why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

[cptchuck]

I had been looking to build up a bolt action tac driver. We never have gun shows in my county and all the sudden one came to town!! The very last table had a rem700 223 tasco world 3-9x40 scope on it. I loved that baby after 200 dollars worth of ammo trying to figure out what it liked best. 35g Vmax and 53g Vmax was both awesome. Until my gun dealer called and said he has fiocchi 40g Vmax. Everywhere I read said my gun needed 55g and above but I have a 1:9 twist and everything everyone told me so far is I am wrong about the ammo i buy.

So I am here to post pics of my new groups and see if another round can get better groups. What do you guys use? How are you groups at 100 yards?

My scope and mounts are hawke. Sidewinder 30 (amazing is not even close to it) 6.5-20X44. The trigger was pre-set when I got it but if your start to pull it will fire, you can’t get a full finger pad pressed on b4 it fires. A Heavy bull barrel. hogue over mold stock with vents on the front sides. Front Bipod and shoulder for back rest.

Groups
pic is sideways 3 shots 100yrd 40g Vmax bi-pod/shoulder

3 shots 100yrd 40g Vmax fiocchi walmart $30 gun rest/stand

3shot 100yrd 35g NTX bi-pod/my body

same grain

Here is the beast!!

20x half mildot 1-5 setting for night vission also

Mil dot fits full field of view, something I HAD to have

 

[High Binder]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

^^ Holy giant knobs Batman! WTF?

Must be another government overrun.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

Here's an important question for you. How does it 'group' at 400 or 500 yards? And as to that, any/all here will suggest that a minimum of 5 shot groups, if not 10 shot groups, be a minimum.

But that is a whole other story. I respectfully suggest that you check out the 'Basic Marksmanship Forum' here on the 'Hide. Many (or all) of your answers will be there.

There too, you'll find more questions. Ones that you didn't know you even had.

 

[Killer Spade 13]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

Perhaps we should go to 100 round shot groups with shots being made in specific time increments?

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

Those may be giant knobs... and only three shot groups... but not bad when they go under a dime.

If this is GA Army Vet's first post... think what he'll be showing us after some lessons from the 'Hide.

Welcome aboard and good shooting!

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[cptchuck]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

The big knob is an add on so you can leave you face on gun and still see range. It slides right off..

I will do the 10 shot group monday or tuesday. As far as the 200+ yards go its very hard for me to get to those places to shoot. I was blown up in Iraq and have a broken back, the closest place to shoot that far requires you to walk to the range over rough groud.

Thanks for the input and I will check the other pages out.

 

[Shooter_308]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

First off, Thanks for your service!

Second, nice groups but i too would like to see some higher-count shot groups. Is the rifle itself stock??? If so that's pretty imressive for a stock SPS-V!

 

[cptchuck]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

My gun was said to be a 223 1:9 twist, the ammo that works best for me is the 35NTX and 53Vmax superformance Hornaday and its favorite most accurate is 40gr Vmax fiocchi. My groups are .210 and .340

My friend loved it and wanted to build one, he went to walmart and picked up a rem 700 ADL 223 1:12 twist he shoots 60grain TAP hornaday. I grouped his gun at 1.20ish anything more or less will put groups the size of tennis balls or bigger. same for my gun. If I put ammo everyone else swears works for my twist the groups are baseballs..........

I looked for 2hrs on here and day after day looking on google for input from people with the same issues. I have seen others with the same grain and I use, and they work as well as mine. But I am asking the pros here what is so different with our guns??? The local gun builder here is no help. He says I/we are wrong.

 

[cptchuck]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

Sir to be honest I picked it up from a gun show used, he said it came from a sheriff out of Fla. Put a new scope on and sold it for 525, i paid 500 and put a hawke sidewinder 30 6.5-20x44 scope on it. B4 the new scope I was shooting 1/2in moa all day. Now I can darn near read the barcode on my targets and my groups ran down to side by side touching.

I wish I knew more about it because I would love to build another like it! So I could say I did it. With factory loads I am pleased!!

 

[wfjames22]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ga Army Vet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

</div></div>

Spin your bipod 180 degrees dog, its on backwards. Thanks for your service and sacrifice.

 

[Queequeg]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ga Army Vet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My gun was said to be a 223 1:9 twist, the ammo that works best for me is the 35NTX and 53Vmax superformance Hornaday and its favorite most accurate is 40gr Vmax fiocchi. My groups are .210 and .340

My friend loved it and wanted to build one, he went to walmart and picked up a rem 700 ADL 223 1:12 twist he shoots 60grain TAP hornaday. I grouped his gun at 1.20ish anything more or less will put groups the size of tennis balls or bigger. same for my gun. If I put ammo everyone else swears works for my twist the groups are baseballs..........

