Any F1 racing fans?

[Shooter McGavin]

I realize it was a decision Mercedes had to make for its future. Hamilton is getting older, but still wins championships and Bottas isn't going to win championships with Mercedes or anyone else. George will be the future face of Mercedes. It's best to get him in now while he can learn something from Lewis, such as tire management because he doesn't know how to do that during a race.

I like Bottas and had hope he would win a championship with Mercedes, but it always seemed the cards were stacked against him. When Nico beat Lewis for the championship I understand that there was a lot of animosity between the two drivers during that season and made the garage a terrible place to be for everyone. No wonder Nico retired after that season.

 

[eflyguy]

If you watch sky coverage, when they've had Nico on recently, you can see why. He's opinionated and argumentative as fark (and possibly the most effeminate "guy" I've ever seen..) Can't stand him.

44 is confrontational. I can imagine how bad it was when they drove together.

 

[eflyguy]

More grumpy old guy observations after reading some this morning..

I sure hope Haas dumps "has-a-spin" and gets a real driver for next year. His lack of talent aside, he does not have the personality to be a member of this club. It was shown before he even started the season, and he's done nothing to redeem himself.

Don't they have Uber in Russia? Opportunity awaits..

 

[Schütze]

I sure hope Haas dumps "has-a-spin" and gets a real driver for next year. His lack of talent aside, he does not have the personality to be a member of this club. It was shown before he even started the season, and he's done nothing to redeem himself.

For this to happen they will need another driver with the matching $$$ coming from his dad.

 

[Bacarrat]

Mazepin isn't going anywhere. As long as daddy pays for the sponsorship, he stays in the seat. Same goes to Stroll...but his daddy owns the team. About the only pay driver that is worth a damn is Checo.

 

[BytorJr]

Mazepin isn't going anywhere. As long as daddy pays for the sponsorship, he stays in the seat. Same goes to Stroll...but his daddy owns the team. About the only pay driver that is worth a damn is Checo.

I am actually wondering if RBR would have been better off with Albon another year. Checo makes WAY too many mistakes. Remember, Sir Crybaby ran Albon off twice when he would have been on the podium. Checo cannot qualify worth a shit. So either the RBR car is so freaking hard to drive or the others are not good drivers. My guess is that the car is a beast!!! That Max is literally so much better of driver than the rest of the field had he had the Merc the last 4 years he'd be 4x world champ - unquestionably.

Young Stroll actually isn't as awful as I thought. Is he Future F-1 World Champ. No. That list is short: Max, Lance, LeClerq and Russell.

Funny how Max just came out and said Albon has the speed. Literally in the last few hours: https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/...on-f1-return-with.7gAZDLeJ9kL7UKDu3Slh6Y.html

 

[Bacarrat]

Albon and Gasly both suffered under pressure. I don't know how many times last year Albon was stuck behind midfield teams for the duration of the races. Checo at least advances if he qualifies poorly. Plus he has a win, albeit, Max blowing up a tire and Hamilton overheated the brakes going into turn one at Baku. It's been only half a season I don't expect a world beater out of a #2 driver, I actually think he is a little ahead of what Albon and Gasly has done so far. In race pace, Checo has been pretty consistent most of his career.

Aside from last year, since Strolls car was basically a carbon copy of the 2019 Mercedes, he hasn't impressed much. Good for middle to rear of the midfield teams.

 

[eflyguy]

For this to happen they will need another driver with the matching $$$ coming from his dad.

Sigh, I suspected as much.

I do wish Checo could get a break. He did advance last weekend. Not many others did. That said, it should be RBR/Merc 1-4 every qualifying - but even this weekend, it was bad timing that put him out.

Bring on Monza! Oh, fark. "Sprint" qualifying.

Anyone want to talk about attending a race vs. watching on TV? I spent a weekend at Indy - not THAT weekend. I'll never forget the experience. Every practice session, the support races, qualy. The circus. They let us park on the infield Friday and Saturday. I walked dozens of miles. Took everything in. Standing at the fence on the back straight as those cars blew by and set off explosions with every gear shift. Mind-numbing.

My ex and daughter went to COTA in 2019. They parked just in time to get to their seats for the formation lap, and left shortly after it was over. I'm glad they made the effort, but I think they missed out on the real experience of F1.

