Sidearms & Scatterguns 1911 carry

[summy]

Before we gt into it, I'm sure I'm opening a huge can of worms here. That being said, I don't have much experience with concealed carry and handguns in general, so yes I will be taking a concealed carry course at some point before I start regularly carrying. So lets get to it...
I'm thinking about getting a Galco small of back holster and carry at 4:30-5:00 (im right handed). Reason being, when just thinking about the body mechanics of the draw, I would need to get a fistful of that 1911 almost into my armpit to clear the holster with a conventional 3:00 carry. So here's my question, does anyone have experience with this form of carry with this or a similar holster? Downsides? I know that the spinal injury argument has been brought up about a million times along with the draw being slow and general discomfort sitting, but is there anything else? Any really good things you've noticed about carrying this way? Tips? Tricks?
Thanks in advance

 

[Asperly Aimless]

That position of carry is the shit if you plan to stand up straight all day.

That position of carry sucks donkey balls if you plan to sit down, lean over, bend over to pick something up, etc.

You shouldn't have to have a fist full of 1911 in your armpit if drawing from a IWB at 3:00 and even with a high rise outside the waistband holster, if you practice your draw you don't end up with a fist full of gun in the armpit either.

Start packing your gun around the house as practice. It allows you to see what does and does not work for everyday mundane life while carrying a pistol concealed.

 

[Hookturnr]

Get yourself a 4" 1911 and put it in agalco vhawk with slight cant built in then carry it at about 330 EVERY DAY...rock on

 

[mountainman308]

Get a 4 inch 1911 and a Galco King Tuk. Play with the positioning between 3:30 and 5:00. Try different cants. Wear it every day. Learn to keep your back straight when bending down to pick shit up, leaning over or bending at all. Practice drawing from a seated position. Practice drawing while belted into the driver/passenger seats in your vehicle. Practice practice practice until that draw becomes second nature.

 

[Metal Gear]

I agree with Asperly. However everyone is different, and not knowing your body type or daily routine where you would carry, I cannot necessarily say what the best way for you to carry would be. I will say that the majority of right handers who carry IWB (myself included) carry around the 3:30-4:00 position. With this position I have no issues in comfort while sitting whether it is in a chair or a vehicle. If you have a shorter torso and worry about holster clearence you can get a 4" or even 3" 1911 if that is what you want to carry.

Carrying a heavier steel pistol like a 1911 does require a nice sturdy belt, and a good holster. A recommendation I will throw out for both those needs will be White Hat Holsters.

 

[summy]

I'm 5'10" and about 150, so I don't have T-rex arms but I'm not an albatross either. As far as activity that I would be doing, I can't really say for certain. I'm still in school and campus doesn't allow carrying (stupid in my opinion) so short term wouldn't be very much day to day. The norm would probably be trips to the store or around town. Most of the rest would be at the camp for snakes, coyotes, bear, 2 legged vermin and and other conceivable situation in the back woods.

 

[bkw1911]

All I'll say is if you can't draw the gun or the draw is slow, why would you consider that setup/gun? Getting it out is most of the battle and getting it out and in the proper grip is of utmost importance. If you can't draw a 5 or 4" 1911 in the standard vertical position I hate to break it to you but it's not the gun for you concealed or not. (Fwiw I shoot with kids 5ft tall who have no issues drawing a full size 1911 in a hair over 1 sec). If your 5'10" and don't have a spare tire then you have a very easy body profile to carry any number of mid-full size gun on your strong side vertically without a gut pushing the gun into your shirt and profiling it. I don't have a spare tire and I can conceal all sizes of pistols on my strong side with just a t-shirt and it hugs my body and doesn't print. Fundamentals are mostly the same as all other training/competitions I do, my hand goes to my side, except for moving the tshirt it's the same motion. I would wager more than half the people carrying in there crotch, small of back, pockets, man purses, wherever else, would end up dropping the firearm trying to get it out in a real situation. If youre forced into needing a deep concealed carry that's one thing and you would have to practice lots, but it sounds like you have the luxury of carrying however you want so I would definitely keep it on your strong side in an inside the pants holster or go with a smaller g19 or 3" 1911 and get an outside the pants that hugs tight to your body.

