Which caliber is better

[37L1]

Sadly now that I have had a chance to read every comment a part of me (assuming my English isn’t shitting the bed) thinks this is bait. I however am going to hope for genuine youthful naivety.

There are many steps to get to a mile consistently, yet alone 2-3-4.

To this fellow I encourage you to keep shooting and keep honing your skills. I don’t think you fully grasp the goal you have and what it entails. Even what you would use for 2 miles would be grossly different than 4.

Taccom Charlie periscope system

Severe plus elevation mount/rail

Personally would choose something in line with the higher power March optics. The March Genesis 6-60 i have been messing with runs $6000 on average. Not including VAT which for me is 24%. I don’t know your sales tax off the top of my head.

Rifle build presumably running north of $10,000. I myself am fond of the taccom structured barrels. Expect something with a 36 to 44+ inch barrel.

Countless load development and projectile development/testing.

10+ drones to meter wind between you and the target. I shoot in the Nevada desert often and even in 1000 yards frequently see the mirage changing directions 3 times over that distance.

If we’re starting from the ground up, totally blank slate I would want to budget around $50,000. And no you won’t be using this setup for anything under 3000 yards. There won’t be training at 1000 yards when your mount and rail alone gives +60 to 100 moa. These are purpose built systems.

Again I apologize if my word choice is off. English is my third language so I know it can be.
——

There is a wonderful YouTube channel I recommend that you follow. Mark and Sam after work. They have years of ELR shooting under their belts, of all variety. Even some shots/ideas I considered pipe dreams. His ELR 45/70 with iron sights recently being a prime example.

Your English is far better than most of ours here on the Hide.

 

[Alaska]

Which caliber would be better for shooting over 3.5 miles accurately. The .338 LM or the .416 Barrett. I'm asking this because I am going to attempt to break the world's longest shot. And it was 3.4 miles I am doing it at 4 miles. I will be in the Nevada desert. And for the most part flat or level ground.

300 Gr Berger OTM
H1000 in 338 LM

 

[GregMow]

Here is some advice you need to learn for the rest of your life. Listen closely. Don't ever, under any circumstance. Ever. Let your girl know how much money you send on shooting. Ever. They will complain and try to talk you into spending it on them.

My wife isn't as bad as others and we make a very good living for ourselves, but she always asks for things when we are in my gun room. She will come in there and saying something like, "I like this stock, who makes it?... I want a Peloton"

That is the absolute truth of it. My wife is the same. Buy what you want but expect for me to ask you for something when i want it. The workshop is always the place. But when you find the one that supports your passion and doesn't complain about the expensive little box that shows up And shares some of your passion you know she is the one

 

[rottenruger]

First of all I believe the longest recorded shot for the shoulder-fired weapon is around 7,000 yards which I believe is Paul Phillips and that would be like 3.9 miles. Second please note it's actually not a world record as Guinness well not recognize the LR Shooting Sports there are already others including myself and Paul Phillips that are working on shooting 5 miles so that being said be prepared to send hundreds of rounds down range to be lucky enough to make contact and by the way it's not possible with the dinky 338 Lapua even with the larger cartridge like the Barrett and steyer you will have to use a Charlie and a Delta unit

Well I love my dinky 338 LM but I know it has it's limitations......which are beyond my aims.

I also love the Styer 460 I shoot on loan each year at long range "school", but I don't know if even it has the kinda range you're talking of.

Your class is beyond my pay grade!!!

 

[richidaho]

So, find you some 20 mm brass and neck it down to 50 cal. Find someone to build you an action that won’t blow-up. Maybe Batt or take a few Machining classes and build your own. You will need a barrel 40-60”. The loner the better. You will most likely have to build a stock from scratch also. You best become a machines. That way you can make your own bullets turned and tuned monolithic depleted uranium bullets.
During ww1 they made a few anti-tank guns you could model your gun off of. I’m thinking the Russians may have made a few in ww2 don’t remember. Think big it can be done.

