6BR Dies

[Cardboard Assassin]

I'm getting geared up for 6BR and need to pick up some dies.

So what are folks using for 6BR dies? To be clear I like to buy good gear first time around.

I read on 6mmBR that a good option was to send a Redding die and some fired cases to JLC Precision who will hone / tailor the die to the brass - has anyone tried this? Worth the effort?

I have a neck expander die for 6mm which I plan to use to set neck tension so would this make a difference when picking dies? From what I have read when using a neck expander most people remove the expander button from the full length die so that it undersizes (and then gets opened up to the correct size with the neck expander).

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

Actually the only options I can find are Redding and Forster, looks like my options are pretty limited.

 

[jmw]

Whidden

 

[MarshallDodge]

My rifle came with Redding dies and work fine.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

Is it true that the decapping pin needs to be smaller than normal (smaller flash hole) for 6BR?

 

[MarshallDodge]

Is it true that the decapping pin needs to be smaller than normal (smaller flash hole) for 6BR?

Yes, I believe the pin size that you want is .057. That is what came with my Redding set and works great with Lapua and Norma brass.

 

[Krob95]

i had good luck with a redding type s die for my 6BR. Had no issues loading low single digit sd ammo with it.

 

[mbeavers1]

Harrels custom die. Fire 3 pcs of brass 3x and then mail it to them. They will pick a die that matches your chamber and the cost is very reasonable.

 

[just browsing]

If you’re not averse to spending the money and/or waiting, the SAC custom dies are legit.

 

[blbennett1288]

I have used Forsters micrometer seater and full length sizer with great success.

I have not had the same success with Redding, although their CS has been top notch.

I use a 21st century expander mandrel to set neck tension

I would recommend the Mighty Armory PUA decapping die.

 

[Cynical]

Short Action Customs resizing die and their seating die, and get to loading.

 

[ghostrider272]

Using Hornady match grade dies.

 

[Wheres-Waldo]

Grafs has Wilson 6BR Norma FL Bushing dies in stock at the moment as well.
As far as a seating die... get yourself either a Redding or Forster Ultra mic die and get a chamber to fit cartridges you reload for. Much cheaper than buying a seating die for each cartridge and maintain quality equipment across all cartridges you load.

 

[just browsing]

Just FYI, a Dasher seater works great for BR and BRA... if you happen to have one laying around, might as well put it to use.

 

[hollowoutadime]

Have had good success with Redding S type bushing dies and Lapua brass. .266 bushing. Varget works well.

 

[Joel Danielson]

Harrels custom die. Fire 3 pcs of brass 3x and then mail it to them. They will pick a die that matches your chamber and the cost is very reasonable.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This if you need it soon. They have fast turn-around and make quality products.

 

[Jayhawkhuntclub]

Forster sizing and seating dies and a redding body die. Hoping Lee will make me a collet die when things calm down.

 

[Clark]

My 6mmBR reamer has a 0.272" neck and I have never had to turn brass, Rem or Lapua.
My Forster FL sizer die neck was honed out by Forster on their Sunnen to 0.265".
I use a Forster 6mmBR benchrest die.
I use a Wilson case gauge.
I have built 6mmBR on two R700 actions, one Sav99 action, and one 1903 Turkish Mauser action.

 

[Lunchbox27]

I’m using the Redding Type S set. No issues, works as it should.

 

[grizzaws]

Precision Reloading is listing Forster 6 BR seater, full-length sizer, and die sets in stock.

Shop Rifle & Shotgun Reloading Supplies | Dies | Bullets | Hulls | Wads | Powder - Precision Reloading

Shop online for shotshell and metallic reloading supplies, shooting supplies, metallic presses, rifle reloading components, shotshell reloading components, shooting accessories, rifle reloading brass and Bullets.

www.precisionreloading.com

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

Life got in the way a little recently so this got put on ice.

I've done a decent amount of reading on this and I'm leaning towards the Harrels custom die (I like the idea that they have a selection of 8 sizes and chose the one that best suits the fired brass - quick turnaround time is nice too) or the SAC die.

Orkan did a nice write up on the SAC and it looks like a million dollars but it is on the pricy end of the spectrum. The option to use a good quality neck expander at the same time is nice but it is a one size fits all type of deal which kinda gives the Carrels die an edge (as they match the die to the fired case it should size the brass the minimum amount to let it chamber with no effort).

Decisions decisions........

 

[mbeavers1]

I like the concept of the SAC and the mandrel but Im curious how it will work considering spring back. It seems you will be fighting to get neck tension right between the bushing and the mandrel, especially w new brass. I am sure SAC has solved this somehow though because they put out quality stuff.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

I like the concept of the SAC and the mandrel but Im curious how it will work considering spring back. It seems you will be fighting to get neck tension right between the bushing and the mandrel, especially w new brass. I am sure SAC has solved this somehow though because they put out quality stuff.

