Your technocrat elite knows best

[308pirate]

How to solve the housing crisis

Salesforce founder on 'the key' to unlocking California's homeless crisis

Homelessness is griping the state of California.

www.foxbusiness.com

Benioff, who is the co-CEO of cloud-based software company Salesforce, which is headquartered in San Francisco, believes “the key to homelessness is housing.”

​

The he has another brilliant revelation

In his opinion, the French government’s housing strategy gets it right. “If you go to France, you know, they have a Minister of Low Income Housing -- they call it Social Housing,” he said. “They plan it inside their communities -- we just don’t do that.”

Where would we be without these people's intellect?

 

[W54/XM-388]

Technocrat Elites and the Rich Elites openly state all the time that people should just give up freedom and do what they say because well they are rich or powerful.

Then they wonder why eventually the common folk are rather happy when they fall off their self important pedestals.

 

[RyanScott]

They should probably make it legal to build more housing then.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

They should just make a law banning homelessness. If you are homeless, then you will be arrested and put in jail.

Oh wait....

 

[P-Squared]

Yup, been there done that. Look up Cabrini Green in Chicago. Eventually they had to tear that 'Social Housing' down. Can't you use a little effort to learn from the past mistakes? Just like socialism.

 

[Mwalex]

"Social housing" is a breeding ground for crime, drugs and disease. Even programs like Habitat for Humanity has shown to be detrimental to the neighborhoods where the houses are built. By detrimental I mean a drop in property values after the home or homes are built. To be fair and balanced the stats that I read on the impact on property values was many years ago.

 

[W54/XM-388]

Yup, been there done that. Look up Cabrini Green in Chicago. Eventually they had to tear that 'Social Housing' down. Can't you use a little effort to learn from the past mistakes? Just like socialism.

So now instead of just letting folks who like living like criminals have to live in the mess they make, they now spread them all around to make sure everybody gets to enjoy people with no care about anything including themselves in every neighborhood.

The issue wasn't the housing, but rather that they went soft on crime and didn't police the hell out of it like they should have.

"Social housing" is a breeding ground for crime, drugs and disease. Even programs like Habitat for Humanity has shown to be detrimental to the neighborhoods where the houses are built. By detrimental I mean a drop in property values after the home or homes are built. To be fair and balanced the stats that I read on the impact on property values was many years ago.

People who get stuff for "free" rarely care for it the same way folks who have to work hard for it do.

 

[nn8734]

Isn’t our Section 8 housing program the rough equivalent of France’s ‘Low Income Housing’ program? Not sure if theirs is literally free or not...

Whoever is the head of Section 8 is our “Low Income Housing Minister”.

 

[deersniper]

Whoever is responsible for spreading section 8 into nice neighborhoods should be hung from a light post.

Same for the people putting mass transit into nice suburbs

 

[RyanScott]

You can whine about suburbs being spoiled when they can pay for their own infrastructure maintenance and replacement. So basically never.

 

[pmclaine]

How to solve the housing crisis

Salesforce founder on 'the key' to unlocking California's homeless crisis

Homelessness is griping the state of California.

www.foxbusiness.com

The he has another brilliant revelation


Where would we be without these people's intellect?

"They" do not "plan social housing" in "their" communities.

"They" "plan social housing" in "our" communities.

 

[deersniper]

You can whine about suburbs being spoiled when they can pay for their own infrastructure maintenance and replacement. So basically never.

Yeah those people in nice suburbs don't pay a ton of taxes. Lol

 

[Nik H]

"They" do not "plan social housing" in "their" communities.

"They" "plan social housing" in "our" communities.

Truth

 

[RyanScott]

Yeah those people in nice suburbs don't pay a ton of taxes. Lol

Relative to the infrastructure required? They don’t pay nearly enough to rebuild the infrastructure they require. Have you priced a mile of five lane road lately?

 

[deersniper]

Relative to the infrastructure required? They don’t pay nearly enough to rebuild the infrastructure they require. Have you priced a mile of five lane road lately?

Where do you think the money to build and maintain the roads comes from?

