What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

Doyputasos

Doyputasos

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Jan 11, 2012
235
2
Southern California
#1
My buddy and I just stretched out our rifles past 1k yd today for the first time. We are both shooting stock savages, mine the m12 LRP in 260 and his the 10 FCP-K in 308. We had one possible hit and many other shots within 6" on my 9"x16.5" ar500 silhouette. I am wondering if my target is too small for this distance and our serious yet novice approach. So, what is your experience and what do you shoot at out past 1k?

ps, I am regularly able to get 5 shot groups under 0.5" at 100 yd.
 
#2
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

My background is as a military shooter so I'm partial to the standard E-type silhouette.

While many will immediately respond with "Bullshit! That's way too big! Aim small, miss small!" my experience as a military trainer has been to teach using crawl - walk - run methodology. I'll show you first; teach you; coach you through it; then train and evaluate you. If you can't hit the target or see where you're making left-right errors you're wasting time and money and not learning anything (either through positive or negative feedback).

A military E-type silhouette is roughly 40 inches tall and 20 inches wide -- giving you a 4 minute of angle elevation fudge factor for ranging at 1,000 yards and a 2 MOA wide target to allow for minor wind call errors (at 1,000 yards). As you walk further back from your targets your miss error margin becomes smaller as bullets lose velocity and time of flight increases (and effects of weather have increasing influence on your math and estimates).

You can get by either shooting only at the head (a 1 MOA target at 1,000), or give yourself a little extra error allowance by going to an IPSC target. I am very partial to Ryan's Big Dog Steel Targets (a site sponsor).

482012_10151025065587779_697814616_n.jpg


532244_10151025067387779_1885650774_n.jpg
 
#5
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

We put up a range, joint share. 5" & 10" square's from 200 -1200 yards, at 1k & 1200 we also have a 15"x18" rectangular plate. You can figure out what gets shot at the most.
Because of property agreements and such, we can drive to 1200, but with fences and limited accsess, after 1200 we have portable, now somewhat permenent full size IPSC"s to 2100 yards.
Yes they are larger than moa for the most part, but there is barely ever a day that the wind won't kick your ass. Somedays a hit on the edge is good enough, other days you can try bring it to center, just depends on the person.
At 1850, 2000, and 2073, a hit is a hit! We do have a bunch of templates to paint kill zones on the targets for reference, but with the number of idiots using the place, just usually paint what we're going to shoot for the day as quick as possible, the wind is only 5 minutes away.
Also if we're going to have a freindly competition, we have 12 of those sniper's hide reactive targets we can litter the range with, just don't leave them out for theft reasons.
 
#6
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

Here is our 1,000 yard target. A 3x5' AR500 steel plate. The circles are 4" in diameter.
This forms a larger circle to the eye with open sights. The guys using a high powered scope can see the smaller spots with no problem. The air has to be under 60 degrees F in order to use this combo-target spot. As soon as it warms up, the spots just burr into a large floating spot.
The hits are from a 91/30 PU scoped rifle, An M1A with Leatherwood scope and a Swede-41 Sniper rifle.












We have clear skies and no humidity. You can see the spot with the unaided eye in the morning.
65300.jpg
 
#7
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

These targets are always popular. Gives the shooter lots of options and a whole lot of fun to shoot. If you want long range realistic hostage option like what K&M has on their car lane, we can also make a full size IPSC with offest holes for hanging. The offset holes make it so that instead of the chest plate being centered the full size IPSC is off center so the Head Target is fixed over the IPSC's shoulder.

headsup.jpg


http://www.bigdogsteel.com/snhirehechta.html
 
#8
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mwsenoj</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So, what is your experience and what do you shoot at out past 1k? </div></div>How far past 1K? At 1500 yards one MOA is......

I have seen 11x17 at 1000 at Rifles Only. That's small. I like 12x24 at 1000. That's small, too, but doable without too much trouble.

For training people, 3MOA (36" round) at 1000 is fine - and a confidence builder.
 
#9
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

I agree with Graham, We keep a 14x14 at 980 and a 36" round.

The round works great to get folks on the steel and to test loads..

The primary target is the little one, it will keep you humble:)

Past 1000.. Our 1530 target is 36" round...
 
#11
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

The advantage to using an IPSC-sized and shaped target is you can turn it on its side and generally see how you'd fare against something like a pig, coyote, or deer.
 
#12
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

Hmmm... Me thinks I understand why I get so pissed off when I'm missing a 66% IPSC at 1K. I like the idea of bigger but aiming smaller in order to see errors better. Although if you want humbling... ssatt68 and I were shooting at a 4" plate at around 950
crazy.gif
. One of us hit it once, but it was so damn small and the mirage was so bad we saw it move 1x for each of us. When we got down there we only saw 1 clear impact, so at some point one our hits was impacting either the stand or the strap. Point being, even if you are trying to hit ridiculously small it can get difficult in warm conditions to even see the impact period if you go to small. It was extremely fun trying though
grin.gif
 
#14
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

At TVP they've got 12" squares out to about 1200. and I know the mile target and ELR targets are bigger but not sure how big.

