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6.5 Grendel
- Thread starter padom
- Start date
Looks like I'm going first.
20" Odin Works 1/8" twist barrel
CCI 450 primer
Hornady brass
28.8grs XBR8208
123gr Hornady SST
2582fps 2.1 SD
Sub .5 MoA
20" Odin Works 1/8" twist barrel
CCI 450 primer
Hornady brass
28.8grs XBR8208
123gr Hornady SST
2582fps 2.1 SD
Sub .5 MoA
123 Nosler CC/Sierra HPBT/Scenars, 120 Scenar L
31.5-31.7 CFE, CCI 41/RP 7 1/2
2.26-2.285, depending on distance to lands and variable magazine length and feeding reliability.
2525 in 18” Lilja or JP, 2550-2575 in 20” Bartlein, 2650-2675 in 24” Satern.
All quite accurate and generally low ES/SD, depending on brass and brass prep. Very forgiving to load for.
31.5-31.7 CFE, CCI 41/RP 7 1/2
2.26-2.285, depending on distance to lands and variable magazine length and feeding reliability.
2525 in 18” Lilja or JP, 2550-2575 in 20” Bartlein, 2650-2675 in 24” Satern.
All quite accurate and generally low ES/SD, depending on brass and brass prep. Very forgiving to load for.
Bullet: 123 gr Scenar
Powder: 28.0 gr of AR-COMP:
Brass: 1x-fired Lapua
Shoulder: 1.215" (fired expands to 1.219")
CBTO: 1.714"
Neck: .288 Bushing
Primer: CCI 450
Velo through 18" Larue barrel: 2492 FPS
SD: 2.6
Powder: 28.0 gr of AR-COMP:
Brass: 1x-fired Lapua
Shoulder: 1.215" (fired expands to 1.219")
CBTO: 1.714"
Neck: .288 Bushing
Primer: CCI 450
Velo through 18" Larue barrel: 2492 FPS
SD: 2.6
Damn that load seems a bit over the max to me. Are you seeing any pressure signs? I have loaded XBR in 3 grendel barrels now and at 28.5 grains I started seeing serious pressure.
BDog
Great numbers, but would agree that load is about .3gr above what is generally considered max over on Grendel forum. Betting brass and primer pockets don’’t hold for long either. Of course, everyone’s barrel and chamber are different. To those unfamiliar with Grendel, certainly wouldn’’t recommend that as a starting load, and suggest slow work up from 28.0, paying attention to distance to lands along the way.
Great numbers, but would agree that load is about .3gr above what is generally considered max over on Grendel forum. Betting brass and primer pockets don’’t hold for long either. Of course, everyone’s barrel and chamber are different. To those unfamiliar with Grendel, certainly wouldn’’t recommend that as a starting load, and suggest slow work up from 28.0, paying attention to distance to lands along the way.
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My go to load is 26.8 grains Ar-Comp in Lapua brass under a 123 Scenar or ELD seated 2.245-2.250.
16" Ballistic advantage light weight mid-length gas= 2363 SD-5 ES-13
5 at 500
[IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/i.imgur.com\/bLJ4Zdp.jpg"}[/IMG2]
18" JP light contour rifle gas= 2440 SD-5 ES-17
[IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/i.imgur.com\/s5UfuOU.jpg"}[/IMG2]
20" Precision Rifles (bartlien barrel) rifle gas = 2460ish and the SD/ES were good but I'm unable to find my notes right now.
[IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/i.imgur.com\/q8CcBiH.jpg"}[/IMG2]
16" Ballistic advantage light weight mid-length gas= 2363 SD-5 ES-13
5 at 500
[IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/i.imgur.com\/bLJ4Zdp.jpg"}[/IMG2]
18" JP light contour rifle gas= 2440 SD-5 ES-17
[IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/i.imgur.com\/s5UfuOU.jpg"}[/IMG2]
20" Precision Rifles (bartlien barrel) rifle gas = 2460ish and the SD/ES were good but I'm unable to find my notes right now.
[IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/i.imgur.com\/q8CcBiH.jpg"}[/IMG2]
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No case head deformation. Primers are slightly flattened, still rounded on the edges. I've seen a handful or so of loads at the same charge as mine give or take a bit, posted on various forums. So I didn't think anything of it. I have no idea what max "book" pressure is. I start low and work up till I find a good accurate load that the rifle likes.
Not worried about brass life. My buddy shoots this round in factory Hornady and gives me his brass. I already have about 800 pieces between what I bought and what he gives me. Plus I'm just not seeing any signs that these rounds are over-pressured. Every rifle is different.
I haven't had any issues with it. I haven't tried running it with my can though.
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While i suspect not many will play with 100 grain Amax, I have a box and decided to burn some imr8208 today in my 18" JP barrel.
POI and velocity, there definitely appears to be a node at 30.0 grains and possibly a step or two above where I stopped at, 30.8
If you can't see the velocity readings they are as follows:
30.0= 2712 SD-3 ES-7
30.2= 2733 5/10
30.4= 2742 9/19
30.6= 2775 14/26
30.8= 2782 15/28
If OCW theory holds, +3% of 30.0 = 30.9 so next time out I may try 31 grains, but given the numbers and group at 30.0... thats very tempting to remain there.
POI and velocity, there definitely appears to be a node at 30.0 grains and possibly a step or two above where I stopped at, 30.8
If you can't see the velocity readings they are as follows:
30.0= 2712 SD-3 ES-7
30.2= 2733 5/10
30.4= 2742 9/19
30.6= 2775 14/26
30.8= 2782 15/28
If OCW theory holds, +3% of 30.0 = 30.9 so next time out I may try 31 grains, but given the numbers and group at 30.0... thats very tempting to remain there.
what's your COAL roughly? And what is your max COAL with say a 123 Amax or 123 ELDM touching the lands?
edit:
I see st the top of your target it says 2.245 COAL...How far off the lands are you?
Padom, I seat all my bullets between 2.245-2.250
I am not sure how far the 100 A-max is from the lands, I just loaded them to what was printed in the hornady manual, 2.245-2.250. The 123 ELD is jumping about .030" and the Lapua Scenar 123 is jumping about .060".
20" Proof Research carbon fiber barrel
Hornady once fired brass
CCI #41 primer
123gr Lapua Scenar loaded to 2.260 COAL (1.721 off Hornady ogive gauge)
27.6gr AR COMP
2485-fps ES:10 SD: 4.5 over 10 shots
10 shot groups are around .6 consistently for me at 100 yards.
Hornady once fired brass
CCI #41 primer
123gr Lapua Scenar loaded to 2.260 COAL (1.721 off Hornady ogive gauge)
27.6gr AR COMP
2485-fps ES:10 SD: 4.5 over 10 shots
10 shot groups are around .6 consistently for me at 100 yards.
This just arrived...
Velocity testing 107 loaded to 2.258, this leaves them jumping .097" in my JP's chamber. 18" barrel, rifle gas.
will punch some paper next.
Velocity testing 107 loaded to 2.258, this leaves them jumping .097" in my JP's chamber. 18" barrel, rifle gas.
will punch some paper next.
This just arrived...
Velocity testing 107 loaded to 2.258, this leaves them jumping .097" in my JP's chamber. 18" barrel, rifle gas.
will punch some paper next.
Have you had an opportunity to target test these loads? I'm very interested in the 6.5G and this bullet in particular.
~J
Okay but not great. Dots are 1"... going to explore some slightly lower charges and 28.6 next. If that doesn't tighten things up I'll try 8208.
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My load is: 30.7gr CFE223, 123Amax/Eld, Hornady brass, 2.245 COL, Rem 7 1/2 primer. 2550fps from 24" barrel. 1/2"-3/4" @100yd
I'll check my records when I get home. I worked up a load with 8208 as well. I'll let you know what it was. I found I got better velocity and accuracy in my rifle with the CFE223.
