6.5 Creedmoor for a mile?

[Robo]

I have an opportunity to try a new range at 1760 yards this Spring but only have 6.5 Creedmoor or .308 as options right now. Assuming the .308 is a non-starter, I'm wondering if I can get my 147gr ELD to get out that far from my 26" AIAX barrel? I'm getting about 2775 fps with 41.5gr of H4350 and, even under warm, humid conditions, my calculator is telling me that I'll be going subsonic around 1500 yards. I know I can work up the load a bit more but haven't tried that yet. It appears that even if I can push it to 2900 fps, I'll hit transonic speed at around 1650. I'm open to other bullets or powders, along with other suggestions as to whether I can get this caliber out that far with reasonable accuracy. Thanks.

 

[hognuts]

Reasonably, no. But it can be done.

I've seen impacts at that distance and further. In our Sin City match before SHOT a few years ago we had a mile target. Guy went 3/3 in a match, at that distance. It was a standard tactical precision rifle. I don't remember caliber for certain, but I think it was a 6.5.

Spotting misses can be a bitch with the little B.B. Guns at that kind of range.

 

[Milo 2.5]

https://youtu.be/8fg0rwT4LPY

 

[jbailey]

Assuming the .308 is a non-starter...

what is the set up of your 308?

Read my report here for what a 308 can do at well past a mile:
https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...-198gr-flatlines-elr-in-mt-results-from-field

 

[JSTARSZ]

I think it has to do with what your density altitude is. I have successfully hit 1350 yards with hits (50% of the time) and attempted 1450 (still 0% at that one). My DA for shooting is between 1500-2100ft and the 142 Sierra goes transonic around 1500 so I am right on the edge. At my DA I don't think I have the gas for it unless I hot-rod it.

 

[Robo]

what is the set up of your 308?

Read my report here for what a 308 can do at well past a mile:
https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...-198gr-flatlines-elr-in-mt-results-from-field

I've got an AIAX MC short action that I swap out 6.5 and 308 barrels on. My 308 is a Bartlein 1:10 20 inch so not sure what you were able to do with Josh is possible for me. since I would only be going up to that mile range 1-2 times a year, so not really looking for a custom solution. Very impressive results you had though.

 

[Robo]

I think it has to do with what your density altitude is. I have successfully hit 1350 yards with hits (50% of the time) and attempted 1450 (still 0% at that one). My DA for shooting is between 1500-2100ft and the 142 Sierra goes transonic around 1500 so I am right on the edge. At my DA I don't think I have the gas for it unless I hot-rod it.

I've successfully shot out to 1400 with my 6.5 but that was still before it hit transonic. That was in upstate NY on a humid summer afternoon and don't recall what the DA was.

 

[Robo]

https://youtu.be/8fg0rwT4LPY

Very nice shooting. Looks like you were using 140gr Berger. What muzzle velocity were you getting with that load?

 

[Milo 2.5]

Very nice shooting. Looks like you were using 140gr Berger. What muzzle velocity were you getting with that load?

LMAO, not me, some dude in Australia. He said 140 hybrid. My experience with the 6.5- 140 hybrid, and 7mm- 180 hybrid have not been what his vid showed, to me they have not transitioned well.

 

[ballisticdaddy]

I have taken my 6.5CM with 24" barrel out to a mile with about 60% hit ratio. The cartridge is more than capable of reaching that distance the only downside is any wind will wreak havoc on the 140 class bullets. On a calm day you will have better luck!

 

[kthomas]

Give it a shot - I bet you will be surprised at how stable the bullets will be out to that distance.

 

[A5scott]

It's doable. like other's have said, wind and spotting misses can make it challenging, assuming your ammo is good. You might try the Warner-Tool flatline bullets. Working your way out and verifying drops out to 1 mile will help track your trajectory

Scott

 

[Robo]

LMAO, not me, some dude in Australia. He said 140 hybrid. My experience with the 6.5- 140 hybrid, and 7mm- 180 hybrid have not been what his vid showed, to me they have not transitioned well.

I thought you might be that dude from Australia......LOL.

 

[Robo]

I have taken my 6.5CM with 24" barrel out to a mile with about 60% hit ratio. The cartridge is more than capable of reaching that distance the only downside is any wind will wreak havoc on the 140 class bullets. On a calm day you will have better luck!

