6.5 SAUM Questions

[PowerstrokeOBX]

So after chatting to a couple fellows in the shoutbox the 6.5 SAUM has me really intrigued. From what I have heard guys are slinging 140 VLDs at 3100 with ESTIMATED barrel life in 2-3k, which is acceptable for me. Question is, is the same load that slings 140s at 3100 providing the barrel life? Or are you guys down loading slower then hot rodding it for hunting or matches?

Also can it be loaded in LA? Any advantages to loading it in a SA?

And any special brass prep on 1x fired cases? Was looking to get CopperCreek to load a couple hundred rounds for me then I was going to load it the second time(unless it was a pain then I would get them to do it again).

It sounds like a decent wind bucking low recoil(relative term) magnum.

 

[TannerGun]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

It seems like you'd want a "medium" length action for this cart. Clearly, George is the man and is probably putting his in the same length box that the Non-Typical uses (I think he's chambering the 6.5 SAUM in a new model rifle).

Something like a Model 70 WSM action, or a Kimber 8400 WSM action would be excellent, because I wouldn't want to hamstring the cart with a 2.8"ish box.

I'd personally run the 130 VLD and invest in some great knives and boots

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TannerGun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It seems like you'd want a "medium" length action for this cart. Clearly, George is the man and is probably putting his in the same length box that the Non-Typical uses (I think he's chambering the 6.5 SAUM in a new model rifle).

Something like a Model 70 WSM action, or a Kimber 8400 WSM action would be excellent, because I wouldn't want to hamstring the cart with a 2.8"ish box.

<span style="font-weight: bold">I'd personally run the 130 VLD and invest in some great knives and boots

</span></div></div>

Knives are no fun, they don't shoot fire and make loud noises

. I also don't like boots when I can wear tennis shoes

.

Out of curiousity, why would you run the 130s?

 

[TannerGun]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

I meant that a 6.5 SAUM will be an awesome critter getter, and you'll need good boots and knives to go along with it

The 130 VLD is loved by a few guys that stack up more game animals every year than anybody else I know, so that's really the basis for my thinking there.

That bullet leaving at 3250-3300 is excellent.

At 600, (by my number crunchin'), the 130 VLD at 3300 beats the 140 at 3100 by over a Minute of drop, and only gives up .1 of a Minute in wind in a 10mph wind.

That being said, I think the 140 could be pushed harder than 3100... But both of those options are stellar. Ya can't lose!

 

[captain zeke]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

Wonder if this will work in a short action factory remington7saum when I get ready to re barrel it !! Wonder if the 130 vld in the 7saum case will work in a magazine ! This cartridge has got me to thinking hard for sure thanks Isaac

 

[A10XRIFLE]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

The Cartridge is awsome. The Idea was 140's at under 3100 (3080) and keeping the pressure at 55,000 PSI. Easy to do with both Retumbo and H1000. This was for all the matches where the speed limit was 3100 it made perfect sence. After messing with the cartridge for over a year and 3000+ loads I saw the excelence of the cartridge as a Big Game Laser. the pointed 130's at 3250 are still pretty low pressure and are. 5.8 mills to 1000 yards. We are debuting an Xtreme Hunter Rifle at the Shot show thats under 8 pounds and has every feature a rifle needs. This we were shooting for as the one and only rifle needed for everything on all fours in North America.

As far as Mag length our mags for the Saum are 2.950 OAL and the top loader version is a 3.015 OAL in the Templar Hunter. its still a true short action caliber and I see no need for a long action or medium length for this cartridge.

 

[bward]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

How many barrels did you go through over the 3000 rounds?

 

[VKC]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

Holy cow that's a smoking fast round.

 

[jcann]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Cartridge is awsome. The Idea was 140's at under 3100 (3080) and keeping the pressure at 55,000 PSI. Easy to do with both Retumbo and H1000. This was for all the matches where the speed limit was 3100 it made perfect sence. After messing with the cartridge for over a year and 3000+ loads I saw the excelence of the cartridge as a Big Game Laser. the pointed 130's at 3250 are still pretty low pressure and are. 5.8 mills to 1000 yards. We are debuting an Xtreme Hunter Rifle at the Shot show thats under 8 pounds and has every feature a rifle needs. This we were shooting for as the one and only rifle needed for everything on all fours in North America.

As far as Mag length our mags for the Saum are 2.950 OAL and the top loader version is a 3.015 OAL in the Templar Hunter. its still a true short action caliber and I see no need for a long action or medium length for this cartridge. </div></div>

Are we looking at barrel life here George because a 7wsm or 7/300 shooting 168gr vld at 3150fps pretty much out performs the 6.5 at 3250fps in all categories as a hunting round in my opinion. I dont know what the pressure would be though. As far as any four legg animal in North America that may be a streach. I'll take mass over velocity when talking terminal ballistics. The 6.5saum is interesting but your limited on the heavy weight bullets if you want to go after the larger hoofed species or those that can bite.