 

[Metal Gear]

I believe you will find the 3:00-4:00 position most comfortable for all around carry. There is much to learn when it comes to ccw, and I think personal experience is the best way to learn what works for you. With that said, I am happy to give you any advise or my unbiased opinion on anything ccw related. I have been carrying just about everyday for 5 years and I am a certified instructor and do ccw courses here in Ohio, so feel free to ask anything on here or by private message, even if you think it is a stupid question.

 

[Veer_G]

Take the advice given and consider carry anywhere but in the small of the back. If you go down and land on it you can either hurt your spine or your kidney, one, and two, why would you want to hang something off the small of your back and then have to worry about not having eyes in the back of your head? It sounds good (SOB carry) in principle, but in actual practice it's pretty limiting, and requires as much room if not more than a typical strong-side draw. (And I'm a certified instructor and have been carrying since 1985. )

 

[summy]

Thanks guys, it seems more like a very task/activity specific carry rather than an every day deal. Seems like I'll be looking around for a belt and holster for strong side carry, the white hat suggestion was great, seems like a quality product at a decent price. For now at least I'll be carrying a full size 1911 and would prefer owb I think.

 

[mountainman308]

If you are going to carry OWB, make sure you have plenty of sport coats, jackets, long cut t shirts and the like. While OWB is faster access, its also harder to keep concealed. Just my 2c.

 

[Cobracutter]

Also think hard about changing your CCW weapon. The 1911 has it's own set of issues and should you actualy need to use it for defense, has significant drawbacks compared to the modern service pistols.

For reference, I shoot 1911's better than anything, its almost effortless. I love the platform... however as a combat/Self defense weapon, its been obsolete for decades. Do yourself a favor and get a glock/HK or even smith/sig if that's your flavor.

 

[Rob01]

For reference, I shoot 1911's better than anything, its almost effortless. I love the platform... however as a combat/Self defense weapon, its been obsolete for decades. Do yourself a favor and get a glock/HK or even smith/sig if that's your flavor.

While I don't know if it's obsolete I agree with the better options for carry. Started shooting 1911s in the Corps in 1986 and carried one in Barracks Duty in the PI. Also carried one when I was a DOD police officer. Compete with a 2011 and 1911 now in USPSA. Great platform and accurate. That said in 3 gun I still use my Glock and also use a Glock for carry. Just have more confidence in their reliability.

 

[Facemelter]

I carry my Fullsized R1 on a Volund Gearworks belt and a Galco IWB holster. A good belt makes a big difference in having a good solid base or having a bad day.

 

[Metal Gear]

As a person who loves the 1911, I too agree that there are better options for concealed carry, but a 1911 is certainly not a bad choice and it really just comes down to personal preference.

Today the 1911 is definitely not an obsolete service or self defense pistol. There are many military and law enforcement units that continue to use the 1911, and tons of respected individuals on the civilian side still carry them daily as their ccw. If you are interested, a simple search on the web will give you a list of sources that can show you where it is still being used today.

More importantly, whatever firearm you do choose, make sure you learn the system and practice with it. The 1911 in my opinion does require more practice than a firearm such as Glock.

 

[ivel_86]

In


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[Cobracutter]

Anyone who is thinking or carries a 1911 or any gun with a manual/grip saftey needs to read this:

My CCW Shooting AAR--Now with More Graphic Pics on pg 29 & 30 - Page 1 - AR15.COM

 

[Cobracutter]

As a person who loves the 1911, I too agree that there are better options for concealed carry, but a 1911 is certainly not a bad choice and it really just comes down to personal preference.

Today the 1911 is definitely not an obsolete service or self defense pistol. There are many military and law enforcement units that continue to use the 1911, and tons of respected individuals on the civilian side still carry them daily as their ccw. If you are interested, a simple search on the web will give you a list of sources that can show you where it is still being used today.

More importantly, whatever firearm you do choose, make sure you learn the system and practice with it. The 1911 in my opinion does require more practice than a firearm such as Glock.

There really are not "many" military or LE units using the 1911. Outside of MARSOC, I cannot think of anyone in the US mil who still uses them besides maybe some pistol comp shooters in AMU.
On the LE side, I don't know of anyone who issues 1911's other than HRT or some other small tac teams, they are usualy officer owned.

