22LR ammo Question

alamo5000

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Among those of you that have tested and/or shoot a variety of .22LR ammo, what in your opinion has been the best ammo in way of consistency? By that I mean consistent velocities, small SD, and those typical types of measurements is what I am specifically referring to.

For this particular question let's leave out the absolute accuracy of a given ammo. I am not asking which one shoots best out of YOUR rifles, but rather for it to be based around actual measured numbers (if you have them).

Any additional information along those lines would be appreciated.

The reason I want to get this information is so there can be an ongoing thread (maybe) and so that I can start building up ammo stockpiles. I will eventually choose a few types of ammo to do further testing in my rifle and then hopefully stockpile the stuff.

Another note is this can apply to subsonic as well as supersonic ammo. Ideally I will get some idea for each side of things as I want both types of ammo.
 
Alamo5000
I believe that the question you are asking is somewhat difficult to address in a manner that can be of assistance.

For perspective - I am a competitive smallbore shooter with over 40 years of trigger time (and counting). Over that time period, I have had ammunition from RWS, Lapua, Federal and a small amount of Eley that were exceptional and would fill in all of the check boxes you mentioned. Consistent velocity, small SD, yada yada....

Those lots - and all of the measured data - is over a huge time period and every single round is long gone. How would that data be beneficial in comparison to ammunition being produced today by the various manufacturers and a multitude of different lot numbers?

You mention that you are not interested in what shoots best in each of our rifles, but base it on actual numbers from other tests. If I am testing ammunition, why would I continue to test many lots (and keep that data) if I find one that performs exceptionally well in my rifle - but may not perform well in yours?

The endeavor you describe - unless I am misunderstanding your goals - will only end up in paralysis by analysis. The data would be out of date by the time it would be collected and reported as we know match ammunition does not sit on the shelves for very long right now. Even if you pulled all of the data to make a comparison of what is most consistent for stock piling, you would still be best served to do your own testing to make your rifle / ammo combination optimal.

Again, I'm just having difficulty understanding what you are really trying to do. The only thought that keeps bouncing around my brain is "you can't get there from here"....

Regards,
Ken
 
Alamo5000
I believe that the question you are asking is somewhat difficult to address in a manner that can be of assistance.

For perspective - I am a competitive smallbore shooter with over 40 years of trigger time (and counting). Over that time period, I have had ammunition from RWS, Lapua, Federal and a small amount of Eley that were exceptional and would fill in all of the check boxes you mentioned. Consistent velocity, small SD, yada yada....

Those lots - and all of the measured data - is over a huge time period and every single round is long gone. How would that data be beneficial in comparison to ammunition being produced today by the various manufacturers and a multitude of different lot numbers?

You mention that you are not interested in what shoots best in each of our rifles, but base it on actual numbers from other tests. If I am testing ammunition, why would I continue to test many lots (and keep that data) if I find one that performs exceptionally well in my rifle - but may not perform well in yours?

The endeavor you describe - unless I am misunderstanding your goals - will only end up in paralysis by analysis. The data would be out of date by the time it would be collected and reported as we know match ammunition does not sit on the shelves for very long right now. Even if you pulled all of the data to make a comparison of what is most consistent for stock piling, you would still be best served to do your own testing to make your rifle / ammo combination optimal.

Again, I'm just having difficulty understanding what you are really trying to do. The only thought that keeps bouncing around my brain is "you can't get there from here"....

Regards,
Ken
Maybe you are misinterpreting my intentions (then again maybe not). In my original post I wanted to be extremely specific about what kind of data/ideas that I was asking about. What I didn't want is a bunch of 'that blue box I got from Wal Mart functions fine in my gun' type of responses. I was hoping to narrow it down from people that have actually tested their ammo. It doesn't need to be some crazy exhaustive expose' on a particular lot of ammo, but much more specific than just 'it shoots good'.