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

Fox news announced it today, but apparently it became known on September 1st

Kimi is calling it quits. Remember him as a brash young man who loved to party. He suffered at McLaren, but was still one of the best of this generation. He was a favorite and he will be missed.

”Leave me alone; I know what I’m doing.”

Formula One champion Kimi 'The Iceman' Raikkonen announces retirement

2007 Formula One champion Kimi Raikkonen has announced his retirement from Formula One. The Finn will finish the season for his Alfa Romeo team.

www.foxnews.com

 

[eflyguy]

Fox news announced it today, but apparently it became known on September 1st

Every source that actually covers F1 announced it within minutes of the coordinated formal announcement from F1.com and AlfaRomeo (on the 1st). Kimi also, on his Instagram. A hastily-recorded "analysis" by Will and Lawrence in what looks like a hotel lobby was up on YouTube within an hour or so.

My point is - if you follow F1, Fox is not exactly "on the ball.."

 

[Schütze]

Every source that actually covers F1 announced it within minutes of the coordinated formal announcement from F1.com and AlfaRomeo (on the 1st). Kimi also, on his Instagram. A hastily-recorded "analysis" by Will and Lawrence in what looks like a hotel lobby was up on YouTube within an hour or so.

My point is - if you follow F1, Fox is not exactly "on the ball.."

Yes, will defiantly miss him. One of the last great ones. Now there are only cry babies left....

 

[brianf]

Kimi will be missed but I think he’s over rated…coming from a Ferrari fan.

he reminds me of a 90% Alonso.
Tons of ability, can drive anything …but it doesn’t mean he should drive everything.

stick to your profession and only your profession. If you are tired of being a mid packer up your game, don’t go to rally or lemans.

we’ve all heard stories of him drinking and partying, which while great for fans…makes you wonder if he lost a tenth or so once in a while because he wasn’t 100% all the time/every time. Could he have ran one more mile that would have kept him sharper on the last stages of a race.

 

[Schütze]

Kimi will be missed but I think he’s over rated…coming from a Ferrari fan.

he reminds me of a 90% Alonso.
Tons of ability, can drive anything …but it doesn’t mean he should drive everything.

stick to your profession and only your profession. If you are tired of being a mid packer up your game, don’t go to rally or lemans.

we’ve all heard stories of him drinking and partying, which while great for fans…makes you wonder if he lost a tenth or so once in a while because he wasn’t 100% all the time/every time. Could he have ran one more mile that would have kept him sharper on the last stages of a race.

Really ?? You can't be serious .... I better don't respond to your insult of one of the greatest drivers F1 had. It will do no good.

 

[eflyguy]

Hehe.. I love Kimi, mostly for his "don't give a" attitude, but he's also a strong family man. For someone to accomplish what he has with that attitude is pretty cool. Imagine if he had applied himself.

I've never had a favorite anything. I don't like all the fanfare around someone who happened to slide into the best seat for a number of years. That diminishes from the sport.

.. and oh my farking god get rid of that giggling bobblehead that F1/Sky is using now and then. What a freaking airhead! It's like they're catering to pre-pubescent school girls on tik-tok..

 

[brianf]

Really ?? You can't be serious .... I better don't respond to your insult of one of the greatest drivers F1 had. It will do no good.

Im not saying he doesnt have talent, he could prob jump in a school bus race and do well

but calling him one of the greatest drivers ever is a very long stretch

he was never the best driver on the track, he has had wonderful drives

but look over the last 20 years and there are a lot of names id take before I take kimi to start a team

i dont take the last 4-5 years or so into the equation because once the cost savings stated F1 has been ruined, im talking about when it was unlimited budget and tech

starting 12th and driving your way up to 4th on one set of tires is exceptional but try starting top 5 and winning not coming in 2nd...thats a great driver

kimi is behind alonso and in front of massa

look at his head to head stats with teammates who werent junk (trying to remove getting crashed from behind/accidents, so total points wont tell the total story)

he lost to alonso
he lost to vettle
even more / less with massa

massa should have the same amount of championships but timo glock forgot how to drive in the rain on the last corner in brazil

starting a team tomorrow youd pick these guys before kimi and all of them raced during his career

alonso
hamilton
vettle
schumacher

read this article on de la rosa who was on teams with him and the others

Former Teammate Reveals Where Kimi Raikkonen Lacks Compared to Lewis Hamilton and Fernando Alonso

According to former driver Pedro de la Rosa, world champion Kimi Raikkonen is a lesser driver than two other world champions: Alonso and Hamilton.

www.essentiallysports.com

not bashing him but his personality has overshadowed his skill at times

 

[BytorJr]

Hehe.. I love Kimi, mostly for his "don't give a" attitude, but he's also a strong family man. For someone to accomplish what he has with that attitude is pretty cool. Imagine if he had applied himself.