The ammount of training it takes to become profiecent coupled with the mechancial limitations and then throw in the advantages of guns like glocks there is zero reason to carry a 1911....other than for the sake of doing it.

Just beacuse SOME people do it, does not mean its a good idea. I could sit here and name organzations who use garbage gear, it really means nothing.

 

[355sigfan]

The 1911 does have its own set of draw backs compared to more modern designs but its far from being obsolete. The biggest issue with the 1911 is the maintenance schedule is far more intensive compared to modern pistols so you will have to stay on top of replacing parts at regular intervals. But its not that big of a deal for someone who is competent. Now its not a sidearm for those not willing to do that.

Also think hard about changing your CCW weapon. The 1911 has it's own set of issues and should you actualy need to use it for defense, has significant drawbacks compared to the modern service pistols.

For reference, I shoot 1911's better than anything, its almost effortless. I love the platform... however as a combat/Self defense weapon, its been obsolete for decades. Do yourself a favor and get a glock/HK or even smith/sig if that's your flavor.

 

[Cobracutter]

The 1911 does have its own set of draw backs compared to more modern designs but its far from being obsolete. The biggest issue with the 1911 is the maintenance schedule is far more intensive compared to modern pistols so you will have to stay on top of replacing parts at regular intervals. But its not that big of a deal for someone who is competent. Now its not a sidearm for those not willing to do that.

Look, it’s my shadow showing up, who only posts in a thread I post in, to try and start drama.

It would be one thing if my shadow gave good information, unfortunately, he has appears to have brain damage.


My own personal Troll, Aren't I lucky?

 

[355sigfan]

There really are not "many" military or LE units using the 1911. Outside of MARSOC, I cannot think of anyone in the US mil who still uses them besides maybe some pistol comp shooters in AMU.
On the LE side, I don't know of anyone who issues 1911's other than HRT or some other small tac teams, they are usualy officer owned.

The ammount of training it takes to become profiecent coupled with the mechancial limitations and then throw in the advantages of guns like glocks there is zero reason to carry a 1911....other than for the sake of doing it.

The biggest reason to carry a 1911 over a Glock or other more modern design is accuracy and the trigger. The reason 1911's and 2011's dominate in the shooting sports is because they are so shootable. And winning gun fights is about hitting the bad guy before he hits you. Now rather the edge the 1911 gives you in the shootability department over rides the maintenance and reliability concerns is up to the person making the purchase decisions.

Beware of people who make absolute statements because they are generally wrong.

 

[355sigfan]

You know trolling better than anyone lol. The statements you make are just absolutely amazing. Making friends all over the forum I see. 1911's useless and obsolete sure what ever Cobra.
LOL

Look, it’s my shadow showing up, who only posts in a thread I post in, to try and start drama.

It would be one thing if my shadow gave good information, unfortunately, he has appears to have brain damage.


My own personal Troll, Aren't I lucky?

 

[Cobracutter]

The biggest reason to carry a 1911 over a Glock or other more modern design is accuracy and the trigger. The reason 1911's and 2011's dominate in the shooting sports is because they are so shootable. And winning gun fights is about hitting the bad guy before he hits you. Now rather the edge the 1911 gives you in the shootability department over rides the maintenance and reliability concerns is up to the person making the purchase decisions.

Beware of people who make absolute statements because they are generally wrong.

Yes which is why the top Counter-Terrorists units in the world, the ones who actualy NEED accuracy to not hit hostages.....shoot Glocks.... The ones who previously used 1911's , and despite the best Combat support and full time armorer support of any entity in the world, dropped them and went to Glocks.

Please show me an instance where a 1911 would have been preferable to a Glock or other 9MM service pistol beacuse of accuracy issues.

You once again, are just here to start shit, grasping at straws and being the inner troll you aspire to.

I love how your justification for everything is "The shooting sports" or "when I was doing 3 gun"......................When talking about comabt/2 way shooting.

 

[Cobracutter]

You know trolling better than anyone lol. The statements you make are just absolutely amazing. Making friends all over the forum I see. 1911's useless and obsolete sure what ever Cobra.
LOL

Where did I say it was useless? Once again, you making shit up, putting words in people's mouth and being the same ignorant jackass clown as always.

