I'm just interested in your thoughts, if USO will survive the onslaught of new products coming to the market this year from other larger US manufacturers? 
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Rifle Scopes Will USO Survive???
- Thread starter sib1948
- Start date
Yes they will. They already have a following and come recommended. Not like New products will instantly kill off a company. And even if they did it would be in a few years and assume said company didn't add their own new product to the industry
Yes they will. They still offer a fantastic line up of optics that are bomb proof. They are still innovating with new models and have a core following. Beyond that, their customer service is second to none. Obviously no one wants to have to use the customer service but heaven help you if you do with some of these larger manufacturers. Not all of my rifles have USO on them, but I wish they did.
These optics are professional grade, but novices recognize their quality too. Given both, USO is successful and will be.
I'm just interested in your thoughts, if USO will survive the onslaught of new products coming to the market this year from other larger US manufacturers?
I dont see anything new that will kill another competitor in the Optics market. Dont really think it works that way.
Curious where you are coming from? Are you for or against USO's "survival"?
Sounds like you think they wont survive, otherwise why would you create a thread like this?
WTF kind of post is this? Reading the provoctative title, it implies the OP has some type of updated information about something that has hit the company - that's what I thought when I read it -" oh, sh** what happened at USO? " Only to find out that he's just trolling.
I brought this up because I felt that they always had a strong following and were mention when Threads brought up premium scopes, but not so much this year. I know that Hide members have great Customer Service through Lazy21. To my eyes, however, when I have shot here in the AZ desert many times over the years, they have seemed dark and with dull colors compared to S&Bs.
I was NOT trolling, but trying to ask a legitimate question which HAS been answered. I appreciate everyone's input.
What a bullshit trolling post!!! Period. You ask an uneducated question then snipe the USO product because it's dark to your eyes. USO has a niche market with their custom scope line, who else does that? Oh that's right Leupold does a little bit of that but that's apples to oranges. Oh and by the way some of the "big boys" have been sniffing around since USO began offering a production line, in fact I personally heard a S&B exec state, "it would probably just be easier to buy you then compete." Oh and lastly USO has doubled sales in the past 24 months not bad for such a shitty seeing scope.
Thanks, peterh. I really wasn't trying to create a Firestorm! I should have ducked, but didn't see this coming,
Problem with the question is that it is based on an opinion. If you want to question the survival of a company because the glass "seemed dark and with dull colors compared to S&Bs", then are you going to question the survival of all other optics based on the same opinion? there are many optics out there that don't match up to USO but yet they still survive.
Pretty sure USO is safe or at least I hope so because I just sent a nice chunk of change in for an ER-25 with all the trimmings.
Pretty sure USO is safe or at least I hope so because I just sent a nice chunk of change in for an ER-25 with all the trimmings.
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Deleted member 10043
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LOL. In Marxist philosophy, the term trolling is used by the social class who owns the means of production and whose societal concerns are the value of property and the preservation of capital, in order to ensure the perpetuation of their economic supremacy in society. USO will live on and death to the bourgeoisie.
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Honestly I saw the thread and thought it was going to have insider information too. I was just thinking the other day how USO seems to not have much of a following anymore. I'm not an optics expert, have never used USO but they DO seem to have lost some popularity around here. I see fewer and fewer people talking about them and using them from a totally unscientific perspective.
If they really have doubled their sales in the last 24 months good for them. They have a reputation as being bulletproof, which is valuable the more intense use you put your optic through. My bro-in-law's Vortex Razor crapped out during the SH Cup this year (after shooting it on a loose scope base for half a day.) They will take care of him for sure, no manufacturer is immune, but my point is it would be better to not have to use the warranty in the first place.
If they really have doubled their sales in the last 24 months good for them. They have a reputation as being bulletproof, which is valuable the more intense use you put your optic through. My bro-in-law's Vortex Razor crapped out during the SH Cup this year (after shooting it on a loose scope base for half a day.) They will take care of him for sure, no manufacturer is immune, but my point is it would be better to not have to use the warranty in the first place.
I dont like cookie cutter scopes. USO provides custom scopes with the features I want. I will keep buying USO and specing them how I want. I see myself buying 2 to 3 more scopes over the next few years and they will be USO.
I heard that a lot in the past, that USO had good but not great glass. No one has ever questioned the build quality and toughness of their scopes, though.
I've also heard that they've improved the glass in recent years.
I just got an ER25 in a trade and to my eyes the glass is as good as the Steiner Military 5-25 it replaced. I am impressed with this scope, I really am. The EREK elevation knob is really bad ass, too. It's my 2nd USO and let me say now, the market needs a USO as much as it needs an S&B or a Vortex. Long live USO.
