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Create a channel Learn moreWe are working on a modified CRF. It will be able to run on any model, but we are doing the development work on a Deviant. We are in the final stages of testing but for this one the testing is extensive. I don't expect this to see the light of day until 2025.Hi Eric, do you plan on bringing back the CRF Rebel?
Glad to hear, I have long action rebel that's like to get a new crf magnum bolt for.We are working on a modified CRF. It will be able to run on any model, but we are doing the development work on a Deviant. We are in the final stages of testing but for this one the testing is extensive. I don't expect this to see the light of day until 2025.
We've added a 3-position safety option to the Rebel (available now). I expect that in time, the CRF will be available on the Rebel but at first it will come out on the Deviant.
-Eric
Keep your eyes open for announcements after the first of the year. Conceptually, this version is doable in the other models. We will take it one at a time. When we can prove it also in the other models you will see it become an option.Glad to hear, I have long action rebel that's like to get a new crf magnum bolt for.
Need to clear up a few misconceptions.
Regarding Defiance pricing, you need to take a fresh look at our webstore at https://defiancemachine.com/product-category/actions/
You'll see that our prices have been modified over time and are more consistent with our competitors than some believe. I've admitted publicly on Frank's podcast that I made a mistake on pricing when we took over.
What's your sales pitch for why someone should pay $1600 for an Anti when Mack Bro's has a 20oz steel hunting action for $900? Nitrided as a standard feature.
Huh. Seems a bit half-assed.It hasn't. The the bolt handle location is changed. Rather than having full lug contact as in a 90 it'll have part of the lugs not in contact so as to achieve the 75 degree throw.
If you have a serious pressure issue and the lugs get set back you'll have part of the lugs set rather than all, if that makes sense.
Maybe not bad..... just....sub- optimal?Partial lug contact? That seems...bad?
To clear up the anTi vs. anTi-X, discontinued or not confusion, the anTi (no X) model was discontinued because the new Renegade action is the same receiver with a Legacy (curved handle) bolt. We also have the Classic which is a round bodied pinned lug action similar to the anTi. The addition of the Renegade and the Classic made the anTi demand drop off to nearly zero. Since the anTi-X (X difference is an integral scope rail) is our most popular steel hunting action, it was kept while we discontinued the anTi (no X).What's your sales pitch for why someone should pay $1600 for an Anti when Mack Bro's has a 20oz steel hunting action for $900? Nitrided as a standard feature.
We are definitely doing a deep dive on this subject. We are learning that it can be pricey and take time but from what we are hearing about how well it works, making these a standard option for those who want this level of performance seems a natural fit for Defiance. We just need to make a simple and clear path for our customers before we announce it being available through us.For the last 10 years, I have been sending anything that moves to IonBond for their TB41 / Decobond 41.
Bolt bodies, extractors, firing pins and cocking pieces. The performance of this coating has been exceptional.
Wouldn't that actually be 83% contact (75/90) assuming 100% contact on a 90 degree bolt? Math has never been my strong suit.Regarding the voodoo of the 75-degree lug, the lugs have nearly 90% full contact with the flat inside the receiver. The remain portion that is not in contact is still over the ramp leading to the locked position. At no point is the lug positioned over open space (you can see this by looking down the tenon of a closed action with a flashlight).
Thanks for your explanation!It is a long tried and capable way to shorten bolt throw to make space for whatever is in the way.
It's not pricey and it's a quick cycle time in my opinion.We are definitely doing a deep dive on this subject. We are learning that it can be pricey and take time but from what we are hearing about how well it works, making these a standard option for those who want this level of performance seems a natural fit for Defiance. We just need to make a simple and clear path for our customers before we announce it being available through us.
Agreed. I would assume so.It seems like the geometry would be very different for a 3 lug bolt (AI) vs. a 2 lug bolt (R700).
We are working on a modified CRF. It will be able to run on any model, but we are doing the development work on a Deviant. We are in the final stages of testing but for this one the testing is extensive. I don't expect this to see the light of day until 2025.
We've added a 3-position safety option to the Rebel (available now). I expect that in time, the CRF will be available on the Rebel but at first it will come out on the Deviant.
-Eric
I can confirm that a modified CRF will be available that can be run in various models. If by "ultralight" you are talking about the anTi-X model, this is where things get trickly.So here is my big question, in the future will I be able to get one of your ultralight actions with a 75 degree bolt, CRF that takes standard prefits and/or a 3 position safety?
I’m an ARC fan due to the CRF and lack of an extractor cut requirements for prefits but if you can make that happen I would be interested in picking up one for an ultralight rifle build.
Or, it could be a helpful solution for many shooters who requested this option and appreciate the alternative to a 90-degree. It depends on your perspective and intentions. Our R&D team is working on many things. I don't think we can dismiss their hard work so casually.Design an action around 75° lift, don't do it as an afterthought add-on. Why won't bat's new 75° bolts retrofit inside an older 90? Because it was a full re-design, no partial lug engagement. This is poor execution to drive sales, not ingenuity and engineering.
Idk what the problem is that's needing a solution. How much time does a 15° change or bolt lift save? Another question, how much extra cocking force is needed to open the shorter throw now that may disturb the rifle, requiring more time to re-align to target? Did you drop FP spring rate to keep lift the same sacrificing ignition force and primer strike consistency? I'm just being devils advocate here. A corner was cut by going to a 75° bolt lift with only 2 lugs that are 180° apart from one another.Or, it could be a helpful solution for many shooters who requested this option and appreciate the alternative to a 90-degree. It depends on your perspective and intentions. Our R&D team is working on many things. I don't think we can dismiss their hard work so casually.
Make sure you email Tikka about your concerns too.A corner was cut by going to a 75° bolt lift with only 2 lugs that are 180° apart from one another.
I read loud and clear that you aren’t a fan, but everybody is not you. Just because you see no need doesn’t make it so for the rest of the shooting world. Give it a rest already.Idk what the problem is that's needing a solution. How much time does a 15° change or bolt lift save? Another question, how much extra cocking force is needed to open the shorter throw now that may disturb the rifle, requiring more time to re-align to target? Did you drop FP spring rate to keep lift the same sacrificing ignition force and primer strike consistency? I'm just being devils advocate here. A corner was cut by going to a 75° bolt lift with only 2 lugs that are 180° apart from one another.
I have the 75 on 2 of my 4 impacts. It isn’t for everyone, my son has no use for it, my daughter loves hers. I don’t notice the extra lift weight, I am sure it’s there, but the bolt still runs fine. I have fat hands and like the clearance between the scope and the bolt knob. It is a preference issue, you don’t like it, I like it enough to buy 2 additional bolts. Not at all concerned about the lug contact, basic engineering says you should have at at least a 25% safety margin on your worst case scenario, I typically double that in my day job, but I am not getting anywhere near nominal design parameters, so all is good!Idk what the problem is that's needing a solution. How much time does a 15° change or bolt lift save? Another question, how much extra cocking force is needed to open the shorter throw now that may disturb the rifle, requiring more time to re-align to target? Did you drop FP spring rate to keep lift the same sacrificing ignition force and primer strike consistency? I'm just being devils advocate here. A corner was cut by going to a 75° bolt lift with only 2 lugs that are 180° apart from one another.