Which Heavy Duty Truck?

[Hound Dog]

All the diesel motors will continue to change as emissions standards continue to evolve. If you’re under the impression that a 7.3l ford built in 2003 is anything close to a 6.7l built in 2019 you’re mistaken. Same goes for Cummings and Duramax.

Actually you missed it by 1 year. the 7.3 died Dec 31, 2002. Ford could not put them in anything starting Jan 1, 2003, because that was the first round of diesel emissions. No matter how hard Ford or International tried they could not get the 7.3 to pass the new tier 1 emissions. If they had, we would have probably never heard of the 6.0

 

[Tater Salad]

Actually you missed it by 1 year. the 7.3 died Dec 31, 2002. Ford could not put them in anything starting Jan 1, 2003, because that was the first round of diesel emissions. No matter how hard Ford or International tried they could not get the 7.3 to pass the new tier 1 emissions. If they had, we would have probably never heard of the 6.0

Correct. My train of thought there is that there are 2003 model year trucks with the 7.3L motor in them.

 

[wade2big]

@Luke,
Just buy my personal truck. I don't need it as I drive my work truck everywhere and I have a family vehicle for all of us.
2014 ram 2500
megacab
6.7 cummings diesel
4X4
26,000 miles
Problem solved my friend.

It is about to go.

 

[Hound Dog]

Correct. My train of thought there is that there are 2003 model year trucks with the 7.3L motor in them.

Yes there are some, I actually have one. Build date of October 2002, title says 2003. They are just not common, if the build date is Jan 1 03 or later it has a 6.0. Not sure the actual start production date, but have seen some as early as September titled as 03, Some where in November I think they were putting both engines in, but trying to use up all as many of the 7.3's that were finished ready to install before the tier 1 come into effect. 03 is the year model you really have to be careful with. The 7.3 trucks were still good, the first gen 6.0 not so much, they can be made into OK engines but it is not cheap. Ford actually got permission to keep putting 7.3's in ambulances and some of the specialty vans for a couple months into 03, but had to pay a hefty fine for every one installed. The turbo on the 6.0 wouldn't clear the ambulance and van cowl. The 99.5 to 03 super duty's are my little toy's so fairly well versed on them. Hope I didn't sound arrogant or anything.

 

[jinxx4ever]

the trucks pulling on the road for guys making a living tell the real story. Probably 90% of hotshotters running dodge ram diesels. There's a reason. They are the toughest engine going. Also just for fun, check out what a fuel and oil filter will cost u for a Ford diesel. Check out the cost of injectors. Tough? It's not even close . Something else to think about, if an 8 cylinder was any good as a diesel, your big trucks would b running them. They aren't . 6 cylinder's. Also ur farm tractors. They run low rpm and high torque, lotta HP!. That's what it's all about.

 

[lightman]

Theres probably not a right or wrong answer. They all work and they all have problems.

I have a 2012 Super Duty. Empty it gets between 17 and 19 MPG. ( I guess that I'm one of those thats full of shit) It gets slightly less with a light boat or 4 wheeler trailer. My 32ft gooseneck with my tractor and other stuff drags it down to around 10-10.5 MPG. But we're talking 16,000-17,000 pounds. It has no problem pulling any of this. The worst MPG that I ever got empty was on one stretch of interstate out in western Kansas, about 15.5 mpg. I was running 81 mph into a strong head wind and that part of the interstate is climbing in altitude.

I recently spent some major bucks for repairs on stuff that Ford knew about but failed to correct. Namely the injection pump and a leaky radiator. I was pissed, to say the least!

But about the same time a neighbor spent about the same amount on his DuroMax for much the same thing.

And about the same time a co-worker bought a Dodge that he traded off pretty quick. He complained about lousy milage and unspecified problems that kept it in the shop a lot. He took a beating to get away from it!

The Dodge that I had pretty much fell apart around the engine. Body and interior!

So, I recommend picking one based on the dealers rep.

 

[Hobo Hilton]

I've pondered on your OP for a few days... I've experienced all of the American trucks for the past 50 years...
Let's start here: 1) What do you want, 2) What do you NEED, 3) What you can afford....... ? Are you mechanical, have a shop and tools or will repairs be done at an automotive service shop?