For example if someone shoots 22LR all the time and they have a pet ammo they like and they say 'this ammo gives me on average an SD of 10' or something like that, that would be really valuable information. I want to shoot my .22LR out as far as I can get so consistency is a primary concern.

Once I can build a list of candidates I will buy a bit and test it myself. By framing the question the way I did I was hoping to get responses from people that have actually put their 22LR on a chronograph. Even if the data is somewhat rough, it's still better than no data at all.
 
I had my vudoo lot tested at lapua and Midas plus was the best so I bought a case. Since then I have personally lot tested some eley match and eley tenex since then and both shoot better than the Midas plus for me when I find the right lot.
 
RT, you forgot a couple sectors of the rimfire matrix.
It's distance/price/quality/accuracy matrix. ;)

Short range can be cheap junk and still be accurate.
As long as you don't mind powder burns on y'er targets, right?

But at longer distances the price goes up in direct proportion
to the quality needed to obtain the desired accuracy.

Kinda like the unicorn sector of the crazy/girlfriend/wife matrix. :D
 
Maybe you are misinterpreting my intentions (then again maybe not). In my original post I wanted to be extremely specific about what kind of data/ideas that I was asking about. What I didn't want is a bunch of 'that blue box I got from Wal Mart functions fine in my gun' type of responses. I was hoping to narrow it down from people that have actually tested their ammo. It doesn't need to be some crazy exhaustive expose' on a particular lot of ammo, but much more specific than just 'it shoots good'.

For example if someone shoots 22LR all the time and they have a pet ammo they like and they say 'this ammo gives me on average an SD of 10' or something like that, that would be really valuable information. I want to shoot my .22LR out as far as I can get so consistency is a primary concern.

Once I can build a list of candidates I will buy a bit and test it myself. By framing the question the way I did I was hoping to get responses from people that have actually put their 22LR on a chronograph. Even if the data is somewhat rough, it's still better than no data at all.
Build a list of candidates? You're way over thinking this.

Buy a selection of higher grade ammo from name brands like Eley, Lapue and RWS and find out what your gun likes. How some ammo performs in my rifle is not necessarily how it will perform in y.ours. Don't make this harder than it is.

Find something that seems to work well in your rifle then if you have time and resources to do so, lot test and buy a shitload of whatever lot shoots best.
 
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I've consistently lot tested but no matter the answer it's still specific to your gun/your barrel.

I typically go for CX, and have a case that was recently tested at the Lapua center, but I've had a few lots of CX that shot horrific in my gun as well. I will look at CX, SKLR, mostly but have also had good luck with SK Red, Eley Match Black, and Tenex. I try to go through a minimum of a single box if not more, generally 2-3 to see what the results are. I start at 50, then 100, then multi distance on the best lots. If I don't need to adjust my Kestrel at all until the 350+ yd distances, those are winners. The rest I try in different guns.
 
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Among those of you that have tested and/or shoot a variety of .22LR ammo, what in your opinion has been the best ammo in way of consistency? By that I mean consistent velocities, small SD, and those typical types of measurements is what I am specifically referring to.
For example if someone shoots 22LR all the time and they have a pet ammo they like and they say 'this ammo gives me on average an SD of 10' or something like that, that would be really valuable information. I want to shoot my .22LR out as far as I can get so consistency is a primary concern.
It's impossible to say which is the best. The best ammo varies by lot, even when they have the same name on the packaging.

Every kind of match ammo -- whether it's the top tier (and most expensive) Lapua X-Act or other varieties such as Midas +, Center X, Eley Tenex, or Eley Match, or any RWS variation -- is made in batches called lots. Some lots shoot better than others.

To add to that, not only does ammo performance vary by lot, but it's possible that some lots perform better in some rifles than in others.

To find what shoots well in your rifle, the only way is to actually test different lots of different varieties of match ammo from Lapua, Eley, and RWS. There are no shortcuts.
 
It's impossible to say which is the best. The best ammo varies by lot, even when they have the same name on the packaging.