Found my records. 28.0 8208XBR, hornady case, rem 7 1/2, 2.245 col. 2581fps w/24" barrel. 123amax
This is my daat from this weekend. Still have to decide on the load 6-7 looks like a good start point
24" 1:8
Tac
107 smk 1.56
12 2690 30
11 2653 29.7
10 2644 29.4
9 2616 29.1
8 2602 28.8
7 2546 28.5
6 2545 28.2
5 2526 27.9
4 2483 27.6
3 2437 27.3
2 2394 27
1 2373 26.7
24" 1:8
Tac
107 smk 1.56
12 2690 30
11 2653 29.7
10 2644 29.4
9 2616 29.1
8 2602 28.8
7 2546 28.5
6 2545 28.2
5 2526 27.9
4 2483 27.6
3 2437 27.3
2 2394 27
1 2373 26.7
Where’s node in terms of point of impact for loads? One round sample or multiple round average? Consistent poi for a multiple of loads a better indicator of node than two loads with similar velocity. Interested in your further results.
Single round of different charges fired overy a magnetospeed sporter. I need to make up a load again to get POI but the nodes are points where the velocity, in this case, has little or no variation from one round to the next
The 6-7 node seems to be my low node but not 100% sure
Finally got to chrono some loads that I’ve been more focused on accuracy than speed. Worked up in 20” very short throated Satern, but had to test in equally short throated 24” Satern.
123 Sierra BTHP 27.2 AR Comp CCI41 2.23 OAL
2530/16ES/5.7SD
129 Nosler ABLR 30.2 CFE 223 CCI41 2.285 OAL
2500/17ES/9.8SD. Only had three rounds to test.
123 Sierra BTHP 27.2 AR Comp CCI41 2.23 OAL
2530/16ES/5.7SD
129 Nosler ABLR 30.2 CFE 223 CCI41 2.285 OAL
2500/17ES/9.8SD. Only had three rounds to test.
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Built two 6.5 Grendel's on AR-15 platform
18" Christensen Carbon Fiber barrels
123 ELD
CCI 450
XBR 8208 27.8gr
2.250" OAL
18" Christensen Carbon Fiber barrels
123 ELD
CCI 450
XBR 8208 27.8gr
2.250" OAL
Hunting loads I have for my 20" Howa 1500 SA
129 Hornady Interlock
24.8 G 8208XBR
Hornady 1x Fired Brass
CCI 450s
2205 FPS ( expands out to 215 yds and could push it faster with XBR but the grouping is insane)
Grp size is ludicrous at 0.22 MOA (4 different shooters all shooting 3 shot groups)
123 Hornady SST
28.1 AR Comp
Hornady 1xFired Brass
S&B Small Rifle Primers
2540 FPS
0.75 MOA
Not worried about SD/ES with hunting loads since they wont be used past 200 yds.
129 Hornady Interlock
24.8 G 8208XBR
Hornady 1x Fired Brass
CCI 450s
2205 FPS ( expands out to 215 yds and could push it faster with XBR but the grouping is insane)
Grp size is ludicrous at 0.22 MOA (4 different shooters all shooting 3 shot groups)
123 Hornady SST
28.1 AR Comp
Hornady 1xFired Brass
S&B Small Rifle Primers
2540 FPS
0.75 MOA
Not worried about SD/ES with hunting loads since they wont be used past 200 yds.
I’m hoping mine does too.
20” Grendel forum group buy barrel
130gr ELDM
Lapua brass
CCI #41
26.7-27.0gr AR Comp 2395-2403fps.
Will be testing the above node for groups this weekend. Showed zero pressure signs during velocity testing.
26.7 AR Comp, 123 Amax/SST, 2510fps, crappy Hornady brass.
3/4moa w/1.5-6X USO, 18” midlength Specialized Dynamics.
3/4moa w/1.5-6X USO, 18” midlength Specialized Dynamics.
