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69 SMK and H4895
- Thread starter Pinecone
- Start date
For sure some ones using that combo and its got to be accurate. Im using 2520 which is the ball powder equivalent for AA2495 which is Accurate's equivalent for IMR4895 and I think thats the same or close to H4895....confused? Me too. Either way the burn rates are right next to each other on the chart and thats right for the 68-69 grain bullet.
With this chart: Burn Rate
H4895 is a good bit faster than AA2520. 2520 is next to 4064.
I have the H4895.
I have seen a couple of people running the combo, but wanted some more data points.
What I saw was 23.5 and 25.0 grains. OCW would say that 25.0 is two nodes higher than the 23.5. So those are actually consistent. Hodgdon says 24.0- 26.0 grains of H4895.
H4895 is a good bit faster than AA2520. 2520 is next to 4064.
I have the H4895.
I have seen a couple of people running the combo, but wanted some more data points.
What I saw was 23.5 and 25.0 grains. OCW would say that 25.0 is two nodes higher than the 23.5. So those are actually consistent. Hodgdon says 24.0- 26.0 grains of H4895.
25.0 H4895 has been very consistent for me in several rifles. H4895 is often overlooked for 223 but has proven to be the best powder I have tried for it in several rifles with several bullet weights.
4895 rocks with 69 grain bullets. I legged out with this load 24 grains 4895, nosler or smk (they're the same), LC brass, wolf primers. That load got me a 7th place in the Nathan Hale trophy at Perry. Don't know why more guys don't use 4895 in 223.
I have not used H4895, but I have been very impressed with IMR 4895 and 69gr SMK. I have found 24gr in a LC brass w/ Tula primer groups real nice in my 1-8" Mark12 and 24gr in Win case with Win primer groups just as well in my Savage bolt gun. I found a lower node at 23.3gr of powder in both guns as well. Both guns shoot this combination nicely as well as a 50gr V-Max with 26gr of powder. With the luck I am having, I really don't see a need to do much testing with other powders. I am sold on it.
25 gr. of H4895 behind a 69 gr. and 24.3 gr. behind a 75/77 gr. for accuracy. I use RE-15 to get more velocity, but it doesn't get as good of accuracy. Therefore, the RE-15 gets used in an AR platform and the H4895 gets used in my bolt gun or TC. Up until I started experimenting with IMR8208 XBR I pretty much used H4895 exclusively for the heavier bullets in .223. For the lighter match bullets in .223 in my bolt gun it's AA2015.
That said, an excellent long range varmint load load is 25.5 gr of H4895 behind a Honady 60 gr. V-max. The one with the boat-tail.
That said, an excellent long range varmint load load is 25.5 gr of H4895 behind a Honady 60 gr. V-max. The one with the boat-tail.
[MENTION=11748]sandwarrior[/MENTION] I just got done doing a OCW with 75's in a bolt gun and also found the node to be 24.1-24.3 with H4895. [MENTION=79345]Pinecone[/MENTION] I'll be throwing some 69's today at 25g, let you know how that turns out...
24.2 of H4895 with the Hornady 75 mag length or the Berger 75 VLD long loaded has been rediculous for me. In an AR.
in my Bolt gun, 25.0 of H4895 with the 75 Berger is scary.
in my Bolt gun, 25.0 of H4895 with the 75 Berger is scary.
I tried 24.8, 25, 25.2 with the 69smk and got ok results but not what I was looking for... 25.2 shot the best but the group shot in a string so I have more work to do with powder and seating depth. The velocity out of my 24" R700 factory 5r with 25g was 3080ishas recorded by my magnetospeed. I was also tring some berger 75vld's at 25 and 25.2 and lost a primer at 25.2 so I will be sticking around the 24.2 range which was in about 2960fps, IIRC.
Great info, it sounds like the 25.0 of H4895 with 69 SMK is good to go.
Part of this it, I don't feel that I can shoot irons well enough to do an OCW with my HBAR (A2 style).
Regardless of whether I normally shoot irons, I always do my accuracy testing and load workups with a scope. If your AR has a removeable carry handle, just get a riser mount for the top rail, or if A2 get a carry handle mount. Shoot for group size, then just remove the optic when you're done.
You can't hit what you can't see, aim small-miss small, etc etc.
I thought I had a good combo with H4895 but it turns out it was Reloader 15. Pretty warm load but was getting weak ejection from my Bushmaster Varminter with 25.0 grs.
Bullet: Sierra 69 gr. HPBT
Powder: Alliant Reloader 15 25.5 grs.
