Valkyrie

[TonyTheTiger]

Sounds like BS. I've loaded 75 ELD's at 2.35" and got compression at 24.1-24.2 grains of 8208.

 

[JMcBurn]

Sounds like BS. I've loaded 75 ELD's at 2.35" and got compression at 24.1-24.2 grains of 8208.

How fast are you getting out of that load?

I am at 24.5 gr in Lapua brass at 2.445" gets me like 2970-2980 with a 24" tikka 223 bolt gun. I can go higher before I see anything pressure related, but that is where the node is for me (<10 SD and shoots in the .2-.4 range at 100)

Is that reasonable?

25g in a 223 AR15 with 80's at 2.3" and you didnt blow your damn face off? That load was also highly compressed. This is straight nonsense talk.

23.2-23.6g of 8208 with 75/77gr pills in an AR15 is a known node for pretty much every rifle. That doesnt have a single thing to do with you claiming your shooting 25g of 8208 with 80's in a now 20" AR15 and arent blowing primer pockets straight out instantly. How do I know this, because Ive loaded 10's of thousands of 77's with 8208 in AR's. Above 24g primer pockets are gone after just 2 or 3 reloads.

So even if you did do something so stupid as to cram 25g of 8208 into a 223 case and jam a 80 ELD way down into that case to get 2.3" coal, your above statement is very misleading saying you get 2875 from a 18 (20") AR15 with 80's because I assure you NOBODY does that or gets that. Why, because its extremely unsafe and would trash brass instantly. Let alone put you at risk as well.

Yes the pockets were probably toast, but it was more to just see how fast they would go before I saw serious pressure signs. Maybe my barrel has a really long throat or something like that which is why I didn't see anything crazy. I walked up at .1 gr increments only shooting 1 at a time.

But to stop said thread derailment.

QL is predicting like 2984 fps out of a 80 eld at 2.28" oal using 28.9 gr of RL 17 with a 24" tube which is at the 55ksi saami pressure spec. Estimated 103% case fill.

 

[padom]

I'm not disagreeing with what you get in a 24" bolt gun with 24.6g or what QL says RL17 will get you.

I'm discounting that you said you get 2875 with 80 ELD in a 18" or 20" AR at 2.3" with 25g 8208..

 

[JMcBurn]

I'm not disagreeing with what you get in a 24" bolt gun with 24.6g or what QL says RL17 will get you.

I'm discounting that you said you get 2875 with 80 ELD in a 18" or 20" AR at 2.3" with 25g 8208..

I've seen some people running >25 gr of 8208 with a 23" Bolt Gun Barrel getting over 3150 out of the 75 ELD and my testing with the 75 vs 80 ELD is only approximately 35 fps different in my Tikka at the same charge weight.

The people that I've seen doing that say that the Brass is toast after one firing.

But again like I said I was only going up to see how fast it would go. Had had to be WAYYYY over pressure and would never feed a rifle a steady diet of it.

So lets get back to 224 Valk.

 

[padom]

The 80 ELD at like 2850 matches the 90 smk at 2700, but the valk should be able to push it close to 3k according to QL. (I believe those numbers because I have shot the 80 ELD out of a 223 at 2.300" and got 2875 out of an 18" barrel)

so no 224V cannot push 80s at over 3000 or anywhere close to that. I think we've established that.

 

[JMcBurn]

so no 224V cannot push 80s at over 3000 or anywhere close to that. I think we've established that.

Maybe I was not clear. I was discussing the 80 ELD going around 3k. I stated this due to some of the preliminary data that has come out of QL.

Seen some reports of the 90 going nearly 2900 though with a super compressed charge of RL17 from some other places I follow. Then again at the same time I have heard the 90 SMK is not the most consistent;y accurate bullet out of a 1-7 twist barrel.

 

[padom]

preliminary data coming out of QL or Federal is not lining up with anything we've seen real world from actual people with 20" 224V in hand. not even close to reports we were initially fed. we are seeing numbers exactly what I was expecting. and what people get with RL17 hot rodding loads never to be able to load those cases again is not the same.

 

[cuffm4615]

Got this Email today:

"Dear JP customer,



If you are receiving this email, it means your current order for one of our JP Supermatch™ barrels in .224 Valkyrie is eligible for fulfilment in our first production run. But, because of the unforeseen complications of developing barrels for a brand new caliber like this, we wanted to contact you before completing your order.