If you are not a mechanic with a shop - Buy a Ford. Service, knowledge and parts are available coast to coast.
If you have basic mechanical skills, buy a Dodge diesel. At least you have a good power plant and can maintain and upgrade the rest of the vehicle as needed.
If you decide gamble on a Chevy / GMC... Build a shop, buy some tools and a genuine (GM) Shop Service Manual.

Trucks are like Dogs... There are no bad dogs, just bad dog owners. There are no bad Trucks, just bad truck owners / operators........ If it is "makin' a little noise". Stop and fix it. It ain't going to heal itself up.

Best of Luck,

Hobo

 

[Luke]

@Luke,
Just buy my personal truck. I don't need it as I drive my work truck everywhere and I have a family vehicle for all of us.
2014 ram 2500
megacab
6.7 cummings diesel
4X4
26,000 miles
Problem solved my friend.

It is about to go.

How much after the SnipersHide discount?

 

[Landon4]

I’ve got a 2011 Cummins with 297k on it and a 2011 f-250 with 462k on it both trucks have been good trucks I’ve done more to the ford in repairs but it sees a lot more heavy use than the dodge. I do prefer to pull with the dodge mainly because I like the exhaust brake on it but the ford doesn’t have any issues pulling that I’ve ran into pulling trailers for the company I work for. As someone else stated most hotshot drivers seem to use dodges that I’ve seen, but it seems most company’s such as Halliburton, and schlumberger seem to use Ford and I see a lot of other oilfield related companies running fords. The dodge definitely has more room under the hood if you need to do any repairs everything in the ford is a bitch to get to. Both of my trucks have full egr and dpf deletes and they run very well my son has been driving the dodge for the last year or so, and the ford is my main truck that I work out of.

 

[rjacobs]

the trucks pulling on the road for guys making a living tell the real story. Probably 90% of hotshotters running dodge ram diesels.

I like the cummins motor, so dont take this the wrong way....

Dodge's are BY FAR the cheapest to buy new. The dealer discounts are stupid... My old man and I were discussing this as he is looking for a new high trim level 3500 and is shopping all 3. He is shopping Ford Platinum(~80k) or Limited(~90k), GMC Denali(~80k), and Ram Limited(~80k). Ford is like 6-8k off pretty easy, might be able to stretch to 10k off MSRP. GM is pretty easy to snag 8-10k off MSRP with 11-12k off do-able depending on time of year. The Dodge Limited is ~80k MSRP(basically same as Denali and Ford Platinum) and the first dealer he went to tossed 15k off without batting an eye and we have seen some at 20k off MSRP advertised across the country(my old man is retired and will fly anywhere to save money). 5-10k cheaper than the next equivalent truck buys you 20-40k miles worth of fuel... thats substantial. If I was simply using a truck to hot shot, put a lot of miles on, and make money with, and all 3 were "roughly" equivalent trucks, im buying whatever is cheaper to buy.

 

[schmi015]

Honestly anyone reading this should check out Dave Smith Motors in Idaho. They sell more trucks than just about anyone in the PNW. I finally decided to upgrade from my 13 year old 137,000 mile 2006 Tacoma and they gave me a price well below what anyone local in Maryland would give me, it made it worthwhile to fly out and drive it back on a shakedown cruise.

 

[KYAggie]

schmi015 speaks the truth. Dave Smith motors is in Kellogg, ID not far from Coeur d’Alene where I use to live. I know they use to run free shuttles to the Spokane, WA airport to pick up customers and I bet they still do that. They sell Dodge and GM trucks and their prices typically more than make the trip worth it.

Dave Smith Chrysler Dodge Jeep Ram | Car Dealer Kellogg, ID

To buy a new car in Idaho or get auto service nearby, come to Dave Smith Chrysler Dodge Jeep Ram. Visit the World's Largest Jeep Ram Dealership!

www.davesmith.com

 

[schmi015]

Forgot to add I upsized from a Tacoma to a Chevy 2500HD.

 

[Bender]

I miss my 03’ 8.1 496 big block with the Allison. Zero issues. Way ahead of diesels when you add up injectors and new def systems. I would have it back in a second. Made more TQ at 1800 than a 5.3 ever did anywhere.

 

[7.62willdo]

So what have we learned from this thread, the top three diesel trucks are...(in no particular order)

1) dodge
2) ford
3) chevy
The worst diesel trucks are, in no particular order.....

