Any F1 racing fans?

[BytorJr]

Lewis looked like a sore loser on Sunday.

He acted like one as well. Saying things like: THEY are against me, they don't want us to win, they this and that, they they they. Unlike 1: Danny Ric who admitted he screwed up when passing Ocon (he's a jerk anyway) and Carlos "There's a wall there" Sainz who both admitted "my fault."

Granted, "Bono" told Lewis that he could do the start outside of that area, but the Formula1.com site said the team had no clue he was so far up the road. Problem is Lewis thinks he owns F-1 now. Time for Red Bull to give Max THE CAR. No question in equivalent cars Max would destroy Hamilton (my opinion). It's obvious the Red Bull is incredibly hard to drive, very twitchy and a lot of "snap" in it. My disgust in Hamilton grows weekly. He has been and always will be a crybaby.

 

[bigdaddydmd]

I got up extra early to watch it Sunday and that 0410 start time is hard on a Sunday morning. While the race was pretty uneventful it was still worth it. Especially watching Kvyat stick in there for so long. Not that I'm a big fan of him.

I still do no understand why Hamilton was administered two 5 second penalties? Did he have two practice starts? And why was he allowed to serve both 5 sec penalties at the same pit stop? I thought they couldn't be served in the same stop?

Ferrari just don't have the car to compete, but both Vettel and Leclerc sure can play defense and hold up the pack. I'm going to be torn next year since I'm not a huge Scuderia fan, but I do like Sainz and am hoping he and LeClerc make a potent combo for Ferrari.

 

[BytorJr]

I got up extra early to watch it Sunday and that 0410 start time is hard on a Sunday morning. While the race was pretty uneventful it was still worth it. Especially watching Kvyat stick in there for so long. Not that I'm a big fan of him.

I still do no understand why Hamilton was administered two 5 second penalties? Did he have two practice starts? And why was he allowed to serve both 5 sec penalties at the same pit stop? I thought they couldn't be served in the same stop?

Ferrari just don't have the car to compete, but both Vettel and Leclerc sure can play defense and hold up the pack. I'm going to be torn next year since I'm not a huge Scuderia fan, but I do like Sainz and am hoping he and LeClerc make a potent combo for Ferrari.

My understanding from what Sky said (I used DVR this week though ), was that
1) Yes, he did two practice starts (we only saw the one). TV cameras did not pick up the first practice start the way I read it.
2) If the penalty is given before the race it has to be served in the race (or maybe it is if it occurs before a pit stop).

I really don't like Ferrari; but I'd much rather see them win than Mercedes. At heart Ferrari is still a sports car/racing car company and mercedes is just some big corporate blob who has no real emotional attachment to racing from my eyes. Red Bull is new, practically speaking, to the sport and definitely has more "racing" in their blood from all forms of motorsport they do, so does Williams (RIP) and Renault as well.

 

[Jethro3898]

Bytor, you are correct.

As we all know, you are required to take 1 pit stop in a F1 Grand Prix.....you can take more than 1, but 1 is required.

I believe I'm correct about this: If a time penalty for an infraction is leveled against a driver before their required pit stop in a Grand Prix (not necessarily before the race begins), the driver must serve the penalty at his pit stop. Should it be leveled against a driver after their pit stop, a driver can elect to either take another pit stop and serve the penalty or have the time penalty assessed to his final race time.

I've never been a Ferrari fan, but my heart really goes out to them this year. At first it was kind of funny that their car sucked, now I feel bad for them that they can barely get out of Q3. Hearing the communication between the pit wall and Seb is almost cringeworthy. You can tell he lost all confidence in the car a while back; now he has lost all confidence in the team. A competitive Ferrari is good for F1, as is Renault, McLaren and Williams.....simply due to legacy.

 

[bigdaddydmd]

Looks like Ferrari is bringing up some of their F2 Ferrair Drivers Academy for practice at the next Grand Prix, notably Schumacher. Wonder what this means for next year for Alpha Romeo drivers?

 

[Aussiedan]

I love all racing, it takes massive talent, physical conditioning and no shortage of balls to be at the top.
However, since F1 has recently become the platform for a certain hypocritical, wealthy, entitled whiny little bitch to tell everyone how oppressed he is, i wont watch.

I cant and won't support anyone who endorses the BLM group.

I 100% support the message that black lives matter, just not the group itself.

 

[BytorJr]

Bytor, you are correct.

As we all know, you are required to take 1 pit stop in a F1 Grand Prix.....you can take more than 1, but 1 is required.

I believe I'm correct about this: If a time penalty for an infraction is leveled against a driver before their required pit stop in a Grand Prix (not necessarily before the race begins), the driver must serve the penalty at his pit stop. Should it be leveled against a driver after their pit stop, a driver can elect to either take another pit stop and serve the penalty or have the time penalty assessed to his final race time.

I've never been a Ferrari fan, but my heart really goes out to them this year. At first it was kind of funny that their car sucked, now I feel bad for them that they can barely get out of Q3. Hearing the communication between the pit wall and Seb is almost cringeworthy. You can tell he lost all confidence in the car a while back; now he has lost all confidence in the team. A competitive Ferrari is good for F1, as is Renault, McLaren and Williams.....simply due to legacy.

Yeah, having Williams and McClaren good again will make a world of difference. Renault has always been a supplier of engines so them having a factory team is different. Though, as a Prost fan, I like he's kind of assumed a "Lauda" roll with them. I'll grant you that it's hard to see Team Red struggling to out qualify Haas and Williams. That said, I'll never be a fan after the treatment they gave Prost in his second season. Yeah, I harbor a grudge .