Thanks for playing Troll.

 

[Rancid Coolaid]

To the OP: forget the SOB holster, too easy for someone else to take the gun from you, no security, and terrible comfort when anything but standing.

As for 1911 being obsolete, I'd say never go full retard. It fires a potent round, it handles exceedingly well, and a well built gun can be hella accurate and 100% reliable - and a cheap one can be little more than a hammer. I own a nice swath of handguns, including a few Glocks I have grown to love; but in harms way, I trust my 1911 more than anything else I own. If you are choosing your carry gun based on maintenance, I'd say you might be doing it wrong.

Don't skimp on a holster and belt, that will do more for effective concealment than anything else. I usually run a Milt Sparks Executive Companion, it is slim (like the 1911) and the bottom will mold to your ass and not move at all when moving - when carried in the 3:30 - 4 position. I can run, I can drive, I can do almost anything and the gun is in tight and motionless, no adjusting, no blousing.

I agree entirely that, for a 10,000 round gun, 1911 might not be an ideal fit; but for concealed carry where you might actually have to draw from concealment and fire, there is nothing I'd take over my Nighthawk T3. (I've heard many say you need more rounds than a 1911 offers, and true, most documented shootings require multiple hits on target, but a handgun is a poor "field of fire" weapon, and every round that strays from target strays to another target, intended or otherwise.

Get a good holster, and shoot your gun allot. Allot!5

 

[355sigfan]

Lol I own and shoot Glocks and 1911's 1911's are simply more mechanically reliable. No way to argue that. Most Glocks are 3 to 4 inch guns at 25 yards while a good 1911 is usually 1 to 2 inches at the same range. I also know that the reason DELTA dumped the 1911 was nothing to do with accuracy. You are such a damn boot sniffer its hilarious. Just because a special unit uses a type of gun does not mean its the best choice for everyone nor does it invalidate anyone elses choice to go with something else. Listen Cobra I will say this I do respect the fact you served in the military and that is great and honorable. But stop trying to belittle others who have not or other who are choosing to serve in other ways such as being a LEO. Also remeber one more thing. You are entitled to your opinions but they are not facts and just because someone does not share your opinion does not make them wrong. Some free life advice. You seem like someone who is 20 something who is a bit insecure and makes up for it by being opinionated and being quick to slam anyone around you who disagrees. That is not a healthy way to go through life.

Yes which is why the top Counter-Terrorists units in the world, the ones who actualy NEED accuracy to not hit hostages.....shoot Glocks.... The ones who previously used 1911's , and despite the best Combat support and full time armorer support of any entity in the world, dropped them and went to Glocks.

Please show me an instance where a 1911 would have been preferable to a Glock or other 9MM service pistol beacuse of accuracy issues.

You once again, are just here to start shit, grasping at straws and being the inner troll you aspire to.

I love how your justification for everything is "The shooting sports" or "when I was doing 3 gun"......................When talking about comabt/2 way shooting.

 

[Mendy300wm]

I carried a full size 1911 for 5 years, I'm 6'1" 205 pretty lean so carrying IWB at the 3oclock wasn't that big of deal my shirts would drape over th gun with no problem, unless I bent over you couldn't tell I had it on. If you are one of those guys that has a rather large waist line you are gonna have a hard time concealing a gun on your waist as it will be the widest part of your body.

Now I only carried that gun for 5 years and only really when it was convenient, cause the mother fucker was heavy, I got so sick of carrying that thing all the time... My buddy had a hk45c and I asked him if I could carry it while he went out of town, he let me.... Long story short I went and bought a hk45c and the rest is history.

Do not get a 3" 1911 they have their own set of problems.

And there is no one holster for ccw I have multiple holsters for every gun, you'll buy and learn, I Use different holsters for different occasions

 

[Metal Gear]

I am not a fan of a manual safety on many handguns other than a 1911. With proper training, accidently engaging the safety on a 1911 should never be an issue. When drawing a 1911 from a holster your thumb should automatically be on the safety, and as you come up on target safety should be disengaged. While shooting the 1911 you keep your thumb over the safety. This is the correct technique, using it will avoid any issues. It does aid having a safety with a larger ledge to rest your thumb on, which many modern 1911's do come with from the factory.

