A & D FX120i & trickler questions

[Ranger188]

Waiting for mine to ship out.
How long do you turn yours on before reloading? CE suggests 2 hours, seems long.
Do you run any kind of "line" conditioner or power surge protecter?
Anyone using a anti static pad under it?
Any other useful ideas I should know?

 

[MangoFett]

Turn it on for 2 hours. At minimum an hour, that's the only time it can be weird and drift on you after that it's crazy stable.

No need for protectors, if I'm not mistaken there's one built into the power supply.

I wired up and used an anti static pad for my charge masters in the past but honestly the difference was so marginal I cant definitively say it improved anything. I didnt bother to use a mat for the A&D I just set it up on a slab of granite I sprayed vinyl record spray on which is suppose to be anti static. I've been using it for a couple months now and haven't had any problems at all or any static build up on the plastic parts. I wouldn't worry about the pad.

Only other tips would be to keep it far from drafts and air conditioning, keep your phone and tv away as well.

 

[MarinePMI]

Truth be known...I haven't shut mine off in a few weeks. Just leave it on.

 

[Kyskeet]

I never turn mine off, other than per calibration instructions.

 

[MikeMcCasland]

I leave mine on most of the time, but if it's off I'll give it a 15 min warmup.

I do use a line conditioner (Tripplite 1200), and it's actually kicked on a few times, which I wouldn't have expected because I don't *see* power issues in the house otherwise, but it's detected them. I also wrap all nearby power cords with ferrite magnets.

You should also get rid of any florescent lights in the area; people always parrot that about scales on reloading forums, but my chargemasters were never that impacted by them. That said, flouro lights WILL throw off my 120i bigtime.

You'll also want to limit any nearby airflow; the scale is probably going to be way more sensitive than what you're used to.

Edit: If you got the Area 419 goodies to go with it, I'd use caution with the guided pan. If you have problems with readings jumping around, try the factory plate.

 

[MarinePMI]

Edit: If you got the Area 419 goodies to go with it, I'd use caution with the guided pan. If you have problems with readings jumping around, try the factory plate.

Please elaborate. What did you see?

 

[MikeMcCasland]

Please elaborate. What did you see?

With my Area 419 base, it would cause my scale to jump around a bit. Not a lot...maybe .04-.06gr in either direction. I think it has to do with how the 'nipple' in the bottom was machined, but I'm not exactly sure. It is however consistent and isolated to using the 419 base plate.

I'd have situations where I was loading up for a match, and half way through all my rounds, I'd take the 419 cup off the pan and instead of being -750.72, it would show -750.78 etc. I'd re-zero and go on with loading, and it'd do it again in another ~10ish rounds. I went nuts troubleshooting this issue (how I got the line conditioner, ferrite magnets, eliminated flouros), until I read on another forum where someone had a similar problem.

When I use the A&D 'platter' the problem goes away entirely. Mine is rock solid now and doesn't move zero at all, even after being on for 4-5 days since I last charged with it.

Edit: I've been using the A&D plate for a while now, and honestly don't have any issues with it, and slightly prefer it to the 419 base. When I ordered my scale, I got the full 419 package; knowing what I know now, I probably wouldn't have done that. I'd of just purchased some of their upgrades individually.

Edit: Fixed some grammar and sentence structure.

 

[Anthonyc]

Mine is stock and I start weighing about 30 minutes after turning on.

 

[MarinePMI]

With my Area 419 base, it would cause my scale to jump around a bit. Not a lot...maybe .04-.06gr in either direction. I think it has to do with how the 'nipple' in the bottom was machined..not exactly sure. It is however consistent and isolated to using the 419 base plate.

I'd have situations where I was loading up for a match, and like half way through all my rounds, and I'd take the 419 cup off the pan and insted of being -750.72, it would show -750.78 etc. I'd re-zero and go on with loading, and it'd do it again in another ~10ish rounds. I went nuts troubleshooting this issue (how I got the line conditioner, ferrite magnets, eliminated flouros), until I read on another forum where someone had a similar problem.

When I use the A&D 'platter' the problem goes away entirely. Mine is rock solid now and doesn't move zero at all, even after being on for 4-5 days since I last charged with it.

Edit: I've been using the A&D plate for a while now, and honestly don't have any issues with it, and slightly prefer it to the 419 base. When I ordered my scale, I got the full 419 package; knowing what I know now, I probably wouldn't have done that. I'd of just purchased some of their upgrades individually.

