What to buy getting into long range

[KentuckyKestrel]

I’m a baby when it comes to long range. I’m looking for recommendations on what the first pieces of gear/kit I should acquire before I hit the range.

Obviously the starting point is a gun and ammo. That’s not the info looking for. Now if it’s something on the gun, I’m all ears. Should I get a chronograph off rip, a kestrel, or should I maybe look into a shooting bag? I’m not on a strict budget, but like I’m not made of money.

Thanks for the help!

 

[FimRire RongLifle]

A training class will be the best piece of gear you ever buy and as long as it's practiced it lasts forever. Besides a rifle a support bag would be my next stop however a good class will help you with all the needs and give you a feel for their use to make decisions

 

[hafejd30]

Gun
Optic
Ammo
Bipod
Rear bag
Ballistic app or kestrel
Range finder (can be stand alone or paired to kestrel or app)
A class/range/friends you can learn from

Read a bunch of threads on here and learn what you need or want. The rabbit hole is deep and it’s easy to get far into it where $$ doesn’t necessarily mean you’ll do better. 6.5 CM would be the easy button on caliber.

 

[Maurygold]

Gun - ruger precision, or tikka t3 tac a1 (6.5 creed moor)
Optic - vortex PST w/ vortex or ARC rings
Ammo - Hornady precision hunter or match
Bipod - Harris (or atlas if wanting to spend money)
Rear bag - Cole-tac or armageddon
Ballistic app or kestrel - iPhone app (ballistic AE)
Range finder (can be stand alone or paired to kestrel or app) - sig 6k
A class/range/friends you can learn from

Read a bunch of threads on here and learn what you need or want. The rabbit hole is deep and it’s easy to get far into it where $$ doesn’t necessarily mean you’ll do better. 6.5 CM would be the easy button on caliber.

a few suggestions

 

[Devildog]

The first thing you need is a lot of money.

 

[Maurygold]

The first thing you need is a lot of money.

Try boating. What most people would consider an absurd firearm collection won’t buy one decent motor.

You can do a lot with 4-5k in todays market getting into this hobby.

 

[FieldGaugeFailure]

Try boating. What most people would consider an absurd firearm collection won’t buy one decent motor.

You can do a lot with 4-5k in todays market getting into this hobby.

I came from car racing. My tire budget each year alone could buy a few Barrett MRADs. Shooting has been a nice budget hobby.

 

[USMC22]

some form of data book.

 

[hafejd30]

a few suggestions

My suggestion would be

Tikka or a custom from px to start
Athlon or Burris XTRIII from px
Atlas CAL for bipod

I had a couple Viper PST and they weren’t reliable enough for me to recommend. I’d spend the money on a rifle on a tikka before a Ruger. But rugers are still decent. I’d easily get an atlas before a Harris. But the Harris will work if needed and I still have 5 or 6. I just think the bipod upgrade would be something he could swing right away and appreciate.

 

[FuhQ]

The first thing you need is a lot of money.

Facts...

 

[Ronws]

Taking a class or lessons is a great idea. Especially one where they have rifles and gear to loan you and you can see what works best for you.

For some time, the go to for long range was 6.5 Man Bun but it does not have to be that way. Really, any rifle where you can manage recoil and get consistent results is the one. However, that changes for some.

Depends on the job, really. If you just want to ring steel or punch a hole in paper, which are valid pursuits and lots of fun and full of hair-pulling challenges, you don't need a big and heavy bullet.

If you are hunting game of assorted sizes at differing distances, I would think nothing less than 7 Rem Mag or 7 mm PRC. Someone I know hunts Aoudad with a .300 Win Mag.

Someone else hunts everything with a .300 PRC and other with .300 WSM.

That's why the suggestion to take a class can really help. Even if you build a medium priced rig, you will start with more knowledge to say, okay, that action and barrel are good. That trigger is good. That scope looks good to my eye (a very subjective thing that should not be overlooked.)

My amateur opinion and pick is 7 PRC for feral hog up to elk. Though, hog hunting, I would be better off using my Windham Weaponry R16SFST-308 (AR-10.)