I've never had a favorite anything. I don't like all the fanfare around someone who happened to slide into the best seat for a number of years. That diminishes from the sport.

.. and oh my farking god get rid of that giggling bobblehead that F1/Sky is using now and then. What a freaking airhead! It's like they're catering to pre-pubescent school girls on tik-tok..

Not a Nico fan, eh? LOL. I almost have to go to mute when he comes on. I'm not really even much of a Button fan either. Martin Brundle is the guy and I like Johnny Herbert (he's a complete goofball).

 

[BytorJr]

Im not saying he doesnt have talent, he could prob jump in a school bus race and do well

but calling him one of the greatest drivers ever is a very long stretch

he was never the best driver on the track, he has had wonderful drives

but look over the last 20 years and there are a lot of names id take before I take kimi to start a team

i dont take the last 4-5 years or so into the equation because once the cost savings stated F1 has been ruined, im talking about when it was unlimited budget and tech

starting 12th and driving your way up to 4th on one set of tires is exceptional but try starting top 5 and winning not coming in 2nd...thats a great driver

kimi is behind alonso and in front of massa

look at his head to head stats with teammates who werent junk (trying to remove getting crashed from behind/accidents, so total points wont tell the total story)

he lost to alonso
he lost to vettle
even more / less with massa

massa should have the same amount of championships but timo glock forgot how to drive in the rain on the last corner in brazil

starting a team tomorrow youd pick these guys before kimi and all of them raced during his career

alonso
hamilton
vettle
schumacher

read this article on de la rosa who was on teams with him and the others

Former Teammate Reveals Where Kimi Raikkonen Lacks Compared to Lewis Hamilton and Fernando Alonso

According to former driver Pedro de la Rosa, world champion Kimi Raikkonen is a lesser driver than two other world champions: Alonso and Hamilton.

www.essentiallysports.com

not bashing him but his personality has overshadowed his skill at times

Yikes....of those 4. I think Alonso would be on my bottom slot, but barely. Tough call Schuey over Hamilton, but me thinks I'd go with Schumacher first as he showed he could drive and win without absolutely superior equipment. So in order: Schumacher, Hamilton, Vettel, Alonso for me. Alonso has a personality that's apparently quite abrasive to the the team, so looking at it from that perspective he's my last of those 4.

Massa. Hmmm. Which would you pick then...Massa or Barrichello? I'd agree Massa is every bit of the driver as Kimi.

 

[brianf]

Not a Nico fan, eh? LOL. I almost have to go to mute when he comes on. I'm not really even much of a Button fan either. Martin Brundle is the guy and I like Johnny Herbert (he's a complete goofball).

the one thing i do like about nico is what he said about wanting to retire

he didnt like the insane pressure
he didnt like the "fight" against teammates (he has said that several times, and he seems like a calm/hippy guy as well)

but one interview he was speaking about why not give it another go

paraphrasing.. he said he focused so hard and trained so hard the year he won the championship that he didnt think he had that level of dedication in him again. and knowing that level was needed to win championship he didnt want to race for second.

we can call him a wimp and such but he was still young/good on a top team and able to make big contract, so i believe him more than not


Yikes....of those 4. I think Alonso would be on my bottom slot, but barely. Tough call Schuey over Hamilton, but me thinks I'd go with Schumacher first as he showed he could drive and win without absolutely superior equipment. So in order: Schumacher, Hamilton, Vettel, Alonso for me. Alonso has a personality that's apparently quite abrasive to the the team, so looking at it from that perspective he's my last of those 4.