 

[Aidenhicks]

So Paul Phillips' team hit 4 miles a few years back but it was James Devoglier that was shooting at the time. Think we got it after maybe 20 shots and then shot for another day and a half. Hitting it wasn't really the point, we were there as a research project which is why there was never any BS claim of a record. We shot for a few days looking at the performance of different bullets well past transonic. Looking at how conditions effected things at extreme ranges. More or less just figuring out how do deal with those ranges and then applying those lessons back to "modest" distances like 2 miles. There were a number of lessons learned and some of them were real mind fucks.

The logistics of the effort were significant and there was ultimately a team of 10 to get it done. Spotting calls with a forward observer and one of my cameras was the only way to walk it in and without audio on the cameras it would have been harder because I was listening for impacts that I couldn't see and judging if they were closer or further from the previous shot. FO had to be hundreds of yards back for safety because of the vertical spread we were seeing. From bullet to bullet the difference was degrees rather than MOA. Their calls were very hard to judge a correction from in the end that was one of the major lessons.

If you are dead set on this kind of pursuit, expect it to be at least a $10k effort and probably significantly more. That or you can just fly a drone around and show yourself jumping up and down claiming victory...

-Alex

$10k? I probably should start saving more money then. I am dead set on trying.

Didn't we have this same thread a few weeks back? That or it was at another fishing hole.

This is a new one

So, find you some 20 mm brass and neck it down to 50 cal. Find someone to build you an action that won’t blow-up. Maybe Batt or take a few Machining classes and build your own. You will need a barrel 40-60”. The loner the better. You will most likely have to build a stock from scratch also. You best become a machines. That way you can make your own bullets turned and tuned monolithic depleted uranium bullets.
During ww1 they made a few anti-tank guns you could model your gun off of. I’m thinking the Russians may have made a few in ww2 don’t remember. Think big it can be done.

Thanks

 

[GregMow]

Which caliber would be better for shooting over 3.5 miles accurately. The .338 LM or the .416 Barrett. I'm asking this because I am going to attempt to break the world's longest shot. And it was 3.4 miles I am doing it at 4 miles. I will be in the Nevada desert. And for the most part flat or level ground.

In my last post which was a reply i forgot to say a few words. I will definitely look forward to seeing the results. Please keep your head up and if 4 miles is your goal dont stop until you achieve it. Keep your goals high accept advice and /or seek it from those that can make it happen. It is never an impossibility. Nothing is impossible. Good luck to you

 

[Aidenhicks]

In my last post which was a reply i forgot to say a few words. I will definitely look forward to seeing the results. Please keep your head up and if 4 miles is your goal dont stop until you achieve it. Keep your goals high accept advice and /or seek it from those that can make it happen. It is never an impossibility. Nothing is impossible. Good luck to you

Thanks. Means a lot.

 

[Surma-T]

So, find you some 20 mm brass and neck it down to 50 cal. Find someone to build you an action that won’t blow-up. Maybe Batt or take a few Machining classes and build your own. You will need a barrel 40-60”. The loner the better. You will most likely have to build a stock from scratch also. You best become a machines. That way you can make your own bullets turned and tuned monolithic depleted uranium bullets.
During ww1 they made a few anti-tank guns you could model your gun off of. I’m thinking the Russians may have made a few in ww2 don’t remember. Think big it can be done.

The .510 1200gr GS custom SPs will run just fine. Originally made at the request of Anzio iron works.

I’ve shot their 20mm necked to 50, as well as a 20mm from them that came to over 8 feet long with suppressor. Total weight was like 120lbs if I remember right (it’s been almost a decade)

Edit: I will have to remember to take some photos when we get back to Finland in a month. I still have a few left over from an obscene subsonic project I was working on years ago. Just have to figure out where I stashed them. If I recall correct though they are about 8 caliber in length so 4”. Hence obscene.

 

[richidaho]

O, forgot ELR Competitions have a 50 pounds or less limit. Might make it pretty tough on a gun like that. You could just show up as an exhibitionist and show off your big gun have fun.

 

[TxWelder35]

Do you have any reloading experience? What equipment do you have?

Just making sure you know that factory ammo in this realm does not exist

 

[Aidenhicks]

Do you have any reloading experience? What equipment do you have?

Just making sure you know that factory ammo in this realm does not exist

I have someone to reload for me and to teach me to reload.
And I know that factory ammo is shit.