The mile might be 18" square? I'll to try find out, but it'd be nice if someone who knew could chime in.

**ADDED**

ELR targets (out to 2350) were said to be .75 to 1.25MOA. According to the thread for the match.
 
#15
#16
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

I shoot an 18"x24" silhouette and if one of my shooting friends brings his Larue, then I also shoot an 11.5"x17" Larue.

Neither is a piece of cake at 1,900 yards (our standard shooting distance).

Jeffvn
 
#17
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

My 1500 yd plus range has a 24" wide torso target and a 4x4' plate. I agree with the reasoning especially past 1000 to have a bigger plate to be able to walk people on to center. I went 4 for 5 at 1780 on the big plate last time with the 338 edge. Was pretty happy that they were all near center.

Not to brag, but at 1000 yards the 66% IPSC started getting pretty routine, so we hung a 25% one that is 4" across. When my bro-in-law tagged that 3 times in a row at 1000 with his new 308 it was pretty fun. It is not too tough with the .260's, I'm VERY pleased with that cartridge!

Of course wind and mirage can always screw everything up!
 
#18
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

We have full size IPSC out to 1000, along with 10x10 plates out to 900. At 1000 we have a 12" disc in addition to the IPSC. We also have 4x4, 4x8, and 5x10's out to 500. At 1100 and 1200 we have full size Mil-E, and at 1640 we have a 25x49 plate.
 
#19
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

I had a local guy make me an 18" square and a 24" square. I have hit them both at one mile, and have hit the 24" multiple times, on multiple occasions @ 2k yards.

At 1760 yards the 18" is equal to just a hair under 1 moa. (1 MOA = 18.42" at that distance)

My best day, I hit the 18" 8 out of 10 shots, the first and last were misses from 1760.

At varying distances over a mile I like the 24". It gives me a little more margin of error, but still keeps me really close to 1 moa, which I think of as damn fine shooting.

Dark

 
#20
Re: What size steel are you shooting out past 1k?

A training tip for coaches and spotters (using military E-types) is being able to talk your shooter into the center of the target using shades and favors -- holding on the target or into the wind and shooting quickly without having to reach up and diddle with dials, or coaching new shooters into the center if they have standard or hunting scopes without mil dots or hashes.

Obviously a shooter quarters the target with his crosshairs to "Hold center." Next correction is "5 right" (or left) and he can hold windage on the neck edge (particularly fast if you haven't dialed in a drift correction). "10 right" and he can hold on the right edge. "15 right" and he can guesstimate 5 inches off the right or left edge and spin the round into the target, riding a right-left wind correction, just by holding as winds gust and subside.

Same technique for IPSCs, but instead of calling the inch values you use "Left neckline' or "Left edge."
 
#22
I use a 14" square target when I am out past 700 meters or so. I have a 5" round, a 10" round and the 14" square at my "range". I basically hike out to a few known distances of 710M, 900M 1010M. There are definitely days where I scare the target more than I actually hit it when at ~1000yd...

Perhaps I should move up in size!

-Mark
 
#26
I went from 3/8" to 1/4" mild steel for my 24"X24" mile and beyond target. It's a bit of a hike to set the target up and the thinner metal is considerably lighter. The .338 LM doesn't dent it too badly at that range. I also think it makes a more audible sound, although it has to be pretty calm to hear the hit at a mile.

-Shaky
 
#27
I love to use 1/4" Premium AR500 for long range targets. Its plenty hard for rifles at 600-700 yards and it rings like a bell. We have some 1/4" targets here and they are suprisingly tough. The 100% IPSC target is probably my favorite in 1/4" set at about 1000 yards.

Yes, much lighter to hike to and from if need be!!!
 
#29
We have a few in stock, and we could get one down to Texas for $175 shipped. Thanks for the interest. You guys are certainly keeping us busy! Glad you are enjoying the targets.
 
#33
I use 12x12 1/2 inch AR500. I just make sure I set up where I can see splash all around...I learn as much from my misses as I do my hits. Id get bigger steel, but that chit is heavy lugging it all over the Dez. My next purchase is 24x24 1/4 inch AR500 for 900 plus yards, lighter weight, better ding, and plenty resilient for that distance.
I just rattle can it white...anybody try other colors?
Oh yea...not a bad idea to take a 2 1/2 gallon water can extinguisher and a shovel with you just in case of a small ricochet fire... I don't want to be "that guy."
 