Massa. Hmmm. Which would you pick then...Massa or Barrichello? I'd agree Massa is every bit of the driver as Kimi.


i think in this day of racing the driver has so much input that their development skills are as important as on track skills

with that of my early 2000's list above (not in order):

schu.. personally i think he is better or even with senna and fangio is #1 for all time... not even a question

he was not only a talent but the team he always carried with him while a super talented group of engineers, they also knew how to communicate with each other which is why it was a powerhouse every year. schumacher knew the team was beginning to be very important years before the other drivers who were still hoping from car to car

alonso..is a dick to everyone no one liked him, but when he was young i guess he listened more lol

hamilton... everyone bitches at him...he can drive and i think he also has the development skills.

vettel...i think he is poor at development, prospered when his car was utterly dominant (newey is still one of the best aero guys) but 3-4 years in a row means you can drive

the massa/barr...i think massa has him but as a team mate barrichello was one of the best #2's there has been. needed to go light on fuel to pace the race for schue..he was able to get in front by the 3rd corner and hold up just enough. needed some great in-laps on bad tires not to get jumped and split the ferraris keeping the race plan in tact..you got them.

 

[Schütze]

Pedro Martínez de la Rosa
Race Wins: 0
Starts: 104
Races Led: 0
Front Row Starts: 0
So you take this guys "judgement" on Kimi seriously?

I judge Racing drivers by driving skills AND character, hence my comment Kimi being one of the greatest F1 drivers.

 

[Schütze]

And this racist prick LH will never be the greatest driver even if he wins every race / championship, at least not for me.

 

[Bacarrat]

And this racist prick LH will never be the greatest driver even if he wins every race / championship, at least not for me.

I think that is the general consensus for most non British race fans. Now more then ever, it's the car then the driver that makes up for the pace. Most evident last year when Russell took over in the second to last race and pretty much dominated the race in LH's car.

 

[brianf]

Pedro Martínez de la Rosa
Race Wins: 0
Starts: 104
Races Led: 0
Front Row Starts: 0
So you take this guys "judgement" on Kimi seriously?

I judge Racing drivers by driving skills AND character, hence my comment Kimi being one of the greatest F1 drivers.

….no I should take yours instead??? Lol

he didn’t say he was slow, he didn’t say he doesn’t like oversteer…he chose specific points where he was not as good as the other top drivers of his era.

you have one race to win who do you want out of Hamilton, Alanso, kimi all in their prime….not kimi

if what you say were true then the NFL should fire all the scouts just ask the player with the best numbers that to make draft pics

 

[Schütze]

….no I should take yours instead??? Lol

he didn’t say he was slow, he didn’t say he doesn’t like oversteer…he chose specific points where he was not as good as the other top drivers of his era.

you have one race to win who do you want out of Hamilton, Alanso, kimi all in their prime….not kimi

if what you say were true then the NFL should fire all the scouts just ask the player with the best numbers that to make draft pics

Nothing in this treat is about truth Sir, just your and my opinions and views on things. Out of the 3 you mention there it could only be Kimi, because one is a bastard and the other a whiner. But you of course knew that I'd say that, that's why you choose the 3.

 

[eflyguy]

I can appreciate 44's talent, but can't stand his arrogant and whinging personality as his success grew.

Same with Michael.

If I were king (of a team) I'd be a failure, because I'd much rather have a relatively talented driver like Kimi who didn't pander to the media circus. I fully accept, however, that is the show. F1 wouldn't exist without it. It's all about money, not fans or technology.

 

[eflyguy]

Hehe.. anyone else spot the glaring jab at Lewis by Bottas in Sprint Qualifying?

He could have easily given 44 the chance to pass the McLarens, imo. I wonder what mystical problem caused 44 to fail..

(and 340kph?? DANG!!)

 

[geek65]

About as exciting as watching paint dry, much prefer MotoGP (probably more overtaking in one race [if not one lap] than a whole F1 season). Although F1 was interesting in the 1980s/1990s and I do like the cars from the 1960/1970s. F1 may be of more interest when Lewis Hamilton retires. Also liked Group B rallying.

 

[bigdaddydmd]

I enjoy the sprint qualifying. I knew Bottas was quick this weekend but man, did he and Maxx lead that pack. Max couldn't get within DRS range of him. It was nice to see the Mclarens fighting for second row.

