Rifle Scopes USO Optical Quality?

[Andielouroo]

Can anyone with recent experience with USO products comment on the optical quality? I've owned a couple in the past and in my experience they were hit and miss on optical quality, and even the best weren't as great as many other optics out there. Just wondering how they stack up now with the "B" models. I appreciate that glass quality is subjective, but I'd appreciate any comparisons you're willing to offer.

 

[Yoteski]

I peeked through a B25 this last weekend for awhile. Thought the glass looked very good. It's so hard to tell quality, but it provided a nice crisp, full view sight picture.

 

[mrobles3808]

I recently owned some USO B series optics. I love them to be honest, but always desired to have a better optical image. Although it wasn’t bad by any means, I expect more in optics above 2k. There are so many options right now, I can confidently say you can get better glass than what’s offered in the USO.

 

[Notdylan]

I had a B-17, it was a nice scope. The ATACR 4-16 was nicer. The colors just seem to pop more with the ATACR while they were kind of flat in the B-17. The USO was clear though and I liked that top turret a lot. The real disappointment with the B-17 was the hard (NOT) anodize, that thing scratched very easily. They are also quite long.

 

[Diver160651]

Can anyone with recent experience with USO products comment on the optical quality? I've owned a couple in the past and in my experience they were hit and miss on optical quality, and even the best weren't as great as many other optics out there. Just wondering how they stack up now with the "B" models. I appreciate that glass quality is subjective, but I'd appreciate any comparisons you're willing to offer.

@JC Steel is sponsored by them buy also one of the best shooters around.. Maybe ask him.

I will say this I had a 35mm tube 58mm obj ER25 it really was on par with my S&B -- maybe I was the lucky one but I miss that scope.. Again, I'd ping Jake. I think he might be biased but honest

 

[Swamplife]

I recently purchased a B10 and find the color, clarity and contrast are up to par, especially for the price. My Hensoldt and S&B High Power are a step above but so is the price.

 

[Poorboyr]

Do a search about this topic. I know it’s been talked about before.

To me, USO has very nice glass. The best way to describe USO glass is true color. What I mean by that is the color is not fake bright. When you look through a Vortex Razor Gen II or Nightforce, it’s very bright. Almost too bright to me. When looking through the USO it shows you how your eyes would see the color.

Some people like that and some don’t. Everyone sees things differently. I think the glass is in the top five. It’s not theta or Mark 8 glass but not very far behind. I’m very happy with my USOs.

 

[chavezz556]

I recently purchased a B10 and find the color, clarity and contrast are up to par, especially for the price. My Hensoldt and S&B High Power are a step above but so is the price.

I thought they retailed for the same as a S&B > $3k ? Am I wrong?

 

[boomslang]

I thought they retailed for the same as a S&B > $3k ? Am I wrong?

S&B High Power retails for $5k+.

 

[samnev]

I've only owned 1 USO scope an ST10 But imo opinion it had the best glass of all the scopes I've own perhaps except my NF ATACR 5-25X56.

 

[Flyingbullseye]

They are definitely up there but in my opinion near the bottom of the top tier class of glass. Side by side a Steiner 16X and even a Schmidt I didn't notice really any difference until I began to compare them with more fine resolution details. That's where it becomes more apparent The USO B I used just came up a little, and I mean small but noticeable, short in make the fine details as clear as the rest. This won't cause anyone to miss a shot and unless you're comparing it side by side to another top tier scope you'll never notice the difference. Outside of that great scopes, and I really loved the new elevation knob, I'd love to have had a chance to test it side by side to a TT for feel. Absolutely excellent build all around.

 

[Basher]

I've only owned 1 USO scope an ST10 But imo opinion it had the best glass of all the scopes I've own perhaps except my NF ATACR 5-25X56.

Yep. I just sighted in my ST-10 ERGO this past weekend and was surprised by how clear and crisp the image was. Color is a tad on the warm side, but I really liked it. For a fixed 10x and for what I paid, it’s an amazing value!

