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Suppressors When suppressing an AR, how do you
- Thread starter 308sako
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Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Don't shoot as much
No?, I have not tried on of these yet, but supposed to help
Noveske switchblock
Don't shoot as much
No?, I have not tried on of these yet, but supposed to help
Noveske switchblock
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
The only way is to convert to a piston setup, this will keep the gas out of the receiver area.
I have run a regular DI gun supressed and I just cleaned it like normal, yes it was always dirtier then normal but it still functioned fine.
CJG
The only way is to convert to a piston setup, this will keep the gas out of the receiver area.
I have run a regular DI gun supressed and I just cleaned it like normal, yes it was always dirtier then normal but it still functioned fine.
CJG
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Disclosure: my experience so far is with .22s.
As was reported to you on Arfcom, a piston upper is only a limited solution.
The problem is the prolonged back pressure caused by the can. When the bolt opens, the crap in the bore is blown back into the receiver, in addition to the usual DI gas (augmented by the increased pressure).
Ever heard of a Gas Buster charging handle? There's a reason for it.
Disclosure: my experience so far is with .22s.
As was reported to you on Arfcom, a piston upper is only a limited solution.
The problem is the prolonged back pressure caused by the can. When the bolt opens, the crap in the bore is blown back into the receiver, in addition to the usual DI gas (augmented by the increased pressure).
Ever heard of a Gas Buster charging handle? There's a reason for it.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Minimize the carbon fouling in the action/carrier area?
you will need to carefully remove the M4 suppressor this will greatly reduce the problem. Seriously the suppressor blows the powder residue out of the barrel on to the bolt and bolt carrier. Some of the problem is also extra gas blown down the gas tube. One thing that will help is an adjustable gas block several people make these I have one made I think by JP it works good. The adjustable block will reduce the gas volume and pressure in the gas tube, this will allow the gas system to operate correctly with the suppressor on the gun. Another benefit of this is you can reduce the pressure to delay the bolt opening until the pressure has dropped in the barrel. The piston system system may damage your gun if it is not designed for suppressor use as the suppressor will increase the pressure and volume of the gas acting on the piston.
Minimize the carbon fouling in the action/carrier area?
you will need to carefully remove the M4 suppressor this will greatly reduce the problem. Seriously the suppressor blows the powder residue out of the barrel on to the bolt and bolt carrier. Some of the problem is also extra gas blown down the gas tube. One thing that will help is an adjustable gas block several people make these I have one made I think by JP it works good. The adjustable block will reduce the gas volume and pressure in the gas tube, this will allow the gas system to operate correctly with the suppressor on the gun. Another benefit of this is you can reduce the pressure to delay the bolt opening until the pressure has dropped in the barrel. The piston system system may damage your gun if it is not designed for suppressor use as the suppressor will increase the pressure and volume of the gas acting on the piston.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Run it as dry as you can reliably do so...
that will help with fouling.
Run it as dry as you can reliably do so...
that will help with fouling.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
The other option that has worked is running it REALLY REALLY wet so that all fouling wipes away very easily because it never dries
The other option that has worked is running it REALLY REALLY wet so that all fouling wipes away very easily because it never dries
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
I run mine wet so it wipes out a little easier, I think its better on the bearing surfaces too, as long as you dont let it accumulate dirt.
CJG
I run mine wet so it wipes out a little easier, I think its better on the bearing surfaces too, as long as you dont let it accumulate dirt.
CJG
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Got a gas buster on all my rifles, may help a little but not much, plan on cleaning your upper often, and if you reload, start to use a tumbler.
Got a gas buster on all my rifles, may help a little but not much, plan on cleaning your upper often, and if you reload, start to use a tumbler.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
I concur with Kent's suggestion of using lube sparingly. You might also want to experiment with dry lubes. I also use Gas Buster charging handles on all my suppressed ARs and do find they make a significant difference. The GB will not eliminate all gas particularly on shorter barrel guns but they do help a lot.
Lastly, I have found excellent success with using a standard weight recoil spring with a DPMS two-piece heavy buffer. This setup runs fine in my 11.5" SBRs, my M4 (select-fire 14.5" barrel) and the two 16" barrel ARs I own both suppressed and unsuppressed with standard velocity M193-spec, Black Hills 75-grain and TAP ammo. The heavier buffer increases dwell time slightly. On the full-auto guns this slows the cycle rate a bit, which isn't a bad thing as the guns run smoother. On the semi-auto weapons the increased dwell time reduces some of the added back pressure from the suppressor.
I very much agree that a gas piston gun does not alleviate the blow back issue. Many people who don't really have first-hand experience with piston guns have been duped into believing otherwise.