Now, if you are new to this forum you will quickly learn of Cobracutter and his attitude, and biased opinions that are often times not backed up by actual validated facts. In reply to Cobracutter, here are just a few military and LE units who use the 1911: Marine SOC, some SEALS, LA SWAT, FBI Hostage Rescue Team, and various other LE units across the country.... I guess since those units use the 1911 they do not require reliability, and precision though huh...

Also note that there would be more 1911's in LE use today, but the 1911 requires more training than the modern polymer handuns. Not to mention, the cost alone of a solid 1911 is much greater. It is safe to say that 90% of standard LE do not get nearly the amount of training they should. When certain LE departments experimented with 1911's as their duty firearm, they experienced an increase in negligent discharges which is purely operator error due to insufficient training like I mentioned above, so they pulled them.

 

[FN in MT]

To the OP...FWIW....I have a 4 1/4" Ed Brown Commander sized 1911 in .45 acp. Been carrying it at 4:00 or so, in a Milt Sparks summer Special or their VM-II rig. I carry a spare mag off to 8:00 or so. I've got several SIG's and a few HK's but prefer the EB as it's very accurate, great trigger, positive safety and has been 100% reliable with 230 gr WW SXT's, which I have easy access to.

I've found it to be a comfortable carry set up. I'd suggest taking a look at quite a few different holsters before simply buying something and MAKING it work. Borrow both IWB and OWB rigs if you can. See what works for YOU.

FN

 

[Cobracutter]

Lol I own and shoot Glocks and 1911's 1911's are simply more mechanically reliable. No way to argue that. Most Glocks are 3 to 4 inch guns at 25 yards while a good 1911 is usually 1 to 2 inches at the same range. I also know that the reason DELTA dumped the 1911 was nothing to do with accuracy. You are such a damn boot sniffer its hilarious. Just because a special unit uses a type of gun does not mean its the best choice for everyone nor does it invalidate anyone elses choice to go with something else. Listen Cobra I will say this I do respect the fact you served in the military and that is great and honorable. But stop trying to belittle others who have not or other who are choosing to serve in other ways such as being a LEO. Also remeber one more thing. You are entitled to your opinions but they are not facts and just because someone does not share your opinion does not make them wrong. Some free life advice. You seem like someone who is 20 something who is a bit insecure and makes up for it by being opinionated and being quick to slam anyone around you who disagrees. That is not a healthy way to go through life.

Wait, 1911's are more reliable than Glocks? Are you joking or doubling down on stupid?

Again, show me one instance where the accuracy of a pistol mattered in a gunfight? Where someone who had a 1911 would have scored hits where his glock or similar gun missed?

The funny thing is, instead of coming up with a resonalble explaination for your assertation (which you have still failed to do) you double down on stupid and call me a bootlicker. I guess its convienent for you to ignore that fact that perhaps those special mission units who do counter-terror and hostage rescue, and have a very high focus on combat accuracy, have dumped the 1911. Larry Vickers must be a bootlicker too, you know the 1911 guru who was not only an Assualter, but the pistol instructor for CAG/DELTA will be the first to tell you that they went to glocks beaucse 1911's are simply not reliable enough for combat. Clearly the Glock's must be accurate enough for shooting around hostages and into tight windows beacuse they have been using them ever since.


Only a fucking moron does not use the experince and knowledge of subject matter experts and leaders in their field to make educated decisions. Why reinvent the wheel?

You are nothing but a petty troll. You have zero experince or knowledge to benefit this site. All you have done is post rebuttals to everything I have said, and you ignore all the hard questions. I call that a pussy. Grow a set of fucking balls and man up. I stand behind every word I type and can articlate why I say what I say. I will also be the first to admit when I am wrong and appologize. You are do neither. The people who read this see you for what you are. A joke.

 

[summy]

To everyone that actually gave useful information and opinions, thank you very much. As I said I'm newer to handguns and figured it would be a good idea to at least ask the question.
On the topic of 1911s for carry...the first shots out of my 1911 were more accurate, consistent and comfortable than any other handgun I've fired. (Admittedly not many) I don't shy away at all from routine weapons maintenence and replacing parts that may need it. I'm also a mechanical engineering student so tearing things apart and finding problems is not new to me at all so I'm not worried about that. Long story short, a ccw should be one that you're accurate and confident with shouldn't it? Right now that's a 1911. FWIW I do plan on getting a 4 inch sometime in the future.