I’d love to check out a B series, but other than trying someone else’s, that won’t be for awhile.

 

[Andielouroo]

Guess I'll need to track down someone local to me who has a B-25 to test drive.

 

[drglock]

I use Schmidt Benders but my son has a B17 and I think the glass on his is pretty good.
This is through scope pics using a iPhone. First one is 100yds second is 700 if I remember right.

 

[Maggie]

Guess I'll need to track down someone local to me who has a B-25 to test drive.

Hi Andi, feel free to use our dealer locator on our website to find a store near you. Many of our dealers have a variety of our optics on display for customers to look through. Shoot me a PM if you need any help.

 

[just browsing]

I have nothing useful to add... but Good Lord that reticle is hideous.

 

[myronman3]

one man’s “hideous” is another man’s “appreciate the uncluttered reticle”. i think a lot of reticles are far too cluttered for my taste.

 

[just browsing]

The giant numbers though? ?

 

[Basher]

I have nothing useful to add... but Good Lord that reticle is hideous.

The Mil-GAP is the grand-daddy of a whole lotta today’s reticles. It paved the way for a load of progress. I used to think it was “too pedestrian” and simple, but now I have two USOs with it, and wouldn’t mind a few more as backups. For a field use reticle, it’s great!

 

[hypno02]

Mediocre glass. Even worse QC. I sold 100 athlons to every uso and the only scope that ever came back to the shop with a wobbly dick objective lens was a b17.

I won’t even begin to talk about all of the other qc issues we observed with USO.

 

[sobrbiker883]

The Mil-GAP is the grand-daddy of a whole lotta today’s reticles. It paved the way for a load of progress. I used to think it was “too pedestrian” and simple, but now I have two USOs with it, and wouldn’t mind a few more as backups. For a field use reticle, it’s great!

George drew it on a cocktail napkin while talking to JBW3 and things changed for all of us.
I personally prefer the Mil-MPR, and kids- us old folks have been smoking holdover stages long before Christmas tree reticles were widely available.

 

[RifleBlog]

The pending lawsuits between the partners / venture capitalists / leadership at USO citing “significant quality and internal problems”, paired with the abrupt leaving of Montana and management shakeup don’t inspire confidence in the brand, personally.

 

[Poorboyr]

The pending lawsuits between the partners / venture capitalists / leadership at USO citing “significant quality and internal problems”, paired with the abrupt leaving of Montana and management shakeup don’t inspire confidence in the brand, personally.

Where is this at?

 

[chavezz556]

The pending lawsuits between the partners / venture capitalists / leadership at USO citing “significant quality and internal problems”, paired with the abrupt leaving of Montana and management shakeup don’t inspire confidence in the brand, personally.

So they left Montana?

 

[RifleBlog]

Where is this at?

https://www.nccourts.gov/assets/documents/opinions/2018_NCBC_106.pdf?V.5zOUxizFTzVg4RKyty0Sw4DLGCtDqj

"Plaintiffs also allege that Warren failed to inform Plaintiffs of certain material facts regarding the purchase of U.S. Optics including: that Warren was representing both U.S. Optics and DRSG as broker and receiving commissions from both DRSG and from U.S. Optics for brokering the deal, and therefore had a conflict of interest (Id. at ¶¶ 67–71); and that Warren failed to disclose “critical information regarding deficiencies of U.S. Optics.” (Id. at ¶¶ 72–74). "

So they left Montana?

Here is one of their staff commenting on it. I blurred out their name as I didn't think it was fair to post it:

 

[para1505]

Leaving Montana? WTF

 

[TheGerman]

I use Schmidt Benders but my son has a B17 and I think the glass on his is pretty good.
This is through scope pics using a iPhone. First one is 100yds second is 700 if I remember right.
View attachment 7038778View attachment 7038779

488

 

[Steel+Killer]

@JC Steel is sponsored by them buy also one of the best shooters around.. Maybe ask him.