After final testing of these barrels, we have discovered that accuracy specific to 90gr. Sierra Match King and the 90gr. Fusion hunting ammo is only mediocre. These results are not up to the JP standard, and as such, we cannot honor our accuracy guarantee with this 90gr. ammunition.



However, the Federal varmint load using the 60gr. Nosler Ballistic Tip and our personal test loads using 77gr. Sierra Tipped Match Kings shot well from these barrels. With the 77gr. Tipped Match Kings, we achieved maximum velocities in the 3000 ft/s range. This compromise of utilizing lighter projectiles with much higher MV and slightly lower BC may actually result in higher hit probabilities within the effective range of the cartridge. This is particularly the case with unknown distance targets.



At this point, we want to offer you the choice of confirming your order and receiving one of these first JP .224 Valkyrie barrels. Alternately, you may opt to wait for our next run of barrels with further design changes to improve the performance of the 90gr. bullets. The choice comes down to your choice of application and ammo.



Please respond to this email with your preference.

If you choose to wait, your order will still be fulfilled in the order it was received as soon as the new barrels arrive and are tested. If you choose to wait, we expect to ship your order sometime in May.


Sincerely,

JP Customer service team"


Honestly I'm not surprised, and I'm glad they are doing due diligence before releasing their barrels. I haven't seen anything impressive from the 1-7 twist barrels and 90 grain bullets from other barrels that are out. It may be chamber dimensions as well, but either way, glad they are working on it. I have opted to wait as I am in no hurry.

I did inquire to see if they have tested 80 grain class bullets. Ballistically they seem to have an advantage over the 90s at most distances.

I got the same Email. Glad they are looking out for their customers but have to admit I'm now a bit worried that I may fed into the hype a little too quickly. We shall see.

 

[Birddog6424]

The very first write up I saw from the owner of a Valkyrie showed much lower numbers than originally hyped.

I think it's going to be a very fun round and folks will enjoy it. I'm just not sure it's going to do what it was initially reported. It should be a ball as a varminter or steel plinker.

I'm going to stick to my Grendel. I'm still having a lot of fun with it, and for my hunting purposes, I like the larger bullet a little better. I'm also having a lot of fun with the new bullet I've been trying out. I decided not to listen to the people who told me they don't shoot the 130gr bullet very well, and I've been tinkering with the new Nosler 130gr RDF. So far it's been very impressive. Shooting very nice, and not going sub till 1300 yards.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

I decided not to listen to the people who told me they don't shoot the 130gr bullet very well, and I've been tinkering with the new Nosler 130gr RDF. So far it's been very impressive. Shooting very nice, and not going sub till 1300 yards.

Hadn't thought of trying that one. What kind of speeds are you getting?

 

[Greg Langelius *]

My views about the V are leading me to a wait-and-see approach. There appear to be teething pains associated with the new arrival. Not a deal breaker, but still something that cautious me would prefer to approach with minor trepidation. This primarily because I think that later products will have improved design.

The off-topic comments on .223 are always enjoyable to follow. FWIW, my pair 5.56 24" 1:8" run virtually flawless with the rifle length gas system, 50gr through 75gr, and I understand that the criticisms refer to the V.

I saw that Midway was running a one-time-only deep discount on 240rd of IMI 77, and mine is scheduled to arrive tomorrow. I also have an AR Stoner 16" Upper coming in Wednesday that uses a 1:7" twist, so I guess it'd be worth a try to run it with some of the IMI. I am mindful of Padom's high praise for the IMI 77, and that had some influence in my breaking down and initiating the purchase of the ammo. If it's a disappointment, I will only blame myself. I get to make all my own purchasing decisions, and nobody else could be culpable for disappointments. Actually, I have good expectations for both purchases.

The AR Stoner Upper will be a crapshoot anyway, since it received a positive buyer's review, but only one review so far. If it works, it'll be a cheaply obtained thrill; and if it doesn't, it's still probably be OK for Combat Matches. It's mainly to fill a hole in my set of capabilities following the possible misplacing of a pair of 16" Uppers. That part is puzzling, but bottom line, I can't put my hands on them after a couple of weeks of searching and inquiry, and the need remains. I have some hunches, and they may still turn up.

Greg

 

[Birddog6424]

Hadn't thought of trying that one. What kind of speeds are you getting?

