6mm Creedmoor Reloading Report: H1000 vs. H4350 + Hornady ELD X

[mckchome]

I recently picked up a 6mm Creedmoor from GuNinja here on Sniper's Hide (specs: LRI build, Deviant Action, 26'' 1/8 twist Bartlein barrel). But I wanted to provide a reloading report on some recent 100 yd ladder tests done comparing H1000 and H4350. As I surf the forums, it seems that folks are interested in the potential of H1000 as a barrel-life-improving powder. Here is a summary of my results. And BTW, I am entirely open to feedback both on the process and the results.

Details: Hornady ELD X (103 gr), Hornady x1 fired factor brass, CCI 200 primers. The boxes in both targets on 1'' boxes for a common reference.

H1000 (45 gr-48.5 gr)
- loads were done in .5 grain increments, beginning at 45.0 and running up to 48.5 (at this point I basically ran out of case capacity).
- velocities ranged from 2937 (45.0 gr) to 3130 (48.5gr).
- - no pressure signs at any point.
- While I was generally happy with the velocities at the higher end, the grouping was mediocre.
- the entirety of the ladder test resulted in a group size if about 2''.
- based on the ladder test, I decided to load up x10 rounds of 47.0 gr of H1000, with the following results @ 100 yards: Group 1 resulted in a group of 1.4''; Group 2 resulted in a group of 1.1''.


H4350 (40.5gr-43.0gr)
- loads were done in .5 grain incremends, beginning at 40.5 gr and running up to 43.0 gr
- velocities ranged from around 2950-3100 +
- the group in this test was significantly better, with a total group size of about 1.5'' and with relatively clear accuracy nodes betwen 41.0-42.0.
- Note that in this test I did shoot x2 of 41.5 gr (they are the two shots at 6 o'clock that are touching).
- no pressure signs at any point.

My next step is to continue working with H4350, especially around 41.5gr. Any thoughts? Again, I'm happy to receive any and all feedback.

 

[spife7980]

My only thought is that 100 yards is too close to do a ladder test. Push it out to 500 and give gravity time to do its thing.

 

[mckchome]

My only thought is that 100 yards is too close to do a ladder test. Push it out to 500 and give gravity time to do its thing.

I appreciate the comment. Let me raise my concern and then get your response. When it comes to these kinds of reloading tests, it seems to me that it is best to remove as many variables as possible, so as to achieve the most accurate results from the test based on the most consistent factors. I am quite confident in my ability to hold a precise point of aim at 100 yards, in part because I can see clearly where the cross hairs lie in relationship to my target (esp these grid targets). My confidence goes down, however, the farther out I go, again in part because of how well I can see details of my target in relationship to my reticle. The father the distance, the less precise the aim and the more difference a small variation in POA can make. Does this make sense? I'm open to critique/feedback of course.

With all that said, I think I'm correct in concluding that--even at 100 yards--these little ladders test have provided some significant data about the usefulness of the two powders for my specific gun.

 

[spife7980]

Well those could all be randomly dispersed in a larger group and you have no way of knowing, you want gravity to work on the bullets at distance.

With a ladder test at 100 you don’t know if you’re seeing this

Or if you’re seeing this

If you’re going to stay at 100 do an ocw.

 

[steve123]

Sorry but you need to do a real ladder test, or a real OCW, or start shooting groups.

 

[mckchome]

Well those could all be randomly dispersed in a larger group and you have no way of knowing, you want gravity to work on the bullets at distance.

With a ladder test at 100 you don’t know if you’re seeing this

Or if you’re seeing this

If you’re going to stay at 100 do an ocw.

Well those could all be randomly dispersed in a larger group and you have no way of knowing, you want gravity to work on the bullets at distance.

With a ladder test at 100 you don’t know if you’re seeing this

Or if you’re seeing this

If you’re going to stay at 100 do an ocw.

That's helpful and makes sense. So you would recommend 500 then? Is there a reason for 500 as opposed to 200, 300 or 400?

 

[spife7980]

That's helpful and makes sense. So you would recommend 500 then? Is there a reason for 500 as opposed to 200, 300 or 400?

The further you go the better, 300 is the minimum, 500 was just an arbitrary number thats out there a bit.
People that shoot 1,000 yard br matches do their testing at 1,000. You better have your shit together to run a full test at 1k though. Somewhere in between there and the minimum still gets you good data but is easier to run.
http://www.6mmbr.com/laddertest.html
So with a ladder you are looking for this confirmation of positive compensation.

If you cant do that at distance then I would suggest you go for the OCW method
http://optimalchargeweight.embarqspace.com/ocw-overview/4529824091
If you were to lay all of your charge weight targets on top of one another, centered on the aim points, you want to find a point where consecutive charge weights impact in the same area.