You want an honest unbiased opinion ask a guy who is sponsored by them........LOL

 

[JC Steel]

Optical quality is all in the eye of the beholder.
Is the uso b series as crisp as a tangent theta or a kahles 5-25? No it is not. I’ve looked through about every single scope on the market.
It’s on par or better optically than about everything else.
But, think about what is important to you in a scope. Make yourself a little scale of importance.
Optical quality will be very low on that list.
Important to me, reliability, dependability, ruggedness, ease of use, turret feel.

 

[JC Steel]

You want an honest unbiased opinion ask a guy who is sponsored by them........LOL

Not many will be honest, but I will be.

 

[Basher]

Used my old ‘11 ST-10 today in a local match. Neither the image quality, or the fact that is was a fixed 10X, held me back. Nor would either have helped me remember to dial the correct amount of elevation, or use the correct hold-over on stages I didn’t have time to dial... It’s not a current model, true, but it’s a keeper! It was nice not having to fiddle with magnification. I dialed what I needed (except when I dialed something I didn’t need, haha), set the ERGO near what the stages required, and ran it. It’s a tank that isn’t picky at all. I hope the new BFX-10 can fill the shoes these old ST-10s left behind!

 

[DDT]

...The real disappointment with the B-17 was the hard (NOT) anodize, that thing scratched very easily...

could you please compare surface finish on an old vs. new series of USO scopes (etc. MR, LR, ER line vs. B-series) ? I have seen that USO write (on factory boxes - stickers) the same type of surface finish on both: "Matte Black - Type III Hard Anodizing". I have an old MR-10 and LR-17 scopes and they have "mil-spec" hardcoat anodizing which last longer then oxide anodizing only. So, the new B-series do not have it anymore?

 

[702lineman]

The Mil-GAP is the grand-daddy of a whole lotta today’s reticles. It paved the way for a load of progress. I used to think it was “too pedestrian” and simple, but now I have two USOs with it, and wouldn’t mind a few more as backups. For a field use reticle, it’s great!

I feel the same, wasnt a big fan of it till I had one, now I actually like it quite a bit.

 

[Andielouroo]

https://www.nccourts.gov/assets/documents/opinions/2018_NCBC_106.pdf?V.5zOUxizFTzVg4RKyty0Sw4DLGCtDqj

Here is one of their staff commenting on it. I blurred out their name as I didn't think it was fair to post it:

This is interesting. The link you posted is to a decision from a NC court staying a case in NC filed by investors against the broker who arranged the purchase of USO. The investors say that the broker fraudulently induced them into investing and also misrepresented that the proposed COO refused to leave Montana. The NC stayed the case because there is already a case pending in MT.

The court filing doesn't say anything about the company having left MT. However, when the ownership is suing the broker for not disclosing “critical information regarding deficiencies of U.S. Optics” shits not going well.

 

[Mxridr]

USO is offering big prize money this year that is why some top shooters are running these scopes. And why not

 

[sobrbiker883]

Yep. I just sighted in my ST-10 ERGO this past weekend and was surprised by how clear and crisp the image was. Color is a tad on the warm side, but I really liked it. For a fixed 10x and for what I paid, it’s an amazing value!

I’d love to check out a B series, but other than trying someone else’s, that won’t be for awhile.

I still think the ERGO’s were the best USO put out. I’ll never get rid of my 3.8-22x44

 

[Basher]

I still think the ERGO’s were the best USO put out. I’ll never get rid of my 3.8-22x44

I snagged a 3.2-17x44 from Tim Milkovich, and the ST-10 off the PX here. I don't foresee either going anywhere anytime soon. In fact, I had one of the new EBR-7C Razors for a short while and sold it in favor of running the USOs in order to cut costs. Crazy, right? But hey, they just plain work!

 

[sobrbiker883]

Yes they do. I still have an LR17, SR8C and a 1.5-6 with an awesome dual focal plane reticle, so all my bases are covered.
I like the B’s (spend some time behind Scott M’s), but all mine are from the glory days shooting for USO with three Milkovi...good times.