 

[fdkay]

I miss the good old days when they all wanted to shoot 1000 yards

 

[TxWelder35]

I have someone to reload for me and to teach me to reload.
And I know that factory ammo is shit.

It’s not that factory ammo is shit, it’s that they literally do not exist in these calibers.

Have you reloaded with sub 5fps SD? 10 FPS makes a big difference 4 miles down range, reloading to be that consistent is not easy or cheap

Everything is custom. The brass, the barrel, the chambering, the reamers, the bullets, all of it.

The reloading equipment alone is going to cost you 10k

The gun is 10k

The equipment to make and see hits is 10k

You are going to burn through multiple barrels


If you really want to do this here is what I would do. Don’t buy a single thing right now.

Save the money to Go to the Ko2M event in September and go see what its all about and go talk to people about their set ups.

NRA Whittington Center : King of 2 Mile

The KO2M competition is held as a two-day extreme long-range (ELR) match. This is a team event—prone rifle shooting with a bipod at distances up to two miles. Teams consist of one shooter and up to two wind coaches/spotters helping.

www.nrawc.org

 

[PaulPhillips]

300 Gr Berger OTM
H1000 in 338 LM

The 416 barrett, 460 Styer and cartridges with more energy will be much easier to see splash. The longest shot team GPG has taken has been 3.4 and 4 miles. 7070 yards to be exact on video with 11 witnesses. We don’t claim any records we just do it for fun and to learn more. Thanks

Paul

 

[STLSteve86]

No worries. I already knew that. Remember happy wife happy life. Even if it means not telling the whole truth.

I always tell the truth. If someone doesn’t like you for who you are you don’t need them in your life slowing you down. My wife doesn’t ask questions what I build. She’s happy at home raising kids. Don’t work to much at your age now. Enjoy your spending time with your friends doing what you like.

What is the biggest caliber rifle you currently shoot?

 

[Sureshot300norma]

I am to in the process of breaking a shooting record . It was 12 years of development and thousands of dollars. The rifle is built. Contact Dan Warner at www.warner-tool.com. He is a mad shooting scientist and he has developed a cartridge based on the 20mm Vulcan case cut down and necked down to take a 1005 grain 50 BMG bullet. I'm not sure he will let loose of one yet,but he builds some crazy Ultra long range weapons from the ground up. Tell him what you want and listen to his advice . He has been around a long time in the shooting industry and is one of the best gunsmiths available .Robert Vestal ( vestalscustomrifles.com)also builds some unbelievable ULR rigs and is one of the best gunsmiths available. Hold on to your dreams ,work hard and get it done. Do not let anyone tell you something can not be done. I have been told that many times and I just do it . Sometimes I couldn't do it ,but usually I can. You just have to put in the work.

 

[Smitty0313]

Just a thought.
Join the Marines. MOS 0313.
M242 bushmaster. 25mm. Walk in rounds at 7000 meters. Vehicle size target. Near nighttime helps with tracing and seeing hits.

 

[richidaho]

Snipers Hide should get a few good company’s on board Tubbs group, applied Ballistics, Bartlen barrels and a good homegrown glass company. Next thing you know 4-5 miles is possible.

I have always wanted to put together a gamma ray sniper weapon we’re range would be way beyond 5 miles. The problem is the target doesn’t die like we would like. Go DARP.

 

[Aidenhicks]

I always tell the truth. If someone doesn’t like you for who you are you don’t need them in your life slowing you down. My wife doesn’t ask questions what I build. She’s happy at home raising kids. Don’t work to much at your age now. Enjoy your spending time with your friends doing what you like.

What is the biggest caliber rifle you currently shoot?

300 win mag. In a couple of days I'm stepping up to a 458 mag.

Just a thought.
Join the Marines. MOS 0313.
M242 bushmaster. 25mm. Walk in rounds at 7000 meters. Vehicle size target. Near nighttime helps with tracing and seeing hits.

I was going to join the Navy to train to be a sniper in the SEALs. But with the current shit hole in the Whitehouse. I'm not joining any branch of the military unless something changes.