Mark
I concur with Kent's suggestion of using lube sparingly. You might also want to experiment with dry lubes. I also use Gas Buster charging handles on all my suppressed ARs and do find they make a significant difference. The GB will not eliminate all gas particularly on shorter barrel guns but they do help a lot.
Lastly, I have found excellent success with using a standard weight recoil spring with a DPMS two-piece heavy buffer. This setup runs fine in my 11.5" SBRs, my M4 (select-fire 14.5" barrel) and the two 16" barrel ARs I own both suppressed and unsuppressed with standard velocity M193-spec, Black Hills 75-grain and TAP ammo. The heavier buffer increases dwell time slightly. On the full-auto guns this slows the cycle rate a bit, which isn't a bad thing as the guns run smoother. On the semi-auto weapons the increased dwell time reduces some of the added back pressure from the suppressor.
I very much agree that a gas piston gun does not alleviate the blow back issue. Many people who don't really have first-hand experience with piston guns have been duped into believing otherwise.
Mark
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
I am kinda anal about cleaning my weapons. They are stripped and cleaned EVERY trip to the range.
I am kinda anal about cleaning my weapons. They are stripped and cleaned EVERY trip to the range.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Go to a Gas Buster handle and Noveske Switchblock. I run one of their 10.5" uppers with an M4-2000 can and its still getting dirty but I would much rather have a reliable rifle then worry about a little powder build up. Clean it and go on!
Go to a Gas Buster handle and Noveske Switchblock. I run one of their 10.5" uppers with an M4-2000 can and its still getting dirty but I would much rather have a reliable rifle then worry about a little powder build up. Clean it and go on!
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
I would go with the Piston Conversion kits myself. The very nature of the suppressor itself is to hold the pressurized gases and slowly allow them to bleed off, thus reducing the sound signature. Not only would the suppressed gun be more efficient with the piston kit, it would be much cleaner and easier to shoot, with no gases in the action area. Personally, I cannot see why so many resist the piston kits?? They are just another piece of the evolution of the Ar-16/Ar-15 weapon system. Much to me like the A2, A3 & A4 varieties. With all the cost and hassle of buying a suppressor, I would think adding a simple piston conversion would be a piece of cake, you get much more for your money, and a cleaner, more reliable weapon. I would think the piston kit should pre-date any thoughts of a suppressed weapon.
I would go with the Piston Conversion kits myself. The very nature of the suppressor itself is to hold the pressurized gases and slowly allow them to bleed off, thus reducing the sound signature. Not only would the suppressed gun be more efficient with the piston kit, it would be much cleaner and easier to shoot, with no gases in the action area. Personally, I cannot see why so many resist the piston kits?? They are just another piece of the evolution of the Ar-16/Ar-15 weapon system. Much to me like the A2, A3 & A4 varieties. With all the cost and hassle of buying a suppressor, I would think adding a simple piston conversion would be a piece of cake, you get much more for your money, and a cleaner, more reliable weapon. I would think the piston kit should pre-date any thoughts of a suppressed weapon.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Again, piston kits help a little, but don't cure the problem with a suppressed AR. Most of the gas comes back into the action through the barrel after the the bolt has opened and the spent brass extracted. Going to a piston kit doesn't help that.
I started using automatic transmission fluid on my AR and running it wet, the carbon seems to wipe off much easier than when using commercial gun oils. Probably not particularly healthy, but I doubt many vaporized oils are.
Again, piston kits help a little, but don't cure the problem with a suppressed AR. Most of the gas comes back into the action through the barrel after the the bolt has opened and the spent brass extracted. Going to a piston kit doesn't help that.
I started using automatic transmission fluid on my AR and running it wet, the carbon seems to wipe off much easier than when using commercial gun oils. Probably not particularly healthy, but I doubt many vaporized oils are.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Not sure of the Shit you are Smokin, ynot. So according to you the piston system holds the case in the chamber until all the gasses have escaped out of the front of the suppressor as to not bleed any backwards into the action, and makes it more efficient at the same time? Easier to shoot??? WTF? Save your comments for a topic you know something about.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: yknot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The very nature of the suppressor itself is to hold the pressurized gases and slowly allow them to bleed off, thus reducing the sound signature. Not only would the suppressed gun be more efficient with the piston kit, it would be much cleaner and easier to shoot, with no gases in the action area. Personally, I cannot see why so many resist the piston kits??</div></div>
Not sure of the Shit you are Smokin, ynot. So according to you the piston system holds the case in the chamber until all the gasses have escaped out of the front of the suppressor as to not bleed any backwards into the action, and makes it more efficient at the same time? Easier to shoot??? WTF? Save your comments for a topic you know something about.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: yknot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The very nature of the suppressor itself is to hold the pressurized gases and slowly allow them to bleed off, thus reducing the sound signature. Not only would the suppressed gun be more efficient with the piston kit, it would be much cleaner and easier to shoot, with no gases in the action area. Personally, I cannot see why so many resist the piston kits??</div></div>
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
http://www.slip2000.com/slip2000-EWL.html
NiCorr™ or NP3 finish
They just make cleaning easier, not necessarily less fouling.