 

[Shooter McGavin]

I enjoy the sprint qualifying. I knew Bottas was quick this weekend but man, did he and Maxx lead that pack. Max couldn't get within DRS range of him. It was nice to see the Mclarens fighting for second row.

Max has an old power unit and Bottas just got a new power unit, so that made the difference. I am glad to see Ricardo on the front row tomorrow. Hopefully we see a shoey tomorrow after the race.

 

[eflyguy]

Yup. Was pretty dull. WTH were they thinking in having a sprint qualy @ Monza? Just for the show - again - effectively two races.

I am pleased with the final outcome, except for Gasley - but he f'd up all by himself. He should be up near the front but he screwed that up.

Anyone ever watch supercross (MX) and the like? Now THAT'S how they should start F1 races! .. but then they'd need guards around the cars, like kiddie carts.

 

[eflyguy]

(or NASCAR.. )

 

[eflyguy]

 

[Jethro3898]

In my opinion, this was stupid by both parties.

I think sometimes Verstappen is too aggressive. He has gotten so much better at thinking ahead, but it still creeps it’s ugly head every now and then. I think Verstappen thought Lewis would back off and Lewis was like “bump that”. Lewis was a little desperate.

I think if Max had backed off slightly and let Lewis get the temporary “victory”, he had the pace to overtake him within 3-4 laps. I don’t think Lewis could have held the lead.

I think one of the reasons people like Max is his aggressive driving style. It’s exciting. The problem is he only has one approach: aggressive. Most drivers will back off from Max….Lewis not so much (especially since he is behind in the championship). We applaud Max for his aggressiveness, but it can also be his Achilles heel.

Max had way more to lose. My opinion is that he should have backed off because he would have gained that spot back in a few laps time.

 

[Jethro3898]

I’m just glad to see a McLaren 1-2 on the podium. That’s so awesome. Been a long time.

 

[eflyguy]

Shoey...

 

[BytorJr]

I decided to hit the head and work on my car. Come back to TV and all that Senna/Prost stuff had happened.

But the look on Lando's face after doing the Shoey was worth it. He spit it out and almost puked!!! No wonder he wanted to pass Ricciardo.

Racing incident though. Neither were going to budge. Cry Baby rather pushed Max almost off track coming out of the pits. However, I think the real cause of this wreck was that sausage kerb and how it literally threw Max's car into Hamilton's. I had to mute cry baby and his mother toto. Max was mature in his answers and didn't fall for the obvious trap with which Ms. Pinkham tried to corner him.

That said, I lost complete and utter respect for Damon Hill. Not that I had a lot to begin with; but his comments that "well I'm not really accusing Max of purposely doing that." (But I really am....) just really floored me.

 

[eflyguy]

As much as I'll admit I don't like 44, I'm pretty sure it's clear he caused this.

Watch the start, and how 44 treats Norris in 1-2. Almost identical situation.

Same with LeClerc and Giovinazzi right behind them. If you take the inside at 1, you have to leave space to the left at 2. 44 just cut straight across.

Turn 4 is not the same, despite some commentary on it being "tit for tat"..

Toto was relatively neutral in his comments, and Horner was quite reserved.

So to address DH's comments - I go the other way. I'd say 44 realized he might lose another couple of points, and calculated better to both go out. Remember, DH is a fanboi. It keeps him popular with his home audience - job security.

 

[Schütze]

Hopefully he realizes that he could loose his life doing the shit when he watches the video.

 

[BytorJr]

As much as I'll admit I don't like 44, I'm pretty sure it's clear he caused this.

Watch the start, and how 44 treats Norris in 1-2. Almost identical situation.

Same with LeClerc and Giovinazzi right behind them. If you take the inside at 1, you have to leave space to the left at 2. 44 just cut straight across.

Turn 4 is not the same, despite some commentary on it being "tit for tat"..

Toto was relatively neutral in his comments, and Horner was quite reserved.

So to address DH's comments - I go the other way. I'd say 44 realized he might lose another couple of points, and calculated better to both go out. Remember, DH is a fanboi. It keeps him popular with his home audience - job security.

I think you're exactly right. He has a history of punting people are not being exactly "sporting." IMO, very Senna like. No shocker as that's his idol. But, the shunt at Silverstone should have left him with a 1 race ban IMO, not a freaking 10 second penalty. This is the result, he knows he won't be called out.