USO glass as pointed out previously, is true color (which I prefer), and there’s been many times on hazy days or shaded targets I’ve been able to make hits when other “top” scope owners couldn’t make out targets.

 

[Primus]

I have nothing useful to add... but Good Lord that reticle is hideous.

Well there is at least one person who never lived through the mil dot and mil dot master days.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Well there is at least one person who never lived through the mil dot and mil dot master days.

Remember when the argument was army vs marine dots? and decades of mildots with moa adjustment?
USO has always had great reticles.

 

[Primus]

Football dots.....

 

[Rog2069]

I have nothing useful to add... but Good Lord that reticle is hideous.

USO offers more reticle choices than any other manufacturer I believe (they used to anyway). If you don’t like that one they have others that would suit you I’d guess

 

[5RWill]

I have nothing useful to add... but Good Lord that reticle is hideous.

Once upon a time the GAP milling reticle was one of the few offerings in a Mil/Mil solution that wasn't a Mil-dot. It still resides in my SN-3 a bit thick but by no means a bad reticle IMO.

As for USO my SN-3 is now 10 years old still haven't gotten rid of it. Thing has been a work horse and to this day still has some great glass. My biggest issue with USO is kind of like Leupold and Schmidt until recent, they've just been stagnant as hell. The EREK revision was great and much needed. Reticle selection is still subpar IMHO (though the new JVC reticle is nice) and the form factor of their optics are way above everyone else. The B-25 might be one of the most aesthetically displeasing optics i've laid eyes on. I've never understood why they couldn't shrink the form factor to a reasonable size. I can't really speak to the quality of the new B series but most have good things to say about them. I just think given the absurd array of options we have now especially with so many quality reticles out there, i'd have a hard time dropping retail on a USO this day in age, and i'm a long time fan of theirs. Really preferred it more they were a custom based shop and not so streamlined like now. Granted they had their fair share of QC issues back then too but my SN-3 has always been spot on.

I still think the ERGO’s were the best USO put out. I’ll never get rid of my 3.8-22x44

100% my favorite parallax in both design and use i've ever used. I'd be back pretty quickly if they brought back ERGOs in a shorter form factor.

 

[AIAW]

Once upon a time the GAP milling reticle was one of the few offering in a Mil/Mil solution that wasn't a Mil-dot. It still resides in my SN-3 a bit thick but by no means a bad reticle IMO.

As for USO my SN-3 is now 10 years old still haven't gotten rid of it. Thing has been a work horse and to this day still has some great glass. My biggest issue with USO is kind of like Leupold and Schmidt until recent, they've just been stagnant as hell. The EREK revision was great and much needed. Reticle selection is still subpar IMHO and the form factor of their optics are way above everyone else. The B-25 might be on of the most aesthetically displeasing optics i've laid eyes on. I've never understood why they couldn't shrink the form factor to a reasonable size. I can't really speak to the quality of the new B series but most have good things to say about them. I just think given the absurd array of options we have now especially with so many quality reticles out there, i'd have a hard time dropping retail on a USO this day in age, and i'm a long time fan of theirs. Really preferred it more they were a custom based shop and not so streamlined like now. Granted they had their fair share of QC issues back then too but my SN-3 has always been spot on.

Well said!

I know this is a USO thread, but S&B truly holds a special place in my "systems". One of those things you just can't go wrong with if you know what I mean. That being said, I do have a USO LR-17 TPAL, ST-10 and a MR-10 TPAL that also have that little thing they do well. The GAP reticles do tend to get a little bland though.

I feel like one could literally fire the USO's out of a canon, go find it, remount it and go though.

I mean, it can double as a hammer evidently...

 

[Strykervet]

@JC Steel is sponsored by them buy also one of the best shooters around.. Maybe ask him.