Don't worry. Plenty use the USO warranty and customer service.
To the OP, I hope they stay around. More options the better.
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Deleted member 10043
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I will spec out 3 to 6 scopes, Comrade. We will do it for the Motherland.
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I wish USO would go back to how they were, but I will continue to buy their glass.
They make a good product and have good customer service.
They make a good product and have good customer service.
Go back to how they were? How do you mean?
Unless you are just looking for them to bring back discontinued products like the Ergo parallax or the SN9?
They aren't going anywhere,... While there are a lot of offerings out there right now, USO's niche has always been aimed at users who want high-end/indestructible components, and highly configurable features,... I wish I hadn't sold my SN-3 Ergo,... not that the S&B I have is bad
Ry
Ry
+ 2
The Ergo is much more forgiving when time is short, and the Erek w/ 45 IPHY a rev is only to my liking because I can't get 90 per. Now if USO would just re-number the MDMOA or put the X where the +20 is now and number to 60 total up, I'd be ordering another or sending the 22x back for up grades.
Not everyone has all day to shoot at paper or steel, and that is a failing many can't grasp. To get something one has to give up something and with USO, I come closer to getting what I want than any other mfg out there. At the end of the day it's about the guy spending his money on what he wants to do with a tool. The thundering herd frothing over XXX is fine for the herd, but many have different needs. No one makes a good scope for a 500yd subsonic gun with a retical that breaks down to 1/2IPHY with 90-100 IPHY in one turn, if anyone knows of one let me know, I'm still looking.
All I can say is. I just received my first USO St10 and it had a problem. If man makes it, it can break. Sent it back and I can't say enough about the whole crew at USO. They are the best I have ever seen. I have been in the avionics business for over 16 years and I can tell you as customer service goes the people that make radios for airplanes need to sit down and take notes from USO. As soon as I sell a few toys (guns) I will be getting a LR17 with all the bells and whistles. I do have the newer Nightforce ATACR and it is very nice don't get me wrong there are a lot of good glass out there and it comes down to each and ever one on which one you will get. Don't let anyone tell you different or which one to buy. Make your own discussion and stick to it you will be happier with your self.
Rumor is that Leupold like two other major manufacturers has been using USO patented technology. The other two pay USO for this technology (including S&B) but the mega company has decided to use their crew of lawyers to challenge USO's technology, although Leupy will likely lose they have the money to fight it and are gambling that USO (smaller American based co.) won't. So that is the answer to your question about Leupold suing USO, it's a patent challenge.
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Deleted member 10043
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Interesting. With that information it was easy to find something and the rumors appear to be correct. What I find interesting is USO contacted Leupold for patent infringement on Leupold's Mark 6 and Mark 8 riflescopes with the model M5B2 adjustment knob option. Seems like Leupold would have waited until USO initiiaded a suit. Instead, Leupold went after USO because USO demanded Leupold to enter into a licensing agreement among other things? So, Leupold wasn't already in an agreement to pay USO to use the technology but Leupold is arguing they are not using the particular technology. What I also find interesting is one party threatening to sue and the other party saying enough is enough and initiating the fight. I don't understand the legal strategy in that. Maybe it was USO that was gambling here and Leupold thinks they have more resources to fight? These costs are going to have to be made up in USO sales. Maybe the USO fanboys can start buying more scopes to support USO's fight. They can have special inscriptions on the scopes that will make them even more customized. Or even a special line of scopes whereas xx% of the profits will go towards USO legal costs. Wait, that is already included in the price of current scopes for all manufacturers under contingencies. Maybe the fanboys can go to the shows and intimidate the staff working Leupold's booth. There will be a bunch of rednecks hanging around so I wouldn't advise that at all. But the bottom line is USO was talking smack and didn't do anything so Leupold did. If you are going to be a tiger don't be a paper tiger. Reminds me of a line from The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly. "When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk."
http://litigation.maxval-ip.com/Attachments/CM 3 14-cv-00727_ord.pdf
http://litigation.maxval-ip.com/Attachments/CM 3 14-cv-00727_ord.pdf
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Leupold is asking for declaration that they aren't violating the patent and that the patent is invalid. The last part is important.
It could be that they initiated the suit for financial reasons. The more scopes they sell that are in violation, if they were deemed to be violation, the more they could lose if USO won a law suit down the road.
It could be that they initiated the suit for financial reasons. The more scopes they sell that are in violation, if they were deemed to be violation, the more they could lose if USO won a law suit down the road.
