SPR/DMR matches: What are you running?

Bakwa

Bakwa

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    • Mar 22, 2017
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    #1
    I visited St. Augustine to watch a SPR/DMR comp this past weekend.
    I saw a lot of high end kit. KAC, Larue, Geissele,.. S&B, Nightforce, Razors,... Lots of cans.
    There were a handful of really talented shooters behind some of those rigs too.

    I might have felt under-gunned if I competed that day with my "DMR" setup.
    My DMR-ish upper is a mutt. Spikes CHF barrel, Colt BCG, BCM HG, Stiener 1-4 in ADM mount, Atlus QD bipods, etc...
    DMR.jpg

    Durable and good parts, but it only produces 1.5 minute 5 shot groups with match ammo.
    I'm thinking about putting together a CLE Bartlein upper with a NF 2.5-10 or 1-8 before I jump into this style of comp now that I know what's expected of the shooters.

    For those of you that compete with or work with dedicated SPR/DMR rifles, what are you running?
     
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    #2
    I'm not a super experienced competitor. Only done 2 matches so far but I ran my LMT MWS in .308 my first match and a factory daniel defense upper in 5.56 on a PSA lower for my second one. Finished 12/50ish in the second match. The DD is 1-1.5 MOA and the LMT is generally 0.5-0.75 MOA. There were plenty of guys running high end guns and gear but a lot of them were trying to buy accuracy or just had the money and liked nice kit. IMO, you don't need a high end setup to be competitive in local matches. My rig in the second match was less than half the cost of my first one and my score was 50% higher than the first match. The biggest difference going from the first match to the second was that I learned a lot talking to the guys there and practiced for stuff I did poorly on. Barricades, roof simulator, etc.

    Pretty much all the targets were 2-3 MOA or larger (usually larger) so a 1.5 MOA rifle should be good enough if yours are similar. If you reload you can probably get that rifle down to 1 MOA. I would change out the scope to something you can dial in elevation. NF 2.5-10 would be fine. Vortex viper PST gen II is more than good enough for me.
     
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    #5
    Ballistic RPh said:
    I'm not a super experienced competitor. Only done 2 matches so far but I ran my LMT MWS in .308 my first match and a factory daniel defense upper in 5.56 on a PSA lower for my second one. Finished 12/50ish in the second match. The DD is 1-1.5 MOA and the LMT is generally 0.5-0.75 MOA. There were plenty of guys running high end guns and gear but a lot of them were trying to buy accuracy or just had the money and liked nice kit. IMO, you don't need a high end setup to be competitive in local matches. My rig in the second match was less than half the cost of my first one and my score was 50% higher than the first match. The biggest difference going from the first match to the second was that I learned a lot talking to the guys there and practiced for stuff I did poorly on. Barricades, roof simulator, etc.

    Pretty much all the targets were 2-3 MOA or larger (usually larger) so a 1.5 MOA rifle should be good enough if yours are similar. If you reload you can probably get that rifle down to 1 MOA. I would change out the scope to something you can dial in elevation. NF 2.5-10 would be fine. Vortex viper PST gen II is more than good enough for me.
    Click to expand...

    Thanks for the insight.
    Based on what I saw, I feel like the biggest upgrade I could do for this type of comp would be upping the magnification potential of my optic. My 1-4 just doesn't seem like enough for about half the stages.
    The only reason I'm even thinking about a new [more precise] upper as well is because the first stage was about a 1.5 MOA wide hostage target. It started from the standing, you had 10 seconds to drop to the prone and engage the hostage taker with 5 shoots. It seemed like you really had to have you crap together and a good enough optic to distinguish what was down range for this stage.
     
    #6
    Bakwa said:
    Thanks for the insight.
    Based on what I saw, I feel like the biggest upgrade I could do for this type of comp would be upping the magnification potential of my optic. My 1-4 just doesn't seem like enough for about half the stages.
    The only reason I'm even thinking about a new [more precise] upper as well is because the first stage was about a 1.5 MOA wide hostage target. It started from the standing, you had 10 seconds to drop to the prone and engage the hostage taker with 5 shoots. It seemed like you really had to have you crap together and a good enough optic to distinguish what was down range for this stage.
    Click to expand...

    What trigger do you have?