I have a few other .308 W rifles and really anything 400 yards and under is going to be fine with that. In fact, for hunting, which is my primary activity, I go by impact velocity rather than energy. So, average 2700 - 2800 fps MV in .308 is good to about 300 yards. And that is fine for the heavily wooded south where I live and the southeast.

In the western part of my state is desert and there is a state drawn hunt for mule deer and they say in the description to be able to shoot to at least 200 yards. Turns out that mule deer cannot be harvested by putting salt on their tails.

I think with kestrel in your id, you are probably settled on some ideas and just looking for confirmation? Happens to the best of us.

 

[CK1.0]

The best advice I can offer is to remember that it's not just about the gun, it's a "rifle system".

Start with gun/bipod/bag... but plan accordingly, because it's really more like: gun/tripod/binos/pack/reloading room...

 

[kthomas]

Training classes - I would suggest Rifles Only. Best money spent on the sport.

Besides that, a decent bipod and rear bag. Kestrel 5700 elite and good chrono are decent first buys as well.

 

[Nik H]

The best advice I can offer is to remember that it's not just about the gun, it's a "rifle system".

Start with gun/bipod/bag... but plan accordingly, because it's really more like: gun/tripod/binos/pack/reloading room...

^^^this and don't forget that you are a large part of the system and take a class since you are initially an inconsistent part of the system.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Lottery tickets. You gonna need them.

And, yes, a class or two.

Sirhr

 

[KentuckyKestrel]

I think with kestrel in your id, you are probably settled on some ideas and just looking for confirmation? Happens to the best of us.

It’s on the list, but I made it my tag because I really like the adorable little murder bird that is the American Kestrel.

 

[KentuckyKestrel]

I can from car racing.

I’m a car guy too. This hobby is light work comparatively. Especially because I’m cursed with being way too into the high end machines.

 

[jetmd]

A good level either scope or rail mounted.

Even the slightest cant at ELR distance makes a big difference.

A budget friendly accessory that pulls its share of the load.

 

[MO Fugga]

Go to Brownells and get a Garmin Xero.

 

[JoshPutman]

I came from car racing. My tire budget each year alone could buy a few Barrett MRADs. Shooting has been a nice budget hobby.

My stepdad used to say "How do you make a small fortune in racing? Start with a large one."

 

[FieldGaugeFailure]

My stepdad used to say "How do you make a small fortune in racing? Start with a large one."

Highly accurate. Fuel budget (not car, but towing cross country) was roughly what my ammo budget is each year now.

 

[WTF-2-EDC]

I started a couple years ago...put a muzzle brake and aftermarket buttpad on the 300WIN (Rem 700) with a Timney trigger and topped it with a big NightForce SHV 56. Makes the target at 1000 yards look large. My effective range was 600 yards max on a good day but one day being trained by a competition shooter had be hitting 1000 yard steel before burning 50 rounds. Nearly flatline shooting till you exceed 1000 yards.
Nothin' fancy but it works.

 

[Bluedog82]

 

[Ronws]

Highly accurate. Fuel budget (not car, but towing cross country) was roughly what my ammo budget is each year now.

Same thing was said with how to make a million dollars in the music industry. Start with 2 million.

Also, what do you call a bass player without a girlfriend?


Homeless.

 

[TheJeanyus]

I came from car racing. My tire budget each year alone could buy a few Barrett MRADs. Shooting has been a nice budget hobby.

I tried to explain to my gear head friend group the other day that I have to do my "racing" now in PRS/NRL 22 matches because even the poor man's car racing with a beater Miata in local autocross is too expensive.

 

[cas6969]

The first thing you need is a lot of money.

First thing you need is a long range.

So.... property?


I shoot long range by putting my scopes on backwards, not nearly as much fun.

 

[W54/XM-388]

I’m a baby when it comes to long range. I’m looking for recommendations on what the first pieces of gear/kit I should acquire before I hit the range.