1)dodge
2) ford
3) chevy

 

[Soulezoo]

Anybody telling you they get anywhere near 20mpg with a diesel truck is full of shit. With the DEF fluid trucks you might hit 16mpg average. With the older particulate filter trucks maybe 15mpg. I have had diesel trucks for many years. The avg mpg will be somewhere near 15mpg. My 2003 ram 14mpg. Chevrolet 2010 13.5mpg. The fords around that time are just as bad Tow something heavy and you are looking at about 6mpg.

fuel economy or power. Pick one.

Guess I am full of it then. Had an old 12v Cummins that got 22-24 day in, day out.
My '04 Dodge got about 20-21 empty and more than a few times got over 700 miles on a 34 gallon tank. Do the math. That was on a stock motor.

Currently, this truck puts out <900hp + 1650 tq. With a little squeeze it's 1150 and <2000.(dyno stops at 2000 tq, so I don't know the real number) That's at the wheels. It's run as low as 11.2 seconds in the quarter mile @124 (on squeeze). Then I hook up my 12k 35' fifth wheel and go for a drive. My last trip of 5000 miles doing a Wyo, Montana, Canada, Idaho Washington and Oregon loop I had overall mpg of 10. (Most of the miles were towing, not all obviously).

So what can your little twuck do?

 

[wade2big]

Guess I am full of it then. Had an old 12v Cummins that got 22-24 day in, day out.
My '04 Dodge got about 20-21 empty and more than a few times got over 700 miles on a 34 gallon tank. Do the math. That was on a stock motor.

Currently, this truck puts out <900hp + 1650 tq. With a little squeeze it's 1150 and <2000.(dyno stops at 2000 tq, so I don't know the real number) That's at the wheels. It's run as low as 11.2 seconds in the quarter mile @124 (on squeeze). Then I hook up my 12k 35' fifth wheel and go for a drive. My last trip of 5000 miles doing a Wyo, Montana, Canada, Idaho Washington and Oregon loop I had overall mpg of 10. (Most of the miles were towing, not all obviously).

So what can your little twuck do?

Apparently you are

4x4 HD trucks do not get 20 MPG period. Last time I am gonna say it so we don't have to argue.

 

[UpSideDown]

I work specifically with Ram trucks. I produce aftermarket parts for them. They have pros and cons. If you need a working truck, I really like the Rams. The Fords are a faster feeling truck. Pop the hoods and see if you’d want to work on a V-8 diesel.

The 2003-9 Cummins has a ton of chassis issues.

The 10-13 is better and got a way improved body and interior but basically very similar frame and suspension.

The 14-18 Ram got huge improvements in reliability and comfort.

The 19+ Ram got more improvements to interior, drivetrain and steering reliability. I have a 2019 2500 for a shop truck and I love it. On 35” tires we drove up to Canada, spent hours of time high idling, drove about 700 miles in 4x4, and did about 2400 miles all to the average of 22mpg. Around town I see 14mpg. Mixed with highway normally 19.

I really like the 19+ Ram more than the earlier years. Tons if small changes everywhere.
I don’t think I’d get a 3500 High Output unless it would live its life towing. You might not enjoy the transmission and reduced fuel economy.
Remove the idea of deleting a truck from your mind. A lot of guys mention it, but deleting is gone now. Last year the EPA went hard after tuner companies. You won’t be getting a tune to delete with.

 

[Heretoimproveforhunting]

im running a 2017 chevy diesel 3500 DRW flatbed. WT trim level so it gives yu power everything, but you get yur front row bench seat like the OP me tioned. comfortable fake leather interior. running a dual tank setup. with a ranch hand, first 25k miles i was avg around 17 mpg on the dallas mix of freeways and normal roads. last 15k has been around 15. both of those without loads.

truck has been pretty solid, but GM has had issues with injectors on the diesels and i did have to replace two under warranty. at the time i had to wait 15-20 days for the damn things to come in. at the moment im on a wait list for a coolant level sensor(which went out when they replaced injectors). either they dicked up the order on that or GM is having supply chain issues. seems like everytime i go in (and i go into a fleet garage) stuff isnt immediately available. that is about my only gripe. otherwise its been a decent truck so far.

 

[abn31c]

My play rig is a 09 1 ton fullsize 4 door Ford. With a lil plumbing a lil electronic wizardry and a straight pipe it gets 21 mpg. For daily stuff I have been quite happy with Dodge half tons.

