What is good SD/ES for Rimfire ammo?

[z7.jled]

Just shot some SK Pistol Match, SK Rifle Match and CCI SV through a RPR Rimfire over the magnetospeed
all 10 shot strings at 100yds

SK Rifle Match 1.2" 10 shot group tight with 2 low "flyers" and spread horizontal. 8 shots make it .5" group vertically, 1" horizontal (wind?)
Series 19 Shots:10 SK RM Min 1063 Max 1089 Avg 1070 S-D 7.6 ES 26

SK Pistol Match 1,2" 10 shot group, more scattered
Series 18 Shots: 10 Min 1022 Max 1058 Avg 1044 S-D 11 ES 36

CCI SV 10 shots 2" vertical group
Series 17 Shots :10 Min 1073 Max 1103 Avg 1089 S-D 9.7 ES 30

at 50 yds the SK RM and the CCI SV print 10 shot .5" groups consistently with the same POI.

 

[straightshooter1]

Single digit SD's and low ES's like what you got with the SK Rifle Match and CCI SV's. I look for ES's consistently under 30 and it always surprises me when I see CCI SV's doing that on quite a regular basis. . . . making it great for practice ammo if not for competition.

 

[z7.jled]

The cci sv does really well at 50 but falls apart at 100 for me, but I agreee it’s hard to not keep buying it for less than half the price of the sk ammo

 

[ingraham]

Time of flight and gravity affect the decision.
At 25 yards or less, most any standard velocity ammo is more than adequate.
At 50 yards, 10 fps difference in mv results in 7/100ths inch of vertical spread.
At 100 yards 10 fps produces about 1/4 inch vertical spread.
At 200 yards, 1 fps difference produces 1/10th inch of vertical
and at 300 yards the same 1 fps creates 7/16ths inch difference in poi.
Not hard to do the math. If you want bugholes or 5 shot groups in the teens
at 50 yards you'll need less than 25 fps ES to be able to accomplish it.
At 100 yards 0.5 moa will need less than 20 fps ES.
At 200 yards 0.5 moa will need less than 10 fps ES.
At 300 yards y'er gonna need to do a lot of praying.

Hit what you aim at.

 

[z7.jled]

Time of flight and gravity affect the decision.
At 25 yards or less, most any standard velocity ammo is more than adequate.
At 50 yards, 10 fps difference in mv results in 7/100ths inch of vertical spread.
At 100 yards 10 fps produces about 1/4 inch vertical spread.
At 200 yards, 1 fps difference produces 1/10th inch of vertical
and at 300 yards the same 1 fps creates 7/16ths inch difference in poi.
Not hard to do the math. If you want bugholes or 5 shot groups in the teens
at 50 yards you'll need less than 25 fps ES to be able to accomplish it.
At 100 yards 0.5 moa will need less than 20 fps ES.
At 200 yards 0.5 moa will need less than 10 fps ES.
At 300 yards y'er gonna need to do a lot of praying.

Hit what you aim at.

I understand all of that, can 22lr ammo be found that had ES less than 20fps? What about 15fps? If so, what brand/line typically? I also understand that the rifle and lot# of ammo are huge variables

 

[straightshooter1]

I understand all of that, can 22lr ammo be found that had ES less than 20fps? What about 15fps? If so, what brand/line typically? I also understand that the rifle and lot# of ammo are huge variables

I'd say you'd should take a close look at Lapua's and RWS's high end products.

With the batch of Center-X I have, it often is less than 20 and sometimes Federal's Ultra Match does that for me too.

 

[Rangemaster]

Just shot some SK Pistol Match, SK Rifle Match and CCI SV through a RPR Rimfire over the magnetospeed
all 10 shot strings at 100yds

SK Rifle Match 1.2" 10 shot group tight with 2 low "flyers" and spread horizontal. 8 shots make it .5" group vertically, 1" horizontal (wind?)
Series 19 Shots:10 SK RM Min 1063 Max 1089 Avg 1070 S-D 7.6 ES 26

SK Pistol Match 1,2" 10 shot group, more scattered
Series 18 Shots: 10 Min 1022 Max 1058 Avg 1044 S-D 11 ES 36

CCI SV 10 shots 2" vertical group
Series 17 Shots :10 Min 1073 Max 1103 Avg 1089 S-D 9.7 ES 30

at 50 yds the SK RM and the CCI SV print 10 shot .5" groups consistently with the same POI.

Well, you might have to do what I did. I bought a 50 round box of just about every type of match ammo to find out what my rifle likes. This is very helpful when it comes time to reorder and shit might be out of stock.

Mine loved RwS Red and SK Pistol Match.
2nd inline was wolf and eley black.

 

[justin amateur]

I've tested just about every brand of rimfire available.
Not 5 shots, not 10 shots, a minimum of 50, preferably 100 shots.
17 hmr, 17 wsm, 22 wmr, 22lr at 50, 100 and 200 yards.
I have no life and am easily entertained.

There is no "find the brand y'er rifle likes".
It's an internet fallacy. I think it's a sales gimmick promulgated by retailers.
They want you to spend y'er money on their products.
If they can get you to believe the lie, you'll increase their profit margin.
The quality of the ammunition is not a constant, it changes hour by hour as it's manufactured.
The rated muzzle velocity on the box is an estimation.
If the word "Match" is on the label, it ain't.

