).

</div></div>

Shootist: SWFA is showing the 1.5-6 for sale:

SWFA U.S. Optics 1.5-6 FFP-SFP

 

[shootist~]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

Good on SWFA and USO for the commitment. I'm really looking forward to mine showing up.

 

[Joel45]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

Would love to see some more pics of these things and a range report by someone--I have a 1.5 x 6 order on hold trying to decide if this is the way to go...

 

[[email protected]]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

While a true 1-8 or 1-6 would be ideal. I think the 1.5 to 6 DFP mil/mil EREK with a mil GAP on FFP and segmented on the SFP would be great for a Recce/3 gun scope. I think I will order one to my match SN3-17 EREK. What I would like to see for my SBRs, if the true 1-6 or 1-8 is not an option is a SN4 1-4 with a mil reticle on FFP and segmented on SFP and mil/mil on windage and elevation instead of MOA. I'm too simple minded to do the conversion math and mil works well for me. That setup may cause me to retire my ShortDot LE.

Thanks
Dave

 

[Bedlam]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

Well quite simply put this is nearly perfect for a 3-gun scope. Now if only I can ever afford it...

 

[mluning]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

Any updates on these John?

 

[Singlestack_Wonder]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

tag for update..........

 

[BIG MASE]

Re: C2 DFP conversion for USO 1.5-6x

Got to see the prototype of this scope back in July. It's a very nice optic... (See 3:40 of video)

<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/tjValcxJ-j8"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/tjValcxJ-j8" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>

 

[xk319]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Got mine 3 weeks ago. It's has green illumination. It's the first USO I've owned (owned tr24 and nightforce 1-4x), it was great at the range. Around 50 rounds through at 50 yards quickly to sight in for short range hunting. All I had time for.

The lit reticle is only for dusk/dawn/night situations, when the illumination is on during the day it is not visable as far as I remember. The quote in the email flyer that it is daytime visible is incorrect and was a miscommunication that wasn't caught by anyone in time before it got sent out, I was told by USO. I'll take some pictures in different lighting situations in the next day or two.

 

[Singlestack_Wonder]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: xk319</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Got mine 3 weeks ago. It's has green illumination. It's the first USO I've owned (owned tr24 and nightforce 1-4x), it was great at the range. Around 50 rounds through at 50 yards quickly to sight in for short range hunting. All I had time for.

The lit reticle is only for dusk/dawn/night situations, when the illumination is on during the day it is not visable as far as I remember. The quote in the email flyer that it is daytime visible is incorrect and was a miscommunication that wasn't caught by anyone in time before it got sent out, I was told by USO. I'll take some pictures in different lighting situations in the next day or two. </div></div>

Bummer on the daylight visible illumination.

 

[Bedlam]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

The pictures in the thread seem to indicate that the illumination is daytime visible, or is this a result of the camera?

 

[One-Eyed Jack]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Despite any limitations in bright sunlight, if you leave the illumination on during the day it will benefit a situation where a target pops into dark shadows where you might lose an unlit reticle. My standard USO C2 (red illumination) isn't truly daylight bright either, but works well when I look into shadowed areas. Normally I would lose the reticle because there is no contrast with backlighting.

 

[Singlestack_Wonder]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bedlam</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The pictures in the thread seem to indicate that the illumination is daytime visible, or is this a result of the camera?
</div></div>

evening, cloudy, or early morning shots....

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Switched my 1.5-6 on order to a DFP C2 a little while ago, can't wait to get it and get my 'yote gun up and running!

 

[xk319]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Here are some pictures. They are taken at 1x and 4x respectively. The conditions were outside in the open, mid day, overcast. You can see the illumination is not daytime visible at all. Only for dusk/dawn settings. But the reticle is still quick to pick up without illumination. FWIW, USO told me they were working on several designs for true daytime illumination, one promising that would allow retrofitting to existing scopes.

EDIT: see pictures at bottom of page with new battery installed.

At 1x.

At 4x.