 

[Surma-T]

I am to in the process of breaking a shooting record . It was 12 years of development and thousands of dollars. The rifle is built. Contact Dan Warner at www.warner-tool.com. He is a mad shooting scientist and he has developed a cartridge based on the 20mm Vulcan case cut down and necked down to take a 1005 grain 50 BMG bullet. I'm not sure he will let loose of one yet,but he builds some crazy Ultra long range weapons from the ground up .Robert Vestal also builds some unbelievable ULR rigs . Hold on to your dreams ,work hard and get it done. Do not let anyone tell you something can not be done. I have been told that many times and I just do it . Sometimes I couldn't do it ,but usually I can. You just have to put in the work.

Mr. Warner makes a quality projectile. I’ve enjoyed the times I’ve used his 6.5 as well as his .338. Prefer his 6.5s over most other offerings out there honestly. The 121gr is an absolute favorite for me. I definitely would want, nay love to see this build come to reality someday.

 

[Badshot308]

300 win mag. In a couple of days I'm stepping up to a 458 mag.

I was going to join the Navy to train to be a sniper in the SEALs. But with the current shit hole in the Whitehouse. I'm not joining any branch of the military unless something changes.

When you say 458 mag, are you talking 458 Winchester magnum?

 

[Mikar]

Which caliber would be better for shooting over 3.5 miles accurately. The .338 LM or the .416 Barrett. I'm asking this because I am going to attempt to break the world's longest shot. And it was 3.4 miles I am doing it at 4 miles. I will be in the Nevada desert. And for the most part flat or level ground.

I’ve had really good accuracy from my custom .375 Cheytac with 400 gr. Projectiles

 

[Aidenhicks]

When you say 458 mag, are you talking 458 Winchester magnum?

Yes I believe so sir. I was only told it was a 458 magnum. But I do believe that it was implied to be a win mag. So yes sir.

 

[Mikar]

I’ve had really good accuracy from my custom .375 Cheytac with 400 gr. Projectiles

 

[Bandit320]

300 win mag. In a couple of days I'm stepping up to a 458 mag.

I was going to join the Navy to train to be a sniper in the SEALs. But with the current shit hole in the Whitehouse. I'm not joining any branch of the military unless something changes.

There’s great weapons systems / training / experience in the military that you can get nowhere else. The faces in the White House will come and go, your experience and training you keep forever. Don’t be afraid to step up, you’ll never regret it.

 

[Badshot308]

Yes I believe so sir. I was only told it was a 458 magnum. But I do believe that it was implied to be a win mag. So yes sir.

I have one as a fun gun, but it's real use is as a short range dangerous game cartridge designed for use in Africa. It's not a long range cartridge and definately not an ELR cartridge. That round will just beat your shoulder up and give you no useful practice for your intended goal. You're better off practicing with your 300 Win mag and working your way up into other flat shooting rounds.

 

[Milf Dots]

No worries. I already knew that. Remember happy wife happy life. Even if it means not telling the whole truth.

"Happy House, Happy Spouse." FIFY

 

[A.K. for T-7]

Which caliber would be better for shooting over 3.5 miles accurately. The .338 LM or the .416 Barrett. I'm asking this because I am going to attempt to break the world's longest shot. And it was 3.4 miles I am doing it at 4 miles. I will be in the Nevada desert. And for the most part flat or level ground.

155mm, preferably through a 52 cal tube

 

[Wryfox]

First off, I love youthful exuberence. Primarily because I have accomplished far more than I ever dreamed of in life because I refused to believe in limitations. Childish they say! They say maturity is recognizing your limitations!...well bullshit. No matter how old you are if you stop dreaming, you start dying.

Kid, I'm 55 and love if people say I should grow up. No thank you. I just dream bigger than most. I think that's the most adult thing there is, actually. Having the confidence to say it can be done, without experience to know otherwise. Progress only happens when someone says it can be better, and then actually DOES the things to make it better. I find your desire to be the best at something incredibly satisfying, particularly given the distractions of life these days, that some young people still have the ooomph to drive hard. Good for you, and I mean that.

You have a lot to learn about your effort, and that should be incredibly exciting for you. The prospect of learning and excelling is IMMENSELY satisfying. You will find this experience to be incredibly useful in your life in many ways.