As for Aussiedan, I'm almost there myself. LH's bullshit is getting a bit unbearable. I just about said F-it when he had the Brianna shirt on. Had Merc had balls they'd have said..uhh, dude...you know the RULES say you are not supposed to wear that. Then F-1 themselves wussed out and gave him a finger shake. Though I think they reminded folks of the sporting regulations about shirts like that.

 

[BytorJr]

Holy crap....HONDA pulls out of Formula-1....insanity.

 

[bigdaddydmd]

Yep. Saw that earlier today. Talk about leaving Red Bull high and dry. This really leaves a hole in F1 for some other company to bring in a new power plant. Wonder if anyone will step up? I don't see Renault and Red Bull having that great of a relationship anymore, but I dont' think Mercedes or Ferrari will be interested in selling them powerplants.

 

[Sieg]

Mercedes appears to have an insider advantage with the FIA handlers. I'm sick and tired of wonder who may be able to luck into a podium finish with the two Mercs. Max was the only one that appeared to give them any competition if he didn't suffer a mechanical.

How Mercedes can have the mechanical advantage they've had over multiple years only means one thing....... $$$.

F1 has become as boring as NASCAR and has joined the failing ranks of the NFL and NBA chasing the political sponsor dollar.

Thankfully this years MotoGP season has been the best wheel to wheel racing I've seen in nearly two decades. Not to mention the riders have some serious f'n skin in game.

 

[BytorJr]

I don't think it's quite as boring 1998-2005. I didn't watch much F-1 then. Especially the midfield battle was not nearly as interesting back then.

Yeah, Red Bull got shafted big time. I doubt any new manufacturers can come to speed quick enough to be competitive. Toyota may be capable, but they sucked last time out. Porsche flirted with it and came to their senses that it'd actually devalue the brand if they couldn't compete. I could possibly see VW or Audi doing an engine/team, but with Porsche brains behind it. That said, 1 year isn't enough time to develop an F-1 engine.

It would be funny if Ford came back into F-1 and blew everybody away. I'd be okay with that, and I'm not a Ford lover. It'd be great if an American company came in a dominated the engine world. Haas-Ford, Red Bull-Ford. F-1 actually somewhat fits into Ford's business policy of Turbos and Hybrids. They should totally do it .

 

[bigdaddydmd]

I was thinking the same thing regarding Ford. I would even take Porsche getting back into it.

 

[BytorJr]

I was thinking the same thing regarding Ford. I would even take Porsche getting back into it.

Fond memories for me of TAG-Porsche McClaren. But I think I read where two or three years ago when they were trying to figure out the 2021 (now 2022) tech specs they were almost committed, then pulled out. It really seems right up Ford's alley. They've heavily invested in Turbo and Hybrid. I don't know the 2022 rules though. Then again, now that Porsche pulled out of LMP2 they're really depending on the RSR-19 4.2L to carry the name; and sadly, it's somewhat outclassed at the moment. I tend to agree with Porsche that endurance racing translates more to better road cars than F-1.

Also, the Footwork Porsche was AWFUL. Pretty much, Metzger (who was previously seen as an absolute genius at engine design) royally screwed up. Nice article here:

When Porsche produced its biggest F1 flop

www.motorsport.com

 

[Unknown]

I really like F1 racing and the technology they bring into auto and engine building. I don't think many people realize the physical demands of trying to control a car with that much power and grip on the racetrack. With that said, I have always had a thing for the Lemans prototype cars, and the enclosed wheel hypercars for endurance racing. I think the lines of the enclosed wheel cars are more aesthetically pleasing to me, but it is really hard to argue against the cornering ability and overall performance of the F1 cars.

 

[BytorJr]

I really like F1 racing and the technology they bring into auto and engine building. I don't think many people realize the physical demands of trying to control a car with that much power and grip on the racetrack. With that said, I have always had a thing for the Lemans prototype cars, and the enclosed wheel hypercars for endurance racing. I think the lines of the enclosed wheel cars are more aesthetically pleasing to me, but it is really hard to argue against the cornering ability and overall performance of the F1 cars.

I prefer the older LMP cars without that big fin on the bag. Classic cars like 917, 956, 962, 911 GT and even the Spyder. Not just the Porsche's but their competitors also looked good. Now you have those blunt front ends that just don't do it for me. Granted, the Halo in F-1 has somewhat ruined the looks and I don't think I could drive with that big giant thing in my line of sight. That said, they have already saved what would likely have been a few bad outcomes.

It's amazing to see how slow even the LMP cars are compared to F-1 (at least in turns). Then when you watch GT class it's like they're barely even moving. It's somewhat as obvious in person as well.

 

[Unknown]

I was reading about one of the new class of hypercars that might be able to compete in the LMP class cars next year that puts out 840 horsepower, and the body style (with the exception of the rear fin) is really gorgeous. They were saying that while the F1 cars are faster around a track, that some of the LMP cars are faster in a straight line. In either case, the performance of either F1 or LMP cars is truly marvelous.

When I was much younger I wondered why they would want to limit the horsepower of any competition cars. I eventually understood why safety had to take precedence over all out performance. I still think it would be interesting to find out just how fast they could get cars to go and compete if the drivers had enough courage and daring to drive a 1500 pound vehicle that would have 1700 horsepower ..... if it would be allowed. I know I wouldn't want anything more to do with driving a vehicle like that any more than I want to drive a 300 horsepower 400 pound motorcycle.