Yeah, I think it's worth a "shot", too. I might play around with my load a bit to try to get a bit more velocity out of my 147gr ELDs. Plenty of time to practice as long as I don't push it too hard and have my accuracy affected.

What were using as a load for your 140 class rounds?

 

[Dan Warner]

Flatline 121g 6.5 is supersonic to 1900 yards in a Creedmoor. Just sayin...

 

[Lowlight]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Hu_1vIyJ4OE" frameborder="0" gesture="media" allow="encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Robo]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Hu_1vIyJ4OE" frameborder="0" gesture="media" allow="encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Very interesting, Frank. I'll definitely have to look into these. Thx.

 

[Robo]

Flatline 121g 6.5 is supersonic to 1900 yards in a Creedmoor. Just sayin...

Impressive results. Do you have data sheets for this bullet for a 26" AI barrel using Lapua small primer brass? Thx.

 

[ballisticdaddy]

Yeah, I think it's worth a "shot", too. I might play around with my load a bit to try to get a bit more velocity out of my 147gr ELDs. Plenty of time to practice as long as I don't push it too hard and have my accuracy affected.

What were using as a load for your 140 class rounds?

Lapua brass (large primer) Berger 140 hybrid (.010 jump), H4350 42.2 grains, moving about 2,780 fps @ muzzle

 

[Dan Warner]

Starting load data sheets can be found in our newly created load data library

 

[Dan Warner]

The 26" 6.5 Creedmoor is in the list, but if you are looking for a combination that isn't, we are happy to generate a chart for you.

 

[Conrad]

The Flatline bullets are probably best bet, but Reloder-26 will make the most of your 26” barrel and can push 147 ELDMs over 2900. It can spike a little bit over 85 degrees but if you find sweet spot ES can be very good. My variation in limited sampling from 40-75 degrees was basically nothing.

 

[Robo]

The 26" 6.5 Creedmoor is in the list, but if you are looking for a combination that isn't, we are happy to generate a chart for you.

Thanks. I was assuming that info on there was for 6.5 Creedmoor using Hornady brass. Lapua brass gives different results in my loads with the current projectiles I'm using but probably close enough that I can start with a slightly lower load and work it up.

 

[Dan Warner]

I can do you one better, if you can wait until tomorrow. Since there are so many mfg's of Creedmoor brass, it is near impossible to keep up with the varying capacities. If you send us an email ([email protected]), and include the capacity of your case(s) in H2O wight in grain, I can customize the chart for your specs. At that point, its probably a good idea for me to add the other capacity cases to the library.

 

[Robo]

I can do you one better, if you can wait until tomorrow. Since there are so many mfg's of Creedmoor brass, it is near impossible to keep up with the varying capacities. If you send us an email ([email protected]), and include the capacity of your case(s) in H2O wight in grain, I can customize the chart for your specs. At that point, its probably a good idea for me to add the other capacity cases to the library.

Excellent. I'll be in touch later this week. Merry Christmas to you! Thx.

 

[jb1023]

I can do you one better, if you can wait until tomorrow. Since there are so many mfg's of Creedmoor brass, it is near impossible to keep up with the varying capacities. If you send us an email ([email protected]), and include the capacity of your case(s) in H2O wight in grain, I can customize the chart for your specs. At that point, its probably a good idea for me to add the other capacity cases to the library.

Would love to see that too. I weighed/measured 5 virgin 6.5CM Lapua cases and have a H2O of 51.53. I also weighed/measured 5 virgin 6.5CM ADG cases and those have a H2O of 50.53gr.

 

[Danco411]

I am going to try it next spring too with my Kelbly's/AIAX .260. My current load is pushing 2840FPS with the Hornady 147 ELD-M. Ballistic AE is saying I go transonic at 1700 yards with elevation at 19 mils. Should be fun!

 

[Robo]

Would love to see that too. I weighed/measured 5 virgin 6.5CM Lapua cases and have a H2O of 51.53. I also weighed/measured 5 virgin 6.5CM ADG cases and those have a H2O of 50.53gr. [/QUO

Dan sent me info for my once-fired, resized Lapua small primer 6.5 brass that I tested as having 51.94gr of average H20 capacity and think he'll probably be posting it on their website soon

 

[Dan Warner]

So in light of all the variation, I will sample the various mfg's of the Creedmoor brass and publish a chart based on the capacities. There will not be a great deal of variation in the charts, as they are all starting loads. That means that they are backed off enough so that variation you might see from the chart could be attributed to other factors as well. But yes, 50.5gr is going to be quite different from 53.5gr.