 

[RyanScott]

The issue isn’t so much how roads are built. The feds pay for freeways and part of highways, the states for highways, sales tax for local roads and suburban roads are built by developers. The problem is maintaining everything. The feds don’t pay to maintain it and property taxes don’t come close. Mostly things are just declining in place. The middle class can forget because they move every seven years to a newly cleared former farm further from the center of town. What, you think the $3000 you pay every year towards infrastructure covers what you use?

 

[deersniper]

Lol cause property tax is the only thing we pay.

Here and I'm sure everywhere else a big percentage of the gas tax goes to mass transit and other sjw bs.
Not to mention all the money pissed away on the county/state "worker" parasites. I could do a lot of roads if we weren't buying new trucks for .gov parasites to sleep in and drive from one convience store to the next. And giving them paycheck a and benefits. While private contractors do all the mowing/paving etc.

Have more money for roads too if the crips weren't getting new cars to tax and harass everyone.

 

[deersniper]

Not to mention
"Impact fees" for building a house
"Gas guzzler" taxes on trucks and suvs
Registration fees every year
Etc
Etc
Etc

 

[308pirate]

You can whine about suburbs being spoiled when they can pay for their own infrastructure maintenance and replacement. So basically never.

You obviously have no clue about how residential land development funds infrastructure in many states

 

[308pirate]

Have you priced a mile of five lane road lately?

Have you? How much is it and where?

 

[Strykervet]

Whoever is responsible for spreading section 8 into nice neighborhoods should be hung from a light post.

Same for the people putting mass transit into nice suburbs

Literally put the fucking brakes on a house I was looking at... Cadicorner/next door were two townhouses that were section 8... Goddamn dude. In an otherwise decent neighborhood, there's these two falling apart buildings (no grass/mud lot, gutters hanging, missing siding panels, broken windows, blinds all fucked up if there at all, holes in walls and ceilings, and that's just what's visible from the outside).

Yeah, like I want that right next door.

As it is the house I got has what appears to be some short foreheaded inbreeders, I'm just hoping they're the more good natured type than the hard to get along with. But you can never tell by looks, those mouthbreathing grunts all sorta sound the same too.

 

[pmclaine]

Literally put the fucking brakes on a house I was looking at... Cadicorner/next door were two townhouses that were section 8... Goddamn dude. In an otherwise decent neighborhood, there's these two falling apart buildings (no grass/mud lot, gutters hanging, missing siding panels, broken windows, blinds all fucked up if there at all, holes in walls and ceilings, and that's just what's visible from the outside).

Yeah, like I want that right next door.

As it is the house I got has what appears to be some short foreheaded inbreeders, I'm just hoping they're the more good natured type than the hard to get along with. But you can never tell by looks, those mouthbreathing grunts all sorta sound the same too.

I have a section of conservation land behind my house, 14 acres or so of woods.

In the middle of it is a grand brick house that though still habitable, since its town ownership is really starting to show its lack of maintenance.

The town is all on board with meeting target goals for "affordable" housing.

The town has pretty much run out of buildable lots and as it suffers from location, location, location.

Houses are now bought, demo'd and replaced by mega houses or they leave the shell tear out the insides and totally update them.

Not exactly building "affordable" units.

So the town idea was to transfer the "Conservation Land" to the "Housing Department" and having the former grand residence be utilized as "Affordable Housing".

They promise it wouldn't effect the protections of the open space it currently has as "Conservation Land".

Thankfully it didn't pass "this time" but they got the idea out there and Im sure in another 4-5 years I will se the 14 acres cleared that I grew up in and "Affordable Housing" units at some percentage of the current million dollar median rate will be going in.

Being green is good until it interferes with some other way to make money.

 

[pmclaine]

Have you? How much is it and where?

A mile of roadway is ridiculously expensive.

They could do a lot to make it cheaper by cutting unnecessary regulation and BS that has nothing to do with actually building that mile of roadway.