I would help a lot if you could define your definition of "long range" by answering these questions:

What is the farthest distance you currently shoot?
What distance would you like to be able to shoot to accurately?
What is the maximum distance of the ranges you will frequently visit?
Do you have any physical conditions that makes recoil a problem or weight on equipment a problem?

Do you have a $10k + budget or what is your expected budget range?

 

[NateVA]

I think there are a lot of great suggestions that have already been hit on in this thread. I'll just add that a good shooting tripod has been a monumental game changer for a variety of shooting/hunting activities for me. Also, a suppressor.

 

[WTF-2-EDC]

At the risk of being labeled a pot stirrer, I would not recommend long range hunting to you. First, the benefit of long range shooting is knowing you can make a difficult shot with confidence. The benefit of hunting is the hunt itself, the kill is the end of the fun and the beginning of the work. Unless I am doing ADC work, I prefer to hunt with a bow...there is nothing better than getting extremely close to your prey. It's the most amazing feeling to be right there and the animal doesn't know it.



If you take a shot at an animal 1000 yards away, it's a risk cuz animals move...one step between trigger squeeze and impact can be the difference between a dead animal or a wounded animal and it'll be a while before you can get the place it was hit to see what's what. Finding a wounded animal is no fun and all too often, impossible. It's nothing a noob should do.

Now for practice I recommend the Bulls Bag X7...finest rest there is IMHO.



They are compatible with any type of firearm (all rifles, shotguns and pistols)

 

[NateVA]

If you take a shot at an animal 1000 yards away, it's a risk cuz animals move...one step between trigger squeeze and impact can be the difference between a dead animal or a wounded animal

Doesn't that argument mean archery is also unethical because that happens with arrows too (and animals hear the sound before the arrow gets there)?

 

[Ronws]

Doesn't that argument mean archery is also unethical because that happens with arrows too (and animals hear the sound before the arrow gets there)?

In any case, we are lying to the animal. For archery, you are often in a tree, all kinds of scent hider, what not.

At distance, the animal does not smell you or know you are there.

Granted, some bullets can do the job, even relying on just impact velocity of 1800 fps (I prefer 2000 fps.) The problem with a long range shot at an animal is the time of flight. There can be just enough time for the animal to move and the shot no longer drops him. Now, he is wounded.

Sure, there a guys who have made kill shots past 500 yards. I think it is better to shoot closer in, depending on the round. Average factory load of .308 should be less than 300 yards for good impact velocity. 7 mm PRC can stretch you out farther.

In the end, the ethical shot is the one that you can, without a doubt, bring down the animal. The farther you shoot, the worse it gets.

 

[NateVA]

Granted, some bullets can do the job, even relying on just impact velocity of 1800 fps (I prefer 2000 fps.)

Hornady ELD-M bullets are good down to about 1300-1400 fps impact velocity. And they perform better on North American game than basically any of the bullets that need 1800-2000 (Barnes, Berger, Nosler, ELD-X). Hunters in the US tend to use tough bullets that don't perform well because our game animals don't have as thick of hides/bones/muscles as game in Africa for example. So the bullets aren't getting the impact resistance they need to perform well. There's a lot of people pointlessly using bullets like Barnes TSX for whitetail deer. It'll pulverize the hell out of a rock on the other side of the animal but that's not really the goal.

I think it is better to shoot closer in, depending on the round. Average factory load of .308 should be less than 300 yards for good impact velocity. 7 mm PRC can stretch you out farther.

With a .308 using factory Hornady 168gr ELD-M you still have 1800 fps velocity at 600 yards and that's more than the ELD-M needs to perform.

All of this is beside the point, since I don't think the OP ever mentioned hunting? I just felt that some stuff had to be responded to. Most of what hunters think they know about terminal ballistics comes from using suboptimal bullets. More people need to learn this stuff. The average hunter's knowledge of terminal ballistics is worse than non-existent.

 

[WTF-2-EDC]

Doesn't that argument mean archery is also unethical because that happens with arrows too (and animals hear the sound before the arrow gets there)?

