20" 300WM with a can? Why not? **Chrono update**

[5RWill]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Anchor Zero Six</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm less concerned about speed but rather distance and energy. Could push a 175 faster but the 230 has better performance at longer ranges.

The rifle weighs 13.5 lbs with optic, Atlas and empty mag.</div></div>

Completely understand, i'm more prone to using the higher BC heavier bullets myself. 13.5 isn't too bad. Be sure to update the chrono results on the 230gr.

 

[jrob300]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

You might want to take a hard look at how the 208 Amax, 215 Berger, 230 Berger Tactical OTM and 230 Berger Target Hybrid sit in the case with your particular throat. I noticed that the 215 is probably the optimal bullet for my rifle, because the 230's will be shoved so far into the case, they take up substantial powder capacity. Look at the trade offs and be realistic about your expectations. If you shoot under 1200 yds. 95% of the time, the 208 *might* still be your best bet.

John

 

[Anchor Zero Six]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

Good point, I'll take a look at that.

EDIT: Damnit! The 230's ARE going to suck up alot of space. An extra .18 allowing for.002 of the lands. Guess I'll give PTG a call tomorrow and see if they have anything special hidden in the back of the shop.

 

[Anchor Zero Six]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

Sorry I didn't plug the numbers into JBM. All I was trying to do was get a feel for how much velocity was lost from 26 to 20"

My first load work up will be on the 230's and if my figures work out it should be well over 1100 ft/lbs at 1k.

 

[freerangevoter]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

Tag- .308 about equal to WM in short 20" barrel.

 

[Derrick300]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

Tag for later

 

[jrob300]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: freerangevoter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tag- .308 about equal to WM in short 20" barrel. </div></div>

And this conclusion is the outcome of extensive, well-documented research, which you are now going to share with us. Right?

John

 

[RedGoat]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

Any updates? What happen with those 230 bergers, did you get a chance to work up anything with the 208?

 

[Maverick26]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not? **Chrono update**

A06, very interesting info you have here sir. I myself am building a Model 70 300wm and want the same things you want out of your gun. Be able to reach out to 1000 yards and be lighter but more portable for hunting. I have a Manners MCS-T2A stock ordered for it and plan to have Benchmark Barrels build me a 22" rem. varm. SS fluted barrel for it. Also plan on running Thunderbeast can most of the time.

What ammo to run has been my biggest thinking topic for me but after a lot of lurking and reading Im thinking the 208 Amax or 210 VLD will probably be what I go with. Now with that said I am just starting out and have no reloading gear so this will be a big learning curve for me. Kinda cool to see that you are local so maybe I can bug you someday.

Awesome rightup and great looking rig.

 

[Carrbque]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not? **Chrono update**

I also have a 20" 300WM and I would like to offer some of my data to this cause.

My high side FPS was 2848 and low of 2822 using Federal 190 gr Sierra MatchKings BTHP. I only was able to shoot 10 rounds through the chronograph because the dude at the range next to me was cool enough to let me use his chrono until he had to go.

Gun: Remington 700 5R 300 Win. Mag 1/10 twist. in a XLR chassis, barrel cut to 20"
Temp: 78.0' F
Altitude: 5791 ft.

I haven't had a chance to see how she prints at 1000 but I will post more data as soon as I do.

 

[alpha6164]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: freerangevoter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tag- .308 about equal to WM in short 20" barrel. </div></div>



I am sorry but this simply is not a accurate. Comparing apples to apples which is a 20" 300wm vs 20" 308 there is significant difference in velocities. I recently purchased my buddy's (Chris Costa) 20" 300wm with Surefire brake and uses a SF338 suppressor with it. Suppressed usually chronos 15-20ft/sec faster. It spits out the 190smk factory load at 2801ft/sec. I want someone to show me a 20" 308 that can send a 190smk with modest factori loads even better than 2550.

I am getting my Magpro powder this week and working up a load for the 208amax for it. I have no doubt that with handloads I can get the 208s to 2800ft/sec and if so that is a about 300ft/sec faster than what a 308 can propel the same 208 bullet. And I don't know in what ballistics class makes 300ff/sec faster SAME.