Funny they will EPA the crap out of the project in order to ensure an endangered salamander suffers no injury but because having OSHA set any sort of limit on the exposure to VOCs working an asphalt spreader would make such work absolutely impossible they avoid the issue entirely and provide a specific exclusion for that type of work.

Funny - If you work in a paint shop where they can impose expensive mitigation measures for VOCs they will but as there is no current alternative to a spreader box and breathing asphalt they give it a pass.

Almost makes common sense.

 

[Mike Casselton]

Whoever is responsible for spreading section 8 into nice neighborhoods should be hung from a light post.

Same for the people putting mass transit into nice suburbs

It was part of the redistribution plan of moving section 8 people into $400k homes in the burbs.
With that came an increase in crime and those stupid flashing signs that remind people to lock their doors and keep the garage doors close. They tell us to be part of the solution.

The solution would be to eliminate these distribution plans and to stop building apartment complexes in well to do neighborhoods.

 

[Mike Casselton]

Relative to the infrastructure required? They don’t pay nearly enough to rebuild the infrastructure they require. Have you priced a mile of five lane road lately?

Yeah, a project that should take a month or two gets stretched into 2.5 years and running. It's no wonder why it costs so damn much.
If you need references for these projects I'll provide them

 

[Mike Casselton]

The issue isn’t so much how roads are built. The feds pay for freeways and part of highways, the states for highways, sales tax for local roads and suburban roads are built by developers. The problem is maintaining everything. The feds don’t pay to maintain it and property taxes don’t come close. Mostly things are just declining in place. The middle class can forget because they move every seven years to a newly cleared former farm further from the center of town. What, you think the $3000 you pay every year towards infrastructure covers what you use?

$3000. I wish.

 

[Charger442]

You can whine about suburbs being spoiled when they can pay for their own infrastructure maintenance and replacement. So basically never.

Suburbs and development pay for many things other city areas can't afford.

You obviously have no clue about how residential land development funds infrastructure in many states

That is quite obvious. But he's going to tell the rest of us how the cow ate the steak and that's that.

 

[SilentStalkr]

Technocrat Elites and the Rich Elites openly state all the time that people should just give up freedom and do what they say because well they are rich or powerful.

Then they wonder why eventually the common folk are rather happy when they fall off their self important pedestals.

or, get thrown off of their pedestals.

 

[pmclaine]

Yeah, a project that should take a month or two gets stretched into 2.5 years and running. It's no wonder why it costs so damn much.
If you need references for these projects I'll provide them

Watch what happens when the replacement of the two bridges spanning the Cape Cod Canal occurs....

Its an Army Corps of Engineers project over a part of the strategic intercoastal waterway.

Currently the Bourne Bridge sports this placard....

Who here thinks that the replacement will only take the two years the original took to build?

 

[W54/XM-388]

The issue isn’t so much how roads are built. The feds pay for freeways and part of highways, the states for highways, sales tax for local roads and suburban roads are built by developers. The problem is maintaining everything. The feds don’t pay to maintain it and property taxes don’t come close. Mostly things are just declining in place. The middle class can forget because they move every seven years to a newly cleared former farm further from the center of town. What, you think the $3000 you pay every year towards infrastructure covers what you use?

Perhaps where you are things might be different but around here, it's very firmly the suburbs and folks living in them that pay for all the road infrastructure. The folks who stay in the big city centers contribute very little actually. It's why the best roads are all over the suburbs and connecting areas and the worst ones tend to be around the actual big cities.

In these parts road building is literally a Billion dollar affair. One mega interchange over a couple miles can easily push the billion dollar mark.

Most of that is paid by suburban folks who pay higher amounts per capita of gas taxes and then often a pretty good amount of toll charges each month as well, in addition to other taxes by the cities / counties / state levied on property, purchases and vehicles.

 

[RyanScott]

You obviously have no clue about how residential land development funds infrastructure in many states

As I said building it the first time isn’t so hard. Maintenance is the problem. I suspect I do have a clue as I manage construction professionally

Have you? How much is it and where?

Depends on state but generic costs are $3-5m new, $2m to rebuild, and that doesn’t include buried utilities.

$3000. I wish.