You completely missed the entire point. Bow hunting is the challenge of getting so close you smell the animal. My moose was at 10' when I drew. I was nocking an arrow and when I looked up, all I saw was legs. All hunters miss eventually...some wound animals. But you can stack the odds of a clean kill in your favor...just not at 1000 yards. And that elk above, he was only shot with the camera.

 

[KentuckyKestrel]

All of this is beside the point, since I don't think the OP ever mentioned hunting?

I didn’t, but hunting is certainly on the table for me. With long range hunting, I’m not going to go out of my way for a long shot, but I’m not going to let 700 yards decide whether or not I leave empty handed.

I would help a lot if you could define your definition of "long range" by answering these questions:

What is the farthest distance you currently shoot?
What distance would you like to be able to shoot to accurately?
What is the maximum distance of the ranges you will frequently visit?
Do you have any physical conditions that makes recoil a problem or weight on equipment a problem?

Do you have a $10k + budget or what is your expected budget range?

Longe range in my case would be 100 yards. I would like to have the capability of reaching out to 1500 yds. As for budget, I’m looking at ~$8K.

 

[NateVA]

You completely missed the entire point. Bow hunting is the challenge of getting so close you smell the animal. My moose was at 10' when I drew. I was nocking an arrow and when I looked up, all I saw was legs. All hunters miss eventually...some wound animals. But you can stack the odds of a clean kill in your favor...just not at 1000 yards. And that elk above, he was only shot with the camera.

I think you missed my point. Archery and long range hunting share the problem of animals possibly moving prior to the projectile getting there. For LRH it's because of sheer time, whereas archery it's because of sound and also maybe time depending on distance. So that's obviously not an actual issue to you.

I didn’t, but hunting is certainly on the table for me.

If your hunting is anything other than treestand hunting, bump a good shooting tripod up to a top priority. It drastically improves basically all forms of hunting with a rifle. I shot a coues deer this fall at 400 yards across a canyon from a hill so steep that prone wasn't an option. If I didn't have my tripod I wouldn't have been able to make the shot at all. But because I did, I probably could have easily shot out to 600+ from that same position. I'll also reiterate that a suppressor would be especially great for hunting too. You don't have to worry about ear protection and animals react less to suppressed gunshots.

For more info on how a tripod is going to help your field shooting, I saved this post from Diver160651 from the second page of this thread.

Advanced Marksmanship - Tips & Tricks, from Tripods to Stage Examples for - UKD Team Field Match or Hunting

looking forward to the tripod class also, you are putting out so much info, i really appreciate the time your putting into this.

www.snipershide.com

 

[Ronws]

Hornady ELD-M bullets are good down to about 1300-1400 fps impact velocity. And they perform better on North American game than basically any of the bullets that need 1800-2000 (Barnes, Berger, Nosler, ELD-X). Hunters in the US tend to use tough bullets that don't perform well because our game animals don't have as thick of hides/bones/muscles as game in Africa for example. So the bullets aren't getting the impact resistance they need to perform well. There's a lot of people pointlessly using bullets like Barnes TSX for whitetail deer. It'll pulverize the hell out of a rock on the other side of the animal but that's not really the goal.

With a .308 using factory Hornady 168gr ELD-M you still have 1800 fps velocity at 600 yards and that's more than the ELD-M needs to perform.

All of this is beside the point, since I don't think the OP ever mentioned hunting? I just felt that some stuff had to be responded to. Most of what hunters think they know about terminal ballistics comes from using suboptimal bullets. More people need to learn this stuff. The average hunter's knowledge of terminal ballistics is worse than non-existent.

I have known at least one person to strongly advocate using copper monolithic, such as the Hornady CX Outfitter for larger animals at longer ranges, though you can use them on whitetail as close as 300 yards and in. The reason being that while CX will still expand (the X part of the name) and it is also more likely to create an exit wound than the regular cup and core with lead projectile will. The reason this is advantageous is because it can help with lung collapse and exsanguination, which can help leave a blood trail to track down the harvest.

The one thing to watch out for that I have also learned from others is that copper only bullets can lead to some fouling, so, it pays to clean meticulously, which does not hurt my feelings.