Every kind of match ammo -- whether it's the top tier (and most expensive) Lapua X-Act or other varieties such as Midas +, Center X, Eley Tenex, or Eley Match, or any RWS variation -- is made in batches called lots. Some lots shoot better than others.

To add to that, not only does ammo performance vary by lot, but it's possible that some lots perform better in some rifles than in others.

To find what shoots well in your rifle, the only way is to actually test different lots of different varieties of match ammo from Lapua, Eley, and RWS. There are no shortcuts.
Grauhanen reply hits the nail on the head! You can chronograph. Log data and and play with computer programs and all you will find is that 22ammo is inconsistent. Speeds vary from bullet to bullet. Box to box and lot to lot. Lot testing is without doubt the only way you have to determine the best ammo for your gun!
 
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Each rifle likes different ammo. But on one day a certain rifle shoots well, then on other days, nah! I have a CZ452, two Annies and a Vudoo. They all shot well on some days and crappy on others. I think it's me. I took my Anschutz 1903 MPR (64 action) out the other day and tried some different ammo. It did not like any Eley I fed it, but then I tried some SK Rifle Match. I got a real nice group and I thought it was a fluke, so I shot two more which were the same (targets 6,7, and 8). I guess I know what ammo I'll be shooting in this gun.
50 Yd ammo test Sep 2022.jpg
 
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Eley TENEX and stop shopping around. I shot 20 round strings to get ES and SD. 1st steel picture is a 10 round group at 252 yards. 2nd steel picture is a 20 round group at 252 yards( had 1 fast round)

***I win for actually providing data asked for🤣...also extra credit for providing groups while collecting said data!!!***

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Maybe you are misinterpreting my intentions (then again maybe not). In my original post I wanted to be extremely specific about what kind of data/ideas that I was asking about. What I didn't want is a bunch of 'that blue box I got from Wal Mart functions fine in my gun' type of responses. I was hoping to narrow it down from people that have actually tested their ammo. It doesn't need to be some crazy exhaustive expose' on a particular lot of ammo, but much more specific than just 'it shoots good'.

For example if someone shoots 22LR all the time and they have a pet ammo they like and they say 'this ammo gives me on average an SD of 10' or something like that, that would be really valuable information. I want to shoot my .22LR out as far as I can get so consistency is a primary concern.

Once I can build a list of candidates I will buy a bit and test it myself. By framing the question the way I did I was hoping to get responses from people that have actually put their 22LR on a chronograph. Even if the data is somewhat rough, it's still better than no data at all.
I run a Long Range 22 LR match in Roanoke VA. We have pushed out to 400yds with steel knockdown targets. We have a group of guys that are retired, and shoot once a week. We are working on 500yds now. We shoot most all the ammo made. We shoot to see what the vertical is at long range. This can be done on steel, paper, or just dirt. just what it does in the field. We are looking for height of vertical and % of hits.

We have shot bulk ammo, everything from Remington Golden bullets, Fed Auto match, etc. you see a lot of vertical and flyers. I save this ammo for handgun's and close in stuff.

Next up, low end ( non bulk) like CCI SV, Norma Tac 22, Eley force. These can shoot very well at 50 yds and 100yds, but beyond you will see vertical and flyers. These are for windy days and to save our better ammo.

Next up is the midrange match/target ammo any SK line, Wolf match target and extra, Eley Target, Club, etc. Eley Club and SK Biathlon, and SK long range have been the stand out for me. SK Long Range is at the top for me.

The upper grade of ammo will shoot better, but not good enough for 2 times the cost.

Other guys data will just be a guide. You have to get some ammo, and give it a try in you equipment. I would start with the midrange ammo.
 
I run a Long Range 22 LR match in Roanoke VA. We have pushed out to 400yds with steel knockdown targets. We have a group of guys that are retired, and shoot once a week. We are working on 500yds now. We shoot most all the ammo made. We shoot to see what the vertical is at long range. This can be done on steel, paper, or just dirt. just what it does in the field. We are looking for height of vertical and % of hits.