The truth is: Find the "batch" y'er rifle likes.
It'll be the ammunition that was manufactured with the least amount of defects,
most consistent primer/power amounts, similar bullet weights that produces the most consistent trajectories.
You'll note I didn't say brand. I've had cheap bulk ammo that produced amazing results
and high end supposed "match" ammo that was only useful for the kids to plug soda cans with.
It's not the brand that's critical...it's the quality of the ammunition that will determine if it was worth the money.

Mouthy old coot, ain't I?

SD means nothing to me.
ES is all I care about.

Decent ammo will have an ES of less than 40 fps for 100 shots.
Practice ammo will show an ES less than 60 fps.
Plinking ammo will show an ES less than 80 fps,
and bulk ammo will have cartridges that might not even chamber
due to out of spec brass and tilted bullets.

The stuff with less than 20 fps ES for 100 shots?
That's what's called "magic"....rare and hard to obtain.

 

[Lynn Jr]

Eley is what all the best shooters use so give it a try.
I also don't care what the SD is ES tells the tale.

 

[Just Chuck]

The cci sv does really well at 50 but falls apart at 100 for me, but I agree it’s hard to not keep buying it for less than half the price of the sk ammo

That is something I have seen also, but yet to definitively prove. I too use it (CCI SV) for practice and am using SK Standard + for match.

 

[justin amateur]

Sure wish CCI SV and SK Standard + were capable of decent results for my style of shooting.
The last orders of both were barely bulk ammo.
Chrony numbers reeked as did results.
1.5 inches of vertical at 50 yards for 50 shots.
Bad batches and nothing to be done about it.

 

[BlastersAreCool]

I just bought 500 rounds of cci sv from midway and it looks and seems to reflect your findings Justin. disappointed

 

[justin amateur]

CCI 22lr quality has not impressed me, at all for the past 4 years.
SV, Green Tag, Pistol Match and their hi-v offerings produced disappointing results.
Visible cartridge defects, FTF, MV spread are not indicators of a quality product.
17hmr and 22wmr from CCI show the same problems.
As long as it sells they have no reason to improve the quality.

 

[SporterII]

Four cents a round delivered , CCI is delivering more than can be expected imho.

 

[billmeek]

I tried the Green Tag and was unimpressed. The CCI Standard Velocity was slightly more accurate than the Green Tag. But at a nickel (or less) a round, the CCI SV is good value. At shorter ranges (up to 50 yards), the CCI Quiet beat the CCI SV.

 

[z7.jled]

I may have found a magic lot of Eley Target, only 10 shots down range with it, .1” group at 50 yds and SD of 6, es of 17. More testing to follow to see if these 10 shots were a fluke and of the accuracy holds relatively true at 100 yds

Either way I have 500 rounds of it

 

[tman300wm]

I've been blessed in that my Sako Quad shoots everything really well out to 50 yards. However, after 50 yards things get interesting. So far, Eley Match (black box) is either great or piss pore, depending on the lot number. Lapua Center-X produces outstanding groups, but again it boils down to lot number. Lapua Midas + is also producing excellent groups. That said, I'm getting good groups at 100 out of Eley Club as well, but again, it depends on the lot. I'm now in the habit of purchasing several lots of several brands and seeing what performs best out to 100 yards. Today I ordered several thousand rounds of Lapua Center X in a perticular lot that my rifle really likes. From my experience, I'd say find something your rifle shoots well (lot number) and order as much as you can. I believe someone else mentioned that match grade ain't always match grade, and I couldn't agree more. I have had some $3.00 a box ammo that flat hammered, and I have some $20.00 a box ammo that is only good for making noise. I'd also agree with ES being the ticket.

 

[BlastersAreCool]

Im headed out to the range later this afternoon and gonna chrono some ammo. currently, the plan is to chrono;
CCI SV,Center X, SK Match Rifle, Standard Plus, and Norma Match 22. I will report back my findings

 

[straightshooter1]

Im headed out to the range later this afternoon and gonna chrono some ammo. currently, the plan is to chrono;
CCI SV,Center X, SK Match Rifle, Standard Plus, and Norma Match 22. I will report back my findings

When you get back with those numbers, it'll be interesting to see how they compare to what I have on file (see attached).

. . . and I might just add you data to my list???

 

[BlastersAreCool]

When you get back with those numbers, it'll be interesting to see how they compare to what I have on file (see attached).

. . . and I might just add you data to my list???

 

[BlastersAreCool]

I only got to do center x and CCI sv yesterday BUT, If i can make it out Ill do the others?

 

[BlastersAreCool]

When you get back with those numbers, it'll be interesting to see how they compare to what I have on file (see attached).

. . . and I might just add you data to my list???

 

[TIMMYTOY]

Only ten rounds
Es at muzzle and 50yards 11
at 250 yards 21
SK Long range match out of a Vudoo
This lot shoots very well ! Did have a lot that had muzzle velocity of 1130 and that was Awesome (less dialing/hold overs)