Re: Why don't you guys like Savage? Serious question.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armorpl8chikn</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And what is 'visceral' fortitude? Your deep gut feeling, or unreasonable decision based on fear? Earthy common knowlegde?
Maybe you 'splanched'
Back in the day, we put it straightforward and called it "Intestinal fortitude", i.e. GUTS
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Viscera: The internal organs of the body, specifically those within the chest (as the heart or lungs) or abdomen (as the liver, pancreas or intestines).
The singular of "viscera" is "viscus" meaning in Latin "an organ of the body."
Sorry for not being straightforward and not making it a bit simpler. Thanks for the English lesson.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I find it simply hilarious that anyone would think that "visceral fortitude" is required to type a couple hundred words explaining why one does not like a particular rifle manufacturer. Wow, what courage! </div></div>
I find it hilarious that after a man is bitch slapped you feel the need to throw in a punch or two, good timing.
I will have you know I have already written several hundred words in this thread of my own. I have tried to be civil and choose my words carefully in an attempt to not be the one that caused a full out flame war. I have already said that I plan to buy one of these magical low cost giant killers that so many people feel the need to act like dickholes over. For the record I do not look down my nose at people that cannot afford a custom rifle. I have worked many years and done much trading and swapping to be able to own a few custom guns. I don't like people acting like I am a goddamned fool for owning those custom guns when I could have went down to Wal-Mart and bought something off the rack just as good, when in fact I have witnessed that is mostly bullshit. There are always a few exceptional examples from most manufacturers AS I HAVE ALREADY STATED. I own a few. Like I said this class envy bullshit goes both ways. I should have just quoted in red what exactly Tyler said that I felt strongly about and left it there. I'm out unless anyone feels the need to make some more personal remarks.</div></div>
Actually, thank you for the English lesson. I had a different thought in mind as my last post showed of what I thought 'visceral' meant. I had to look it up to be clear.
Serious, no joking, no sarcasm.
As far as Savages go, meaning the better model 12's, I've found most every one I've ever shot to be very accurate. Most were around .5 MOA and some barely under 1 MOA.
However...and this is big.... I would expect a custom precision rifle to shoot like a benchrest gun. Where I may shoot .5 MOA out of the box with tuned handloads, I feel that if a good gunsmith has done his work, that rifle with tuned loads under extremely 'other factor-less' conditions should shoot .1 or better. That's also a matter of the reloader tuning his loads and his technique. Getting right down to the nitty gritty and finding every way not to change one thing for five shots. But, still, if the custom gun was put together right, it could do that.
It's also understandable, that those kinds of groups are not possible really, with most any gun, because of the nature of the differences of requirements of shooting tactical.
It's also a simple fact that mass machining today with computer controlled cuts and tolerances that can be held in the .0005's is reaching what a good machinist can do with a good machine (that is at least electronically measured).
I have only been able to do THAT with one of my Savages, the 12FV in .223. I shot a series of .08's and .09's for a time that had me thinking I really was on to a giant killer. Then, me or the rifle, that super accuracy faded. I haven't been able to put five shots under .1 since then. Remember, that was only one out of quite a bunch. I still hold that the bench is the best place to see what kind of accuracy THE RIFLE has. It's not as much of a test of the shooter unless you're getting down to splitting fine hairs. Again though, that is also a test of how accurately he can reload. **
Moving back to tactical type shooting, you are never going to need that kind of accuracy. But, it's always nice to have. I have yet to see a Savage that can duplicate any of the Custom bench guns and a lot of the Custom tactical rifles I've had the pleasure of shooting.
**note- LL, (Frank) <span style="text-decoration: underline">hates</span> shooting groups. He told me one time it's like pulling out one hair at a time, all day long. I love shooting groups. The only reason I use the analogy here is because I have always felt it is the purest way to test a rifles accuracy. The best way to eliminate shooter induced problems. I fully acknowledge, it's not a good test for a tactical shooter.