We have shot bulk ammo, everything from Remington Golden bullets, Fed Auto match, etc. you see a lot of vertical and flyers. I save this ammo for handgun's and close in stuff.

Next up, low end ( non bulk) like CCI SV, Norma Tac 22, Eley force. These can shoot very well at 50 yds and 100yds, but beyond you will see vertical and flyers. These are for windy days and to save our better ammo.

Next up is the midrange match/target ammo any SK line, Wolf match target and extra, Eley Target, Club, etc. Eley Club and SK Biathlon, and SK long range have been the stand out for me. SK Long Range is at the top for me.

The upper grade of ammo will shoot better, but not good enough for 2 times the cost.

Other guys data will just be a guide. You have to get some ammo, and give it a try in you equipment. I would start with the midrange ammo.
I'm not that far from Roanoke, couple hours, when are these matches?
 
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Last one this year is Oct 29th.

 
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Last one this year is Oct 29th.

I'll be heading down to TX for the 22PRS Nationals.
 
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By value, and some are no longer made:
Winchester Dynapoints, T-22, Subsonic (Aussie made white box)
Eley CMP
Wolf MT, ME, MG (NAMMO)
Geco Bolt Rifle, Semi Auto
Federal 711B, 711, UM1B, UM1
PMC Target, Sidewinder, Zapper (Korea)
RWS Subsonic HP (nickle case)
Most of this I shot like water cause I thought it would always be available in quantity. King would be the old NAMMO Wolf MT, accurate out of every gun I tested it in. Runners up would be Dynapoints, cheap ammo that was remarkable in accuracy.
 
Eley TENEX and stop shopping around. I shot 20 round strings to get ES and SD. 1st steel picture is a 10 round group at 252 yards. 2nd steel picture is a 20 round group at 252 yards( had 1 fast round)

***I win for actually providing data asked for🤣...also extra credit for providing groups while collecting said data!!!***

View attachment 7958078View attachment 7958081View attachment 7958083View attachment 7958085
That is awesome. Legit badass.
What is your setup?
 
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In my personal experience I think it really comes down to the barrel. I don't feel you have to spend big bucks for absolutely top tier ammunition at $17 a box in order to get the best numbers. This SK LRM in my new RimX Modacam Krieger 16T 23 inch, it's 20 shots and it was actually shots 30-50 first ever through the barrel. I've used it in my 12T 22 inch PVA barrel as well and the numbers were just as impressive at $9 a box.

Screenshot_20220914-162332_XFR REV2.jpg
 
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In my personal experience I think it really comes down to the barrel. I don't feel you have to spend big bucks for absolutely top tier ammunition at $17 a box in order to get the best numbers. This SK LRM in my new RimX Modacam Krieger 16T 23 inch, it's 20 shot and it was actually shots 30-50 through the barrel. I've used it in my 12T 22 inch PVA barrel as well and the numbers were just as impressive at $9 a box.

View attachment 7968213
I somewhat agree....I have a great lot of SK Long Range Match that has great numbers and results and I have some of a different lot that isn't much better than Norma TAC-22 performance ES and SD numbers.
 
I've found purchasing by label/brand to have it's hiccups. :(

Due to variations in components and changing tolerances on the assembly line,
what shot phenomenal from one box, throws strays the next, backed up by the chrony numbers.
I hear folks all the time: "ya' have to lot test to find the best cartridges"
and yet the local Benchrest competitors who do test at the Lapua and Eley facilities,
still end up with boxes that are substandard compared to the rest of the case.
It's rimfire, an 1800's design still in use (with some minor changes in technology)
that has inherent limitations we have to live with. At short range it's effective,
at extended range the problems with manufacture still cause those bullets to stray.
 
I hear folks all the time: "ya' have to lot test to find the best cartridges"
and yet the local Benchrest competitors who do test at the Lapua and Eley facilities,
still end up with boxes that are substandard compared to the rest of the case.
One of the potetial problems with testing at places such the Lapua or Eley facilities is that too few rounds may be tested before a lot is selected.