    I have always used, and did my load development with a Geissele SSA (4.5lbs) with my rifle. Its great trigger and it taught me good trigger control, but for competition style shooting, it really increases the possibility of trigger pull throwing your shot wider one way or another.

    I recently upgraded to a Triggertech Diamond and it made such a huge difference.
     
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    #7
    Gustav7 said:
    What trigger do you have?

    I have always used, and did my load development with a Geissele SSA (4.5lbs) with my rifle. Its great trigger and it taught me good trigger control, but for competition style shooting, it really increases the possibility of trigger pull throwing your shot wider one way or another.

    I recently upgraded to a Triggertech Diamond and it made such a huge difference.
    Click to expand...


    Oh yea forgot to mention this. I'm running a geissele SSA-E in mine. A good trigger makes a big difference as well for precision shooting. I prefer a 2-stage
     
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    #8
    Bakwa said:
    I visited St. Augustine to watch a SPR/DMR comp this past weekend.
    I saw a lot of high end kit. KAC, Larue, Geissele,.. S&B, Nightforce, Razors,... Lots of cans.
    There were a handful of really talented shooters behind some of those rigs too.

    I might have felt under-gunned if I competed that day with my "DMR" setup.
    My DMR-ish upper is a mutt. Spikes CHF barrel, Colt BCG, BCM HG, Stiener 1-4 in ADM mount, Atlus QD bipods, etc...
    View attachment 7419006
    Durable and good parts, but it only produces 1.5 minute 5 shot groups with match ammo.
    I'm thinking about putting together a CLE Bartlein upper with a NF 2.5-10 or 1-8 before I jump into this style of comp now that I know what's expected of the shooters.

    For those of you that compete with or work with dedicated SPR/DMR rifles, what are you running?
    Click to expand...
    Are the 1.5 inch groups because of the barrel or the low magnification?
    Try upgrading the glass to one of the 1-8 or a 2-10 (you'll be doing that regardless, so might as well start there). See if the increased mag allows you to shrink your groups a bit. I'm betting it will.
     
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    #9
    Gustav7 said:
    What trigger do you have?

    I have always used, and did my load development with a Geissele SSA (4.5lbs) with my rifle. Its great trigger and it taught me good trigger control, but for competition style shooting, it really increases the possibility of trigger pull throwing your shot wider one way or another.

    I recently upgraded to a Triggertech Diamond and it made such a huge difference.
    Click to expand...

    I've been running Stag 2-stages in all my guns for years. Got a few on sale years ago and they've been good enough for most tasks so I haven't changed anything until recently.
    I just bought a Geissele SSA-E on a whim and holy crap is it an improvement! I haven't shot with it yet, but sitting in my home office dryfiring, it's a noticeable difference.
    My first thought after installing it and pulling the trigger a few times was, "Damn, it going to be expensive replacing all of my FCG's. Lol"
    If I had to guess, this Geissele will at the very least make it easier to keep consistent groups.
     
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    #10
    fdkay said:
    Are the 1.5 inch groups because of the barrel or the low magnification?
    Try upgrading the glass to one of the 1-8 or a 2-10 (you'll be doing that regardless, so might as well start there). See if the increased mag allows you to shrink your groups a bit. I'm betting it will.
    Click to expand...
    This is true, and an obvious point that I may be overlooking. I'll try a higher power optic on the upper before I get all gung ho on dropping $1k+ on a dedicated DMR comp upper.
     
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    #12
    Bakwa said:
    I've been running Stag 2-stages in all my guns for years. Got a few on sale years ago and they've been good enough for most tasks so I haven't changed anything until recently.
    I just bought a Geissele SSA-E on a whim and holy crap is it an improvement! I haven't shot with it yet, but sitting in my home office dryfiring, it's a noticeable difference.
    My first thought after installing it and pulling the trigger a few times was, "Damn, it going to be expensive replacing all of my FCG's. Lol"
    If I had to guess, this Geissele will at the very least make it easier to keep consistent groups.
    Click to expand...

    Very true statement. Theres no replacement for good fundamentals as well, but a good trigger and scope help and assist with those fundamentals, taking away some of the tolerance stacking. I've also found it very helpful to focus a lot on follow through with gas guns... especially with a good trigger. Good triggers take less force and it makes you sometimes forget to keep that finger to the rear and body still.