When asked how fast some of those unlimited motorcycles or autos could go, the response was "zero to infinity faster than you could say "Oh, SHIT. I'M GOING WAAAY TO FAST!"

 

[BytorJr]

I was reading about one of the new class of hypercars that might be able to compete in the LMP class cars next year that puts out 840 horsepower, and the body style (with the exception of the rear fin) is really gorgeous. They were saying that while the F1 cars are faster around a track, that some of the LMP cars are faster in a straight line. In either case, the performance of either F1 or LMP cars is truly marvelous.

When I was much younger I wondered why they would want to limit the horsepower of any competition cars. I eventually understood why safety had to take precedence over all out performance. I still think it would be interesting to find out just how fast they could get cars to go and compete if the drivers had enough courage and daring to drive a 1500 pound vehicle that would have 1700 horsepower ..... if it would be allowed. I know I wouldn't want anything more to do with driving a vehicle like that any more than I want to drive a 300 horsepower 400 pound motorcycle.

When asked how fast some of those unlimited motorcycles or autos could go, the response was "zero to infinity faster than you could say "Oh, SHIT. I'M GOING WAAAY TO FAST!"

Yep. Most of the LMP cars even LMP 2 are faster in straight line due to lack of drag those open wheels cause.

However your high horsepower and light weight describe the 60/70s Porsche,Ferrari, Ford and others What’s really hard to fathom is how successful the mostly unknown Porsche 936 was. Even well into 80s.

 

[Jethro3898]

I know that most people despise Lewis, but history was made yesterday and the list of achievements has gotten pretty long, so I feel it is worth mentioning.
If we will all remember, people hated Vettel during his streak and Schumacher during his. For that matter, I vividly remember when people hated Jimmie Johnson and Jeff Gordon during their gashes in NASCAR.....I think people just get tired of seeing the same person at the top all of the time. Lewis just adds fuel to the fire with his off-track (and now pre-race) antics.

After winning the Portuguese Grand Prix, Lewis Hamilton how holds the record of most Formula 1 wins in history with 92.....passing Michael Schumacher’s previously held record of 91. For those who don’t keep up with such things, the next closest win totals are 53 (Vettel), 51 (Prost) and 41 (Senna).

Vettel (with 53 wins) is still active, but certainly on the decline, and the only other active driver with any notable number of wins is Kimi Raikkonen at 21. The next closest to Kimi is Valteri Bottas and Max Verstappen with 9 wins each. So 92 wins is bonkers.

Long story short: very impressive and likely not to be equaled or surpassed. 4 or 5 years ago, no one thought Schumacher’s record was ever going to be broken....not even Vettel, who had the best shot at the time. I’d guess that Lewis has maybe 2-3 more years before he sails off into the sunset. He is most certainly going to equal Schumacher’s 7 world championship titles this season. Even though he doesn’t say it, I’m sure Hamilton wants to win an 8th next year and officially break virtually every meaningful record.

Lewis holds the following records as of this post:
Most pole positions, with 97 (next closest is 68, Schumacher)
Most podium finishes, with 161 (next closest is 155, Schumacher)
Most races finished in the points, with 225 (next closest is 221, Schumacher)
Most consecutive points finishes, with 45 (next closest is 27, Raikkonen)
Highest percentage of races finished in the points, with 86% (next closest is 81%, Fangio)
Most races where driver led every lap, with 22 (next closest is 19, Senna)
Most races where driver led at least 1 lap, with 159 (next closest is 142, Schumacher)
Longest total distance led, with 25,259 km (next closest is 24,148 km, Schumacher)
Most pole positions and wins in same race, with 57 (next closest is 40, Schumacher)
(In fairness, there are dozens of records Hamilton does not hold, but the ones above are the records typically considered most desirable/impressive.)

It was fun to see history made.
Im excited to see if the 2022 reg changes (I think they bumped them 1 year due to COVID) make any meaningful changes in the competition levels among teams.

 

[BytorJr]

I know that most people despise Lewis, but history was made yesterday and the list of achievements has gotten pretty long, so I feel it is worth mentioning.
If we will all remember, people hated Vettel during his streak and Schumacher during his. For that matter, I vividly remember when people hated Jimmie Johnson and Jeff Gordon during their gashes in NASCAR.....I think people just get tired of seeing the same person at the top all of the time. Lewis just adds fuel to the fire with his off-track (and now pre-race) antics.

After winning the Portuguese Grand Prix, Lewis Hamilton how holds the record of most Formula 1 wins in history with 92.....passing Michael Schumacher’s previously held record of 91. For those who don’t keep up with such things, the next closest win totals are 53 (Vettel), 51 (Prost) and 41 (Senna).

Vettel (with 53 wins) is still active, but certainly on the decline, and the only other active driver with any notable number of wins is Kimi Raikkonen at 21. The next closest to Kimi is Valteri Bottas and Max Verstappen with 9 wins each. So 92 wins is bonkers.

Long story short: very impressive and likely not to be equaled or surpassed. 4 or 5 years ago, no one thought Schumacher’s record was ever going to be broken....not even Vettel, who had the best shot at the time. I’d guess that Lewis has maybe 2-3 more years before he sails off into the sunset. He is most certainly going to equal Schumacher’s 7 world championship titles this season. Even though he doesn’t say it, I’m sure Hamilton wants to win an 8th next year and officially break virtually every meaningful record.