 

[NateVA]

I have known at least one person to strongly advocate using copper monolithic, such as the Hornady CX Outfitter for larger animals at longer ranges, though you can use them on whitetail as close as 300 yards and in. The reason being that while CX will still expand (the X part of the name) and it is also more likely to create an exit wound than the regular cup and core with lead projectile will. The reason this is advantageous is because it can help with lung collapse and exsanguination, which can help leave a blood trail to track down the harvest.

The one thing to watch out for that I have also learned from others is that copper only bullets can lead to some fouling, so, it pays to clean meticulously, which does not hurt my feelings.

Unless you're hunting buffalo in Africa, monolithic bullets suck. And the most pervasive issue with hunter bullet selection in the US is people overestimating impact resistance. The below comparison in the video is an ELD-M impacting at 1370 fps vs a Barnes TSX impacting at 2300 fps. The ELD-M has the same temporary wound cavity and a better permanent wound cavity despite having about half the velocity. This guy does a lot of videos on bullet choice using organic ballistic gel at varying distances as well as him actually hunting animals at long range then showing the damage.

I can't stress enough that almost everything most hunters think they know about terminal ballistics is wrong. Once I decided to look into it I got much better results. I get better wounds using ELD bullets from my 6.5CM than I ever did using Barnes TTSX out of a 300WM.

 

[W54/XM-388]

I didn’t, but hunting is certainly on the table for me. With long range hunting, I’m not going to go out of my way for a long shot, but I’m not going to let 700 yards decide whether or not I leave empty handed.

Longe range in my case would be 100 yards. I would like to have the capability of reaching out to 1500 yds. As for budget, I’m looking at ~$8K.

So it sounds like your primary use case is target shooting and you mostly shoot at 100 yards but your range goes to 1500 yards.
You mentioned things on the Gun so:

Considering your budget of $8k here is my advice

Put about half of that into a top tier scope such as a ZCO or TT (March and S&B are worth a mention, but the 2 first are the top right now), probably something in a 5-25 x56 range give or take a bit.

That scope can be used for many rifles, for many years and not leave you wanting.

These would help you a lot both short term and long term:
One of the new Garmin Xero radar units would probably be well worth your time
A good kestrel or something similar
A good pair of range finding binoculars that are rated to at least 2000+ yards
A good ballistic calculator app for your phone

 

[Ronws]

Unless you're hunting buffalo in Africa, monolithic bullets suck. And the most pervasive issue with hunter bullet selection in the US is people overestimating impact resistance. The below comparison in the video is an ELD-M impacting at 1370 fps vs a Barnes TSX impacting at 2300 fps. The ELD-M has the same temporary wound cavity and a better permanent wound cavity despite having about half the velocity. This guy does a lot of videos on bullet choice using organic ballistic gel at varying distances as well as him actually hunting animals at long range then showing the damage.

I can't stress enough that almost everything most hunters think they know about terminal ballistics is wrong. Once I decided to look into it I got much better results. I get better wounds using ELD bullets from my 6.5CM than I ever did using Barnes TTSX out of a 300WM.

I have watched a bunch of his videos. Great information and I first started watching in his series of rebuttals to "The Real Gunsmith."

I see what you are saying, though. It is not just caliber and impact velocity. It is the performance of the bullet, though caliber and velocity may differ.

 

[TheJeanyus]

With an $8k budget I would buy:

Rifle: Masterpiece Arms BA PMR Pro II ($2700)
Optic: Vortex Razor Gen III ($2500)
Mount: Masterpiece Arms ($275)
Bipod: Atlas CAL w/ RRS pic/arca mount ($350)
Rear bag/multipurpose bag: Armageddon Gear Gamechanger ($120)
Hornady 4DOF app (Free)
Rifle specific bore guide, coating cleaning rod, jags, brushes, patches, solvent, etc. ($300)
Spend the rest on ammo and a deposit for an in-person class with reputable instructors (Rifles Only, Modern Day Sniper, etc.).

Later, add a Kestrel, rangefinder, Garmin Xero, tripod, and reloading gear.