 

[Jethro3898]

Max just got handed a 3 spot grid penalty over incident.

 

[Schütze]

Max just got handed a 3 spot grid penalty over incident.

BASTARDS !! At its very best it was 50/50

 

[BytorJr]

Sir crybaby always gets protected. Perez should be tasked with taking him out every race

 

[eflyguy]

If you have the ability to watch the "checkered flag" post-race, they have Philipe Masa on and he explains it exactly - if 44 was going to push Max, it should have been at the first turn-in, pushing Max down the escape road. Cutting across to the left-hander after leaving space is too late for a move like that. This was recorded long before the official decision.

Also, watching more replays, the on-board shows Max going to full left lock to try and avoid 44 as he's cutting across and running him off-track. Over and over we hear about how if the front axle of one car is ahead of the rear of another, it has "the right" to be alongside thru the corner. 33's fronts were about to run over 44's! You can frame-by-frame at around 40s here to see what I'm talking about. It also shows 44 was about a foot away from the apex - with a car alongside, on the inside:
(you'll have to watch on YT, can't stop this site from trying to embed it: )

Very, very disappointed in the stewards on this one. I think most of the former-driver commentators (except DH) will be as well (especially considering the 10s for 44 @ Silverstone!)

 

[BytorJr]

If you have the ability to watch the "checkered flag" post-race, they have Philipe Masa on and he explains it exactly - if 44 was going to push Max, it should have been at the first turn-in, pushing Max down the escape road. Cutting across to the left-hander after leaving space is too late for a move like that. This was recorded long before the official decision.

Also, watching more replays, the on-board shows Max going to full left lock to try and avoid 44 as he's cutting across and running him off-track. Over and over we hear about how if the front axle of one car is ahead of the rear of another, it has "the right" to be alongside thru the corner. 33's fronts were about to run over 44's! You can frame-by-frame at around 40s here to see what I'm talking about. It also shows 44 was about a foot away from the apex - with a car alongside, on the inside:
(you'll have to watch on YT, can't stop this site from trying to embed it: )

Very, very disappointed in the stewards on this one. I think most of the former-driver commentators (except DH) will be as well (especially considering the 10s for 44 @ Silverstone!)

Martin Brundle is generally correct on every single call he's made regarding 44. di Resta, Davidson and Chandoff also get it right. Only DH thought it was Max. I'd like to know who the driver's steward was today.

I'll look at the video; but the problem is, Merc basically threatens F1 with pull-out and they cower. Back when we had lot's of different engines, that couldn't happen and Bernie would have said...F-off.

Video is down though.

 

[eflyguy]

Video is down though.

Have to click on the "watch on youtube" link. It's there. Or just go to YT and search for "Verstappen & Hamilton Clash" posted yesterday by "Formula 1".

 

[Shooter McGavin]

Max will probably take his new power unit at the Russian GP, so that 3 spot grid penalty won't mean anything as he will be starting from the back. I put it down as a racing incident. They were both being aggressive and not backing off. Good news is that only Max score points towards the championship during the sprint race.

 

[BytorJr]

Exactly as I suspected...TOTO is the culprit to getting the grid penalty.

‘Tactical foul’ or ‘racing incident’? Wolff and Horner have their say on Verstappen and Hamilton’s Monza clash | Formula 1®

Mercedes Team Principal Toto Wolff and his Red Bull counterpart Christian Horner were never likely to agree on who was at fault in the dramatic clash between Lewis Hamilton and Max Verstappen in the Italian Grand Prix – and so it proved, with Wolff calling it a “tactical foul”, as Horner...

www.formula1.com

Helmut Marko needs to put his best person on this: Yuki!!!

 

[bigdaddydmd]

So Hamilton gets a 10 sec penalty for causing a wreck that almost killed Verstappen and when the reverse is true Verstappen gets a 3 grid penalty and 2 points docked? WTF?

 

[eflyguy]

Do you have to ask?

Oh, sorry, you must be racist.

 

[Shooter McGavin]

 

[eflyguy]

I won't post the link because this forum tries to embed, but if you go to F1's YouTube channel, they have Jolyn Palmer's analysis of the incident which goes into some detail. It's impartial, and as much as I'm not a fan of his, I found it worth watching. Nothing new, but interesting comparisons.