Yeah, I noticed it on mine as well, but found that if I nudged the plate in one direction, it would remain consistent. I think there is some slop in the nipple of the plate (that goes into the scale) that allows it to rotate slightly and throw it off. I've been thinking of putting a felt pad of some sort down in the hole to take up the slop...

 

[Gbyleveldt]

You know, I’ve also experienced something similar with the Area419 plate; I’ll try your suggestion and see if it improves. Granted, the effect is minuscule but it’s there. I wouldn’t have given it much thought, had i not ran the scale stock for a while before getting the Area419 goodies. Prior to this the scale was rock solid.

Another thing that drove me batshit crazy was the plex lid. As you brought your hand closer to the scale, the readings would go nuts. I suspected static build up as the cause and thoroughly cleaned the plex lid with anti static spray. That seems to have sorted out that issue. Again, if I didn’t run the scale stock before, and went straight for the whole Area419 package, I would’ve thought the scale was busted.

With my Area 419 base, it would cause my scale to jump around a bit. Not a lot...maybe .04-.06gr in either direction. I think it has to do with how the 'nipple' in the bottom was machined..not exactly sure. It is however consistent and isolated to using the 419 base plate.

I'd have situations where I was loading up for a match, and like half way through all my rounds, and I'd take the 419 cup off the pan and insted of being -750.72, it would show -750.78 etc. I'd re-zero and go on with loading, and it'd do it again in another ~10ish rounds. I went nuts troubleshooting this issue (how I got the line conditioner, ferrite magnets, eliminated flouros), until I read on another forum where someone had a similar problem.

When I use the A&D 'platter' the problem goes away entirely. Mine is rock solid now and doesn't move zero at all, even after being on for 4-5 days since I last charged with it.

Edit: I've been using the A&D plate for a while now, and honestly don't have any issues with it, and slightly prefer it to the 419 base. When I ordered my scale, I got the full 419 package; knowing what I know now, I probably wouldn't have done that. I'd of just purchased some of their upgrades individually.

 

[MarinePMI]

I shit canned the basic lid not long after getting mine. The heavy 419 lexan(?) lid made things a whole lot easier to see and stopped all the flexing when the thrower motor actuated.

 

[DellaDog]

Same here on the 419 pan. Even had them swap it for another, and it too causes drift.
The original pan is definitely more stable, but the 419 is so much easier to center so I accept it.
Hopefully someone figures out a trick to fix it.

 

[Oldbugr]

I posted this same issue with my area 419 pan drifting on another thread and everyone thought i was nuts, or didn't let if warm up long enough, or I needed to calibrate it, blah blah. I've since starting using the pan that came with the scale and have not had any more issues at all.

 

[MarinePMI]

Yeah, I'm wondering if, because the pan can shift to one side or the other by a small amount, if it is affecting the reading because of torque against the displacement sensor...

These are hypersentitive scales, so it wouldn't surprise me if that was the case.

 

[John Glidewell]

I have all the 419 stuff too. What I found, the drifting is caused by static in the thick lid and side panels. I wipe the lid and plastic side panels down with a window cleaner during set up and it does not do this anymore. I will also spray the work are with static guard during set up. I have found over the years that static is the #1 issue for any electronic scale. I also check every 5-10 rounds by just pulling the pan off and making sure it is zeroing.

 

[MikeMcCasland]

I guess I was fortunate with my lid, it didn't give me any drama. For me it was just the 419 pan that caused issues.

I will say with the updated V3 dispenser, the only pieces of 419 gear I'd get these days would be the cup, and the trickler stand.

On a somewhat related note, there's a guy over on accurateshooter who bought an extra pan from either A&D or CA, and did a really nice job cutting it down so only the powder cup would fit on there. If the 'auto center' was important to me, that's probably the route I'd go.

As it stands now though, with the clear lid, I've never dumped powder due to an alignment issue....the same can't be said for stupidly pressing re-zero with the cup out of the unit. Doh!

Edit: As far as folks not believing the issues with the 419...can't say I'm all that surprised. I really didn't want to give up using the pan, but honestly the reason I paid big money for this setup was powder charge accuracy (1k F-Class). Screw feelings and emotion. I just want something that works.

 

[John Glidewell]

Edit: As far as folks not believing the issues with the 419...can't say I'm all that surprised. I really didn't want to give up using the pan, but honestly the reason I paid big money for this setup was powder charge accuracy (1k F-Class). Screw feelings and emotion. I just want something that works.