    Where good trigger really help is positional shooting like PRS style barricades and what not. Thats where a strong trigger pull and really throw your whole position off balance, or at minimum, the gun.

    That 4.5lb SSA trigger I had is what I learned on and used for load development. It is a great trigger and shooting prone can be shot well, just ask service rifle guys.....but damn does a 1.5-2lbs trigger make barricade shooting much better.

    All the following were done with my Vortex PST gen 1 2.5-10 and that 4.5lb SSA trigger... Needless to say, the upgrades have made it easier to be more consistent.
     

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    #13
    I have a fair bit of experience at DMR-type matches and in my experience here are some things that I've noticed and/or taken away from them.

    1. Given the choice, I'd take a 5.56 gun with a good barrel, 16"-18" in length, over a large frame gas gun or one in 6.5G/6ARC/.224V/etc... On average, it will be far more reliable with lower recoil and a higher magazine capacity so while they're trying to recover from their first shot, spot their miss, make a correction, and/or unfuck their double feed, you're already on to the next target. I've seen it happen numerous times and I've been in no hurry to make a caliber change.

    2. Within DMR ranges, 600 yards and in, the above paired with good 77gr match ammo will hang with any of the above in so far as simply getting hits is concerned. Obviously the larger calibers will carry more energy to the target but that too carries some penalties in a match because if it's a small swinger, the guys with heavy hitters are going to have to wait longer for it to settle before they can engage it again.

    3. I like having more magnification than a LPVO like a 1-4 or 1-6 can provide, it's just not enough mag in most cases to spot my hits and misses because you can't always rely on the spotter. True story, I watched a shooter time out on an easy four or five target stage because he couldn't see that he was repeatedly hitting Target 2 and could move on to Target 3. The spotter was calling his hits but I guess with his ear pro on he couldn't hear it, anyway the guy ended up crying like a bitch about it, literally. To that end I think 10X is a good starting point but personally 3-15's and 4-16's with a FFP are the sweet spot for me. I can dial them down when I want to open up the FOV but can also dial them up for long range shots if I need it. That came in real handy when we had some really long shots, stretching things out to about 900 yards or so.

    4. I love a good trigger, I like a nice non-adjustable 2-stage 3.5-4.0 lb trigger. Simple, safe, and reliable. I prefer Geissele.

    5. I like a 13" handguard because it gets the bipod out front but still reachable so I can easily made adjustments but it's not so long that it interferes with my Magnetospeed Sporter. I run two pic rails on the bottom, one as far back as I can get it and one as far forward as I can get it. This gives me some options on where I can put the bipod to give me flexibility in dealing with different types of obstacles and barricades.

    6. Accuracy wise, I like my DMR and SPR rifles to be able to do about 1.0 MOA with match ammo. I could strive for sub-MOA and blow through loads of cash doing it but if I'm around MOA then I'll be fine on just about all of the targets that I encounter.

    Edited to add: 7. I wanted to touch on stocks a little bit. I like a collapsible stock with a clubfoot so that it integrates a little better with a rear bag. I've used Magpul CTR, SL, SL-S, and BCM Gunfighter stocks but none of them really did well with a bag. I much prefer the BCM SOPMOD Mod 1 with the clubfoot or Vltor E-Mod, they've been perfect for the precision carbine role. I don't get wrapped up in adjustable cheek pieces and what not, I generally don't need it since the sight height for irons is about what it is with my optic in a one piece mount.

    If you can throw a higher power optic on your gun and improve the accuracy of the rifle that way without having to put money into a new barrel and such then you'll do just fine at the matches.
     
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    #24
    To reinforce what @Trigger Monkey spoke of above, here is an example:

    16" BCM/CLE/Douglas upper with a 13" KMR handguard. NF 4-16x42 F1 in a Spuhr. Geissele SSA-E. Magpul ACS-L stock.

    The barrel is a Douglas spun up by CLE, with their chamber, which is a 16" recon mid-length 1:7" configuration. Only notable difference is 5/8-24 muzzle threads.
    It is a snug chamber. Factory new Hornady brass barely fits the chamber. New Lapua or Federal are fine. There was a 0.002" headspace difference with the Hornady being longer than the Lapua/Federal. It flat out shoots. I think the average of every group shot over the first 200 rounds is in the 0.6-0.75" range. Velocity isn't a concern as a 75/77 grain bullet is coming out at 2625-2650 fps. Plenty for 600 yards.