 

[Hondo1]

I have taken mine out to a mile on multiple occasions using the 140 eld-m’s. I can definitely be done.

 

[lrshtr]

last fall we were pushing guys to 1600 yards no problem with 6.5cm. We ran out of light while the winds were calm to reach 1760 though. The next day, the winds were gusting to 35 and we could not get anyone on past 1600. The 1600 yard shots were no problem though. That was with a stock RPR, Gen2 Razor and factory hornady 143gn ELDx. The shooters went 6 for 6 at 1600 once we got them on elevation on 24x24" steel. 1760 would have made it if we had better wind that day. This next spring in our next ELR class we will try again and hopefully the wind will cooperate!

 

[Robo]

last fall we were pushing guys to 1600 yards no problem with 6.5cm. We ran out of light while the winds were calm to reach 1760 though. The next day, the winds were gusting to 35 and we could not get anyone on past 1600. The 1600 yard shots were no problem though. That was with a stock RPR, Gen2 Razor and factory hornady 143gn ELDx. The shooters went 6 for 6 at 1600 once we got them on elevation on 24x24" steel. 1760 would have made it if we had better wind that day. This next spring in our next ELR class we will try again and hopefully the wind will cooperate!

Thanks. Do you recall what kind of velocity they were getting out of the 143s? Assume they were going subsonic past 1600.

 

[Casamike]

I was with a friend last summer and he hit at a mile with his 6.5, He runs a Nosler 140 RDF over 41.7gr of H4350. I will admit though that on that day, the conditions were totally perfect, 75-80degrees, with wind less than 3mph and we were in Montana at roughly 8000 ft elevation. I plan to attempt it myself this coming spring, best of luck to you!

 

[Robo]

I was with a friend last summer and he hit at a mile with his 6.5, He runs a Nosler 140 RDF over 41.7gr of H4350. I will admit though that on that day, the conditions were totally perfect, 75-80degrees, with wind less than 3mph and we were in Montana at roughly 8000 ft elevation. I plan to attempt it myself this coming spring, best of luck to you!

I'm going to work up a slightly hotter load for my 147gr ELD to see if I can get it closer to 2900 fps before getting any pressure signs and not losing accuracy. I'm at 2775 with 41.5 gr of H4350 with Lapua brass in my 26" AI barrel, so will see how it goes once I work on it. The goal is to stay supersonic to at least 1600. Time will tell but others seem to have pushed this caliber out to a mile with some success.

 

[lrshtr]

Thanks. Do you recall what kind of velocity they were getting out of the 143s? Assume they were going subsonic past 1600.

yes, it was subsonic. 4DOF has the velocity just under 1000 fps at 1600. I cant remember what DA we were at (prob around 1500). The 143's were about 2725-2750 fps on the magnetospeed.

 

[Robo]

yes, it was subsonic. 4DOF has the velocity just under 1000 fps at 1600. I cant remember what DA we were at (prob around 1500). The 143's were about 2725-2750 fps on the magnetospeed.

That's just under what I'm getting out of my 147 ELD-M now so at least I'm in the ballpark for stretching it out. Thx.

 

[jaybigboy34]

Impressive results. Do you have data sheets for this bullet for a 26" AI barrel using Lapua small primer brass? Thx.

I've got the same setup as you and I have went out to 2150 yards with the 140 berger hybrids. I had 2 hits in 9 shots. A mile on a calm day is very doable if you have your dope spot on.

 

[Tjfarmer]

What’s your DA, the world is different where I’m from at 600ft. Really changes things.

 

[jaybigboy34]

What’s your DA, the world is different where I’m from at 600ft. Really changes things.

I am 1850 above sea level

 

[natdscott]

I'll be attempting it.

Something along the lines of a 7.5 Bartlein 30" and one of Dan and Alan's 121. I'm starting with SR Peterson brass, and I'll put it on some tooling to see if/what it needs.

We'll see.

-Nate

 

[Robo]

I'll be attempting it.