Yeah, for sure. And I would hope they would take it as constructive criticism and look into it.

Also, every place is different. I am in Reno, NV where it is very dry and static can be a bitch. Why I moved my load area to a dedicated room in the house. I try to replicate a good environment, controlled temp and humidity. It all makes a difference if you are going after precision. These external factors can play havoc on equipment and you nuts trying to figure it out.

 

[A&8's]

I leave mine on 24/7. Just sitting on the wooden bench top, plugged in direct. LED lights in gun room, phone stays about 12' away while using, no fan blowing near the scale. No problems.

 

[Oldbugr]

I would like to say the same as Gwain... Constructive criticism, not slamming Area 419.

 

[John Glidewell]

Yeah, I'm wondering if, because the pan can shift to one side or the other by a small amount, if it is affecting the reading because of torque against the displacement sensor...

These are hypersentitive scales, so it wouldn't surprise me if that was the case.

I just checked mine, it does have a slight shift in it.....hmmmmm

 

[MikeMcCasland]

I just checked mine, it does have a slight shift in it.....hmmmmm

Mine will shift side to side. I almost think the 'nipple' piece is machined too long/deep, not allowing full contact on the 'sides'...if that makes sense. I suspect if you ground it down, or cut .2-.3" it'd make better contact and wouldn't shift.

 

[MarinePMI]

Well, if I get bored after my surgery, I may very well bolt the plate down to the mil table and take some off and see if the resolves the issue....

 

[TN Shooter]

I recently got the FX120i and V3 AutoTrickler (no autothrow) setup. Within the first reloading session I was experiencing what others have mentioned with the 419 tray. Drift in tare as much as .1 grains. Replaced the 419 tray with the factory and haven’t had any issue since. Factory tray gives me the same tare every time I remove the cup. The self centering isn’t as big a deal to me since I’m not running the autothrow and I actually prefer the factory tray now that I have been using it. The nipples are different in length. Just my personal experience.

 

[spife7980]

I only have the factory tray and it does rock/shift a smidge depending on which side the cup is set on... but I cant get it to read incorrectly. Ive moved it all around, Ive tested with different weights in diferent locations and different cups too etc. If there is something on the tray it reads the same for me regardless of its position on the tray. Used to bug me but Ive tested it enough to realize that its not hurting anything for me. Never had an issue getting the cup under the straw either that would drive me to look for an alternative.

 

[John Glidewell]

I switched back to the factory tray, no issues.

 

[CarlM]

I really didn't want to believe this, but I'm having the same issue. Going back to the factory tray definitely seems to work better.
I can't explain it, I'm sure someone smarter than me will figure it out. Btw, if you have Adams 3D printed centering device, you can
use it on the factory tray to center the 419 cup.

 

[Raven81]

I ordered the full V3 kit, but I've only received the FX-120i so far from CE. I also ordered the full kit from A419 as well, along with their funnel kit and loading trays. Pretty sweet gear!

So are the cheap $15 100 gram calibration mass that CE sells good enough or should I go with a Troemner ASTM Class 1 at $77?

Last, while I'm waiting for the V3 kit, can a fella just set an RCBS trickler on the A419 lid and manual trickle through the hole down into the cup. I can just throw my charges short on my Lyman Gen6 and then manual trickle up. Or will vibrations from trickling on top the lid throw off the scale?

I just can't see any other way as the straw on my trickler is way to short.

 

[scorpio 25]

Waiting for mine to ship out.
How long do you turn yours on before reloading? CE suggests 2 hours, seems long.
Do you run any kind of "line" conditioner or power surge protecter?
Anyone using a anti static pad under it?
Any other useful ideas I should know?

Me also

 

[chaosgadoury]

I ordered the full V3 kit, but I've only received the FX-120i so far from CE. I also ordered the full kit from A419 as well, along with their funnel kit and loading trays. Pretty sweet gear!

So are the cheap $15 100 gram calibration mass that CE sells good enough or should I go with a Troemner ASTM Class 1 at $77?

Last, while I'm waiting for the V3 kit, can a fella just set an RCBS trickler on the A419 lid and manual trickle through the hole down into the cup. I can just throw my charges short on my Lyman Gen6 and then manual trickle up. Or will vibrations from trickling on top the lid throw off the scale?

I just can't see any other way as the straw on my trickler is way to short.

Any calibration mass will be good enough as long as the mass doesn't change. You are only looking to reset to a known standard. You can base all your loads off of that. If you reload on someone else scale it might not be exact due to the tolerance of the weight.