 

[Cobracutter]

I am not a fan of a manual safety on many handguns other than a 1911. With proper training, accidently engaging the safety on a 1911 should never be an issue. When drawing a 1911 from a holster your thumb should automatically be on the safety, and as you come up on target safety should be disengaged. While shooting the 1911 you keep your thumb over the safety. This is the correct technique, using it will avoid any issues. It does aid having a safety with a larger ledge to rest your thumb on, which many modern 1911's do come with from the factory.

Now, if you are new to this forum you will quickly learn of Cobracutter and his attitude, and biased opinions that are often times not backed up by actual validated facts. In reply to Cobracutter, here are just a few military and LE units who use the 1911: Marine SOC, some SEALS, LA SWAT, FBI Hostage Rescue Team, and various other LE units across the country.... I guess since those units use the 1911 they do not require reliability, and precision though huh...

Also note that there would be more 1911's in LE use today, but the 1911 requires more training than the modern polymer handuns. Not to mention, the cost alone of a solid 1911 is much greater. It is safe to say that 90% of standard LE do not get nearly the amount of training they should. When certain LE departments experimented with 1911's as their duty firearm, they experienced an increase in negligent discharges which is purely operator error due to insufficient training like I mentioned above, so they pulled them.

And those units you mentioned (which are a cherry picked super minority) have the money for the insane training and maintance required to make it work. No SEALS use the 1911, so stop spreading bullshit.

When one of the top SMU's in the world who specialize in Hostage Rescue and Counter-Terror (two things that require a very high degree of accuracy) ditches the 1911's despite the unparrelled Budget/Combat/Armorer support they have for glocks, we would call this an indicator.

So when the guys who have the most training, biggest budgets and can choose bassicaly anything they want decide the juice is not worth the sqeeze, you want to argue against that? Good luck.

 

[Cobracutter]

To everyone that actually gave useful information and opinions, thank you very much. As I said I'm newer to handguns and figured it would be a good idea to at least ask the question.
On the topic of 1911s for carry...the first shots out of my 1911 were more accurate, consistent and comfortable than any other handgun I've fired. (Admittedly not many) I don't shy away at all from routine weapons maintenence and replacing parts that may need it. I'm also a mechanical engineering student so tearing things apart and finding problems is not new to me at all so I'm not worried about that. Long story short, a ccw should be one that you're accurate and confident with shouldn't it? Right now that's a 1911. FWIW I do plan on getting a 4 inch sometime in the future.

That is a training issue. And unless you have some serious formal training with smithing a 1911, then you are in for a rude awakening. Very little on a 1911 is drop in. Many of us shoot 1911's more accuratley and easily than just about everything else. It is still a poor choice. Your money so do what you want. You also asked for advice so take it or leave it.

 

[summy]

And for the record cobra, that makes you look like a joke. Hijacking a thread for your personal temper tantrums is pretty pathetic. I'll respect your opinion about 1911 and I'll agree that they do require more time and work to maintain, but serious calm the hell down.

 

[Metal Gear]

No SEALS use the 1911, so stop spreading bullshit.

I have read a few stories of SEALS ditching their issued sidearm and instead using a 1911. A notable one comes from Chris Kyle's autobiography where he mentions just this.

 

[Cobracutter]

I have read a few stories of SEALS ditching their issued sidearm and instead using a 1911. A notable one comes from Chris Kyle's autobiography where he mentions just this.

Yes beacuse Chris Kyles book was not littered with made up stories and bullshit, which has been proven multiple times.

Listen to less stories and stick to verifiable sources.

 

[355sigfan]

I never said the 1911 was more reliable than a glock. As for when has accuracy mattered in a gun fight. Are you fucking serious. Accuracy matters in all of them. You will not survive if you miss


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[Veer_G]

If you are going to carry OWB, make sure you have plenty of sport coats, jackets, long cut t shirts and the like. While OWB is faster access, its also harder to keep concealed. Just my 2c.