I looked for 2hrs on here and day after day looking on google for input from people with the same issues. I have seen others with the same grain and I use, and they work as well as mine. But I am asking the pros here what is so different with our guns??? The local gun builder here is no help. He says I/we are wrong. </div></div>

I have a Savage with 1:9" twist that shoots everything I've tried in it very well up to 70 grain bullets. I have never tried anything heavier (or longer) as it has been my understanding that the 1:9" twist is insufficient to stabilize longer heavier bullets. I have read that some folks with 1:9 twist barrels have had good results with bullets up to 77 -80 grains in the .308. We'll see one day!

I haven't really been all that interested in experimenting further as 52, 68, 69 and 70 grain bullets shoot so well I figured why bother, especially since I have been doing so much more with the .308!

From most accounts, the 1:12" barrels should not be accurate with bullets over 55-60 grains but who knows!

Welcome aboard here!

 

[desertrat1979]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

+1 with stretching it out further. I know it may be tough to get to longer ranges, but 100yd groups are only really good for getting your rifle zero'd on the load you decide to settle on.

You may get tight groups at 100 yds, but 4-600 yards will tell you if its able to keep the bullet stabilized. I have seen guys who live by a load that shoots an inch at 100, but has less spread at longer ranges than other loads that shoot sub-minute groups at 100. If the bullet is stable, its not gonna deviate as much, especially at a distance.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

Welcome aboard and thanks for your service.

I have no idea why folks tell you things like that. If you get a chance, they should see your targets; love to see the look on their faces.

Just goes to show...

Lighter/shorter bullets can perform well up close, but will fade somewhat as distances open up. S' OK, they're just doin' their job,. Longer diatances like heavier/longer bullets. In the 1:9" twist, 69 or 70gr bullets would be a good choice, you may get HDY 75gr HPBT Match to work, but I suspect the 75ge A-Max is just at the edge of being too long.

One concern about lighter bullets and faster twists; they can run at especally fast RPMa. There is come potential for disintegration from excess centrifugal forces, but most modern varmint bullets can handle it.

Greg

 

[Switchblade]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

You can run anything up to 77gr with about the same results at 100M. The 55gr will perform well to around 500M, but the 62fmjbt(M855) will outperform the 55 all day long. The 77gr will put you out even further due to the wind resistant weight.
My suggestion would be to buy an inexpensive, reliable chrony, and clock your factory loads in YOUR rifle. Then buy a log book to write down the performance, notes and comments at each range. Then take a box of each load, and set a 100M(beginner) zero. Now take each load, and dope it to as far as you can shoot safely. Remember, you will use about one or two boxes of each doing this, but you will have a very solid idea on which weight bullet performs the best at all your ranges.
Then you may get into reloading...we all do, it's a hazard of the sport, you know, spending way too much money...and you can start with a basic load using that weight bullet to match the factry velocity as a baseline. Then you simply loaad 1/4gr steps up, and 1/4gr steps down to about 2gr to see which load gives you the tightest, most precise groups at moderate range...using your scope dope to say 500M if you have that, or 300 if you have that. You will probably at this point have either a 300M zero, or a 500M zero just because it's easier to manipulate teh scope at that setting up or down. This is th epoint too, that you will already realize that you have a not so good scope, and start looking hard at a SWFA SS, or one of the other nicer entry level scopes(you will of course be lusting over the Nightforce, USO, S&B, etc at this point too)
Hahahahaha, man, you are in for frustration, fun, and an overall good time. Welcome aboard

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

Sounds like you have a very light trigger pull.

If <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">you</span></span> think it's too light, then it <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">is</span></span> too light; get it to a smith ad get that adjusted to <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">your</span></span> satisfaction. No sense living with somebody else's preferences, especially for things like the trigger pull weight. That's a safety issue.

Greg

 

[cptchuck]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

I love the triger pull, it was way to light to start with, I want not used to something liket that. But After 2 time taking it out I was more than used to it. I want to figure out what its set at and make my other guns the same way....

Here are my 15 shots at 200yrds on a stormy day... gusting winds

15shots for you guys wanting more shot groups. never took time after anyshots, when five were done I put another 5 in and then another 5, rode down range to pick up the target and here it is 100yards 15shots 40g fiocchi Vmax

 

[Former0302]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

Each rifle is a little bit different.

I have a 700 PSS in .223 with a 1/9 twist that doesn't like anything above 55 gr ammo. 55 gr and lower is .5 to .25 MOA (up to 200 yds anyway), throw in anything heavier and groups really open up.

But, it looks like you've definitely found some ammo that works for that rifle. The up side is you'll get a lot experience reading wind if you're able to shoot further distances.

 

[rpk762]

Re: why are they saying my ammo is wrong for my twist?

There is nothing wrong with what you are shooting. I shoot a 50gr bullet out of a 1:8 twist. If it shoots it is good enough.