I cant disagree, their stuff does look quality.

I get your point but couldn't spring back be corrected by swapping to a different bushing to squeeze the brass a little more, it'll still spring back but in theory it will be sized correctly? I have never used bushing dies so I may be out to lunch here.

I intend to use mandrels either way (either as part of the SAC die or as a standalone with another die like the Harrels.

 

[kriller134]

I just ordered a set of 6bra dies from whidden. Ordered last night and they shipped out today.

 

[mbeavers1]

I cant disagree, their stuff does look quality.

I get your point but couldn't spring back be corrected by swapping to a different bushing to squeeze the brass a little more, it'll still spring back but in theory it will be sized correctly? I have never used bushing dies so I may be out to lunch here.

I intend to use mandrels either way (either as part of the SAC die or as a standalone with another die like the Harrels.

My thought is you get in a bit of a feedback loop between bushing size and mandrel size.

Seems if you plan to use a dedicated mandrel, then no reason to shell out the extra $$.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

I have used Forsters micrometer seater and full length sizer with great success.

I have not had the same success with Redding, although their CS has been top notch.

I use a 21st century expander mandrel to set neck tension

I would recommend the Mighty Armory PUA decapping die.

Thanks for the tip.

I have one coming my way.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

Harrels custom die. Fire 3 pcs of brass 3x and then mail it to them. They will pick a die that matches your chamber and the cost is very reasonable.

My understanding is that the Harrels dies are regular non bushing full length dies, assuming this is the case anyone know if it is possible to remove the expander button?

If this was possible in theory I could use the Harrels to size the case and with no button the neck would be left undersized, I could then use the expander mandrel to size the neck / open it up to the correct size.

 

[mbeavers1]

My understanding is that the Harrels dies are regular non bushing full length dies, assuming this is the case anyone know if it is possible to remove the expander button?

If this was possible in theory I could use the Harrels to size the case and with no button the neck would be left undersized, I could then use the expander mandrel to size the neck / open it up to the correct size.

The harrells die has no expander button so you must use an expander mandrel. It is a FL die with only a decapping pin.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

The harrells die has no expander button so you must use an expander mandrel. It is a FL die with only a decapping pin.

I'm thinking I will give one of these a whirl

 

[mbeavers1]

The only trick is the 3pcs of 3x fired brass.

When you break in your barrel, shoot 3 pcs of virgin brass. Then take a 6mm neck bushing (cant remember size, 268 or 269 maybe...just enough to hold bullet in) And tap it half way down the neck halfway. Deprime and reload it. Repeat once more. This gives you 3x fired brass that perfectly matches your chamber.

If you have any questions, just call them and they can explain.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

The only trick is the 3pcs of 3x fired brass.

When you break in your barrel, shoot 3 pcs of virgin brass. Then take a 6mm neck bushing (cant remember size, 268 or 269 maybe...just enough to hold bullet in) And tap it half way down the neck halfway. Deprime and reload it. Repeat once more. This gives you 3x fired brass that perfectly matches your chamber.

If you have any questions, just call them and they can explain.

I dont currently have any bushings but I can pick one up.

So if I understand correctly I dont need the die just the correct size of bushing and tap it on so it can hold a bullet again (ie neck sizing only so leaving the case untouched and firing the same brass 3 times to get the it as close as possible to the size of the chamber)?

 

[mbeavers1]

You got it.

You will need the bushing for the die anyways since they are FL bushing dies. Im running a 266 bushing with Lapua brass.

What brass you running? The BR will like lighter neck tension, like 0.0015 ish. I dont know how far down the rabbit hole you want to go but here's what you'll eventually need when you find the bottom!

21st Century Mandrels - 0.243, 0.2425, 0.242

Pin Gauges to accurately measure neck (calipers suck) - 0.2405, 0.241, 0.2415, 0.242. Buy on amazon (look up Vermont steel - see pic) . Make sure you get all go or all nogo gauges - go gauges will be slightlt smaller that size or nogo slightly larger. Not enough to matter, jusy be consistent. To use, simply mandrel brass then slide in pin that fits. Bullet OD (0.243) minus pin size is neck tension.....voila!

 

[mbeavers1]

If you want to hold out, Im gonna try out Mighty Armory's 6br die. Its a 268 neck and 242 mandrel....similar to SAC. Less steps....

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

You got it.

You will need the bushing for the die anyways since they are FL bushing dies. Im running a 266 bushing with Lapua brass.

What brass you running? The BR will like lighter neck tension, like 0.0015 ish. I dont know how far down the rabbit hole you want to go but here's what you'll eventually need when you find the bottom!