Lewis holds the following records as of this post:
Most pole positions, with 97 (next closest is 68, Schumacher)
Most podium finishes, with 161 (next closest is 155, Schumacher)
Most races finished in the points, with 225 (next closest is 221, Schumacher)
Most consecutive points finishes, with 45 (next closest is 27, Raikkonen)
Highest percentage of races finished in the points, with 86% (next closest is 81%, Fangio)
Most races where driver led every lap, with 22 (next closest is 19, Senna)
Most races where driver led at least 1 lap, with 159 (next closest is 142, Schumacher)
Longest total distance led, with 25,259 km (next closest is 24,148 km, Schumacher)
Most pole positions and wins in same race, with 57 (next closest is 40, Schumacher)
(In fairness, there are dozens of records Hamilton does not hold, but the ones above are the records typically considered most desirable/impressive.)

It was fun to see history made.
Im excited to see if the 2022 reg changes (I think they bumped them 1 year due to COVID) make any meaningful changes in the competition levels among teams.

Well, in defense of my man Prost and even Senna, they had MUCH stiffer competition and I'm not just talking drivers - teams were more competitive then, reliability was much worse (like MUCH worse), the scoring system was completely different and they had like 16 races a year. I believe at one time somebody computed that Prost would have been 6 or 7 time WDC with the current points standings. Truly his worst year was the 2nd year with Ferrari.

Now, nothing against Hamilton the driver, but his politics need to stay out of the racing game.

Now, on to better things. EVERY driver has commented that Mugello, San Marino, Portimao, Nurburgring are all "intense", "not like today's tracks" , a "real track", "fun." When all the tracks got (re)designed by Hermann Tilke, they became sterile tracks with no penalty for screwing up. Had they got the DRS right at San Marino it would have been unreal -50 to 100 meters more and it'd have been serious hard core defending. So, I hope after this year there is some push to de-sterilize these tracks. We need more Mugello, Portimao - just like Suzuka is, Spa. I still think COTA is way too sterile and typical - trying to copy other turns from tracks instead of making it's own mark. That Alan Jones commented Tilke's tracks are constant radius turns say sit all - BORING.

COTA is not 1/4 the track of Laguna Seca, Road Atlanta or VIR. None of those is up to safety standards. I missed my opportunity to drive Road Atlanta and VIR way back in 2003-4 time frame. To bring Road Atlanta up to safety standards would be $$$$$$$$$$$. Too many walls would have to be moved, runoff areas - but can you imagine F-1 there?

Max said he'll have to drive till 40 .

I also think Albon is gone...Checo will most certainly replace him. Red Bull have to have 2 good drivers in order to get Max that Championship. Perez will push Max, but I doubt can actually beat him (at least not often). But Albon is 0.5-0.8 seconds behind in quali and his race performances has sucked as of late.

 

[bigdaddydmd]

Well stated. The best part of the 2020 season was getting to see tracks that normally aren't on the circuit. They took a toll on these drivers and cars since the speeds and downforce have increased so much and those tracks were designed back when cars were slower. Look at how many tracks have had new fastest lap times set this year. How often do you see a double red flag race or the amount of DNF/retired that occurred this year? That is what I have been watching. Granted they are still running on Pirelli compounds designed for 2018 and that has had a factor in the amount of DNF.

Yes, 2020 is the year of Mercedes, but I could give two shits about that. They have been boringly surgical, precise, and maddingly dominant. Midpack has been entertaining as it usually is.

The shifts in drivers by the teams for next year will be intense. I don't know about Albon. It looks like Red Bull will stand by him, but I think his time is up. The stand out to me this year was Hulkenberg. Hell, he only raced twice and isn't even one of the 20 drivers. I think he may show back up in F1 next year somewhere, but there is a lot of young competition in the stables in F2 waiting.

 

[BytorJr]

Well stated. The best part of the 2020 season was getting to see tracks that normally aren't on the circuit. They took a toll on these drivers and cars since the speeds and downforce have increased so much and those tracks were designed back when cars were slower. Look at how many tracks have had new fastest lap times set this year. How often do you see a double red flag race or the amount of DNF/retired that occurred this year? That is what I have been watching. Granted they are still running on Pirelli compounds designed for 2018 and that has had a factor in the amount of DNF.

Yes, 2020 is the year of Mercedes, but I could give two shits about that. They have been boringly surgical, precise, and maddingly dominant. Midpack has been entertaining as it usually is.

The shifts in drivers by the teams for next year will be intense. I don't know about Albon. It looks like Red Bull will stand by him, but I think his time is up. The stand out to me this year was Hulkenberg. Hell, he only raced twice and isn't even one of the 20 drivers. I think he may show back up in F1 next year somewhere, but there is a lot of young competition in the stables in F2 waiting.

Yes, I think the San Marino time was like 5 seconds faster!!!! Unreal.

Ahh, the Hulk. He's a cool customer for sure. I loved how he drove up in in Porsche 911 GT2, looked for a car parking area, and swiped his badge going "into work" in the pits. Must be a crappy life to be hanging with "a friend" getting coffee (guarantee a supermodel) and have to drive into work to hop in an F-1 car. I actually think he'd be better with Max than Checo. I can see conflict if Checo arrives at Red Bull. But Horner for sure is sticking by Albon....will Helmut?