 

[wade2big]

2018 dodge ram 2500
6.7L diesel
4 door 4x4

This photo speaks for itself.
99.9 mpg.

its about as accurate as all the other stuff posted ? Maybe the brand new ones are better. I’m just having fun.

 

[hollowoutadime]

First, the is no "g" in Cummins.

I believe that most diesels are HPCR (high pressure common rail) design and use a Bosch high pressure pump and injectors. Most of the 3/4/one tons have plenty of pulling power, so for me, it was a question of reliability and serviceability. Cummins uses an inline 6 cyl where the Duramax (Chevy) is an 8 cylinder design. While both have similar power and displacement, the inline 6 (Cummins) has only one head and allows access to both sides of the block without an intake straddling both banks of cylinders. So for me, I went with the Dodge/Cummins design. Having a solid front axle, it might be stronger (not sure), but it's ride cornering isn't as good as the Chevy's independent front end. Since mine was mostly utility driven, I didn't care about interior refinement.

What you might not hear is that modern diesels use $300+/ea injectors (each) that are susceptible to fuel (water) contamination. They are actually little solenoids that pulse 25,000 PSI fuel 5+ times per cycle into the cylinders. Water in diesel fuel ruins the injectors. Thats why serviceability matters, and an injector replacement is easy on an inline design. I did a repower using a Cummins and prior, took all this into consideration.

 

[Geno C.]

This is post tune and deleting. While it actually gets higher hand calculated, it is not where near 20mpg. I tow at least 50% of the time. The computer over stated fuel economy before the delete and tunes.

 

[Geno C.]

And the miles are 27861. That was this last year. We take a hit with winterized fuel also.

 

[Landon4]

My f-250 stays on like 17.7 average on the computer, if I reset either trip a or b on a long highway trip it’ll read around 20.5 this is on a 2011 with a full egr and dpf delete, that’s with my pack rat 2 weatherguard sideboxes and the big weatherguard crossbox. When I hand calculate it’s around 1.5-2 mpg lower.

 

[Geno C.]

The 3.55 gears in the non drw fords will help some for sure.

 

[Landon4]

Yeah and I usually don’t drive real fast just a couple over the limit, I know if I’m running 80 or so it kills it but around 70 it’s not bad

 

[packratt]

If you are looking to sit 3 in front, the 40/20/40 split front seat is a good option to a bench. If you are buying used, and find a console truck, that fits your specs other than only having 2 front seats that isn't an issue. There are people with 40/20/40 trucks that would be happy to trade their middle seat for your console. Dealer pricing is nuts and you are looking at 500-1500 junk yard. If you are close enough to face to face trade someone will jump on it.

 

[346ci]

We have 2010-2011 Ram 2500s with the 6.7 and 2011-2019 F250s with the 6.7. All used for DOT so sadly no much needed deletes done.

The rams are ok, driver's seat bottoms wear out pretty fast but most of ours have been redone. Have a spare water pump ready to go on, keep CCV filter changed.

We had one 2011 F250 drop a glow plug and it needed a engine/turbo(early and under warranty thank God). The 2011s have exhaust temp sensor, DEF heater and radiator leak issues. The 2017-2019 F250 death wobble is terrible, other than that they are good trucks and have lots of power. Very easy to change the oil and fuel filters also.

 

[WeiserBucks]

I'd bet 99% of you guys complaining about mileage are also rocking an over fueled, big tired automatic transmission pile of fuck.

A properly tuned manual truck with stock tires gets very good mileage. My 07 5.9 gets 22 in mixed driving and 16 towing 25k , in the fucking mountains of Idaho.

 

[Heretoimproveforhunting]

I'd bet 99% of you guys complaining about mileage are also rocking an over fueled, big tired automatic transmission pile of fuck.

A properly tuned manual truck with stock tires gets very good mileage. My 07 5.9 gets 22 in mixed driving and 16 towing 25k , in the fucking mountains of Idaho.

is 07 pre def?

 

[WeiserBucks]

Sure is .

 

[Tylerbry]

1999.5-2003 super duty. Mine has 180k and runs like its new. I just drove it from Alaska to Georgia last fall without any problems. I see em for sale occasionally for around 10k. Unless you’re looking for something newer then I would still go with a power stroke but I like fords. In my experience the only thing dodge has going for them is the Cummins. The rest of the truck will fall to pieces.