21st Century Mandrels - 0.243, 0.2425, 0.242

Pin Gauges to accurately measure neck (calipers suck) - 0.2405, 0.241, 0.2415, 0.242. Buy on amazon (look up Vermont steel - see pic) . Make sure you get all go or all nogo gauges - go gauges will be slightlt smaller that size or nogo slightly larger. Not enough to matter, jusy be consistent. To use, simply mandrel brass then slide in pin that fits. Bullet OD (0.243) minus pin size is neck tension.....voila!

Thanks for the info. I did not realize they were bushing dies. I have never used bushing dies and I read mixed reviews but it seems all high end dies are bushing type so that says something.

As I see it bushing dies should give more flexibility for setting neck tension (as brass flows & neck thickness changes swap the bushing to correct), whereas a standard die would have to be manufactured to significantly undersize when brass was new so it still had enough "range" as neck starts to thin.

I too will be running Lapua brass (have 200 new cases). I totally understand what you mean with regard to the gauges (I only heard about these for the first time recently) and thanks agin for the info.

When people say that reloading is a slippery slope they aint kidding. At the start I figured I'd buy a press and a die but now I'd need a separate garage for all the gadgets I've picked up along the way (Giraud trimmer, annealer, gazillion dies, case gauges, multiple measuring devices etc etc).

I'm going to call Harrels today. One thing I did wonder about was if there are any issues with sending the fired cases to them as I live in Canada?. Sensible people know that it is simply 3 pieces of harmless metal (brass, hell I'd even remove the spent primers) which I am sending to a location to allow the selection of a tool (die) before they are returned to me but if they get on the radar of an overzealous law enforcement type along the way could it spell trouble with all the bureaucratic restrictions that are in place (ITAR etc)?.

Has anyone ever sent cases from / to Canada? Will this result in a visit from my local friendly SWAT team or getting on a "No Fly" blacklist?

I hate to say this but if this is a possibility it will make my decision a lot simpler as a couple of options are eliminated immediately.

 

[mbeavers1]

The mighty armorys are not. They are regular ol FL dies with an improved button and great concentricity. I used them for my 6cm and they were nails, but the 6br die just came out.

Im gonna try because its on less pull. Can always mandrel if i need too.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

If you want to hold out, Im gonna try out Mighty Armory's 6br die. Its a 268 neck and 242 mandrel....similar to SAC. Less steps....

Sounds interesting. So is it similar to the SAC die which has a mandrel option?

I got to wondering how the SAC die with the mandrel works. I'm guessing on a fired case the mandrel could pass through the oversized neck which would then be resized with a bushing die before the mandrel is dragged back through it to open it up to the correct size again (kinda like an expander ball but better).

This would be a nice fast one pass solution except that my understanding is that the mandrel should be used on the downstroke (not the upstroke) as the case is less likely to get deformed when doing it this way. If this is the case then two separate steps would be better (if I am out to lunch on this please feel free to correct).

Am I correct in thinking you already have / use the Harrels die? If so I would be curious to hear how they compare.

 

[mbeavers1]

Well, I havent seen the SAC die in person but it looked like a full OD mandrel the whole way. The Mighty Armory expander has the mandrel OD only for about 1/4" just above the decapping pin where a normal button would be. I cannot comment on the SAC die cuz Ive never seen/used. The guys i know that have used the other sizes, love them, and they make quality stuff.

You are correct that a mandrel expands on the downstroke. But if your neck is sized very close to final OD, does that matter? Dunno....but gonna find out!

I currently have the Harrels die and have used it for almost 2k rds. My SD/ES was like 5/10. Accuracy was great - 1/2 MOA easy - better than I can shoot for sure. I bought the MA die today so will see how it compares.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

Well, I havent seen the SAC die in person but it looked like a full OD mandrel the whole way. The Mighty Armory expander has the mandrel OD only for about 1/4" just above the decapping pin where a normal button would be. I cannot comment on the SAC die cuz Ive never seen/used. The guys i know that have used the other sizes, love them, and they make quality stuff.

You are correct that a mandrel expands on the downstroke. But if your neck is sized very close to final OD, does that matter? Dunno....but gonna find out!

I currently have the Harrels die and have used it for almost 2k rds. My SD/ES was like 5/10. Accuracy was great - 1/2 MOA easy - better than I can shoot for sure. I bought the MA die today so will see how it compares.

I think I got how the SAC works wrong. I was thinking that the mandrel would be part of the resizing die and size on the upstroke where I think it actually works on the downstroke.

SAC stuff does look slick. I just ordered their universal seating die and a modified case. Their sizing dies are out of stock until August or early fall which kinda eliminates them for me.