 

[Raven81]

Got it! So no advantage to the certificate weights.

 

[Rhed]

Even exhale on your breathing throws it off. So I wear a dust mask. And that helped too. The stock pan is good. But it does have slight variance around the pan.

 

[Rhed]

@ Skunkworx Was my sarcasm really that obvious? Lol

 

[DellaDog]

Just went back to the original pan - no drift.

I really wanted the 419 pan to work, aesthetically it’s beautiful and for quick centering its ideal, but not returning to zero defeats the purpose of the whole setup.

Here’s hoping someone figures out a simple solution.

 

[Bertoli888]

@Ranger188 The one thing that has not been mentioned. I suggest to get a heavy piece of Kitchen granite slab as a base. Kitchen manufacturer usually throws them away (the hole where the kitchen sink goes). I am using a pool coping. The older original version trickler base used to jump around. Also notes that I use paper to balance the trickler angle while others use the base screws.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

Bringing this thread back up for some help....

I bought a V3 with 419 kit from a guy on here and it's been great with the exception of a significant amount of over trickling. I have the trickler set all the way down so that it has as little slope as possible and it still overshoots fairly often. I am using staball powder btw.

Is there a device like what I bought for my chargmaster that will help this or some setting I can adjust? I have the + / - setting on the back down as low as it will go as well.

Thanks, this really has me frustrated.

 

[spife7980]

Yeah, all the chargemaster inserts places also have an autothrow version that ive seen.

Speed it up and slant it down maybe?
Shine a light on it while its final trickling and see if its clumping up and coming out in surges but thats usually an issue with stick powders, not ball. If its an even flow and its just going too slow, you have the scale speed sensitivity to high correct?

 

[CarlM]

You definitely need a couple of degrees of slope in your trickler. Mine almost never over throws, if any thing it usually just under.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

Yeah, all the chargemaster inserts places also have an autothrow version that ive seen.

Speed it up and slant it down maybe?
Shine a light on it while its final trickling and see if its clumping up and coming out in surges but thats usually an issue with stick powders, not ball. If its an even flow and its just going too slow, you have the scale speed sensitivity to high correct?

Yeah I think so. I went through and did all the settings it said to do in the little booklet. It seems like it just doesn't slow down quite fast enough.

I tried making it slope more but didn't get anywhere with it. I didn't go very far down that road but it didn't seem like that was going to work.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

You definitely need a couple of degrees of slope in your trickler. Mine almost never over throws, if any thing it usually just under.

I've got a little slope because it won't adjust enough to make it level. Mine will be anywhere from .02 under to .1 over, then about half the time its right

 

[John Glidewell]

Pics and or video, including the back panel so we can see settings. Sounds like it is not set up properly.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

Pics and or video, including the back panel so we can see settings. Sounds like it is not set up properly.

Ok. Will do here in just a bit.


Thank you everyone for the help!!! I need some help here.

Everything I've seen about these V3 systems says that it should pretty much be throwing perfect charges over and over again with an occasional. 02 gr variance. Is that a correct expectation?

 

[CarlM]

I only use H4350, IMR4166, and Varget, almost always throws spot on or .02 under.

 

[John Glidewell]

Yes, + or - .02 grains on every throw is what I see with most being right on the money.

 

[spife7980]

Also, I set my speeder switch on the back of my v2 to be middle to fast with it sloped down, seems to help me with a more steady flow.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

I can't get the video to load. Tired a few times and it took a long time to load up,, then when it got to 100% it gave me an error meazage.....

Here's some pics though.

Set to 43.5gr

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

I tried moving the slider thing to several different places but the more I take it towards +, the more it overthrows by

 

[John Glidewell]

Can't really see anything there. Why is the trickler sitting on that? Here are some pics of mine. Little towards the + side and trickler tube slightly elevated.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

Can't really see anything there. Why is the trickler sitting on that? Here are some pics of mine. Little towards the + side and trickler tube slightly elevated.

View attachment 7729877View attachment 7729878

I just had the trickler on that plastic primer tray to get it up a little higher. It was hitting the cup just barely just sitting on the table. I have now replaced that with a ceramic coaster. It doesn't have any vibration or anything.


I can't adjust it any more towards level than it is and giving it more slope makes it worse.

 

[John Glidewell]

That does not make any sense. Something is wrong with you set up. Did you look under the trickler base to see if the feet are still there?

 

[John Glidewell]

Mine, all the way down and all the way up.