Here's my full apples to apples.

I use the Litz custom curve in AB on my 123gr ELD-M. Using todays environmentals of 3367 DA with a 10mph left to right FV crosser I get an adjusted velocity of 2576fps. That's a 150" drop at 700 yards with 47" of wind. And 414" drop at 1000 yards with 114" wind. Subsonic at 1010 yards.

For the 130gr RDF I'm using a G7 of .307 and an adjusted velocity of 2477fps. That's 146" drop at 700 yards and 36" wind. And 375" drop at 1000 yards with 82" wind. Doesn't go subsonic till 1285 yards.

The 130gr outperforms my 123gr in pretty much every category. I'm still tinkering though. I have a 20" barrel, so guys with a longer barrels going over 2500fps will be killing it.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

@Birddog6424 My ballistic calculator tells me exactly the same thing, is this all observed data downrange? The advertised BC sounds pretty awesome, if you're telling me it's accurate thats exciting.

 

[bikeracer]

A bit off topic - but thanks for the tip on Midway's sale on IMI 77 - I was just about buy some for a class and that saved me a bunch of money.

 

[XLR308]

I have a new Aero Precision set of recivevers tucked away in the safe for this round. I have just been waiting for the manufacturers and the R&D team (consumers) to work out the kinks. The original 1-7 twist seemed a little slow for the 90smk and I'm sure some are finding that out the hard way, I also recall recently reading about some bad batches of the 90smk factory load being out of spec and over pressure blowing primers.

 

[mdmp5]

I've tested 4 different 26" 223's by Bartlein, Shilen, Criterion, Mullerworks and soon Kreiger. I would love to see your chrono numbers shooting 80 ELD's out of an 18" barrel at 2875 in a 223 cause I don't believe it...

im.getting 2850 with 80's out of 4 differenr 26" 223's and it's within a few fps in every one of these barrels. 24.6g Varget which is on the higher side and 2.5" coal 80 Amax and 80 ELD. Not sure how your getting higher velocity out of a barrel 8" shorter and the bullet jammed down in the case 0.2" farther than me taking up that extra case capacity.

Actual numbers

am i reading this right? is this 300 yds?

 

[Birddog6424]

@Birddog6424 My ballistic calculator tells me exactly the same thing, is this all observed data downrange? The advertised BC sounds pretty awesome, if you're telling me it's accurate thats exciting.

I've fired about 40 of these rounds so far after load development. I'm very impressed. They are shooting around the .5 to .7 moa mark at 100 out to 500 without much issue. They still maintained a very good vertical dispersement at 900 and 1100 yards. But it was a windy day. And that's with an 11.2 SD.

That's what I need to tinker with. I think I'm about .2grs to .4grs high of the node, I need to play with it a little more and get it in to a single digit SD.

Hitting the 900 and 1100 yard target with the 130's versus the 123's was a noticeable difference. Especially the 1100 yarder. The 123's run out of gas at 1000 yards. So those are my confirmed velocities and drops on both of those loads, both loaded to mag length.. Those environmentals and velocities are essentially my last range report.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Thanks for the info!

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I finally got my Valkyrie together and have been shooting it some. I went with a Craddock Precision 22" 6.7 twist Rock Creek barrel with rifle +2" gas system.

I'm getting just under advertised velocities for all the loads and I'm sure my barrel will pick up some velocity in the next 50-100 rounds. Out of the gate the 90gr gold medal was right around 1/2moa with the 75gr FMJ and 60gr ballistic tip being just under 1MOA. After about 80 rounds I gave the barrel a good cleaning and everything tightened up. The gold medal is shooting itty bitty knots and the FMJ and ballistic tip are hovering right around 1/2moa. The gold medal is producing SD's of 5-7 for 10 shots and ES's around 20.

I'm having some issues with the 60gr ballistic tip loads. If I mag feed them they're getting jacked up enough going in that they'll only shoot 1MOA, but if I single feed them they tighten right up. Not a huge problem but just something I'd like to note. I've noticed the same thing with some other bullets in AR15's.

 

[Niles Coyote]

Good to hear it's shooting the 90's well. My 22" Bartlien from Craddock should be arriving in the next couple days.

 

[Diver160651]

and you didnt blow your damn face off?

I am sorry, but I am going to steel this ... use it whenever I can... Priceless

thanks