I will say this I had a 35mm tube 58mm obj ER25 it really was on par with my S&B -- maybe I was the lucky one but I miss that scope.. Again, I'd ping Jake. I think he might be biased but honest

No, not lucky, I have one but 34mm I'm pretty and not only is it a tank it's also a very nice scope with lots of usable elevation due to the EREK turret. It's bright and super clear. Positive clicks on the turret and they seem to track well. I also have an LR17, their spotter and a 1-8x. All bought in the PX on here for half price. So it was hard for me to go wrong. I can't say anything about the B series other than that they look nice and don't have the slightly complex, yet singular feature that set them apart, the EREK repositionable erector. It's a love/hate relationship at best unless you use +MOA mounts like they were designed for. When it's zero'd, what's not to love? Other than length and weight I guess, they had that going too. But I don't think anyone made a scope as tough as USO did. Again, can't speak for B series other than I'd like a 1.8-10x. USO always had and still does have great magnification ranges IMO too.

Supposedly they use or used Schott glass? Am I correct about that? Made in USA. They can/could be ordered completely custom from tube size to obj. size, erector type, reticle, side or front focus, etc., you name it. So that's nice if you order direct (and if they still do some of that). I think the B series is the answer to people having problems with the EREK, perhaps it was ahead of it's time. It was probably a costly scope to make, the LR's and ER's, etc. So maybe it just didn't work out as planned. IMO, it looks like they were working for a govt. contract that didn't pan out too.

I still like 'em. Didn't plan on being a USO fanboy, they were just great optics for a great price. I paid $2100 for the ER25, all bells and whistles, $1400 maybe for the LR17, all bells and whistles, $600 for 1-8x dual focal plane w/tree reticle, blue illum., and $600 for the observation scope with a custom made rubber eye shutter, all with the milGAP reticle except for the 1-8x that has the simple tree reticle. So for those prices, I can't complain and you can't find a better scope with those features in that price range. Then or now. And as far as I know, nobody else makes a repositionable erector so you can actually use all the 35mils or 110MOA or whatever they advertise. Having matching reticles in two scopes plus the spotter/observation scope is pretty nice too. I like it.

I use the LR17 on an SR25 and the ER25 on an HTI .50BMG. The LR17 is a bit longer and heavier than I'd like on the SR25 but the ER25 matches up with the HTI like it's made for it. No complaints, they're clear and bright and I see way on out with 'em. They're very solid scopes that you can probably pound nails with and recoil hasn't been an issue on the .50. Length and weight are sorta absorbed by the rest of the weapon here so no complaints on that this time.

The dual focal plane 1-8x is really nice in that it works like a ringed dot sight at 1x or so and as mag goes up, the basic tree reticle becomes more visible and the ring just disappears. At higher powers, it's just a FFP tree reticle. I put it on an SBR'd Grendel that I felt could take advantage of something like that. It's 24mm I'm guessing, maybe a bit more? It looks as good as it should given it's size and it's clear downrange. Weight and length on it are negligible given the size. Still solid.

Then they made the massive SN9. A true looooong range scope, one of the first I guess. External adjustments, built in base, up to 40x w/235mm obj. IIRC. I only mention it because they actually made this monstrosity for the very few people that actually needed one. That's pretty cool. I'm guessing they're not as open to stuff like that today though.

Anyway, hard to go wrong on the old stuff, can't say much for the new stuff. But a good deal on a B10 is something I'd be interested in if I can't find a killer deal on a NF of similar range, similar options. And I'd like one of those super compact S&B's. But I'll probably be keeping my USO's either way.

 

[Tommydean]

I have two st-10’s both on .308’s. Love em. Love the reticle to

 

[RTH1800]

USO is actually jointly owned by Verizon and UPS. They developed the scope to increase shipping and phone traffic back and forth for repairs. ??

 

[Primus]

They were an option when your option was a mk4 with premier reticle or an early PM was all that was put there. Today or in the last10 years or so, I don't know why anyone would waste money on them.