It's possible for some lots to produce results that aren't consistent, that aren't all similar to the best results obtained. Some groups may be better than others. A good lot that's consistent will produce good results group after group. The differences in consistency will be more readily apparent at 100 meters in the testing facilities. Shoot as many groups with the best candidate lots as possible.
 
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Maybe you are misinterpreting my intentions (then again maybe not). In my original post I wanted to be extremely specific about what kind of data/ideas that I was asking about. What I didn't want is a bunch of 'that blue box I got from Wal Mart functions fine in my gun' type of responses. I was hoping to narrow it down from people that have actually tested their ammo. It doesn't need to be some crazy exhaustive expose' on a particular lot of ammo, but much more specific than just 'it shoots good'.

For example if someone shoots 22LR all the time and they have a pet ammo they like and they say 'this ammo gives me on average an SD of 10' or something like that, that would be really valuable information. I want to shoot my .22LR out as far as I can get so consistency is a primary concern.

Once I can build a list of candidates I will buy a bit and test it myself. By framing the question the way I did I was hoping to get responses from people that have actually put their 22LR on a chronograph. Even if the data is somewhat rough, it's still better than no data at all.


Test anything that says match, and go from there. Nobody else can give you what your rifles like.

I keep a stockpile of eley target for 1 rifle, but the next lot of target sucked so I started buying match. It's 2-3x the cost but it's much more consistent lot to lot. I use that rifle for an indoor winter league that's shot at 50' and I can still see the difference in ammo at that little distance.

Another rifle likes sk lrm and center x. It hates eley anything. It really hates CCI or Federal bulk to the point that I don't buy it because it's a waste.

Pistol match special in my mark IV target. Because I tried it and it works, so why chase my tail?
 
One of the potetial problems with testing at places such the Lapua or Eley facilities is that too few rounds may be tested before a lot is selected.
It seems to me that several years ago people posting test facility results commonly showed 20 rounds being shot from multiple lots. And 30 and 40 of the final one or two lots. I don't see that being posted anymore.

Buying a lot on the basis of one 10 shot group is not buying lot tested ammo in my books.
 
Making and selling ammunition is all about perception.
If you think it's better quality y'er gonna expect to pay more.
If the company can get you thinking it's gonna do well because the word "match" is on the box,
you just know it's gonna be on there in big bold print, eh?
Advertising blurbs about how each batch is tested at the factory to ensure best quality
panders to rimfire aficionados sense of optimism. Where there's hope, there's profit. :D
 
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Test anything that says match, and go from there. Nobody else can give you what your rifles like.
I plan to, but that has absolutely zero relevance to what this thread was supposed to be about.

If I had seen three pages of 'yes I tested XYZ ammo and the ES was 20 and the SD was 9' then I would be happy. That was literally the only thing I was asking.

There is no room for opinion or conjecture in that kind of question. (or so I thought).

In any case I bowed out of this thread because in my opinion it went completely away from what the intention was. A thread full of hard data would have been nice.
 
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I plan to, but that has absolutely zero relevance to what this thread was supposed to be about.

If I had seen three pages of 'yes I tested XYZ ammo and the ES was 20 and the SD was 9' then I would be happy. That was literally the only thing I was asking.

There is no room for opinion or conjecture in that kind of question. (or so I thought).

In any case I bowed out of this thread because in my opinion it went completely away from what the intention was. A thread full of hard data would have been nice.
You obviously didn't see my post🤦‍♂️. Am I just wasting my time trying to help you😖
 
I plan to, but that has absolutely zero relevance to what this thread was supposed to be about.

If I had seen three pages of 'yes I tested XYZ ammo and the ES was 20 and the SD was 9' then I would be happy. That was literally the only thing I was asking.

There is no room for opinion or conjecture in that kind of question. (or so I thought).