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#35
Made a 40" wide x 29" tall backer target with an 8" round hanging about 6" in front of the backer. Painted the backer white and the 8" plate is bright orange. Use this at 1760 yd., the 8" plate is clearly visible in decent conditions using a 15 power scope. Hitting that 8" plate at a mile makes me smile.
 

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#38
#39
#40
sinister said:
My background is as a military shooter so I'm partial to the standard E-type silhouette.

While many will immediately respond with "Bullshit! That's way too big! Aim small, miss small!" my experience as a military trainer has been to teach using crawl - walk - run methodology. I'll show you first; teach you; coach you through it; then train and evaluate you. If you can't hit the target or see where you're making left-right errors you're wasting time and money and not learning anything (either through positive or negative feedback).

A military E-type silhouette is roughly 40 inches tall and 20 inches wide -- giving you a 4 minute of angle elevation fudge factor for ranging at 1,000 yards and a 2 MOA wide target to allow for minor wind call errors (at 1,000 yards). As you walk further back from your targets your miss error margin becomes smaller as bullets lose velocity and time of flight increases (and effects of weather have increasing influence on your math and estimates).

You can get by either shooting only at the head (a 1 MOA target at 1,000), or give yourself a little extra error allowance by going to an IPSC target. I am very partial to Ryan's Big Dog Steel Targets (a site sponsor).

482012_10151025065587779_697814616_n.jpg


532244_10151025067387779_1885650774_n.jpg
Click to expand...

I was "crawling" in July of last year.
I had no issue shooting .3" groups at 100 yards, but my first outing at LR kicked my ass.

I've had three outings with sinister, and his steel, in the past year and got a 4th round hit on steel at a mile in the last outing.
Second round hit at a mile on the second day.

I will attest wholeheartedly to his methods and opinion.
If you want a challenge, get some little circles or squares to spice it up.
They're cheap anyway.
 
#42
lostcoyote said:
9011460276_04ec374d39.jpg


i had kurt at LVsteeltargets make this one for me
1m (39") high
1/2m (19.5") wide

the 10" square head corresponds to 1moa at 1000 yards
and the height being 1 meter makes it 1 mil at 1000 yards

i had him round all corners to so that i wouldn't get jabbed by a corner
Click to expand...

That is a pretty sweet looking target. I want to get one similar to that. Right now I just have a swinging 14 inch square hanging from a home made frame. It works but that is cool!
 
#43
Where we shoot it is very difficult to determine where a miss goes so we shoot at a 36" x 48" mild steel 3/8". It saves a lot of time getting on "paper" at 1760 and 2000 yards. At 1000 we use a 14" x 18" man shape. We have an antelope shaped target made of two 3/16" layers of mild steel we set up at a half mile for fun but it has a lot of holes through it from 300 win mags and 208 grain Amaxs
 
#44
I have a 45% IPCS target from JC steel and its been doing really well out to about 750 yards. But I just cant seem to touch it out at 1000 and that really bothers me. Im a student and don't have an unlimited budget and was wondering what kinda steel I need for those long shots? I don't want to be paying out the butt for AR500 (even though it is a good buy)
Good read boys! Keep it up!
 
#46
Plate

I am shooting on a 16" plate out of soft steel at the moment, its is 0,8" thick. It works fine with my .338 LM at 700yards. At 400yards the impacts causing to much damage. With .308 at 700yard you don´t hear the impact, but maybe see it swing.
Depending on the color i use it is possible to see the hit´s at 700yard with a 60x. It saves me a lot of time as i am shooting in a difficult area.
 

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#47
Jackomason said:
I have a 45% IPCS target from JC steel and its been doing really well out to about 750 yards. But I just cant seem to touch it out at 1000 and that really bothers me. Im a student and don't have an unlimited budget and was wondering what kinda steel I need for those long shots? I don't want to be paying out the butt for AR500 (even though it is a good buy)
Good read boys! Keep it up!
Click to expand...


For the long stuff, try our 1/4" AR500. Will save some money, and it rings louder. Thats all we use at 1000 plus yards!!
 
#50
jcvibby said:
For the long stuff, try our 1/4" AR500. Will save some money, and it rings louder. Thats all we use at 1000 plus yards!!
Click to expand...
Jake,
The club I shoot with now has availability to create a place for 1300-2200yd shooting and are deciding what to place out there. They have to consider a number of variables, including the likelihood that shooters new to ELR shooting (past 1200), which is most of us, will be a bit pressed to get on target at first. Also, we have allow that there will be larger calibers such as .375 Cheytac and even .50 BMG.

Thus there is consideration to place a central target with an array of others surrounding it to provide good wind age and elevation feedback. Also they are looking at 1/2" AR500 out of concern for longevity with the larger calibers.

In your opinion, will the 1/4" hold up? Or 3/8? Or is the 1/2" in this case the right choice?
 
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