And here's another thing: carry OWB or IWB is going to wear the hell out of the linings of suit jackets, coats, and the contact points with whatever casual shirts you may throw on. Think carefully about your wardrobe and even consider the idea of having linings added and/or alterations as need be.

As to the rest of you, please, stop the bickering in here. The OP is both admittedly young and inexperienced. For now, he's captivated by the idea of 1911s for carry. As he goes through life he may come to different conclusions about an appropriate weapon. They're like women, it can take a few to find the right one and settle down. If he actually has to draw and survives the first shirt-tail-on-hammer snag, he may come to consider a more streamlined option for concealed carry. Until then, if you need to beat up on each other, why not take it to PM?

 

[Metal Gear]

Summy, the maintenance aspect of 1911 is not a big deal if you are a casual shooter. In my personal experience of a few thousand rounds through my 1911, all I have done to keep it reliable is switch out the recoil spring every 1200-1500 rounds, and keep it properly lubricated. Also, good magazines without worn out springs can definitely make or break the reliability of a 1911.

 

[Cobracutter]

Lol I own and shoot Glocks and 1911's 1911's are simply more mechanically reliable. SNIP

I never said the 1911 was more reliable than a glock. As for when has accuracy mattered in a gun fight. Are you fucking serious. Accuracy matters in all of them. You will not survive if you miss


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I guess someone else must have typed that on your account huh?

"Again, show me one instance where the accuracy of a pistol mattered in a gunfight? Where someone who had a 1911 would have scored hits where his glock or similar gun missed?"

Your either a dishonest piece of shit or your illiterate. What part of my question can you not understand? Do not understand the difference between mechanical accuracy ("of a pistol") and the accuracy of the shooter?

You are a coward and a passive aggressive bitch. You refuse to answer direct questions, and just make up whatever the fuck you want in a poor attempt to keep an argument alive. You have zero standing, and are EASILY proven wrong, as anyone who reads these posts can see. All you do is stir shit.

Congratulations, you are the First person who make my ignore list.

 

[EXTREMEPREJUDICE]

Before we gt into it, I'm sure I'm opening a huge can of worms here.

Apparently so..............................

Reason being, when just thinking about the body mechanics of the draw, I would need to get a fistful of that 1911 almost into my armpit to clear the holster with a conventional 3:00 carry.

Actually that is a very good fighting position allowing for plenty of CQB clearance and weapons retention. It's also extremely efficient, that's why your IPSC/USPSA and IDPA competitors use it. As mentioned, while it seems like an option the SOB carry has too many downsides for my liking. It's not comfortable sitting, and challenging to draw when doing so. In fact, it's difficult to draw from period............especially if you don't want to cover yourself with the muzzle (who does?) If I was going to enter a club where they do a cursory "open jacket, run hands along your side pat down" then I might utilize it (even then probably not.) A well tuned 1911 is probably the most enjoyable pistol to shoot ever made but the fantastic 2.5# trigger makes it a liability for a carry weapon, not to mention the manual safety and restricted magazine capacity. I love 1911's................but carry a Glock. As always, everyone has an opinion and YMMV!

 

[Cobracutter]

Summy, the maintenance aspect of 1911 is not a big deal if you are a casual shooter. In my personal experience of a few thousand rounds through my 1911, all I have done to keep it reliable is switch out the recoil spring every 1200-1500 rounds, and keep it properly lubricated. Also, good magazines without worn out springs can definitely make or break the reliability of a 1911.

What is your baseline for a reliable 1911? What level of maintenance? What level of training to become proficient?

Its easy to just say shit, it's another for them to match up with reality. History/experience points in a different direction then you describe.

 

[355sigfan]

Obviously meant more mechanically accurate as you can see Fromm comment immediately after talking about group size. Lol. Good job on catching a typo.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[29aholic]

And for the record cobra, that makes you look like a joke. Hijacking a thread for your personal temper tantrums is pretty pathetic. I'll respect your opinion about 1911 and I'll agree that they do require more time and work to maintain, but serious calm the hell down.

He hasn't been hugged lately.