    Bipod stud up front. Rail section in the rear to clip into the tripod. I prefer the Harris over the Atlas on the SPR style rifle.

    Magpul ACS-L gives a solid area for cheek weld, locks up snug, and provides the club foot for a rear bag.

    Weight is favorable coming in at 9.5 pounds without the can and ammo. Say 11 pounds with the muffler and 20 rounds.

    On the optic: skip the 1-8. I had the NX8 on a different 16" upper, and it isn't conducive to precision. I originally went to the NF 2.5-10x42 on this rifle. It works, but the NF 4-16x42 is tits. I'm usually in the 12-14x range.
    549019BE-B796-4220-B346-1D71B5DFD0C3.jpeg
     
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    #25
    Tono said:
    I would have to agree on spending money on a higher power optic.

    For a short period of time, I ran a 5-25 x 56 scope on a DDM4V7. I wanted to make sure that the scope was good while waiting on the rifle that it was intended for... With the 5-25 x 56 scope I was able to shoot groups that were 0.7 to 1.00 MOA with various ammo 55gr to 77gr.

    Once I moved back to my 1-5 x 24 SFP LPVO scope, my group sizes went up. The low magnification played into this, but also the thickness of the reticle lines prevented me from being able to hold on the same spot.
    Click to expand...


    It isn't just a matter of magnification. I'd rather shoot with a top-tier 1-4X scope, than a cheap 15X scope. The quality of the glass (as well as the reticle design) play a significant role.

    The 10-shot group pictured below was fired at a distance of 100 yards from a Noveske Recon barreled AR-15 using a Schmidt & Bender Short Dot LE on 4X magnification. The group has an extreme spread of 0.77".


    recon_barrel_10_shot_group_02-1586145.jpg




    short_dot_23_resized-1586147.jpg




    ....
     
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    #26
    Just posted this in the other thread ha.

    JP 223 base model (unbelievably accurate) = $$$
    XTR3 3-18 w/full custom sunshade (sun in NM was brutal) = $$
    ckye-pod = $

    Knowing I am shooting the best (IE CONFIDENCE IN GEAR) = priceless

    2019 TS 3.jpg


    Targets at this match ranged from 200 - 700 with unlimited rounds for the carbine shooter (Competitions Dynamics Team Safari) and for the 2nd year in a row we dropped 0 carbine shots. Thing is literally unbelievably accurate.


    GL
    DT
     
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    #27
    Molon said:
    It isn't just a matter of magnification. I'd rather shoot with a top-tier 1-4X scope, than a cheap 15X scope. The quality of the glass (as well as the reticle design) play a significant role.

    The 10-shot group pictured below was fired at a distance of 100 yards from a Noveske Recon barreled AR-15 using a Schmidt & Bender Short Dot LE on 4X magnification. The group has an extreme spread of 0.77"
    Click to expand...

    I agree that the quality of the glass and reticle design play a significant role in how a rifle may perform down range and I wouldn’t advocate using a 4-16X walmart special all in the name of getting more magnification. That being said, within the context of setting up a rifle for DMR-type matches I would take a SWFA fixed 10X or 3-15 over a S&B Short Dot 1-4 even if the glass in the S&B is better. It’s one thing to use the 1-4 to shoot groups at 100 yards on a high contrast target and it’s another to take that same scope out into a field environment and try to spot impacts on an overgrown berm under time.
     
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    #28
    3AD81919-4E92-42A7-AC2E-931F05F5FEC6.jpeg

    This is the setup I prefer for dmr type matches.
    16” Ranier “match” grade barrel, 223 Wilde chamber (nothing fancy, but gets the job done). Produces 1 MOA 10 shot groups with unsorted LC brass, 23.2gr 8208xbr, 77gr smk loaded to mag length. Bushnell LRTSi 3–12x44. It’s maneuverable, accurate, and reliable.
    At these style of matches, reliability is key (both mechanical operating reliability, as well as accuracy reliability over rapid and/or long strings of fire). I’ve seen plenty of shooters get destroyed by reliability issues. 5-12x is a pretty good sweet spot, especially when paired with solid tracking and/or a good reticle.
     
