So long story short, bought an RPR in 6 Creed last year. Factory barrel made really small groupings. Figured I would buy an aftermarket barrel to get even better groups. Did load testing with new barrel. Used 4 different bullets and did load testing for all. Nothing, wouldn't group better than MOA at 100. Had the barrel looked at by competent Smith and he was puzzled. Gave him whole gun and he did load testing and same results, nothing better than MOA. Put the stock barrel back on and sub moa groupings again. Called barrel maker. Sent in barrel, they said nothing wrong with it. Came back to me and same story. Well, I will never be using that manufacturer again. Some companies have good CS, and some don't.
-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
Aftermarket barrel hype
- Thread starter Doc68
- Start date
You don’t owe the barrel maker anything. Which one is it?
Edit: I’ve never had an issue with a top quality barrel. Had lots of mediocre factory barrels though.
Edit: I’ve never had an issue with a top quality barrel. Had lots of mediocre factory barrels though.
I had a barrel that was exactly the same as the OP is talking about several years ago...shot 5-600 rounds through it had 4” cut off recrowned and 3-400 more rounds nothing ever under 3/4” and most 1+”.
Mine was a criterion 30” savage prefit chambered in 260rem.
Mine was a criterion 30” savage prefit chambered in 260rem.
Yea... Aftermarket barrels are garbage I mean who buys into that barrel hype ...I bet more matches are won and records set on factory tubes.....
D
Deleted member 10043
Guest
Probably put the OEM brake on that aftershave barrel. Fucked it up.
Interesting.
Aftermarket barrel not performing.
I’m curious to the maker.
Not a problem I’ve had.
Aftermarket barrel not performing.
I’m curious to the maker.
Not a problem I’ve had.
Criterion, it was bought back in December last year from Brownells (love Brownells, not their fault). It is a 26" heavy profile 6 creed barrel.
Now, I never said matches aren't won with aftermarket barrels. I'm just speaking to my one and only experience husky driver. I'm just upset that it came to this after spending almost 500 on a barrel that was supposed to be a superior product.
As far as pictures of load development, no I don't have any. I can tell you I started at book minimums for charges and went to 2 great over book max. Used other people's pet loads, went from jamming into lands to 70 thousands off lands. Just nothing ever worked.
Last edited:
30" is a lot of barrel. I have one 30" and it needs more powder than I expected to get it to shoot decent. How far past your prior load did you go with your load development? Were ED/SD all over the map or reasonable with just crappy results?
SD/ES were reasonable with the best being 8.4. I used H4350, Hybrid 100V and 4831SC powders. Used Federal match primers, Remington large rifle and also used cci large rifle primers. Used Peterson and hornandy brass. Just nothing ever would shoot well.
Have you asked the smith if he would cut it back 2" and rechamber it?
A little surprised that criterion won’t make it right. Any idea what your gunsmith and criterion did to check the barrel out? A bore scope won’t tell you a whole bunch. The only criterion I ever scoped was a mess in the throat, but that barrel is shooting fine last I heard.
I consider criterion to be a mid-tier barrel, like X-caliber. I’m sure it will be hard for you at this point, given your experience, but next time just go to the top of the heap for a barrel blank.
I consider criterion to be a mid-tier barrel, like X-caliber. I’m sure it will be hard for you at this point, given your experience, but next time just go to the top of the heap for a barrel blank.
I figure once I get back from this 9 month vacation the army is sending me on, I will buy an LRI Ruger Precision prefit or have them spin me up a 7mm-08 AI. Figure I'll order it a couple months before I come home so it's ready to go .
If you bought it from Brownells they will return it. I would do that and get my $500 back.
Their barrels have never been spectacular IMO...I have 2 buddies that had the same issues several years ago both were sent back and both were told nothing was wrong.
Ive read a lotta guys have had good luck with them but I’ve personally never seen one shoot well enough for me to say it shot good.