20" BCA upper that shoots incredibly well.
Starline brass
CCI SRM
130grn Nosler RDF or 129grn Hornady SST
26.5 grn of H4895
Set to maximum magazine length
Very accurate but "slow" ~2375fps
Same upper
Starline brass
CCI SRM
130grn Nosler RDF or 129grn Hornady SST
26.9 grn AR Comp
Set to maximum magazine length
Very accurate ~2450fps
I haven't measured yet but I'm pretty sure I have a "long" jump to lands
Starline brass
CCI SRM
130grn Nosler RDF or 129grn Hornady SST
26.5 grn of H4895
Set to maximum magazine length
Very accurate but "slow" ~2375fps
Same upper
Starline brass
CCI SRM
130grn Nosler RDF or 129grn Hornady SST
26.9 grn AR Comp
Set to maximum magazine length
Very accurate ~2450fps
I haven't measured yet but I'm pretty sure I have a "long" jump to lands
What is the COAL on your load? I'm having to seat mine shorter than I expected, so I'm curious what others using the 120 eldm are getting.
I am at Max on the OAL, about 2.260, that is about all your going to get in an AR platform unless your single loading.
I'm shorter than that. 2.215 just barely sticks in the chamber. A light tap to get the cartridge out. I think it's right at the lands.
Very unusual, I have several AR's and none of them will touch the lands at magazine length. Have you heard of any other people with this problem? Does this mean factory ammo will not fit in the chamber?
Just ran another ladder with tac
Same gun same OAL but different chronograph and added the suppressor. Gas off.
28 2578
28.3 2560
28.6 2620
28.9 2636
29.2 2648
29.5 2694
29.8 2714
30.1 2730
30.4 2754
30.7 2779
31 2792
31.3 2820
31.6 2849
31.9 2872
32.2 2874
Comparing the two ladders the nodes aren't in the same spot. Any ideas?
Same gun same OAL but different chronograph and added the suppressor. Gas off.
28 2578
28.3 2560
28.6 2620
28.9 2636
29.2 2648
29.5 2694
29.8 2714
30.1 2730
30.4 2754
30.7 2779
31 2792
31.3 2820
31.6 2849
31.9 2872
32.2 2874
Comparing the two ladders the nodes aren't in the same spot. Any ideas?
Suppressor. Are you seeing pressure signs at top end? Primers flat? That’s pretty stiff load at top end.
It doesn't happen with factory ammo. I've tried 120 Fusion, 130 gold medal, Hornady 123 eldm, 123 SST, and 123 amax. All fall freely from the chamber. I loaded a dummy round with 123 eldm and it falls freely at 2.245 oal. I haven't found very many others loading 120 eldm. So thanks for the extra info.
Measure base to ogive for 120 ELD vs any of the others-think you’ll find 120 has very different ogival shape, and therefore different loaded OAL requirement. If you don’t have a Hornady OAL tool, it’s a worthy investment for your bench. I have a similar issue when using 120 Scenar L vs 123 Scenar. 120 very tangent ogive, 123 Secant ogive-tangent requires shorter loaded OAL.
You are right. I have the OAL tool. The 120 eldm measures 1.200 oal and 0.671 bto. The 123 measures 1.230 oal and 0.655 bto. If both were seated to the same COAL, the ogive on the 120 would be ~45 thousandths closer to the bullet tip. So the 120 needs to be seated 0.045 deeper. Which matches my results exactly.
It's nice when dimensions line up. Thanks for the help. I'll load the 120s at 2.200 and see what happens.
31.4 CFE with almost every 123 will get you 2525-2550 in a 20” barrel. My Satern and Bartlein say so, haven’t chrono’d Wilson Combat yet, but betting so.
Sorry for the late reply I never got the notification and not on much.
No pressure signs that I can see. Primers are good, ejection is moot as the gas is off, no extractor or ejector Mark's. Not even scratches on the case body from swelling too much like I get with my .260
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