Probably not far off. A fraction of property taxes goes to roads, a fraction of sales taxes, about $300 in gas tax per person and a percentage of vehicle licensing fees. Most of what you pay for capital improvements or maintenance infrastructure probably comes from utility bills, where customers farther from utility facilities are heavily subsidized by customers close to generation shouters and water sources.

Suburbs and development pay for many things other city areas can't afford.
That is quite obvious. But he's going to tell the rest of us how the cow ate the steak and that's that.

Wealthier people tend to live in suburbs and so they pay greater taxes, but specifically not for construction and maintenance of infrastructure. Development costs are a ponzu scheme, with government using new development to pay for deferred maintenance to support existing development. Eventually the area declines to undesirability, development stops and the mayor is Bernie Madoff.

 

[RyanScott]

Perhaps where you are things might be different but around here, it's very firmly the suburbs and folks living in them that pay for all the road infrastructure. The folks who stay in the big city centers contribute very little actually. It's why the best roads are all over the suburbs and connecting areas and the worst ones tend to be around the actual big cities.

In these parts road building is literally a Billion dollar affair. One mega interchange over a couple miles can easily push the billion dollar mark.

Most of that is paid by suburban folks who pay higher amounts per capita of gas taxes and then often a pretty good amount of toll charges each month as well, in addition to other taxes by the cities / counties / state levied on property, purchases and vehicles.

I can’t see your location on mobile but from your post I’m guessing you’re in Texas? TXDOT is billions in debt and rising fast. 25,000 tract homes and their commuters don’t cover the cost of a billion dollar interchange. The typical American pays less than $400/yr in gas taxes.

The suburban lifestyle is unaffordable in the long term.

 

[deersniper]

GTFO with those numbers. PA gas tax is $0.77. 500 gallon at 20 mpg is 10000 miles? Who drives that little.

And trucks pay a shit ton of gas tax. And all the stuff that the rural and suburb people buy pay for that.


You must be a .gov "worker"

 

[deersniper]

I guess you think all the big city parasites pay for the roads. The same people that are all on welfare and have the states send a ton of money to them each year. Yeah. They pay for the roads.

 

[deersniper]

Lol Texas. Maybe the illegals that are all over the place are paying for the roads

 

[RyanScott]

GTFO with those numbers. PA gas tax is $0.77. 500 gallon at 20 mpg is 10000 miles? Who drives that little.

And trucks pay a shit ton of gas tax. And all the stuff that the rural and suburb people buy pay for that.


You must be a .gov "worker"

Private sector. From a statistical perspective your post is FUBAR. You’d need to use average numbers for mileage, VMT and tax rates. Instead you used a mileage number lower than average, a VMT number lower than average and the highest gas tax in the country. You should just google what the average driver pays in gas tax and use a professionals math.

I guess you think all the big city parasites pay for the roads. The same people that are all on welfare and have the states send a ton of money to them each year. Yeah. They pay for the roads.

Urbanized areas trend wealthier and produce the majority of economic activity. Ironically it’s rural areas that have the greatest percentage of government employees.

 

[deersniper]

Your facts are not
You sound like an agenda 21 troll who wants everyone to live in cities.

All the affluent people flee to the suburbs for good schools and less crime. The cities are shitholes filled with crime and terrible schools. And they have to be subsidized by the rest of the state. But that's where the money comes from. Lol ok

 

[pmclaine]

I can’t see your location on mobile but from your post I’m guessing you’re in Texas? TXDOT is billions in debt and rising fast. 25,000 tract homes and their commuters don’t cover the cost of a billion dollar interchange. The typical American pays less than $400/yr in gas taxes.

The suburban lifestyle is unaffordable in the long term.

No whats unaffordable is all the "entitlements" that are unfunded.

Lets stop foreign aid and allowing people stealing their way into the country to access programs other people have paid for.

You sound like an Agenda 21 man.

Do you realize the cities provide little for themselves.

They are like a tumerous mass that feeds off the outside of its periphery.