D
Deleted member 10043
Guest
I can dig it. I like how people send their barrels back and the manufacturer claims there is nothing wrong. Like we are supposed to expect the truth. Yeah, right. I would just clean it up and send it back and say something stupid like give the customer some bullshit like we tuned the barrel to some optimal time. Please verify with OCW or ladder test and how very important it is to find the optimal seating depth. Send the customer down a rat hole. We got people here that send 1500 rounds down range in load development alone and never think to blame the manufacturer.
Last edited by a moderator:
I’ve also had a kreiger and a bartlein go bad...kreiger at 800 rounds starting throwing flyers at 850 it went back 3wks later I had a new blank.
Bartlein at 700 started throwing flyers and sent it back...4wks later I had a new blank.
Hi,
What happen to them is that their barrels are/were always better suited for gas guns and their reputation was/has been built upon that success, BUT jumping into "precision" bolt gun market requires a different set of standards and they are not up to the top tier barrel manufacturers level.
Sincerely,
Theis
Kreiger did there was a 1” loose spot at 12” in from the chamber side like the rifling was coming apart...bartlein did not they just said the barrel was bad.
When I say flyers I mean they were throwing rounds 2’ off at 550yds...both these barrels started this at matches and 2 good shooters shot them and verified.
I really like my criterion barrels.
If someone can’t make a barrel shoot I suspect the reloader and trigger puller more than the barrel.
If someone can’t make a barrel shoot I suspect the reloader and trigger puller more than the barrel.
I agree that Criterion is a mid tier barrel. I shoot them pretty much exclusively. The first one I had was a solid .3-.4 moa barrel with DTACS. I've done load development on several for friends. Most settle in at .5-.6 moa with most groups being right around .5 moa. I've never had a top tier barrel, but I've seen people post load development photos where pretty much everything shoots under .6. The first Criterion I had was like that. None have been like that since. Now most loads shoot around 1" with the good ones in the .5-.6 range. That has been my experience with Criterion over half a dozen barrels. In my opinion, 1/2 moa is good enough for PRS. If I had the scratch I would probably just buy a top tier barrel and be done with it. For what I do Criterion prefits offer a good value.
D
Deleted member 10043
Guest
I'm getting better than that with very little load development. I mean I'm talking one or two sessions and I'm down to a Crit shooting .3 MOA. Add me behind the rifle and it is a consistent .5 or .6 set up. The rifle accuracy is always better without a shooter behind it. The use of the word Tiers is way too subjective with anything other than optics, et al. I wish the old 100 yard challenge was still intact. We had a variety of rigs and shooters. It was a great database.
Last edited by a moderator:
I had a prefit (not Criterion) that didn't shoot well until I had the chamber set back by GAP. The manufacturer said the chamber was fine when I sent it back for inspection, apparently they were fine with a throat so long that bullets would fall out of the case before touching the lands.
Barrels differ quite a bit.
Surprisingly my current Shilen prefit shoots as good as any premium barrel I've owned.
Had one Schneider that never shot better than .4" and averaged .6". It burned out early too.
Had one Kreiger that shot well at first but by 275 rounds or so started blowing bullets up, granted it was a hot chambering. Kreiger wouldn't replace it.
Some barrels just shoot better than others, most do well, and some are crappy.
Surprisingly my current Shilen prefit shoots as good as any premium barrel I've owned.
Had one Schneider that never shot better than .4" and averaged .6". It burned out early too.
Had one Kreiger that shot well at first but by 275 rounds or so started blowing bullets up, granted it was a hot chambering. Kreiger wouldn't replace it.
Some barrels just shoot better than others, most do well, and some are crappy.
My last pre fit Shilen was really good.
Especially the last half of its life.
My current Shilen is pretty decent but still fairly new.
I hope it turns on and lasts like my last one did.
Especially the last half of its life.
My current Shilen is pretty decent but still fairly new.
I hope it turns on and lasts like my last one did.
D
Deleted member 10043
Guest
A friend did a Remage switch barrel, think Criterion prefits, the 6.5 x47 barrel was great and load dev was simple, the 22-250 was a bitch, and he seems happy with it, to me it is mediocre, nothing special.