Something along the lines of a 7.5 Bartlein 30" and one of Dan and Alan's 121. I'm starting with SR Peterson brass, and I'll put it on some tooling to see if/what it needs.

We'll see.

-Nate

What's your experience so far with Peterson SR brass? I've read some good reports but haven't tried it yet?

 

[natdscott]

Actually zero. I'm on the list for 500 count here in the next week or so.

I'll be honest...I see their process, I spoke to them several times, they're taking great pains (e.g. 3 draw brass) to provide excellency, they are providing innovative optionsn and they are a startup American company with young people working hard to make something that matters.

Here.

I'll be damned if I won't try to support that.

Reports are very good, and as soon as I get them, I'll put them on some tooling and see what I can see. If I have to turn some, then so be it.

 

[Robo]

Actually zero. I'm on the list for 500 count here in the next week or so.

I'll be honest...I see their process, I spoke to them several times, they're taking great pains (e.g. 3 draw brass) to provide excellency, they are providing innovative optionsn and they are a startup American company with young people working hard to make something that matters.

Here.

I'll be damned if I won't try to support that.

Reports are very good, and as soon as I get them, I'll put them on some tooling and see what I can see. If I have to turn some, then so be it.

I agree that what they're starting to do sounds impressive. I'll be interested to hear what you think once you try them out. I'll probably be picking some up in the near future too and do some comparison against my Lapua loads.

 

[sifer0425]

I'm going to work up a slightly hotter load for my 147gr ELD to see if I can get it closer to 2900 fps before getting any pressure signs and not losing accuracy. I'm at 2775 with 41.5 gr of H4350 with Lapua brass in my 26" AI barrel, so will see how it goes once I work on it. The goal is to stay supersonic to at least 1600. Time will tell but others seem to have pushed this caliber out to a mile with some success.

iam doing 2789 with 40.8gr of h4350 on a 140gr hornady bthp at .010 of the lands right now

 

[bfoosh006]

What altitude is your range at ?

I was surprised my 6.5CM would shoot the mile.... pretty darned well, at 5,320 elevation. Arid and no wind in the AM.

 

[Biscuits]

Bump for this with a related question

I just bought and sighted in a Tikka T3x TAC A1 in 6.5 CM with a 24 inch barrel.

I've chromo'd factory Hornady 147gr ELD Match and it is coming out at 2610fps. This seems less than what I was expecting. Temperature about 18C and sea level.

Plugging it into the Hornady standard calculator gives 1400 metres of supersonic range and plugging it into the 4DOF calculator gives 1200 metres of supersonic range.

Anyone using the 147gr as factory ammo, what are you getting for muzzle velocity and range?

I've only bought a box of the 147gr, but I have a long range day coming up. Should I be looking at using 147gr ELD Match on that day, or some other factory ammo? 140gr ELD Match is also available.

 

[phlegethon]

Bump for this with a related question

I just bought and sighted in a Tikka T3x TAC A1 in 6.5 CM with a 24 inch barrel.

I've chromo'd factory Hornady 147gr ELD Match and it is coming out at 2610fps. This seems less than what I was expecting. Temperature about 18C and sea level.

Plugging it into the Hornady standard calculator gives 1400 metres of supersonic range and plugging it into the 4DOF calculator gives 1200 metres of supersonic range.

Anyone using the 147gr as factory ammo, what are you getting for muzzle velocity and range?

I've only bought a box of the 147gr, but I have a long range day coming up. Should I be looking at using 147gr ELD Match on that day, or some other factory ammo? 140gr ELD Match is also available.

Tikkas have slow barrels. You should be OK. Most cartridges are not supersonic at a mile. Most modern bullets do fairly well with the transition.

 

[Steel head]

In the past I found the 147’s did better than the 140’s at distance but that was a while ago and before I started having Hornady issues.

That speed is pretty good for a tikka

 

[Slides]

You may find it speeds up a touch with higher round count too.

 

[Klay23]

Going to attempt this as well.
MPa BA with 24” barrel. Working on loads now. I have a handful of bullets to attempt this with and plenty of time. Berger VLD’s and LrHT’s. Where should I start and what kind of FPS should I be trying to achieve to make the mile shot? At Coleman Creek training center at about 500ft elevation I believe