Primer: Remington 7 ½
Case: Winchester
Average Velocity: 2930 fps
Extreme Spread: 22.69
Standard Deviation: 10.04
LOAL: 2.260 (1.875 Base to Ogive with Stoney Point)
Bullet: Sierra 69 gr. HPBT
Powder: Alliant Reloader 15 25.5 grs.
Primer: Remington 7 ½
Case: Winchester
Average Velocity: 2930 fps
Extreme Spread: 22.69
Standard Deviation: 10.04
LOAL: 2.260 (1.875 Base to Ogive with Stoney Point)
What's wrong with Varget? Here's a 5 shot group from my JP 223 with 26 grns Varget and a 69 grn SMK moly coated. Oh this was shot at 200 yards.
it's like comunist russia.
I walk into all my local stores, and the shelves are either empty, or only holding shotshell powders, and oddballs. I feel lucky when I find something close to what I want. Found Varmint, in one store. Found some BLC2, in another, and a BONUS! They had some 4198. What I'm doing now , is working up loads using ANY powder I can get my hands on, that "might" work.? Why not 4064 ? I've got some put together to try, and so on.
I walk into all my local stores, and the shelves are either empty, or only holding shotshell powders, and oddballs. I feel lucky when I find something close to what I want. Found Varmint, in one store. Found some BLC2, in another, and a BONUS! They had some 4198. What I'm doing now , is working up loads using ANY powder I can get my hands on, that "might" work.? Why not 4064 ? I've got some put together to try, and so on.
I've found a tiny bit of Varget a tiny bit of I4895 and some I4198 and am doing like you are....Loading up with the bits of the powder I have on hand.....
I've been using more I4064 than anything lately as I've found it to be reasonably available. I assume that is because it isn't as popular as Varget, I4895 and a few others. This works well for me as I load .308 as well and there is actually pretty decent overlap with I4064 between those two cartridges.
Sorry for the delay. Ran back into this thread while searching for H4895 and what others were using for charge weights with 69's...
23.5 and 69smk's as well as berger 70vld's is what I found to shoot great in the R700 5r with a 24" barrel.
I am now looking at 24.4 in my 20" R700 tactical. I shot groups at 200 yards last week and ran 24-25.2g in .2 steps and 24.2 shot the best with 4 going into .4" and the 5th opening up to 1 inch, 24.8 had the best SD/ES numbers yet didn't print all that tight... I had a magnetospeed attached at the time so I plan to retest 24.4, 24.8 and 25.3 as 25.2 appeared to be tightening up. I am hoping for a load that will work equally well in both the 20" tactical and my 18" AR barrel. 24.4 put me right at 2900fps with a ES in the low forties... 24.8 was half that ES.
FWIW, I am using Wolf gold brass in this rifle (found 210 free once fired brass on the range a while back) and it holds about 1-1.5 grains more water than my lake city brass.
Coincidentally, Winchester white box (62 fmj's) with WCC head stamps are the same weight and volume as the wolf gold brass, Hmmm...
Did you ever settle on a load?
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What's wrong with Varget? Here's a 5 shot group from my JP 223 with 26 grns Varget and a 69 grn SMK moly coated. Oh this was shot at 200 yards.
Nothing wrong with Varget at all other than the supply.
As for H-4895, not one of my favorites. I've been able to make it work but it can suddenly "go over the top" pressure wise. That said, bullets and primers are now back in stock at most places. Powder is a "can't afford to be too fussy" item and I now shoot what I can get.
I just finished working up a load for my 15" AR. 23.1 was square in the low node with 70 grain Berger VLD's right at 2600 fps. Two groups to comfirm final load were .4" and .5" both had 4 shots touching out of five. Vertical is small at distance too.
I agree that it can suddenly build pressure fast. In my 5r (it has a true 223 chamber) I went from a nice load with no signs to a pierced primer while about .5 grains under Hodgdon's max suggest charge. But, I can't get the velocities this powder yields with any other temperature insensitive powder either... at least with 69 and 80 grain bullets in my stable of 223's, it gives an easy 50-100fps advantage to Varget depending on the rifle. I've tried imr8208 but could never get it to group as tight as Varget and H4895 will.
Try some Alliant PP 2000MR. I did and was very pleased. When my new barrel is finished and installed I'll be doing some serious work with it. According to Alliant it's great for .223 bullets in the 69-90gr range. A much easier powder to meter in a powder measure and you can get to Varget speeds without having to use a compressed load. Also don't have to use a drop tube just avoid the "Varget Crunch".
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H4895 will work great for heavy bullets in .223. I don't think that I ever got as hot as 25.5g, if I recall many guys were/are shooting 23.5-24g. Try rem 7 1/2 primers if you can find them.