In any case I bowed out of this thread because in my opinion it went completely away from what the intention was. A thread full of hard data would have been nice.
And I think that you missed the answers that are being provided. What you are not getting is that there is no magic answer to your question. What people who shoot a lot of.22 Match ammo are trying to tell you is that .22 rifles and barrels are very specific as to what they like and it varies not by brand and type, but by lot number, even within a brand and name.

There are never ending examples of this.

If you’ve been really reading and paying attention, you’ll notice that the common theme is to buy at least mid to high level cost ammo and your general results will be better than buying low end ammo, but that you will still need to test lots in order to find out what shoots best in your rifle and barrel.

That IS the answer you asked for, it’s just not the answer that you wanted.
 
And I think that you missed the answers that are being provided. What you are not getting is that there is no magic answer to your question. What people who shoot a lot of.22 Match ammo are trying to tell you is that .22 rifles and barrels are very specific as to what they like and out various not by brand and type, but by lot number, even within a brand and name.

There are never ending examples of this.

If you’ve been really reading and paying attention, you’ll notice that the common theme is to buy at least mid to high level cost ammo and your general results will be better than buying low end ammo, but that you will still need to test lots in order to find out what shoots best in your rifle and barrel.

That IS the answer you asked for, it’s just not the answer that you wanted.
I am not totally brand new to any of this. I specifically asked for hard data. Some people provided just that. I wasn't asking anything at all about anything else. I wanted measurable data and with that data I could pick 5 to 10 options and do my own tests.

If the responses here did not come from a chronograph then in this context I am not interested in it. That may sound harsh, but I am interested in those responses, but in a different context. In this thread I wanted hard data covering multiple brands of ammo.

In any case what's done is done. I am not crying about it, just bitching a little bit.
 
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It seems to me that several years ago people posting test facility results commonly showed 20 rounds being shot from multiple lots. And 30 and 40 of the final one or two lots. I don't see that being posted anymore.

Buying a lot on the basis of one 10 shot group is not buying lot tested ammo in my books.
Something to think about is how the rifle tested. if you are testing a RFBR rifle and they put it in a vise and lock it down it may not shoot the same as it would off a rest. if it has a tuner, are you 100% sure it is at the best setting? this could be why the 20-40 shot test for a lot.
6 years ago, was my first trip to Lapua prior to going there I did intensive testing to make sure the rifles were shooting its best. these 5 10 shot groups shot with lots I bought randomly to test were shot with a Falcon the far left was my best lot at the time the circle was 10mm in size, so I knew what to expect. now here where this helped, when the rifle was tested it was done with the barrel clamped in the vise as no jig was available the best lot did 12.14mm @50M and 18.58 @100m which was basically untuned because of how it was tested. so, it didn't beat my best lot, but I got to watch each shot as it formed that group, and I knew this lot would shoot. I bought all they had nearly 3 cases and wish they had 5 when I tested it in the same rifle as it should be shot it beat the tunnel test by 3.5mm I got an 8.636mm group and not in a tunnel.
IMO you really need to know the rifles being tested to be able to judge the test results. the same rifle 3 years later I did the same thing the tunnel results were 11.68mm @50m 10 shots off a rest. my own testing of this lot at home did a 9.22mm but for 20 shots.
FYI my current best lot I only did a 5 shot group and bought all I could find.

Lee
 

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It can't be taken as a given that one shooter's chronograph data remains valid for other shooters.
The data obtained over the chronograph from one variety of ammo, say CX, will vary from one lot
to the next. It may also vary from one rifle to the next.


I have to agree with that one. Chronograph numbers can vary due to where the device is set up,
how it's set up, type of device, conditions, length of barrel, finish of bore and variations in cartridge assembly.
With rimfire, cartridge quality can vary batch to batch, case to case, brick to brick, box to box and shot by shot. :(

It's why my chronograph is out front whenever I'm shooting off the bench.
If I miss, high or low, the chrony numbers will tell me if it was me or the ammunition.
 
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