 

[Shooter McGavin]

Yes, I think the San Marino time was like 5 seconds faster!!!! Unreal.

Ahh, the Hulk. He's a cool customer for sure. I loved how he drove up in in Porsche 911 GT2, looked for a car parking area, and swiped his badge going "into work" in the pits. Must be a crappy life to be hanging with "a friend" getting coffee (guarantee a supermodel) and have to drive into work to hop in an F-1 car. I actually think he'd be better with Max than Checo. I can see conflict if Checo arrives at Red Bull. But Horner for sure is sticking by Albon....will Helmut?

Albon needs to go. I like him he just isn't able to help Max or Red Bull right now. Max is left all alone against the silver arrows.

 

[BytorJr]

Albon needs to go. I like him he just isn't able to help Max or Red Bull right now. Max is left all alone against the silver arrows.

I like what Max said in one of the press conferences, that he and Louis should switch cars for a few laps. My guess is that was kind of a shot over the bow of the special one. Kind of like saying - dude, I could so kick your butt if I had your car. I can almost guarantee that Louis could not drive Max's car well and certainly he'd be whining every single turn. The fact that Gasly is doing well at Alpha Tauri and driving lights out and that Albon cannot do shit tells me that the RB is VERY difficult to drive. So much so that I think that was Max telling Louis that if I get a good car...you're done. Granted, Max is the only driver since Prost that's really excited me - well, maybe a young Seb Vettel. Though actually George Russell and Lando Norris are exciting to watch too - of these 2 I think Lando is the racer and Russell is the analyst (kind of a bit like Senna and Prost).

Actually, looking back at what I just wrote - Hulk seems the man for the job over Perez. Not just because I can see personality differences between Perez and Max, but The Hulk is obviously a fast learner and capable of driving something unfamiliar - like when he did 5 laps before a race in quali and finished in the points!!!!!!! I just read where Max and Nico actually are pretty good buddies. Besides, any driver cruising up in his GT2 gets my vote because a lot of these newer guys just have prissy sedans.

 

[Shooter McGavin]

I like what Max said in one of the press conferences, that he and Louis should switch cars for a few laps. My guess is that was kind of a shot over the bow of the special one. Kind of like saying - dude, I could so kick your butt if I had your car. I can almost guarantee that Louis could not drive Max's car well and certainly he'd be whining every single turn. The fact that Gasly is doing well at Alpha Tauri and driving lights out and that Albon cannot do shit tells me that the RB is VERY difficult to drive. So much so that I think that was Max telling Louis that if I get a good car...you're done. Granted, Max is the only driver since Prost that's really excited me - well, maybe a young Seb Vettel. Though actually George Russell and Lando Norris are exciting to watch too - of these 2 I think Lando is the racer and Russell is the analyst (kind of a bit like Senna and Prost).

Lewis has troubles when following others his car is set up for him and he has a lot of in put to that. As long as he's out front he's unstoppable. Lewis spends a ton of time with the engineers to learn everything he possible can, a lot more than most. I would believe that Max has in put to how the car should be set up for his driving. More experienced drivers can set cars up.

When I was racing I had a professional race car driver set my car up. It was a night and day difference on the way it drove. Also, had him coach me. My car weigh more than every one else and had less HP; I won the 2017 regional championship because of him. I would imagine an F1 driver would be skilled after driving an F1, but I guess not everyone can be Niki Lauda and set up a car. Since, Niki got Lewis to go to Merc, I am sure he helped him in learning how to set up F1 cars.

I would say todays modern F1 cars are harder to drive if the aero isn't set up properly. The rear on the cars are heavy and want to slide out and unfortunately when you drive on the edge in those cars it's almost impossible to catch the car before it goes into a spin. With that said they need to go back to just V-8 engines to allow other engine makers into the sport and to cut down on the DNFs. JMO

 

[BytorJr]

Lewis has troubles when following others his car is set up for him and he has a lot of in put to that. As long as he's out front he's unstoppable. Lewis spends a ton of time with the engineers to learn everything he possible can, a lot more than most. I would believe that Max has in put to how the car should be set up for his driving. More experienced drivers can set cars up.

When I was racing I had a professional race car driver set my car up. It was a night and day difference on the way it drove. Also, had him coach me. My car weigh more than every one else and had less HP; I won the 2017 regional championship because of him. I would imagine an F1 driver would be skilled after driving an F1, but I guess not everyone can be Niki Lauda and set up a car. Since, Niki got Lewis to go to Merc, I am sure he helped him in learning how to set up F1 cars.

I would say todays modern F1 cars are harder to drive if the aero isn't set up properly. The rear on the cars are heavy and want to slide out and unfortunately when you drive on the edge in those cars it's almost impossible to catch the car before it goes into a spin. With that said they need to go back to just V-8 engines to allow other engine makers into the sport and to cut down on the DNFs. JMO

Agree!!!

I'd like to see the V-10's myself . God bless they sounded great. More manufacturers as well.

As regards to the late Niki Lauda. If you've noticed since Prost got back to Renault, they've been making good strides. I think Niki taught Prost a lot and I know Prost taught Senna a lot those first 2 years on how to set up a car. But back then the suspension had a lot more to do with it. You're right, just a tad bit of aero adjustment can make a huge difference. Though, I think Albon just doesn't have it. He's mentally done.

