I am considering rebarreling my 223 1-12 twist to a 222 rem mag fast twist. I believe that it has more capacity than a 223AI to push the heavy bullets. Why is there no load data and no interest in triple deuce mag for the high bc pills.
why not 222 remington magnum
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The .222Remington Magnum was developed concurrently with the .223Remington. When the US Military and NATO adopted the 5.56x45mm (.223Rem in military clothing), the .222RemMag was DOA, even with the slight increase in performance. There hasn't been any real interest in the .222RemMag in about 30yrs, except that Ruger did use it as the basis for the .204Ruger.
Why pay for hard to source .222RemMag brass, when 5.56x45mm brass is available almost for free.
Why pay for hard to source .222RemMag brass, when 5.56x45mm brass is available almost for free.
I agree whole heartily, I have had three 222 RM though never twisted for the heavier bullets and they just flat perform. No one has loading data newer than 10 years for them unfortunately.
I read much about the performance of the 223 AI but dont know how it can outperform the 222 RM. The 222 RM has 6% more case volume than the standard 223.
My next barrel will be a 1 in 8 and I will use 223 load data for the heavier bullets to develop a load. Most of the load data for the 222 RM is at a much lower pressure than what the 223 is published.
With the 222 RM's longer neck it is a natural for the heavier longer bullets plus no fire forming like the 223AI.
It is claimed that the 223AI has a 7% case capacity increase over the 223, pretty much a wash velocity wise 222RM vs 223AI.
Of course brass is much more plentiful for the 223.
I am quite certain the 222 RM will perform just as good or better than the 223AI with the benefit of a longer neck.
It would be nice if one or more of the bullet & powder manufactures would update their loading data for the 222 RM.
I read much about the performance of the 223 AI but dont know how it can outperform the 222 RM. The 222 RM has 6% more case volume than the standard 223.
My next barrel will be a 1 in 8 and I will use 223 load data for the heavier bullets to develop a load. Most of the load data for the 222 RM is at a much lower pressure than what the 223 is published.
With the 222 RM's longer neck it is a natural for the heavier longer bullets plus no fire forming like the 223AI.
It is claimed that the 223AI has a 7% case capacity increase over the 223, pretty much a wash velocity wise 222RM vs 223AI.
Of course brass is much more plentiful for the 223.
I am quite certain the 222 RM will perform just as good or better than the 223AI with the benefit of a longer neck.
It would be nice if one or more of the bullet & powder manufactures would update their loading data for the 222 RM.
My first varmint rifle was a Sako L461 in .222 RM. Super accurate & a great round. Before the internet was big, I ordered 1000 unprimed cases from a big Remington supplier because all I could find locally was loaded ammo. When I built a custom, fast twist .222 RM, I used max .223 loads as my starting point. Worked fine.
I agree, though, it is a great little round.
I agree, though, it is a great little round.
With the original cases compared side by side the .222 RM offers just a tiny bit of performance over the .223. Even though the case is significantly longer, the body is not. It only offers .019" over the .223 case. Taper being about the same and shoulder as well. So, not a really big capacity change there. However, if one were to extend the body and make the neck about equal to the .223 then there would be a pretty substantial increase in capacity. One worth seeing happen IMO. Especially since this cartridge died without the benefit of the modern powders we have today.
Other than performance capability, you have one other thing going against it. It's too long to fit in an AR with all but the lightest .223 bullets. You're also not going to be able to neck it up and run 6mm, .257", 6.5mm 6.8mm or 7mm bullets in it in an AR. Again though, a pretty good boost on those calibers that already have been tried in the .223 case. You could easily do this in a standard short action. In fact I think Remington 700 short actions (and 600's as well as 788's) did not have the block that .222's and .223's had. This would be about as simple a conversion as you wished from a standard Savage action. Necking it up would be quite interesting as well.
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The original cartridge intended for the AR15 was the .222 Rem mag. It was shortened to the ".224 special" which with a couple very minor tweaks became the 5.56/.223 Rem.
Other than performance capability, you have one other thing going against it. It's too long to fit in an AR with all but the lightest .223 bullets. You're also not going to be able to neck it up and run 6mm, .257", 6.5mm 6.8mm or 7mm bullets in it in an AR. Again though, a pretty good boost on those calibers that already have been tried in the .223 case. You could easily do this in a standard short action. In fact I think Remington 700 short actions (and 600's as well as 788's) did not have the block that .222's and .223's had. This would be about as simple a conversion as you wished from a standard Savage action. Necking it up would be quite interesting as well.
Added:
The original cartridge intended for the AR15 was the .222 Rem mag. It was shortened to the ".224 special" which with a couple very minor tweaks became the 5.56/.223 Rem.
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I've always thought a 22-250 with a fast twist barrel and heavy bullets would be awesome. Haven't heard of anyone doing it though.
22-250 has a nice long neck and would be sweet with 75gr and heavier bullets.
All the factory rifles are slow twist for light bullets.
22-250 has a nice long neck and would be sweet with 75gr and heavier bullets.
All the factory rifles are slow twist for light bullets.
I thought the original AR's were for .222 Rem. France's AR's were .222; have wanted 1 in my collection for years.
The original AR's were .222Rem, but it could not meet the performance requirement without excessive pressures. That result in the dual development of the .222RemMag and .223Rem
Theres a few guys here in Australia messing with the 22-250AI with heavy projectiles, it gets rid of the body taper and slows case stretching.
One of my favorite rifles is my Savage 12bvss castrated with a Shilen 1-8 fast twist 26" 22-250 barrel. Groups 77g CustomComps and 69gSMKs rather well at 600yds.
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My interest in 222 mag is mostly because it is an odd ball. It would be going in a rem 700 with a 10 round mag shooting high volume at dogs. It is intersting that people will go through the effort to make 223AI when triple deuce mag is a similar capacity. I was thinking 75 A max would be the ticket.
You are correct, my mistake.
The original intended round was the .222 Rem. When that did not meet the velocity w/weight of bullet requirements, the .222 RM was developed (it later became the .222 RM,). It was called the .224 Springfield I believe. Which in turn developed the .224 Special (5.56/.223) In any case the .222 RM and the 5.56/.223 were not dual developed, the .223 was decided on as they needed room in the magazine and the long neck of the .222 RM didn't need to be so long. It was shortened and we now have the .223.
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It is usually the cost and availability of brass. For not getting much more why go to a .222 RM? Go with the .223 where brass is all over the place and cheap. As I stated in my earlier post, the only real advantage to this case is if you improve it by using up some of the neck.
All in all though it is a good thought.
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Might make some sense to consider 204 necked up. Better shoulder angle and higher capacity, straight case, neck shortened. If any change in .223 makes sense.
Or, for varmints, try a .204 and never look back.
Or, for varmints, try a .204 and never look back.
I have a 222 Rem in a bolt gun and messed up a Midway order and have 2 boxes of nosler 222RM boxes. PM if interested.
Midway has had 222 Rem Mag brass in stock on a pretty regular basis. It was actually easier to find that 223 brass during the Newtown bullshit.
If you are still interested in this build, I did one and can give you some specs.