 

[One-Eyed Jack]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

xk319, your images make me wonder whether there is some variation in the brightness of the reticle illumination from scope to scope (battery voltage???, highest setting???). It appears your outside conditions are slightly overcast and, frankly, I expected to see at least some hint of illumination. I can't even tell what color it is. I don't have my 1.5-6x SN-4 with red illuminated C2 here, but my recollection is that I could see at least a red glow or more in those same conditions.

 

[xk319]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

I was expecting to see at least some illumination as well. I emailed USO after I had it a few days and asked them, but they said the current system is not daylight visible, though as said they are working on that. I have it on the highest setting.

 

[One-Eyed Jack]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Look at the pix above, taken on an overcast day. The reticle is very bright when the background is a little darker than full sunlight. Just seems odd to me that we can't see your reticle also, even dimly lit. Try a new battery if you haven't already done so.

 

[xk319]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

The lighting conditions are different in my pictures vs. the reps. Mine are outside during the day, his are in a car nearing dusk it appears (when it should be visible).

I'll try a different battery, but this is fresh from USO. Does seem there is a little miscommunication between USO people emailing me and USO people posting on the boards. Some are saying daylight visible, some are saying not daylight visible. Maybe someone can weigh in with a difinitive answer. Mine though is definitely not daytime visible unless there is something wrong with the illumination or the battery is low (highly unlikely due to auto shutoff).

 

[xk319]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Ok, I got a new battery tonight. There is a difference in the brightness. Which leads me to ask why they shipped me a scope with a battery that was used enough that it caused the reticle to be more dim than it was suppose to be. I don't mind getting a used batt, but would like to know so I could get a new one so the reticle is correct brightness and so I don't open the box and look at their product and say "man this reticle isn't near as bright as X, Y, or Z company's reticle", when in reality it is (bad for USO and customer). This isn't a shot at USO service, they're great, just something I'd like to know. Or just ship the scope without a battery and state that. I'm not sure how the battery could have drained this much during the building of my scope. Maybe it was left on multiple times? Or maybe they just put a used battery in in.

Anyway! I took two pictures tonight indoors. The first picture below is of the maxell battery that was in the scope when it came to me and that was in the scope when the pictures in my previous post above were taken. The second picture is with the new energizer battery I just got, check the difference. And tomorrow I will go back outside and take pictures in the same overcast conditions mid day and post them. Like this, first picture with maxell battery it was shipped with and second with the new engergizer battery.

Now, the rep from USO told me in email the reticle is not daylight visible, one here on the thread however says it is. Hopefully tomorrow will shed a little more light on what the visibility of the reticle in daytime is. As always, hope this helps.

 

[One-Eyed Jack]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Batteries get old, they're chemistry. I'm wondering whether there is an optimum reticle color (red, amber, green, blue,...) for daylight visibility. My C2 is red and is quite good in overcast and shadows, but not bright sunlight.

 

[C4MC]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Sweet looking scope. May have to consider one of these for my AR.

 

[xk319]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Ok, here's a set of daytime pictures. These were taken at 8:30 a.m. So a little earlier than the original ones above, with a more overcast condition. As a result the first picture (original battery) the reticle shows a little bit. Second picture with new battery shows the reticle brighter.

So I guess the visibility is what we all gathered, visible in dusk dawn situations really, not particularly usable in mid-day situations.

 

[shootist~]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Great pics xk319 - thanks for posting. I have the green reticle coming as well. I was uncertain what color to get, but in my desert environment it should do well if needed.

 

[kombayotch]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

It appears that the outer ring or horseshoe is present whether the illumination is on or off. But, the center dot only seems to appear when illumination is turned on. Is that correct?

 

[shootist~]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

kombayotch,

The center dot is noticeable all the time and at any power/illum level on my 1.5-6 DPF. At 6x it's a 1 MOA dot, which is thicker than the FFP cross-hair.

Joe

 

[kombayotch]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

That's unfortunate... I really detest the Viper PST's center dot for that. 1 MOA is perfect, but when you crank it down to 1x, it grows to 4 MOA dot and its too big. Get better precision out of the Eotech at 100 or 200 yards. It's center dot is 1 MOA. I like shooting unsupported positions with 1x magnification.

I like dots as aiming points in these low power scopes, but I wish they would keep then on the first focal plane...