I taught HPDE for 6 years or so. Got out of it in 2008 when the economy tanked, had another run in 2012-2013 when a few of us rented a track to play on a few times; and at that time I had been approached at that time by Porsche Club to get whatever it is that allows one to teach at all tracks (even though this was a private event)...why I didn't take that up is beyond me...except work sucked at the time. And yes, my car has the engine where it is supposed to be!!!!!!! .

 

[pilotjoe]

Just wondering if any Formula 1 racing fans on here? Who’s your favorite driver, team or both?

Just found this thread, so I'm late to the party, but here goes. I've followed F1 racing since about 1969 or 70. I fell in love first with sports car racing, as the Ford GT40 captured my fancy as a young boy. Following the Sports cars led me to Can-Am and F1, and even Indy cars, since a lot of the drivers participated in all forms of racing. I started going to Road America for the Can-Am and Trans-Am races in 1969, and was lucky enough to meet Bruce McLaren there. Of course, that means I've been a fan of Team McLaren ever since (even after the takeover by Project 4 an Ron Dennis).

My early favorite drivers were Bruce McLaren, Dennis Hulme, Graham Hill, Gilles Villeneuve (saw him race at Road America in a lesser formula), Jochen Rindt, and of course Mario Andretti.

My all-time favorite F1 driver is Alain Prost. I was a HUGE fan of Alain when he was driving, even when he drove for Ferrari. (I am NOT a Ferrari fan!!) There have been many other favorites over the years, so I won't bore you with the whole list.

Of the current drivers, I'd say that I don't have a real strong favorite. I like Ricciardo a lot, and Kimi. I am cheering for Lando Norris since he shares my last name. Hopefully he will develop into a great driver. And of course he currently drives for McLaren, and they seem to be starting to get back up to speed, so I'm hopeful on two fronts there. I like Verstappen a lot too. Hope he continues to push the Mercedes boys, and hope he can start winning a few more races. (I am sick of Mercedes domination. I'd prefer to see more teams in with a shout for the win on a regular basis.)

Ok I've rambled on long enough. Glad I found this thread. Hope to be able to contribute to the conversation from time to time!

 

[pilotjoe]

was doing Skip Barber SCCA stiff for a bunch of years on the east coast, never got down south though

I raced Skippy cars for a few years, from about 1989 to 1992 or so. I'd have to go look at my old results sheets to get the dates exact. I did my racing school and most of my racing at Road America, but I did go down to Mid Ohio and run there.

My biggest problem was that I started too late. I was in my 30s by the time I started, and had thus developed a bit of survival instinct. That, plus the fact that I would have to pay for any damage to the cars myself, made me keep just that little bit of margin. The young kids where were funded by their dads were braver, and would outbrake me in the dry. Thus I was always a mid-pack runner until the rain came. In the rain it was a lot more about finding and maximizing the available traction and less about outright braking, and I could run up near the front. I prayed for rain every race weekend!

 

[BytorJr]

Just found this thread, so I'm late to the party, but here goes. I've followed F1 racing since about 1969 or 70. I fell in love first with sports car racing, as the Ford GT40 captured my fancy as a young boy. Following the Sports cars led me to Can-Am and F1, and even Indy cars, since a lot of the drivers participated in all forms of racing. I started going to Road America for the Can-Am and Trans-Am races in 1969, and was lucky enough to meet Bruce McLaren there. Of course, that means I've been a fan of Team McLaren ever since (even after the takeover by Project 4 an Ron Dennis).

My early favorite drivers were Bruce McLaren, Dennis Hulme, Graham Hill, Gilles Villeneuve (saw him race at Road America in a lesser formula), Jochen Rindt, and of course Mario Andretti.

My all-time favorite F1 driver is Alain Prost. I was a HUGE fan of Alain when he was driving, even when he drove for Ferrari. (I am NOT a Ferrari fan!!) There have been many other favorites over the years, so I won't bore you with the whole list.

Of the current drivers, I'd say that I don't have a real strong favorite. I like Ricciardo a lot, and Kimi. I am cheering for Lando Norris since he shares my last name. Hopefully he will develop into a great driver. And of course he currently drives for McLaren, and they seem to be starting to get back up to speed, so I'm hopeful on two fronts there. I like Verstappen a lot too. Hope he continues to push the Mercedes boys, and hope he can start winning a few more races. (I am sick of Mercedes domination. I'd prefer to see more teams in with a shout for the win on a regular basis.)

Ok I've rambled on long enough. Glad I found this thread. Hope to be able to contribute to the conversation from time to time!

Yaaayyy!!! Another Prost fan who rates Prost as the ATF!!!!! WOOHOOOOOOOOO. I liked Prost at Ferrari too; but don't remember much of that last season and F-1 wasn't nearly as easy to get then (that's why you had Autoweek).

By far Verstappen is by far my favorite driver; followed probably now by Lando. I want to like Gasly, but after Red Bull I stopped liking him as much. Don't know why. I also like Mr. Saturday, George Russell, as well. Definitely NOT a fan of LeClerc. The thing I like about Kimi is he's so "dull" it's funny. The tirades you occasionally get..."What the F$$@ ....followed by mumbling" is classic.

I'm pretty envious of anybody that got to witness an actual Can-Am race with a 917 (935/936???) in the field in a real race. THAT must have been unreal. My closest F-1 experience with a drive was walking by the late Michele Alboreto in Detroit when he was with Ferrari. We didn't stop, but IIRC he was TINY. Though, in Indy Car, Tony Kanaan almost ran right over me on a motor scooter at the St. Pete Grand Prix in 2012(?).