http://www.slip2000.com/slip2000-EWL.html
NiCorr™ or NP3 finish
They just make cleaning easier, not necessarily less fouling.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
Mobile 1 is your friend...
It does a really good job of keeping carbon down in the gas system.
Couple that with an H2 Buffer and a GasBuster you will be much happier.
Another little tip is to grease the walls of the lower reciever.
This catches quite a bit of crap and keeps it from depositing in the trigger.
Just wipe the old grease out and replace when you clean.
Adjustable gas blocks or tubes are also an option.
Mobile 1 is your friend...
It does a really good job of keeping carbon down in the gas system.
Couple that with an H2 Buffer and a GasBuster you will be much happier.
Another little tip is to grease the walls of the lower reciever.
This catches quite a bit of crap and keeps it from depositing in the trigger.
Just wipe the old grease out and replace when you clean.
Adjustable gas blocks or tubes are also an option.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Code</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Pat M, Second pic I see is a Noveske Switchblock.</div></div>
Yup...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Code</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Pat M, Second pic I see is a Noveske Switchblock.</div></div>
Yup...
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ACD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Switchblock or one of the many piston conversions now available. </div></div>
The Noveske Switchblock is AWESOME.
Absolutely my favorite AR platform to run suppressed (and we've got a lot of nice AR platforms - HK416s, LWRC M6A3, KAC SR15E3, etc.)
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ACD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Switchblock or one of the many piston conversions now available. </div></div>
The Noveske Switchblock is AWESOME.
Absolutely my favorite AR platform to run suppressed (and we've got a lot of nice AR platforms - HK416s, LWRC M6A3, KAC SR15E3, etc.)
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
M4-2000 suppressor / M4 type Colt 1:7 barrel / Noveske Switchblock / PRI Gas Buster handle. I've been lucky with this combo as now I don't notice any gas sneaking past the charging handle into my face. Don't know if it was the Switchblock or the Gas Buster handle or the combo of both but it works great. Definately lube up the lower a bit as you'll get deposits on the lower components but I just air blast them out and relube with grease. This combo doesn't eliminate blowback into the chamber area but am surprised at how little I'm now getting as compared to a standard M4 setup.
Just cleaned it last night for the first time in a LONG time (not one malfunction since last cleaning) and it wasn't as dirty as I would have expected. I like to use the Wipe out foaming bore cleaner by Sharp Shootr as it gets in the nooks & crannies.
Mobil 1 oil? Gotta try that one out.
M4-2000 suppressor / M4 type Colt 1:7 barrel / Noveske Switchblock / PRI Gas Buster handle. I've been lucky with this combo as now I don't notice any gas sneaking past the charging handle into my face. Don't know if it was the Switchblock or the Gas Buster handle or the combo of both but it works great. Definately lube up the lower a bit as you'll get deposits on the lower components but I just air blast them out and relube with grease. This combo doesn't eliminate blowback into the chamber area but am surprised at how little I'm now getting as compared to a standard M4 setup.
Just cleaned it last night for the first time in a LONG time (not one malfunction since last cleaning) and it wasn't as dirty as I would have expected. I like to use the Wipe out foaming bore cleaner by Sharp Shootr as it gets in the nooks & crannies.
Mobil 1 oil? Gotta try that one out.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
My sig 556 Pistol still get real dirty and the gases still blow back in my face when the brass is being ejected. The sig 556 gas piston system still has the same problems as the AR15 when it comes to cleaning.
My sig 556 Pistol still get real dirty and the gases still blow back in my face when the brass is being ejected. The sig 556 gas piston system still has the same problems as the AR15 when it comes to cleaning.
Re: When suppressing an AR, how do you
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Garrett J</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I use a 9mm buffer, and clean the gun more often. </div></div>
Garrett,
How did you get your hands on a supressor in Michigan?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Garrett J</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I use a 9mm buffer, and clean the gun more often. </div></div>
Garrett,
How did you get your hands on a supressor in Michigan?