Thanks for the info!

 

[Sapper524]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MWDG3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">1-8 please!

Break out the US#4 Mini-EREK.

Why not axe the monster power ring for a conservative cattail? Similar to the Swaro Z6 and Minox Z5.

Just saying

</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mo_Zam_Beek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Needs a Mini EREK & a capped low pro windage

Good luck </div></div>

Im interested to see if the 1-8 they are working on will have some of these options ...

Low Pro capped turrents are on top of my personal "want" list on this model. Still waiting for the SN3 version with the RFP version being fine crosshairs in the middle and the FFP reticle blank for .5 mil in all 4 directions.

Lot of reading of the topic here, if interested ...
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=82868

 

[CSTactical]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Have a few in stock. I really like the DFP idea for a low powered scopes.

Mike @ CST

 

[Singlestack_Wonder]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: xk319</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok, here's a set of daytime pictures. These were taken at 8:30 a.m. So a little earlier than the original ones above, with a more overcast condition. As a result the first picture (original battery) the reticle shows a little bit. Second picture with new battery shows the reticle brighter.

So I guess the visibility is what we all gathered, visible in dusk dawn situations really, not particularly usable in mid-day situations.

</div></div>

With other manufacturers starting to deliver on true daylight visible reticles, I'm disappointed that U.S. Optics was not able to deliver on this otherwise great scope. At the price point it would have been a clear winner.

 

[sib1948]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

Green LASERS are typically much more visible in daylight rather than red, so I would assume that may also apply to reticles, but what do I know !!! It is what it is. Like it or not. Hope you didn't pay a lot more for the "illumination".

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

The illumination in my 1.5-6 DFP is perfect. I went with red, as I've had red, green and blue and red is the best IMHO. The whole "daylight visible" point is lost on me. Its not an Aimpoint or eotech and the bold circle is very fast (if you cant center it on your target you should set the rifle down and take up something else). If you run it on and cover a dark background its plenty visible, even here in sunny AZ.

 

[Singlestack_Wonder]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The illumination in my 1.5-6 DFP is perfect. I went with red, as I've had red, green and blue and red is the best IMHO. The whole "daylight visible" point is lost on me. Its not an Aimpoint or eotech and the bold circle is very fast (if you cant center it on your target you should set the rifle down and take up something else). If you run it on and cover a dark background its plenty visible, even here in sunny AZ.
</div></div>

If there was no advantage to bright daylight visible illumination for fast target acquisition, Aimpoints would come with just a black dot. But millions of units sold indicate that the market desires the daylight visible illumination, thus the reason other manufacturers are quickly working to put the technology in their products.

 

[One-Eyed Jack]

Re: USO Dual Foca Plane

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Singlestack Wonder</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The illumination in my 1.5-6 DFP is perfect. I went with red, as I've had red, green and blue and red is the best IMHO. The whole "daylight visible" point is lost on me. Its not an Aimpoint or eotech and the bold circle is very fast (if you cant center it on your target you should set the rifle down and take up something else). If you run it on and cover a dark background its plenty visible, even here in sunny AZ.
</div></div>

If there was no advantage to bright daylight visible illumination for fast target acquisition, Aimpoints would come with just a black dot. But millions of units sold indicate that the market desires the daylight visible illumination, thus the reason other manufacturers are quickly working to put the technology in their products. </div></div>
A dot is very different than an extended reticle (like a duplex crosshair) to your eye and brain. A dot can be very fast, but requires illumination day and night if it's not part of a larger reticle design that can naturally draw your eye to the center. On the other hand, an extended reticle like the USO C2 doesn't require day-bright illumination, IMO. The design of the C2 brings your eye to the center. Nevertheless, a daylight-bright illuminated cross at the center of the C2 could make it slightly faster. One of my favorite reticles is the one in the ELCAN 1x/4x SpecterDR with a brightly lit dot at the center for daylight use and with the main crosshair-type reticle unlit. The lit dot and the unlit crosshair together bring your eye to the dot very quickly.

The USO DFP reticle concept would work well here, lighting only the center aimpoint (dot or cross) enough to be brightly visible in daylight.