This can be run at 100 yards to map the barrels behavior. Its not about group size, you can alter that with seating depth in a second step, but you want the group centers to be the same.
Lets consider charge weight 4: when it freezes in winter that same amount of powder burns slower so less velocity is the result (charger weight 3). Or if its scorching in summer you get more velocity (charge weight 5) but you still hit where you aim. However if you identified your node as 8 when it gets hot you would be hitting high to the right away and if it got cold you wold be hitting high to the left but neither would be your point of aim.

 

[mckchome]

The further you go the better, 300 is the minimum, 500 was just an arbitrary number thats out there a bit.
People that shoot 1,000 yard br matches do their testing at 1,000. You better have your shit together to run a full test at 1k though. Somewhere in between there and the minimum still gets you good data but is easier to run.

Great. I'll give this a try and see how it goes, posting results of course.

 

[ShtrRdy]

I was thinking a ladder test used smaller increments in powder charges? Like 0.2 gr steps?

With 0.5 gr steps you have the potential to miss a node.

 

[mckchome]

The further you go the better, 300 is the minimum, 500 was just an arbitrary number thats out there a bit.
People that shoot 1,000 yard br matches do their testing at 1,000. You better have your shit together to run a full test at 1k though. Somewhere in between there and the minimum still gets you good data but is easier to run.
http://www.6mmbr.com/laddertest.html
So with a ladder you are looking for this confirmation of positive compensation.
View attachment 6971469





If you cant do that at distance then I would suggest you go for the OCW method
http://optimalchargeweight.embarqspace.com/ocw-overview/4529824091
If you were to lay all of your charge weight targets on top of one another, centered on the aim points, you want to find a point where consecutive charge weights impact in the same area.
View attachment 6971470
This can be run at 100 yards to map the barrels behavior. Its not about group size, you can alter that with seating depth in a second step, but you want the group centers to be the same.
Lets consider charge weight 4: when it freezes in winter that same amount of powder burns slower so less velocity is the result (charger weight 3). Or if its scorching in summer you get more velocity (charge weight 5) but you still hit where you aim. However if you identified your node as 8 when it gets hot you would be hitting high to the right away and if it got cold you wold be hitting high to the left but neither would be your point of aim.

This response is so helpful, thank you. And it provides me with an additional load testing method.

 

[Rthur]

I was thinking a ladder test used smaller increments in powder charges? Like 0.2 gr steps?

With 0.5 gr steps you have the potential to miss a node.

I've used .3 grain for ladder tests in this case capacity.
.5 will still give nodes, may require a little more testing once zeroing in on the final charge weight.
Seating depth can be fine tuned after this to yield results.


R

 

[mckchome]

I've used .3 grain for ladder tests in this case capacity.
.5 will still give nodes, may require a little more testing once zeroing in on the final charge weight.
Seating depth can be fine tuned after this to yield results.


R

Understood. Thanks for the response.

 

[briang7511]

Thank you mckchome for doing the testing. do you have any es sd numbers on the H1000 with your 6 creed. Also running a deviant, 26 in barrel and have alot of H1000 on hand. currently using RL16. What brass/ primer are you using in your 6 creed?

 

[mckchome]

Thank you mckchome for doing the testing. do you have any es sd numbers on the H1000 with your 6 creed. Also running a deviant, 26 in barrel and have alot of H1000 on hand. currently using RL16. What brass/ primer are you using in your 6 creed?

Hornady Brass (from factor Match/Hunting ammo), CCI 200. I recorded the following velocities, but that's all the data I have. I'm new to the Magneto speed and am still learning how to pull all of the data>

H1000

45 gr, 2937
45.5 gr 2989
46.0 gr 3024
46.5 gr 3047
47.0 gr 3063
47.5 gr 3081
48.0 gr 3110
48.5 gr 3130
49.0 gr 3178

 

[spife7980]

That was shot with a magneato hanging off the end? Now that you know about where you are velocitywise shoot your next tests without it.

 

[mckchome]

That was shot with a magneato hanging off the end? Now that you know about where you are velocitywise shoot your next tests without it.

Yes, that is correct. But I already did a separate test w/out the chono to confirm results.

 

[Painless300]

What powder would you guys suggest in a 16.5” 6 creed? Thinking 105g projectiles.

 

[mckchome]

What powder would you guys suggest in a 16.5” 6 creed? Thinking 105g projectiles.

That's an interesting question, and one that I would like to see an answer to . It might be best to start a new thread. You will probably get better responses.

 

[Painless300]

Sorry didn't mean to Hijack the thread. Started a new thread.

 

[Nuube]

What powder would you guys suggest in a 16.5” 6 creed? Thinking 105g projectiles.