Just my $0.02

 

[Trevor300wsm]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

One thing to also keep in mind is you can get the 140 VLD's in 7mm and run them similar without going to 6.5mm (if you wanted to keep your 7mm for more versatility). The 7SAUM with the 140 VLD's can produce these speeds easily, but as for pressure, I have no clue on that.

 

[T J]

Re: 6.5 SAUM Questions

I think the 6.5SAUM would be a fantastic cartridge. Sometimes I wonder if I shouldn't have done that instead of the 6.5WSM that i'm rockin now. But I set mine up as a hunting rig, 15lbs of 4 legged ass whoopin

The SAUM is going to be more efficient than the WSM & with the neck dimensions, should last notably longer in the throat. Speaking Pure HorsePower, the WSM will take the cake, but you would toast one in very few matches. I'm running 130 CEB's at 3400fps out of Norma cases. That is stringline flat

& a real pleasure to shoot.

I'm running singleshot on a Stiller S/A @ 3.09-something OAL. George's top loader at over 3.000" sounds like a hunter's delight, I'm definitely intrigued.

Overall, the SAUM (minus the brass availability issues) is going to be the overall winner here. The WSM will out run it, but the SAUM will run with it & last longer doing it.


t

 

[Niles Coyote]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Trevor300wsm</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One thing to also keep in mind is you can get the 140 VLD's in 7mm and run them similar without going to 6.5mm (if you wanted to keep your 7mm for more versatility). The 7SAUM with the 140 VLD's can produce these speeds easily, but as for pressure, I have no clue on that. </div></div>

But would a 7mm SAUM run a 168 vld at 3100 at 55,000 psi that’s the question as running a 140 grain doesn’t mean much if it doesn’t have the BC to go with it.
6.5mm 140 vld is .612, .618 for the 140 hybrid the 7mm 140 is .511 to get near the same BC you need the 168 in the 7mm.

 

[Huntr]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

George,
Any chance we might see some 6.5 SAUM head stamped brass? I am really interested in this round as well, but just wondering about brass (although don't spend too much time on this as I really hope to have my 260 Non-Typical ready in time for my Dall sheep hunt next August). Grin

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

How difficult is it to load for? Neck turning? Trimming?

 

[KYS]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PowerstrokeOBX</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How difficult is it to load for? Neck turning? Trimming? </div></div>

Neck turn, size down the 300 SAUM brass and load it up! Josh @ Copper Creek has some amazing loads. Let him get you started. He has recipe's for a 130gr load and 140gr load. They both are hammers. If you want to hunt..... go with his 130gr load.

Ive shot some amazing groups with a rifle by GAP and ammo by C4.

 

[KYS]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Huntr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">George,
Any chance we might see some 6.5 SAUM head stamped brass? I am really interested in this round as well, but just wondering about brass (although don't spend too much time on this as I really hope to have my 260 Non-Typical ready in time for my Dall sheep hunt next August). Grin </div></div>

I think in order to get properly head stamped brass you would have to put in an order for over 120k pieces of brass. And that's IF a company would be willing to take it on.

 

[KYS]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Niles Coyote</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Trevor300wsm</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One thing to also keep in mind is you can get the 140 VLD's in 7mm and run them similar without going to 6.5mm (if you wanted to keep your 7mm for more versatility). The 7SAUM with the 140 VLD's can produce these speeds easily, but as for pressure, I have no clue on that. </div></div>

But would a 7mm SAUM run a 168 vld at 3100 at 55,000 psi that’s the question as running a 140 grain doesn’t mean much if it doesn’t have the BC to go with it.
6.5mm 140 vld is .612, .618 for the 140 hybrid the 7mm 140 is .511 to get near the same BC you need the 168 in the 7mm.
</div></div>

You can get well over the 7mm BC if you run a 140gr Berger Hybrid and point them. You are looking at .674 on the G1 BC. This round, properly loaded, is a true hammer. I am testing new loads for it from C4 on Monday, I will report back with what I find.

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

I'm convinced. Got a 700 LA mag BF. Just need a blank.