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    #32
    Check the club rules before selecting barrel lengths and scope magnification. Some comps have different divisions for different equipment. The Quantified Performance matches are split into 3 “divisions” with scopes playing a defining role into which you’re shooting. Practical is for LPVO’s, Tactical goes up to 18x, and Open is for high mag optics. There are other qualifiers but you get the jist.
     
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    #36
    Bakwa said:
    I'll try a higher power optic on the upper before I get all gung ho on dropping $1k+ on a dedicated DMR comp upper.
    Click to expand...


    This is one of the scopes that I like to use on my DMR-type AR-15s . . .


    Nightforce NXS 2.5 - 10 X 42 Compact

    nightforce_42_cropped_border_003_copy-1589105.jpg




    This scope is available with MOA or mil turrets, with MOA or mil reticles and it has a ZERO-STOP elevation turret. It has side-adjustment parallax that is adjustable from 25 yards to infinity. It comes with a factory magnification-ring throw-lever that is removable. The scope has user switchable red and green illumination. Naturally, this scope has the excellent glass, durability and precisely repeatable turret adjustments on which Nightforce has built its reputation.

    This scope has all of the above features along with the benefits of a 42mm objective, all while having a smaller footprint than typical 10X scopes, such as the Leupold shown below.



    noveske_spr_with_bipod_and_scope_11-1439094.jpg




    ....
     
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    #37
    I decided to take up prs gas gun matches this year at they young age of 61 and it is a blast . I am using a 20 inch ballistic advantage dmr profile barrel with a national match free float tube and A4 handguards I dont remember where I got the trigger group but I used a medium India stone to polish the surface and remove the burrs ( I didn't remove any metal or alter any angles ) and I used jp yellow springs . it is right at 4.5 lb trigger pull . I am running a Bushnell DMR2 3.5x21 optic and shooting 77 grain Sierra matchkings at 2747 fps . the target s run from around 250 yds out to a bit over 700 yds . for me it is all about having fun and hanging out with a bunch of good people . Dont be afraid to jump right in I have never seen a group of people more willing to help a gy out and offer advise .

    ZNxZHqx.jpg
     
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    #38
    Bakwa said:
    I visited St. Augustine to watch a SPR/DMR comp this past weekend.
    I saw a lot of high end kit. KAC, Larue, Geissele,.. S&B, Nightforce, Razors,... Lots of cans.
    There were a handful of really talented shooters behind some of those rigs too.

    I might have felt under-gunned if I competed that day with my "DMR" setup.
    My DMR-ish upper is a mutt. Spikes CHF barrel, Colt BCG, BCM HG, Stiener 1-4 in ADM mount, Atlus QD bipods, etc...
    View attachment 7419006
    Durable and good parts, but it only produces 1.5 minute 5 shot groups with match ammo.
    I'm thinking about putting together a CLE Bartlein upper with a NF 2.5-10 or 1-8 before I jump into this style of comp now that I know what's expected of the shooters.

    For those of you that compete with or work with dedicated SPR/DMR rifles, what are you running?
    Click to expand...
    I know the match you’re talking about exactly and want in, if I can’t find the ammo. I have a 2.5-10 optic on my DMR build, and hopefully it fits the cake.
     
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    #39
    ajv35XX said:
    I know the match you’re talking about exactly and want in, if I can’t find the ammo. I have a 2.5-10 optic on my DMR build, and hopefully it fits the cake.
    Click to expand...
    For sure! Unless work gets in the way, I'll be competing in the Dec match over there. The hit count isn't that high, so it's not toooo much of a commitment [even with match ammo].
    After watching a good bit of the last match, the only thing I noticed is that you need to be a bit more accurate than you'd think for DMR rig hits. So long as you have a decently accurate setup, and you actually train from positions besides the bench, you will do well at this match.
    Hope to see you there.
     
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    #40
    Bakwa said:
    For sure! Unless work gets in the way, I'll be competing in the Dec match over there. The hit count isn't that high, so it's not toooo much of a commitment [even with match ammo].
    After watching a good bit of the last match, the only thing I noticed is that you need to be a bit more accurate than you'd think for DMR rig hits. So long as you have a decently accurate setup, and you actually train from positions besides the bench, you will do well at this match.
    Hope to see you there.
    Click to expand...
    That match looks too good not to give it a whirl; Hopefully I can make that happen too same time frame. Gonna try to dial in the new rifle build/scope, and hopefully snag some decent ammo rather then what I’ve got in hand.