I've had dozens of custom barrels spun up in the last 10 yrs, I've never had a Bad one, had 2 I did not like, but they shot fine, just needed a cleaning way more often than others.
A friend had a Brux in 6 creed, it generated pressure bad, after 500 rds with no load, and an asston of ruined brass, we pulled it and sent it in, it was replaced w/o explanation. On it, knowing would have been nice, because at some point a guy could run into it again, inspecting with a borescope, it was a nice looking barrel, but over my pay grade.
I've had dozens of custom barrels spun up in the last 10 yrs, I've never had a Bad one, had 2 I did not like, but they shot fine, just needed a cleaning way more often than others.
A friend had a Brux in 6 creed, it generated pressure bad, after 500 rds with no load, and an asston of ruined brass, we pulled it and sent it in, it was replaced w/o explanation. On it, knowing would have been nice, because at some point a guy could run into it again, inspecting with a borescope, it was a nice looking barrel, but over my pay grade.
My buddy had a kreiger chambered in 6BRX with the same issue but his had pressure from the start...tight spot in the bore? It shot great just pressure at low charge weights.
I never did clean his barrel, not something to be proud of, but I am good with a cleaning rod feeling for pinch points. I wish I had did just that.
I used to be against an abrasive like JB bore paste, but today, with my Hawkeye, I'll scope a barrel after my initial 10-14 rds, see and mark where copper fans out in a barrel, then clean. After the next 30 or so shots I will look again, if pattern is still there I will work them over with an abrasive. I can almost keep my barrels copper free. Does nothing to combat hard carbon laid down from RL 16 or H4895, or stop the muzzle end from holding buildups of Varget either.
Interesting...I have a layman scope but lost interest with it pretty quickly...I use it but not very often.
I do how ever shoot 13 rounds through a new barrel...3 light charges shoot one clean x3 then 10 medium charges and clean then on to load development.
I do this to see how the barrel is going to hold copper...if a barrel holds a lot of copper after the 10 rounds I really pay attention the first 100 or so if only lite copper I don’t worry about it.
Iam in the clean every time I shoot camp though...it seems like when I clean every time the barrel shoots more consistently and seems to last a little longer...I am also running tubbs HBN in 2 new barrels...I’m about 90% sure I’ll continue using the HBN at this point.
I can see where HBN may help, friction reduction, make no mistake though, the rifling is still engraving the bullet. And rough spots are rough.
Agree I’ve also noted with HBN it takes longer/more rounds for the barrels to speed up...my BR at 100 rounds was about 15fps faster and at 325ish it was a total of 40-45fps faster than at load development.
270ish through the BRX and is about 35fps faster It might jump another 10-15fps but I think it’s pretty much done.
Have you ever tried to wrap the muzzle with tin foil to brighten it up? Or introduce light from the other end. The resolution on the first models sucked IMO, low light to boot. I guess the newer model is quite an upgrade.
I bought the hawkeye yrs ago when I hadn't a clue what I was viewing, and being a T4A user, it is a hassle just to look at the first 4" from the back, even with the angle eyepiece.
I ran moly for yrs and liked it, had a wet process, using denatured alcohol, they were clean. I tried HBN after using coated dtacs, I fucked it up right off by a non consistent wiping off process doing my own, lol
Naked today, i'm done with that coating shit.
I played with HBN several years ago but I musta done something wrong because all it did was cause a gritty feeling and inconsistent seating...the tubbs stuff is nice but we will see at the end of these barrels but like I say I’m sold thus far.
Never tried the foil thing...the center light is out on my layman so it’s bright on the front and back(for sake of a better explanation)and dark in the center...I need to contact them and send it back
That's a shame on Criterion's customer service. I had an issue with a Proof Research barrel similar to yours. I contacted Proof about my 1.25" average groupings so they kindly asked if a local competent gunsmith could look at it since I was an amateur do-it-myself kind of guy. Gun smith and the Proof representative emailed back and forth and copied me. Gun smith didn't see anything wrong with the barrel but we sent it back any ways. 10 days later Proof sent me a new upgraded barrel and a bunch of swag! 100ish test rounds later she's grouping <.75".