 

[wade2big]

I'd bet 99% of you guys complaining about mileage are also rocking an over fueled, big tired automatic transmission pile of fuck.

A properly tuned manual truck with stock tires gets very good mileage. My 07 5.9 gets 22 in mixed driving and 16 towing 25k , in the fucking mountains of Idaho.

Unfortunately 6 speed manuals are gone and have been. You have to have a ram no newer than about a 2012 maybe and a ford or a chevy from 2006 or earlier. I like to shift gears but I will admit the Autos of today blow away the manuals in every way.

 

[WeiserBucks]

Unfortunately 6 speed manuals are gone.

Bullshit , I drive one every day.

 

[wade2big]

Bullshit , I drive one every day.

Im sure you do. Eventually they will be relics. You cant find a truck that is newer than about 9 years old or so.

i like manual transmissions in trucks, jeeps, and sports cars for the driving experience. Its foolish to think they are superior to the autos today. They arent. I would buy one in a heartbeat though.

 

[Mooseknuckles]

You can still get a 18-19 ram truck with a manual trans with the Cummins.

 

[wade2big]

You can still order a ram truck with a manual trans with the Cummins.

I think 2018 was the last year for that. I will look that up and double check. You may be right.

I havent seen a 6speed on a ram since they turned into a special order option Many years ago.

 

[WeiserBucks]

Every legit OTR truck has a manual, and an inline 6 cylinder. New trucks are trash and will only get worse. The only reason to buy a new one is to keep up with the Jones or a write off.

 

[wade2big]

Every legit OTR truck has a manual, and an inline 6 cylinder. New trucks are trash and will only get worse. The only reason to buy a new one is to keep up with the Jones or a write off.

Or have a truck without a massive repair bill. I agree to what you are saying in a sense but trucks will not last forever no matter how much maintenance you do. Eventually a new truck makes better financial since. They will fall apart.

 

[WeiserBucks]

Maybe you should be a consultant, and tell that to every single company operating pre WWII power generation equipment. Anything that isn't alive can be maintained almost indefinitely.

 

[thejeep]

Hino 155dc

 

[Geno C.]

Maybe you should be a consultant, and tell that to every single company operating pre WWII power generation equipment. Anything that isn't alive can be maintained almost indefinitely.

I assume you don’t fix Diesel engines for a living. I doubt there are many, if any that have a maintenance schedule like mine. Nothing lasts forever. At least not while making any fiscal sense

 

[Geno C.]

I'd bet 99% of you guys complaining about mileage are also rocking an over fueled, big tired automatic transmission pile of fuck.

A properly tuned manual truck with stock tires gets very good mileage. My 07 5.9 gets 22 in mixed driving and 16 towing 25k , in the fucking mountains of Idaho.

I Have $1,000 plus your fuel bill if you can haul 25k from you AO to mine and get 16mpg. Receipts and I’ll scale you when you get here.

Better yet, make the $2,000

 

[Mooseknuckles]

I Have $1,000 plus your fuel bill if you can haul 25k from you AO to mine and get 16mpg. Receipts and I’ll scale you when you get here.

Better yet, make the $2,000

Damn 16mpg hauling 25k! Geno you better trade in those freight shakers and get you some 07 dodge Cummins to tow your stuff ?

 

[Geno C.]

I may be just a dumb carnie, but I know bullshit when I smell it, a mile away. If a pickup could get 16mpg hauling my house trailer, I don’t care how uncomfortable a piece of shit it is, I’d buy 3 of them!

 

[WeiserBucks]

I'm not taking that challenge, I'll stay in America and enjoy my honest mileage.

 

[Geno C.]

Damn 16mpg hauling 25k! Geno you better trade in those freight shakers and get you some 07 dodge Cummins to tow your stuff ?

It’s not all freightliners around here. I have Volvo, Pete and Internationals too ?

 

[Geno C.]

I'm not taking that challenge, I'll stay in America and enjoy my honest mileage.

American, WI isn’t America?! It’s a gods honest challenge. Make it $5,000

 

[Mooseknuckles]

It’s not all freightliners around here. I have Volvo, Pete and Internationals too ?

That’s a good variety, reminds me of working on garbage trucks. We had all of those. Volvo honestly was my favorite truck but the biggest pain in the ass to work on.