I carried a 1911 of one type or other for close to 30 years in everything you can carry one in. I did the SOB gig for a while, but I stood for a living. Printing wasn't an issue, you learn how to bend down if you need to much as a woman learns how to in a skirt.
The Bianchi Pistol Pocket was a good holster as well as the Sparks Summer Special. I had a Jackass (now Galco) Yaqui Slide that was an awesome OWB holster and despite being an open top design with no strap it was almost impossible to get the gun out other than by a natural draw (I had people try).

Having said that, I carry a P229 Sig now. In my opinion the 229 is the ultimate go anywhere do anything gun...again my opinion. Plus, I shoot it better than a 1911.

I will never bet my life on a striker fired gun Glock or whatever. I have seen Glocks fail with ammo with hard primers, if they fixed that then kudos...still wont own one.

 

[mountainman308]

And here's another thing: carry OWB or IWB is going to wear the hell out of the linings of suit jackets, coats, and the contact points with whatever casual shirts you may throw on. Think carefully about your wardrobe and even consider the idea of having linings added and/or alterations as need be.

Funny you mention that Veer. I can guarantee that Wilson's leather does not do a special suede patch that runs along the waste between 4:00 and 5:00 in the lining. It also took me 3 new linings to figure that out. Next time I am just going to get a suede band around the entire inside of the waist.

<a href="http://s1381.photobucket.com/user/wsacripa/media/20140924_172001_zpsceb2a4b4.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1381.photobucket.com/albums/ah213/wsacripa/20140924_172001_zpsceb2a4b4.jpg~original" border="0" alt=" photo 20140924_172001_zpsceb2a4b4.jpg"/></a>

 

[Veer_G]

Funny you mention that Veer.

It's the voice of experience. That, and a seamstress who loves me to death for the repeat business.

 

[355sigfan]

I agree its personal choice. But your issue with Glocks is a ammo rather than a gun problem. Personally I used to love Sigs but I just don't care for DA SA type guns anymore. To each his own.
Pat

He hasn't been hugged lately.

I carried a 1911 of one type or other for close to 30 years in everything you can carry one in. I did the SOB gig for a while, but I stood for a living. Printing wasn't an issue, you learn how to bend down if you need to much as a woman learns how to in a skirt.
The Bianchi Pistol Pocket was a good holster as well as the Sparks Summer Special. I had a Jackass (now Galco) Yaqui Slide that was an awesome OWB holster and despite being an open top design with no strap it was almost impossible to get the gun out other than by a natural draw (I had people try).

Having said that, I carry a P229 Sig now. In my opinion the 229 is the ultimate go anywhere do anything gun...again my opinion. Plus, I shoot it better than a 1911.

I will never bet my life on a striker fired gun Glock or whatever. I have seen Glocks fail with ammo with hard primers, if they fixed that then kudos...still wont own one.

 

[29aholic]

I should have added this in my first reply. Whatever you decide on (I suggest try several) train, train, TRAIN with it and DONT FUCKING CHANGE!!!!
In a stressful situation you will ALWAYS revert back to your training. I cant tell you how many guys I used to train who would show up one day with a completely different rig. I would bide my time until I could catch them off guard and startle the shit out of them. To a man/woman they ALWAYS went for a gun where it USED TO BE!!! Or, tried to pull a gun out of a holster that had a retention strap that wasn't there before.

It was actually pretty funny.

 

[Cobracutter]

So the solution to Glocks which just about every top end trainer/PD/Military runs is to run Sigs with their own set of reliability issues?

Gotta love the gun world.... its like special Olympics sometimes.

Carrying a gun and actually using it in anger/defense are not the same. I could carry a black powder pistol for 30 years and never have "issues".

 

[29aholic]

I agree its personal choice. But your issue with Glocks is a ammo rather than a gun problem. Personally I used to love Sigs but I just don't care for DA SA type guns anymore. To each his own.
Pat

Pat,
One of my criteria for a defensive/offensive firearm is I don't want to have to rely on a specific type of ammo for it to work reliably. Not that I am ever going to be in the situation, but if I were I want to know whatever I stuff in it is going to go off. FWIW I don't carry a 9mm for that very same reason. Call me old fashioned if you will...again my opinion. I didn't like DA/SA guns myself for a long time, but once I got used to it (Training) it wasn't an issue. For me, the ergonomics of the Sig suit me better than anything else I have used.