 

[HOGTOOTH5R]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: alpha6164</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: freerangevoter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tag- .308 about equal to WM in short 20" barrel. </div></div>



I am sorry but this simply is not a accurate. Comparing apples to apples which is a 20" 300wm vs 20" 308 there is significant difference in velocities. I recently purchased my buddy's (Chris Costa) 20" 300wm with Surefire brake and uses a SF338 suppressor with it. Suppressed usually chronos 15-20ft/sec faster. It spits out the 190smk factory load at 2801ft/sec. I want someone to show me a 20" 308 that can send a 190smk with modest factori loads even better than 2550.

I am getting my Magpro powder this week and working up a load for the 208amax for it. I have no doubt that with handloads I can get the 208s to 2800ft/sec and if so that is a about 300ft/sec faster than what a 308 can propel the same 208 bullet. And I don't know in what ballistics class makes 300ff/sec faster SAME.

</div></div>

Tag for some schooling, and Dam that is a Freaken Beauty!!!

 

[alpha6164]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

So as an update. Took the 20" Tactical Rifle 300wm to get some new loads with Magpro and 208amax and got some pretty awesome results for such a short barrel.

TR 300win mag
Federal 215M primer
PPU brass
208 amax COAL 3.530"
Magpro powder
70deg temp



80.0gr= 2742,2736,2739,2746,2739 Avg= 2740 ft/sec
80.5gr= 2766,2771,2783,2764,2773 Avg= 2771 ft/sec
81.0gr= 2783,2789,2783,2781,2786 Avg= 2784 ft/sec
81.5gr= 2795,2824,2830,2812,2818 Avg= 2815 ft/sec
<span style="font-weight: bold">81.8gr= 2824,2812,2861,2888,2886 Avg=2854 (sticky bolt)
82.1gr= 2860,2840,2832,2829,2836 Avg= 2839(Very sticky bolt)</span>


The 81.8 and 82.1gr were too much. The 81.5gr had no sticky bolt and slight flatten primers. Everything else below that amount had no sign of pressure. But to basically get 2815 ft/sec safely from a 20" barrel is pretty amazing. When you plug in the numbers for a 26" barrel at 2900-2950ft/sec you are only gaining 2" of wind drift for a 5mph wind. Obviously you lose some elevation but you just dial that in. For having such a short and handy rifle i think it is a win win.

Also even with the 20" barrel and above velocity it does not go subsonic until ~1600 yards. So this is to prove that a 20" win man is NOT the same as a 308.

 

[jrob300]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not?

I'm a big proponent of short-barreled 300WM's, have a 22" WM of my own and have shot further with it than most here even dream of, and *I'm* surprised by those velocities. Very impressive.

John

 

[Carrbque]

Re: 20" 300WM with a can? Why not? **Chrono update**

Lets bring this thread back to life gents!
I am attempting to find a good load for my 20" 300 WM. to use with my can, so I loaded up some Berger 230 gr hybrid target w/ varying levels of Ramshot magnum to see how this combo works. I am very impressed by this combination and hope to see better results.

Elevation: 5791
Temp: 51'F
Started at 65.0 and increased by .2 grains until max load at 74.0
At max this load showed no signs of pressure and is only 97% full.

65.0 was in the high 2200's and gradually climbed to 2480's at 70.8 gr.
this load really started to impress after 72.0 gr. which was 2540.

I have since loaded more ( three of each) starting at 72.0 grains ending at 74.8 grains. I will head to the range very soon and further test .
<span style="font-weight: bold">I MUST ADVISE THIS LOAD IS WAY OVER MAX !!
</span>

I will post more data after I shoot this next string.

 

[crimson25]

Man, I just stumbled across this old thread and was really liking the progression, until the cliffhanger.

Anyone still out there and have some good data on their shorties from the past 7-8 years? I am about to pull the trigger on a MPA ultra lite hunting rifle and I'm having a hard time deciding between 22" and 24".

 

[slothlacrosse]

Man, I just stumbled across this old thread and was really liking the progression, until the cliffhanger.

Anyone still out there and have some good data on their shorties from the past 7-8 years? I am about to pull the trigger on a MPA ultra lite hunting rifle and I'm having a hard time deciding between 22" and 24".

Depends on what you're shooting. If you're shooting heavier bullets at higher velocities, I'd opt for the 24" barrel.

 

[crimson25]

Depends on what you're shooting. If you're shooting heavier bullets at higher velocities, I'd opt for the 24" barrel.

I have a good supply of uncle sam's 220g and 190g. beyond that, I'll only be shooting factory ammo