USO recieved a call from someone who knew that they had patented the knob technology and had been being paid by two other major companies. USO checked out the knob on the Leupolds and then notified their patent attorney who concurred that it was their patented technology. A letter was sent advising Leupold of what USO believed the facts to be. Leupold has decided to take it to the next level which is common if you are big enough to afford the legal fight. Not sure about the "tiger" talk but neither one of these companies has done anything that is untypical in these situations. The comment that Leupold said "enough is enough" is really funny since this whole thing transpired over a matter of a few weeks and ONE letter sent to Leupold which followed a phone call to Leupold letting them know USO believed their technology was being used. What else would you have a company do that believed it's technology was being utilized without honoring the patent? Two other companies Vortex and S&B have already agreed to using it so it's not like USO is just throwing things around without looking into it. No drama, no smoking gun, just business. So let's not add our desire to make it dramatic to stir shit. This reminds me of situations where a government agency is sued, the initial claim is always denied until all the facts are brought out, then one side or the other back out or it goes to a judge.
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US Optics was here prior to all the whiz-bang latest greatest and will be here after.
I've seen more late production S&B's go down recently than any other mfr, but they aren't going anywhere.
Rob01 likes to talk smack about USO's breaking, but in the years I've been paying attention every USO problem I've seen has been something that should have been caught before the scope left. I think they could improve that, but I feel its symptomatic of being a smaller hands on mfr rather than a large factory. Their CS is arguably the best in the business.
I have expressed my concerns to them regarding the newer business model of streamlining production options, and discontinuing the ERGO and other features. I think the user specified options were a huge part of the Williams' success at the helm of the company, but us specialty shooters are honestly a small part of the market and I'm not a business expert.
Hopefully the ERGO comes back, and options return to where they once were.
Growing pains yes, death knoll no...
I've seen more late production S&B's go down recently than any other mfr, but they aren't going anywhere.
Rob01 likes to talk smack about USO's breaking, but in the years I've been paying attention every USO problem I've seen has been something that should have been caught before the scope left. I think they could improve that, but I feel its symptomatic of being a smaller hands on mfr rather than a large factory. Their CS is arguably the best in the business.
I have expressed my concerns to them regarding the newer business model of streamlining production options, and discontinuing the ERGO and other features. I think the user specified options were a huge part of the Williams' success at the helm of the company, but us specialty shooters are honestly a small part of the market and I'm not a business expert.
Hopefully the ERGO comes back, and options return to where they once were.
Growing pains yes, death knoll no...
Yea, I laugh every time I see it as well. My side kick runs nothing but S&B and everyone of his scopes have been back for repair in the last year, even the one he had to pay $3800.00 for up front, then wait 8 month and 2 days for. It lasted all of 2 weeks before it was sent back for repairs. Everyone lost tracking. Hype is for the thundering herd to follow, and hype'rs to pocket from.
Add, What Lowlight used to say about Leupold so often, now applies to S&B as well.
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Almost jumped on a USO SN-3 or whatever they call them now if it wasn't for the tunneling. I do zoom in and out and that's the only thing I could find I don't like in their scopes. I do love that GAP reticle though. Any idea why they dropped the 34mm tube to their 17X scopes? 30mm they just look too skinny.
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Deleted member 10043
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Leupolds probably break down more than USO because of the shear numbers. If the suspect Leupold knobs fail at the same rate as the USO knobs than USO probably has a case.
Seriously, there is something to be said for cheaper scopes with lifetime warranties with quick turnaround. Keep a couple of them. One breaks down replace it with the spare. Send the broke one back for replacement. You will end up shooting more than packing and tracking optics. Personally, and I include myself, I think most people are not as good as the scope up to and including the cheaper ones. Like buying a high end hockey stick but you can't skate. What is the point? For me, the scope is an appliance that can be replaced. It is not a work of art. It is just one tool of a complex system. The most complex part being the brain behind the rifle. Or lack thereof.
Seriously, there is something to be said for cheaper scopes with lifetime warranties with quick turnaround. Keep a couple of them. One breaks down replace it with the spare. Send the broke one back for replacement. You will end up shooting more than packing and tracking optics. Personally, and I include myself, I think most people are not as good as the scope up to and including the cheaper ones. Like buying a high end hockey stick but you can't skate. What is the point? For me, the scope is an appliance that can be replaced. It is not a work of art. It is just one tool of a complex system. The most complex part being the brain behind the rifle. Or lack thereof.
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I don't talk smack. I talk personal experience. Sorry if it offends you.
If there is a problem getting scopes out right then that should be addressed. Being a small company isn't an excuse when paying that much money for a scope.
If there is a problem getting scopes out right then that should be addressed. Being a small company isn't an excuse when paying that much money for a scope.