 

[pmclaine]

GTFO with those numbers. PA gas tax is $0.77. 500 gallon at 20 mpg is 10000 miles? Who drives that little.

And trucks pay a shit ton of gas tax. And all the stuff that the rural and suburb people buy pay for that.


You must be a .gov "worker"

Funny how politicians are always claiming what a crime it is that the oil companies make a profit off of gas yet if you compare profits to taxes the govt makes a pretty good buck themselves on the sale of fuel.

 

[pmclaine]

Private sector. From a statistical perspective your post is FUBAR. You’d need to use average numbers for mileage, VMT and tax rates. Instead you used a mileage number lower than average, a VMT number lower than average and the highest gas tax in the country. You should just google what the average driver pays in gas tax and use a professionals math.

Urbanized areas trend wealthier and produce the majority of economic activity. Ironically it’s rural areas that have the greatest percentage of government employees.

Where do they get their food from?

 

[SethB]

Affluent people tend to live in cities and pay for their children to go to private school. I get the distinct impression that most of the people posting here 1) don't know what affluence looks like and 2) haven't been a city since Carter was President.

Cities definitely provide for themselves. When you break down who is using government benefits it's a surprising number of rural dwellers, and as time goes by the suburbs are becoming poorer and poorer.

Your suburb might be nice, and shiny and new. But "suburbs" have been around long enough that many of them are as rough as the "inner cities ever were.

Meanwhile, cities are in the midst of a 20 year renaissance that leaves them looking nothing like they supposedly did 30 years ago.

Ryan is right. And all the statistics (which you all conveniently fail to provide) back him up.

Do I need to start posting a reading list?

 

[SethB]

Where do they get their food from?

Are you going to bring up how agriculture is 1% of GDP and employees 2% of Americans?

 

[deersniper]

Yeah statistics. They can't be manipulated.

Gun violence stats
Global cooling stats
Global warming stats
Climate change stats.

 

[SethB]

Statistics can be used for all sorts of things, but unfortunately they can't be ignored.

I mean, you were perfectly happy when the math looked like it worked for your argument.

Meanwhile whole books have been written about suburban finance, and none of them paint a rosy picture.

And don't get me started on neighborhoods that can't afford their own septic tanks and have to ask the city for annexation and connection to the sewer...

 

[SethB]

No whats unaffordable is all the "entitlements" that are unfunded.

So your argument is that Ryan is correct, but there are bigger issues to deal with?

Lets stop foreign aid and allowing people stealing their way into the country to access programs other people have paid for.

Neither is a drop in the bucket. If you want real savings you're going to have to find it somewhere else.

You sound like an Agenda 21 man.

In the conspiracy theory sense?

Do you realize the cities provide little for themselves.

They are like a tumerous mass that feeds off the outside of its periphery.

Bullshit. The majority of GDP is generated in a few hundred urban counties. I think something like 500 counties product 64% of GDP and the other 2500 counties produce only 36%.

 

[deersniper]

More agenda 21 bs

Again where do you think the tax money comes from ?

 

[SethB]

More agenda 21 bs

Again where do you think the tax money comes from ?

The vast majority of it comes from people that live in cities, especially in coastal cities.

Look, I don't like it that blue cities pay the majority of taxes... but they do.

Do you have some plan to fix that?

 

[deersniper]

Foriegn aid and all the illegals / welfare immigrants is a drop in the bucket? are they not using and wearing out the infrastructure plus taking money?

 

[deersniper]

The vast majority of it comes from people that live in cities, especially in coastal cities.

Look, I don't like it that blue cities pay the majority of taxes... but they do.

Do you have some plan to fix that?

Suburbs are around cities. How are you segregating city v suburb tax data?

 

[SethB]

Foriegn aid and all the illegals / welfare immigrants is a drop in the bucket? are they not using and wearing out the infrastructure plus taking money?

Foreign aid is 0.6% of government spending, only about $50B per year.

The highest estimate for the cost of illegal immigration is President Trump's guess at $250B. If that is true then it costs a little over 3% of government spending.

So put together you've now accounted for close to 4% of government spending. Where is the other 96% going?