Only advice I'll give on your effort is be prepared for setbacks. There will be some. No path to success is a straight line. You will be disappointed and frustrated, maybe even want to give up. Some dear friends and family will tell you to stop. It will happen. Its part of the process. But they aren't you and you have to live with your reflection in the mirror. Only you can tell yourself to stop and mean it. Learn from each challenge and you'll be fine. Good luck. With so much time ahead of you, I'm sure there will some very interesting results from your effort. Looking forward to reading about it.

 

[Aidenhicks]

I no longer have the 300 win mag sadly. And I used to own

First off, I love youthful exuberence. Primarily because I have accomplished far more than I ever dreamed of in life because I refused to believe in limitations. Childish they say! They say maturity is recognizing your limitations!...well bullshit. No matter how old you are if you stop dreaming, you start dying.

Kid, I'm 55 and love if people say I should grow up. No thank you. I just dream bigger than most. I think that's the most adult thing there is, actually. Having the confidence to say it can be done, without experience to know otherwise. Progress only happens when someone says it can be better, and then actually DOES the things to make it better. I find your desire to be the best at something incredibly satisfying, particularly given the distractions of life these days, that some young people still have the ooomph to drive hard. Good for you, and I mean that.

You have a lot to learn about your effort, and that should be incredibly exciting for you. The prospect of learning and excelling is IMMENSELY satisfying. You will find this experience to be incredibly useful in your life in many ways.

Only advice I'll give on your effort is be prepared for setbacks. There will be some. No path to success is a straight line. You will be disappointed and frustrated, maybe even want to give up. Some dear friends and family will tell you to stop. It will happen. Its part of the process. But they aren't you and you have to live with your reflection in the mirror. Only you can tell yourself to stop and mean it. Learn from each challenge and you'll be fine. Good luck. With so much time ahead of you, I'm sure there will some very interesting results from your effort. Looking forward to reading about it.

Thank you for your advice. I will take it to heart. To be honest that's the most childish and useful advice I've been given so far. Thank you for that.

 

[TreyMeTrey]

Which caliber would be better for shooting over 3.5 miles accurately. The .338 LM or the .416 Barrett. I'm asking this because I am going to attempt to break the world's longest shot. And it was 3.4 miles I am doing it at 4 miles. I will be in the Nevada desert. And for the most part flat or level ground.

If you are serious will l lend you my Super Duper. Red Ryder BB Gun....LOL
But seriously I'd say the 416 Barrett. It has better Bulket BC over the 375 Cheytac Improved.
Did you consider a 50BMG?
Robert Brantley shoots a 416 Barret in King of 2 Mile along side Mr Phillips
416 Barrett.
Good Luck.Send us a good video. I hope you achieve your goal.

 

[Aidenhicks]

If you are serious will l lend you my Super Duper. Red Ryder BB Gun....LOL
But seriously I'd say the 416 Barrett. It has better Bulket BC over the 375 Cheytac Improved.
Did you consider a 50BMG?
Robert Brantley shoots a 416 Barret in King of 2 Mile along side Mr Phillips
416 Barrett.
Robert Brantley shoots a 416 Barrett in KO2M . (King of Miles)
I think it h as better Bullet BC than the 375 Cheytac Improved..Did you consid

I have considered 50 BMG. Do you think I should use a 50?

 

[Lazyfaire]

@Aidenhicks you need no advice from me. You have a lot of very experienced people on here who know more than I.

15 and with a major life goal like this? This is a deep well that you want to go swimming in. (And I used to think that a high maintenence girlfriend would be cheaper than LR shooting!! You'll need a harem!) Its nice to see a young person who has goals and dreams--seems pretty rare anymore. I agree with others. Check back in and keep this thread alive and let us know whats going on for you.
Heads up and looking forward! Good for you.

 

[brianf]

@Aidenhicks

you say its to break the worlds longest shot...but why

if you do it today, and its broken tomorrow will you go back out?

is it for the recognition (not a bad thing) just asking?

get you "street cred" so you can work at a place like "berger" in the future?

the reason may also dictate gear used

just asking

 

[fdkay]

I have considered 50 BMG. Do you think I should use a 50?