 

[NateVA]

Didn't know your budget was that high. In that case pick between a RRS TFCT-33 or TFCT-34(L?). They're top of the line shooting tripods that will come in handy for both hunting and competition use.

 

[Maurygold]

Didn't know your budget was that high. In that case pick between a RRS TFCT-33 or TFCT-34(L?). They're top of the line shooting tripods that will come in handy for both hunting and competition use.

tripod is the absolute least required piece of kit I can think of.

 

[kthomas]

tripod is the absolute least required piece of kit I can think of.

Depends on the competition.

But for PRS, I think tripods are highly overrated, unless you are using it for optics.

There's lots of situations where tripods are the king of versatility, but PRS isn't one of them.

 

[Maurygold]

Depends on the competition.

But for PRS, I think tripods are highly overrated, unless you are using it for optics.

There's lots of situations where tripods are the king of versatility, but PRS isn't one of them.

bro wants to go shoot at the range - he didn't asked what piece of comp or pack out hunting gear he should buy.

I think you just live to disagree with me.

 

[kthomas]

bro wants to go shoot at the range - he didn't asked what piece of comp or pack out hunting gear he should buy.

I think you just live to disagree with me.

I don't know why I had competition in my mind. Maybe because of the post you quoted.

You're right, to shoot at the range, a tripod is completely unnecessary. You don't need a tripod until way later in the game - shooting in the field they are great.

But yeah, to just get started and to shoot at the range, a tripod is a completely unnecessary expense.

 

[WTF-2-EDC]

Shooting sticks are valuable IN THE FIELD when hunting and the hunter should practice shooting in all the positions he or she may find themself in when hunting in the backcountry. Sitting, prone, of sticks, off-hand...it's the only way to truly know your limitations. If target shooting at distance for fun then the Bull Bag will suffice.

As for Nate's effort to equate LR hunting to archery hunting...the ethical bow hunter closes the distance, bases the shot on the angle, distance and state the animal is in. Is it relaxed, eating or acting all wary and tense. The ethical bow hunter will pass on a shot that's sketchy. Sadly many artchers take poor shots and make bad decisions. Taking a shot at game from 1000 yards out is always sketchy. Oh and I don't tree squat...I'm a ground pounder Nate. All fair chase, spot & stalk, western style bow hunting. That's the pursuit of game. Those in treestands are merely waiting in ambush for game to pass by while playing video games and watching porn on their cellphone in an attempt to stay awake. JMO

 

[NateVA]

bro wants to go shoot at the range - he didn't asked what piece of comp or pack out hunting gear he should buy.

I think you just live to disagree with me.

I don't know why I had competition in my mind. Maybe because of the post you quoted.

You're right, to shoot at the range, a tripod is completely unnecessary. You don't need a tripod until way later in the game - shooting in the field they are great.

But yeah, to just get started and to shoot at the range, a tripod is a completely unnecessary expense.

To clarify, he didn't mention hunting in the OP but he explicitly said in the replies that he also wants to be able to hunt long distances. Hence why I emphasized the tripod after he replied about that. I'm not illiterate.

 

[kthomas]

To clarify, he didn't mention hunting in the OP but he explicitly said in the replies that he also wants to be able to hunt long distances. Hence why I emphasized the tripod after he replied about that. I'm not illiterate.

I haven't been following this thread closely.

For a lot of hunting and field situations, a tripod is an awesome tool. For range use only, it's an unnecessary expense.

If the OP is interested in hunting and field type shooting, a tripod would be a good investment at some point for sure.

 

[OkieMike]

I would help a lot if you could define your definition of "long range"

This ^^^

Determine and define your goal.

Example: "I want to shoot 1000 yard targets... And eventually move out further up to, and perhaps past, a mile."

That will help narrow down your platform choices, optics, accessories, etc...

Your goal(s) will help define what you need to look at purchasing.

I will also add: the suggestion to take a class is spot on. If you walk into a class with a defined goal the instructors can also help you make your list of tools to achieve your goal(s).

Welcome to this mental illness/obsession.

Mike