    Shameless plugs; look into Doug @ Camerlands Bushnell Nitro 2.5-10 deal with the FFP MIL reticle for $199 for what you’re rocking, and for a barrel JSE Surplus has Wilson 18” SPR barrels for a hair over 2 bills. Used one on my DMR build and for a buddies, and both shoot.
     
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    #41
    So, having trained some of those dudes in the St. Augustine area, I've got a pretty good idea of what you up against.

    In the equipment department, that crew doesn't screw around. As others have pointed out, in any shooting sport you'll always have a percentage of people who are trying to "buy" hits BUT bottom line is to be competitive (or become so) you'll need to match your opponents capability in a closer margin. A 1.5 MOA rifle vs a 1 MOA rifle is going to stack the deck in the favor of the latter especially with 2-3 MOA targets in the field. Its something of a false logic to say if the target array is 2-3 MOA then all you need is a 2 MOA rifle.

    On the topic of optics, SPR/DM matches require SPR/DM optics and LPVO's aint it regardless of what you've been told. Yes you can shoot some really amazing groups with 4x but the point of having that glass is that your able to collect and process information in real time. 3-4x on the lower end is preferable and 15-20x is all you'll need on the upper end.

    Lastly if you want to catch up you'll need to train, some of those cats down there are putting in some serious work. The guys over at Gun Gallery are some knowledgeable dudes and can help out pointing you in the right direction in terms of equipment and linking you to professional instruction.
     
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    #43
    Trigger Monkey said:
    I have a fair bit of experience at DMR-type matches and in my experience here are some things that I've noticed and/or taken away from them.

    1. Given the choice, I'd take a 5.56 gun with a good barrel, 16"-18" in length, over a large frame gas gun or one in 6.5G/6ARC/.224V/etc... On average, it will be far more reliable with lower recoil and a higher magazine capacity so while they're trying to recover from their first shot, spot their miss, make a correction, and/or unfuck their double feed, you're already on to the next target. I've seen it happen numerous times and I've been in no hurry to make a caliber change.

    2. Within DMR ranges, 600 yards and in, the above paired with good 77gr match ammo will hang with any of the above in so far as simply getting hits is concerned. Obviously the larger calibers will carry more energy to the target but that too carries some penalties in a match because if it's a small swinger, the guys with heavy hitters are going to have to wait longer for it to settle before they can engage it again.

    3. I like having more magnification than a LPVO like a 1-4 or 1-6 can provide, it's just not enough mag in most cases to spot my hits and misses because you can't always rely on the spotter. True story, I watched a shooter time out on an easy four or five target stage because he couldn't see that he was repeatedly hitting Target 2 and could move on to Target 3. The spotter was calling his hits but I guess with his ear pro on he couldn't hear it, anyway the guy ended up crying like a bitch about it, literally. To that end I think 10X is a good starting point but personally 3-15's and 4-16's with a FFP are the sweet spot for me. I can dial them down when I want to open up the FOV but can also dial them up for long range shots if I need it. That came in real handy when we had some really long shots, stretching things out to about 900 yards or so.

    4. I love a good trigger, I like a nice non-adjustable 2-stage 3.5-4.0 lb trigger. Simple, safe, and reliable. I prefer Geissele.

    5. I like a 13" handguard because it gets the bipod out front but still reachable so I can easily made adjustments but it's not so long that it interferes with my Magnetospeed Sporter. I run two pic rails on the bottom, one as far back as I can get it and one as far forward as I can get it. This gives me some options on where I can put the bipod to give me flexibility in dealing with different types of obstacles and barricades.

    6. Accuracy wise, I like my DMR and SPR rifles to be able to do about 1.0 MOA with match ammo. I could strive for sub-MOA and blow through loads of cash doing it but if I'm around MOA then I'll be fine on just about all of the targets that I encounter.

    Edited to add: 7. I wanted to touch on stocks a little bit. I like a collapsible stock with a clubfoot so that it integrates a little better with a rear bag. I've used Magpul CTR, SL, SL-S, and BCM Gunfighter stocks but none of them really did well with a bag. I much prefer the BCM SOPMOD Mod 1 with the clubfoot or Vltor E-Mod, they've been perfect for the precision carbine role. I don't get wrapped up in adjustable cheek pieces and what not, I generally don't need it since the sight height for irons is about what it is with my optic in a one piece mount.