If you haven't seen this channel, check it out.
Some of his vids are a bit dry, but he will show you the challenges of shooting ELR.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCs3sYk1tuP5Er95EniC-uMw

 

[brianf]

Theis,
I found out the hard way that trying to both run a match and shooting in it compromises both. It's why Ream is running no matches this year and why Walt and Eddie rarely shoot the matches anymore. That said, I've never finished lower than 21st as a spotter in King.

-Alex

you know were that guy is...i know someone looking for him

asking for a friend

 

[XP1K]

I miss the good old days when they all wanted to shoot 1000 yards

That's my current goal.

 

[William Weddendorf]

.458 Winchester for long distance? I am getting the shit vs. Shinola vibe.

 

[Sandow the Heretic]

.458 Winchester for long distance? I am getting the shit vs. Shinola vibe.

And how many people do you think have ever actually seen shinola at this point? Cause if you google it you mostly get watches lol

-Alex

 

[badassgunworks]

you know were that guy is...i know someone looking for him

asking for a friend

He is most likly with his buddy mr prince over in china working on a new deal

 

[BCX]

Now let’s say I wanted to set a world record , would you ELR experts recommend CE, Warner, Badlands or Berger?

 

[badassgunworks]

Now let’s say I wanted to set a world record , would you ELR experts recommend CE, Warner, Badlands or Berger?

So I'm guessing you're intentionally wanting to open a can of worms. So with that all kind of take the bait. If you're planning on shooting for a record that means 7000 plus yards you're going to need some really high BC Bullets. The highest BC Bullets made are warner and Badlands caliber for caliber grain for grain. Undisputable fact. People talk about consistency there are many different ways and looking at consistency quality of Machining quality of run out and quality in Grain weight consistency. Again Warner and Badlands win's hands down. Now if you're talkin about bcsd which for the most part is a waste of time considering we have never seen any comparable apples for apples comparisons between the different manufacturers shot out of the exact same throats and the exact same Barrel wear it's kind of a senseless comparisons. And of course the last concern would B
Be Howard a bullet transitions well we have all seen lots of opinions in that area. Considering no matter what you shoot if you're planning on shooting 7000 or 8000 + yards everything that you sent down range will be subsonic at that distance I could start spouting off some other facts and opinions but I'll leave that up to someone else

 

[BCX]

I’m not looking to attempt any world records… I was half fishing and half trying to get a honest opinion on what guys like.. correct if I’m wrong but CE probably wins more ELR comps? I have shot the Warner Flatlines into transonic. Going to play w some Badlands and Warners again this year.

 

[Sandow the Heretic]

Now let’s say I wanted to set a world record , would you ELR experts recommend CE, Warner, Badlands or Berger?

Res ipsa loquitur.

-Alex

 

[StLPro2A]

Which caliber would be better for shooting over 3.5 miles accurately. The .338 LM or the .416 Barrett. I'm asking this because I am going to attempt to break the world's longest shot. And it was 3.4 miles I am doing it at 4 miles. I will be in the Nevada desert. And for the most part flat or level ground.

If you're having to ask that question, you're wasting your time with illusions of grandeur.

 

[BCX]

Mass wins every time. I’m a 338 cal guy but 3.4 miles-4 miles w a 338 . If you can’t connect in 4-5 shots your wasting your time.

 

[TripleBull]

I always tell the truth. If someone doesn’t like you for who you are you don’t need them in your life slowing you down. My wife doesn’t ask questions what I build. She’s happy at home raising kids. Don’t work to much at your age now. Enjoy your spending time with your friends doing what you like.

What is the biggest caliber rifle you currently shoot?

My wife has been encouraging me to stock up during Covid.

I chose carefully.

You can't have her, stay away or I'll show you a tiny fraction of my ammo supply.

 

[badassgunworks]

I’m not looking to attempt any world records… I was half fishing and half trying to get a honest opinion on what guys like.. correct if I’m wrong but CE probably wins more ELR comps? I have shot the Warner Flatlines into transonic. Going to play w some Badlands and Warners again this year.

Cutting edge has won more matches yes but 75% of the shooters use cutting edge so chicken or the egg . Law of number dictates cutting edge will win more. How ever with that the most consistant longest range shooter that holds most of the largest numbers of impacts is randy ofsted and he shoots badlands made bullets.

 

[BCX]

I hope the badlands make the cut for me… heard nothing but good things about Badlands.