 

[T J]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can get well over the 7mm BC if you run a 140gr Berger Hybrid and point them. You are looking at .674 on the G1 BC. This round, properly loaded, is a true hammer. I am testing new loads for it from C4 on Monday, I will report back with what I find. </div></div>


I look forward to reading your report. Rocking a .674 BC with light recoil & exceptional velocity is the stuff wet dreams are made of

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

Will 1 in 8.5 twist work at sea level for the 140s and 130s? I know 1:8 twist works fine at creedmoor/260 speeds but the saum is 300 FPS faster.

 

[KYS]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PowerstrokeOBX</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm convinced. Got a 700 LA mag BF. Just need a blank. </div></div>

Send it to GAP!

 

[KYS]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PowerstrokeOBX</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Will 1 in 8.5 twist work at sea level for the 140s and 130s? I know 1:8 twist works fine at creedmoor/260 speeds but the saum is 300 FPS faster. </div></div>

George uses a pretty specific Bartlein in 1/8.2 I believe. Would be worth it to buy from him and save yourself some headache down the road.

 

[XTREM HTR16]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

Got a 260 NonTypical ordered now, was thinking a 7WSM would be my next NT, maybe I just stick with 6.5's!

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> We are debuting an Xtreme Hunter Rifle at the Shot show thats under 8 pounds and has every feature a rifle needs. This we were shooting for as the one and only rifle needed for everything on all fours in North America.
</div></div>

I have seen it in action ! Impressive to say the least...

 

[TEAMSENDIT]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

just curious does the 6.5 saum do anything the 264 win mag doesn't other than working in a shorter action?

 

[jbailey]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
You can get well over the 7mm BC if you run a 140gr Berger Hybrid and point them. You are looking at .674 on the G1 BC. This round, properly loaded, is a true hammer. I am testing new loads for it from C4 on Monday, I will report back with what I find. </div></div>

Very interested in those results. 0.674 G1 BC on the 6.5mm 140gr Berger Hybrids would be a nearly 10% increase from the unmodified bullet. That would be considerably more than I would guess, but I don't have any idea how wide the unmodified meplat is... if its wide, that type of an increase is possible, I guess.

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TeamSendIt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just curious does the 6.5 saum do anything the 264 win mag doesn't other than working in a shorter action? </div></div>

Supposedly barrel life, but I really don't know as I have had neither. If the 264 win mag could be downloaded and still have good barrel life like the Saum Id get one over the 6.5 for factory ammo and brass.

 

[ranger1183]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TeamSendIt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just curious does the 6.5 saum do anything the 264 win mag doesn't other than working in a shorter action? </div></div>

this might help you find your answer.

http://www.accurateshooter.com/technical-articles/excel-formula-predicts-useful-barrel-life/

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ranger1183</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TeamSendIt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just curious does the 6.5 saum do anything the 264 win mag doesn't other than working in a shorter action? </div></div>

this might help you find your answer.

http://www.accurateshooter.com/technical-articles/excel-formula-predicts-useful-barrel-life/ </div></div>

Interesting table... I put in my load for 6.5 Creedmoor with 58,000psi approximately 1750-1950 rds. I wonder what his measure of barrel life is? Or accuracy standard?

 

[Jerry m]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

IMO 2-3 thousand rounds (given 140 gr 6.5 bullet at 3100 fps) is very optimistic. I got 1300 rounds out of my 6.5-06, before it started to go south. I understand case design, but that is extreme. That said don't forget the old 6.5 Remington Magnum.

Good luck

Jerry

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

Yeah that's what I was thinking.

Depends on ones accuracy standard I guess.



What charges of H1 and Retumbo you guys running? I assume its loaded light?

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

Are you guys necking down 300 brass straight to 6.5? Or 7 saum to 6.5?

 

[Gray]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Niles Coyote</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Trevor300wsm</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One thing to also keep in mind is you can get the 140 VLD's in 7mm and run them similar without going to 6.5mm (if you wanted to keep your 7mm for more versatility). The 7SAUM with the 140 VLD's can produce these speeds easily, but as for pressure, I have no clue on that. </div></div>

But would a 7mm SAUM run a 168 vld at 3100 at 55,000 psi that&#146;s the question as running a 140 grain doesn&#146;t mean much if it doesn&#146;t have the BC to go with it.
6.5mm 140 vld is .612, .618 for the 140 hybrid the 7mm 140 is .511 to get near the same BC you need the 168 in the 7mm.
</div></div>

You can get well over the 7mm BC if you run a 140gr Berger Hybrid and point them. You are looking at .674 on the G1 BC. This round, properly loaded, is a true hammer. I am testing new loads for it from C4 on Monday, I will report back with what I find. </div></div>

HaVe you tested these loads yet KY?

 

[30cal user]

Re: 6.5 SAUM thread

6.5 4S

yes the scope is a little high...but is a XRS!

Just waiting on Josh now!