When does a bubble level on a rifle or scope come into play. The furthest I shoot is 900 yards and don’t bother using a level. Seems like it is just one more thing to worry about when I’m trying to have fun. 900 yards and in I feel safe to say that they are unnecessary but I haven’t shot with and without to see if there really is a difference. At what distance do hit percentages move up because of that floating bubble?
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Rifle Scopes When to use a Bubble level?
- Thread starter wade2big
- Start date
Use the bubble level to keep consistent from shot to shot. If you are canted slightly left on one shot and slightly right on the next shot, it can affect where the impacts are, especially at ranges like 900 and further.
Long Range Shooters of Utah (LRSU) have a good youtube video on this topic. Search for 'LRSU bubble level'
Long Range Shooters of Utah (LRSU) have a good youtube video on this topic. Search for 'LRSU bubble level'
I also question the importance of these levels, unless your shooting prone/ELR, or your name is Todd Hodnett, who is just warming up at 1,760- I think I’m gonna keep swagging it because I’ve never figured out how to shoot off of tires, culverts, roofs, barricades during a match, while simultaneously checking a level... also it saves me $150
500+ it starts to make a difference, the further the distance the greater the impact. Sure, you can hit a target at 800 from a weird position and not be level...but it changes your POI.
I think it def makes a difference and it’s one of those things that you can use whenever you want no one is telling you to use it but def will help out past 600 also just another gadget and us shooters love tinker gadgets
On our last outing to the desert I was shooting from an improvised position, could not connect with our 1000 yard target. I deployed the folding USO level and I noticed I was canting the rifle. Once correction was made steel was struck. For shorter distances the error is manageable at 1K+ every error is magnified.
My experience is that the bubble level is a big deal. Terrain and shooting position are good at tricking your brain when it comes to what feels like level and a little cant multiplied by even a moderate amount of dialed drop is a lot of error. Most of the shooting I do is not strictly timed and is at targets of relatively small size for the range they are set at so I use a level pretty much all the time. I say that fully realizing that the guys who shoot competitively, at relatively larger targets, where time is a direct element of score, seem to use levels pretty religiously as well.
The bigger question I have is not whether or not to use the level but rather if I am happy with the level I am using or if another might serve me better and be more comfortable, fast, or accurate for me.
The bigger question I have is not whether or not to use the level but rather if I am happy with the level I am using or if another might serve me better and be more comfortable, fast, or accurate for me.
Half and half for me, hate bubble levels in general, but should be checking because the math all matters.
Digital level, in-scope, but not how they did last year's Sig models. I would have it be more communicative than pass/fail with unknown tolerance (felt like a couple degrees at least)
I haven't handled other brands curious what will be available this time next year...
Digital level, in-scope, but not how they did last year's Sig models. I would have it be more communicative than pass/fail with unknown tolerance (felt like a couple degrees at least)
I haven't handled other brands curious what will be available this time next year...
I use it on practice range to help train myself and tweak my vestibular senses.
I try not to use it too much on the clock, especially stages that are <600.
On prone stages or stages where you are allowed to pre stage the rifle, I will use it to set up the rifle plum and lock everything in.
I try not to use it too much on the clock, especially stages that are <600.
On prone stages or stages where you are allowed to pre stage the rifle, I will use it to set up the rifle plum and lock everything in.
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I cant say I've missed due to cant. Maybe I have. But I can say I have seen POI shift due to cant.
Once I noticed that shoot a group at 700yds on paper with the rifle level and with cant and noticed the group with rifle canted did shift POI
Once I noticed that shoot a group at 700yds on paper with the rifle level and with cant and noticed the group with rifle canted did shift POI
Getting the rifle level matters for long range shooting, of course - but, it also matters for shooting tiny groups. Wanna impress your friends with that .5 inch group at 300 meters? You’re gonna need a level, consistent hold for that.
Example -
Take a reasonably “flat” cartridge that drops a hypothetical 9 mil at 1000m. Assume a 5 deg cant and you get a pure trig error of ~.8 mil horizontal - that’s nearly a meter (80 cm, better than 2.5 feet). That 5 deg cant is good for about 9% angular error (i.e. 9% of your vertical correction now sending your bullet left or right). Whether that matters to you depends on what you’re doing, I suppose.
Example -
Take a reasonably “flat” cartridge that drops a hypothetical 9 mil at 1000m. Assume a 5 deg cant and you get a pure trig error of ~.8 mil horizontal - that’s nearly a meter (80 cm, better than 2.5 feet). That 5 deg cant is good for about 9% angular error (i.e. 9% of your vertical correction now sending your bullet left or right). Whether that matters to you depends on what you’re doing, I suppose.
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I understand the concept. I am just unsure of how much difference it makes in real life shooting. I may tape a level on my scope turret. Set up to shoot like normal then look at the level to see how far I am off. Better yet, shoot at distance on a still day ( not easy to find near the gulf coast) and shoot a group of 5. Then do the same checking the level between each shot. Maybe there will be a practical difference and maybe not. Sometimes what is correct in a textbook can be discarded in the real world. Sometimes the textbook is validated. If you work with or around enexperienced engineers or engineers with no real world experience you know exactly what I am saying.
You may be very surprised. I thought I had a pretty good "feel" for that. I wasn't off by much... but I was off.
Do it multiple times. You'll find that you tend to be off the same direction consistently. Adjusting the cant of the butt of your stock (if it has that feature) can help correct the tendency.
I use mine to help with cant at all distances, the more I use it, the more I will naturally hold it in the correct position, it becomes automatic.