 

[mbeavers1]

I think I got how the SAC works wrong. I was thinking that the mandrel would be part of the resizing die and size on the upstroke where I think it actually works on the downstroke.

SAC stuff does look slick. I just ordered their universal seating die and a modified case. Their sizing dies are out of stock until August or early fall which kinda eliminates them for me.

My Might Armory shows up today so ill size a couple and see how the neck tension looks. Its a 242 mandrel which should give 0.002". I have been running a .2425 for 0.0015".

The part I need to work out is lube. I use lanolin when I size and then tumble remove. Thats how all my brass stays til Im ready to load for a match. I then use a qtip and lube the neck ID lightly with Hornady oneshot before mandrelling.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

My Might Armory shows up today so ill size a couple and see how the neck tension looks. Its a 242 mandrel which should give 0.002". I have been running a .2425 for 0.0015".

The part I need to work out is lube. I use lanolin when I size and then tumble remove. Thats how all my brass stays til Im ready to load for a match. I then use a qtip and lube the neck ID lightly with Hornady oneshot before mandrelling.

Funny enough my Mighty Armoury decapping die showed up this morning too (haven’t seen it yet as I’m out of town with work).

I’ll be curious to hear your thoughts, particularly as you already have the Harrels die to compare against.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

My Might Armory shows up today so ill size a couple and see how the neck tension looks. Its a 242 mandrel which should give 0.002". I have been running a .2425 for 0.0015".

The part I need to work out is lube. I use lanolin when I size and then tumble remove. Thats how all my brass stays til Im ready to load for a match. I then use a qtip and lube the neck ID lightly with Hornady oneshot before mandrelling.

Enlighten us with the comparison between the Mighty Armoury & Harrels brother!

Got a new 6BR that needs some shootin!

 

[McMillan]

I use to run redding type s. I have now chamged to bullet central micron dies and have a sac seating die on order

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

I use to run redding type s. I have now chamged to bullet central micron dies and have a sac seating die on order

Never heard of Micron dies. Will exercise my google skills to try to learn more.

I also have a SAC seater on order. They are ~3 weeks from being in stock is what I heard last.......

 

[mbeavers1]

Enlighten us with the comparison between the Mighty Armoury & Harrels brother!

Got a new 6BR that needs some shootin!

Too early for a good review, but I have sized a few. The set up was just like other FL die. The neck tension was as promised, right on 0.002", measured with an 0.2415" and 0.241" gauge pin.

Concentricity was roughly 0.001".

I havent been able to shoot any yet, but hopefully will this week.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

Too early for a good review, but I have sized a few. The set up was just like other FL die. The neck tension was as promised, right on 0.002", measured with an 0.2415" and 0.241" gauge pin.

Concentricity was roughly 0.001".

I havent been able to shoot any yet, but hopefully will this week.

Interesting.

After a bit more reading I`m leaning towards non bushing and the Mighty Armoury looks like a good option, Whidden is the other option I'm looking at - their click adjustable non bushing dies seem like a decent bet too.

The SAC being weeks / months out kinda rules it out or me (I know its a bushing die but they look slick)

 

[mbeavers1]

Loaded and shot 100 today. Sized very easy, very low concentricity. Neck tension measured 0.0015 to 0.002 w pin gauges.
Seated on arbor press with 32 lbs +/- 5 lbs.

Grouped less than 0.5 MOA at 100 and hammered at distance...ran the 850 yd KYL perfect on first try. SDs around 4 and ES around 8.

Id give Wayne at Mighty Armory a shot. I had similar results with my 6CM die.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

Loaded and shot 100 today. Sized very easy, very low concentricity. Neck tension measured 0.0015 to 0.002 w pin gauges.
Seated on arbor press with 32 lbs +/- 5 lbs.

Grouped less than 0.5 MOA at 100 and hammered at distance...ran the 850 yd KYL perfect on first try. SDs around 4 and ES around 8.

Id give Wayne at Mighty Armory a shot. I had similar results with my 6CM die.

Sounds impressive.

I`m assuming the neck tension figures are from the expander ball on the die?

Is it possible to take off the expander ball? So that the die undersizes the neck and but the expander ball isn't there and the neck then gets sized with an expander mandrel?

 

[spife7980]

Is it possible to take off the expander ball? So that the die undersizes the neck and but the expander ball isn't there and the neck then gets sized with an expander mandrel?

Yeah, that’s how most people do it.

 

[mbeavers1]

Not really. The 'expander ball' is part of the stem. You would have to remove the whole stem.

 

[Cardboard Assassin]

Not really. The 'expander ball' is part of the stem. You would have to remove the whole stem.

I guess I could do that. Would work out exactly the same (ie die undersizes neck and with no expander ball / stem it would stay undersized until I use the mandrel).

Don't need the decapping pin as I do that as a separate (first) step.