    If you can throw a higher power optic on your gun and improve the accuracy of the rifle that way without having to put money into a new barrel and such then you'll do just fine at the matches.
    Click to expand...
    I have never shot a match but that is solid advice.
     
    #44
    So... kinda curious about this kind of match - are they very common? More prevalent in certain areas/ parts of the country than others? Is there a typical or standard COF?

    I looked in the Competitions section under Precision Rifle / Tactical matches, and didn't see very much listed under 'DMR' or 'SPR' past 2013-2014...
     
    #45
    milanuk said:
    So... kinda curious about this kind of match - are they very common? More prevalent in certain areas/ parts of the country than others? Is there a typical or standard COF?

    I looked in the Competitions section under Precision Rifle / Tactical matches, and didn't see very much listed under 'DMR' or 'SPR' past 2013-2014...
    Click to expand...

    Not a set COF like Steel Challenge or High Power and they've become less common over the past few years, at least in my neck of the woods (east coast).

    All of the DMR matches I've shot have been built around targets between .5-2 MOA at 300-700yds, with most stages fired from positions other than prone (off a barrel, rooftop simulator, stepped barricade, vehicle hood/roof/open window, etc). Most matches seem to have a 60-120sec par time for each stage, with some MDs setting max round counts per stage while others allow for unlimited shots.

    I always enjoyed shooting DMR matches along with 2 gun and 3 gun as it was simpler from a logistics standpoint (only bringing one gun) and it let me goof around with some of my less often used semi-auto rifles if I felt like it (ran my SVD in a few matches for grins).

    If one becomes available near you I'd recommend at least trying it once, if for no other reason than to get a better understanding of how your "long range" semi-auto gear works while shooting from unconventional positions and under the manufactured/mild stress of a clock.
     
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    #46
    towerofpower93 said:
    All of the DMR matches I've shot have been built around targets between .5-2 MOA at 300-700yds, with most stages fired from positions other than prone (off a barrel, rooftop simulator, stepped barricade, vehicle hood/roof/open window, etc). Most matches seem to have a 60-120sec par time for each stage, with some MDs setting max round counts per stage while others allow for unlimited shots.
    Click to expand...

    So... like the PRS/RTC gas gun class, but without getting boned by the bolt-back action-clear rules for movement?
     
    #47
    milanuk said:
    So... like the PRS/RTC gas gun class, but without getting boned by the bolt-back action-clear rules for movement?
    Click to expand...

    Never shot a PRS match in gas gun class, but shot gas gun only PRS matches before. That part of PRS seems to have died off though, as I see fewer PRS sanctioned gas gun only matches around here. Might just be a regional fluke though...

    Same range and MD ran a monthly DMR match that used a similar format a few years before PRS got big, so it was challenging as far as targets and positions, but without all the gamer gear you see deployed on the clock at a PRS match now. That match was also run as time plus penalties, so taking half your par time to deploy a tripod or the like wasn’t going to fly if you wanted to get your hits.
     
    #50
    Late to the thread, but just ran this in a local precision rifle match. The barricades are very unstable and the range to targets is generally 450-650 and about 2moa in size with a 2 min time limit and no follow up shots; so first round hits are critical.
    Key features are factory 77gr Federal Gold Medal Match at ~2650fps through a Proof 20" carbon barrel thermal fitted to a forged BCM upper, Geissele handguard (with that insane barrel nut), Geissele high speed national match trigger with the lightest possible first stage (about 1.5lbs) and about 2.5lbs DMR second stage. Geissele gas block, Leupold mk 5 with a Tremor3 reticle, and full JP LMOS internals.
    Managed a 2nd place among gas guns, 11th over all. Had good luck with the wind thanks to the reticle and ability to follow up fast.
    Edit: on the discussion of triggers, I think it's more important to have a short as possible lock time with a crisp break rather than extremely light weight. Ultimately that's what sets high power rifle shooters apart at matches like Camp Perry. Even on a barricade the reticle "walks" around from where you're trying to aim. Being able to break the trigger and have the round ignite in the chamber within 3-4 milliseconds instead of 15+ milliseconds means less deviation off point of aim
     

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