Yes, I begged to go to Elf-Winfield at 16 but parents wouldn't go for that - I may have killed myself. And you're right...by 30 you've developed a healthy sense of what a bad wreck can do and that somebody is paying for that wreck...likely you. Reminds me of a story a former instructor (driving) told me. He at a big Porsche Club event at Road America in the 80s. He got a chance to ride around the track at speed with none other than Derek Bell!!!! First of all, he was blown away by the skill of Bell (and this guy I know was beating 996 GT3s in his old 72 911 RSR with ease). But he most remarkable feat was the way Bell took the hairpin - he came in full bore and in a 911 braked IN the turn (not trail braking mind you) and whipped the car around. (Sort of like Vic Elford says you can drive around a turn in ice). In the end, they got out of the car and Bell said..."well, any questions." Answer: "Yes, how many cars did it take you to learn how to do what you did in the hairpin?" He said Bell smiled, chuckled and shrugged his shoulders.

 

[pilotjoe]

The thing I like about Kimi is he's so "dull" it's funny. The tirades you occasionally get..."What the F$$@ ....followed by mumbling" is classic.

If for no other reason, you have to love Kimi for his famous radio transmission - "Leave me alone. I know what I'm doing!" THAT is a classic! I too find his understated personality to be amazingly enjoyable. He's a piece of work for sure. the Iceman!

I'm pretty envious of anybody that got to witness an actual Can-Am race with a 917 (935/936???) in the field in a real race. THAT must have been unreal.

I went to every Can-Am race at Road American from 1969 up until the series ended. It was GREAT! And yes, the turbo Porsches were awesome to say the least. Got to see a lot of soon-to-be famous, and some already-famous drivers during those times. So cool for a young motorhead!

Reminds me of a story a former instructor (driving) told me. He at a big Porsche Club event at Road America in the 80s. He got a chance to ride around the track at speed with none other than Derek Bell!!!! First of all, he was blown away by the skill of Bell

When I had my Porsche 944 I attended a Porsche Performance Driving School at Road America. The lead instructor was none other than Derek Bell. There were a bunch of other pretty well-known drivers there instructing, but I was lucky enough to put put into Derek's group. When we got finished with all the preliminary exercises and got down to lapping the track, Derek jumped into MY car and drove me around the track! He went faster than I'd ever lapped the track, all the while driving with one hand and explaining the finer points of the lap to me in an ongoing monolog! He was SOOOOO smooth! After a few laps we switched seats and he rode around with me while I lapped the track. He never said a word, and we finished the session he just smiled and said "you did very well. I didn't have to tell you a thing". I walked on a cloud for the rest of the weekend.

 

[Sieg]

Been an F1 fan for decades, no more. Tired of watching racing to see who 'wins' 3rd place.

MotoGP has been exceptional this year, 12 races with 9 different winners.

 

[AZshooterz]

Was a fan until they changed the engines and ruined the sound.

Oh the sound of the F1 cars! I think that sound hooks everyone..

 

[Shooter McGavin]

I thought Turkey was some what interesting. Poor Stroll got off his game and just couldn't get his head back into it. It was nice to see Vettel on a podium again. Bottas just could get that track down and had a miserable day. Verstappen tried really hard , but the conditions just sucked.

 

[pilotjoe]

I thought Turkey was some what interesting. Poor Stroll got off his game and just couldn't get his head back into it. It was nice to see Vettel on a podium again. Bottas just could get that track down and had a miserable day. Verstappen tried really hard , but the conditions just sucked.

Just read an article about Stroll. Said when the team was packing up the car for shipping they discovered damage to the underside of the front wing that was upsetting the aerodynamics and caused him to lose pace. So it wasn't just him getting off his game, which is good.

Now Bottas seemed off his game! He just never did come to terms with the conditions or the track. Sad, that. I have been hoping that he would finally start giving Hamilton a run for his money during the races, but so far it hasn't happened too often. Probably won't ever.

I am sick and tired of Hamilton and Mercedes winning all the danged time! I sure hope the new rules changes will finally level the field a little bit. Yeah....probably not!

 

[Shooter McGavin]

That's good to hear about Stroll, I hated the thought of him giving up mentally. I really wanted to see Bottas go at Hamilton this year, but it's a mental sport and you have to be in it 100%. I am sure his divorce didn't help him this year. I would love to see them get away from the Hybrid engines and all the problems they cause.

 

[BytorJr]

I thought Turkey was some what interesting. Poor Stroll got off his game and just couldn't get his head back into it. It was nice to see Vettel on a podium again. Bottas just could get that track down and had a miserable day. Verstappen tried really hard , but the conditions just sucked.

I knew Max was going to spin. I was yelling at him to back off Perez because he was going to get washout from the Pink Panther - lot of good that did me. Bummer.

Bottas. Good grief. He was AWFUL. I don't think it was aerodynamic washing out that did him in, I think he just couldn't get the car comfortable. While I'm not a Stroll fan, after Max dropped out of the running I was really hoping he'd do well.

That said, Perez, if he doesn't have a ride next year that's a crying shame. To think Ocon got a ride after a year out and Perez cannot get one. BTW...does anybody else here think that if it were an American company broadcasting like back when David Hobbs and John Bisignano were announcing if they called Perez "The Mexican" people would be calling for their heads?

 

[pilotjoe]

...Perez, if he doesn't have a ride next year that's a crying shame.

Isn't that the truth. I am amazed that nobody has latched onto Perez. It's got to be a money thing, because he certainly doesn't lack talent or drive. I sure hope he gets a seat with someone!

 

[BytorJr]

Isn't that the truth. I am amazed that nobody has latched onto Perez. It's got to be a money thing, because he certainly doesn't lack talent or drive. I sure hope he gets a seat with someone!

That's actually even more crazy if it's money; didn't he personally step in to keep Force India afloat? Or maybe some Mexican sponsorship? Claro?

 

[*Nine]

That's actually even more crazy if it's money; didn't he personally step in to keep Force India afloat? Or maybe some Mexican sponsorship? Claro?

Perez is linked to Carlos Slim. There's no shortage of money backing Perez.

 

[BytorJr]

Perez is linked to Carlos Slim. There's no shortage of money backing Perez.

I knew it was some big time playa...yeah...no shortage there. He could just buy F-1.

 

[rafiki76]

When I had my Porsche 944 I attended a Porsche Performance Driving School at Road America. The lead instructor was none other than Derek Bell. There were a bunch of other pretty well-known drivers there instructing, but I was lucky enough to put put into Derek's group. When we got finished with all the preliminary exercises and got down to lapping the track, Derek jumped into MY car and drove me around the track! He went faster than I'd ever lapped the track, all the while driving with one hand and explaining the finer points of the lap to me in an ongoing monolog! He was SOOOOO smooth! After a few laps we switched seats and he rode around with me while I lapped the track. He never said a word, and we finished the session he just smiled and said "you did very well. I didn't have to tell you a thing". I walked on a cloud for the rest of the weekend.

That sounds like an incredible experience and I would feel the same way if Derek Bell said my driving was good. I've been on and off with respect to getting a 944 S or Turbo and building a street-track car but every time I get serious into it I have this attitude to keep working on my GTI.

 

[pilotjoe]

That sounds like an incredible experience and I would feel the same way if Derek Bell said my driving was good. I've been on and off with respect to getting a 944 S or Turbo and building a street-track car but every time I get serious into it I have this attitude to keep working on my GTI.

I replaced my 944 with a 964 (1990 Carrera 4). It was a great car, but somehow I ended up missing the 944. If I ever find that time machine I've been looking for, I'd go back and skip the 964 and stick with the 944. Although I might try a regular 911 of that same era (1987-1990). Those are a hoot too.

The GTI is nothing to sneeze at. You've got a great car there too. Have fun with it!

 

[rafiki76]

I replaced my 944 with a 964 (1990 Carrera 4). It was a great car, but somehow I ended up missing the 944. If I ever find that time machine I've been looking for, I'd go back and skip the 964 and stick with the 944. Although I might try a regular 911 of that same era (1987-1990). Those are a hoot too.

The GTI is nothing to sneeze at. You've got a great car there too. Have fun with it!

964's are my favorite Porsche's of all time, but I can understand missing the 944, they're just so cool. But thank you, so far she's Stage 2+ running E30 so the GTI is fun except from a dig. Spins like crazy even with launch control.

 

[pilotjoe]

964's are my favorite Porsche's of all time, but I can understand missing the 944, they're just so cool.

The 964 was a great autocrosser. Did very well with it. But I had enough money in it that I was hesitant to really push it on the track. I did NOT want to bend it. The 944 I just pounded on! Also, on the track I liked the feel of the rear wheel drive better than the all wheel drive of the 964. Both were great cars though. I ended up getting rid of the 964 when our daughter turned 16. I didn't want to have to pay the insurance!!

 

[rafiki76]

The 964 was a great autocrosser. Did very well with it. But I had enough money in it that I was hesitant to really push it on the track. I did NOT want to bend it. The 944 I just pounded on! Also, on the track I liked the feel of the rear wheel drive better than the all wheel drive of the 964. Both were great cars though. I ended up getting rid of the 964 when our daughter turned 16. I didn't want to have to pay the insurance!!

I would love to autocross a 964. I went from AWD to FWD when I got the GTI and I'm just not into awd for fun cars. The launches are great but I like being able to induce oversteer.

 

[pilotjoe]

I would love to autocross a 964. I went from AWD to FWD when I got the GTI and I'm just not into awd for fun cars. The launches are great but I like being able to induce oversteer.

We had a couple of AWD BMWs, and their X-drive system is great because it puts more torque to the rear axle. Something like 60-40 in dry conditions. So the car feels like a RWD car until it gets slippery, then the AWD does its thing. VERY nice to drive. the "Ultimate Driving Machine" as they say!

 

[rafiki76]

We had a couple of AWD BMWs, and their X-drive system is great because it puts more torque to the rear axle. Something like 60-40 in dry conditions. So the car feels like a RWD car until it gets slippery, then the AWD does its thing. VERY nice to drive. the "Ultimate Driving Machine" as they say!

I used to drive a BMW X5 in highschool, AWD was fun but at the end of the day it was a heavy SOB but handled well for it's size. I returned the lease with 2/32 tires.

 

[Jethro3898]

My God!
What a crash. Thank God Grosean walked/stumbled away. That was super nasty.

 

[BytorJr]

My God!
What a crash. Thank God Grosean walked/stumbled away. That was super nasty.

We just witnessed an honest-to-God miracle!!!!!! I don't mind telling you, I'm still a little shaken up. How he got out of that is unbelievable. That he was conscious saved his life. That's at least 3 drivers saved by the Halo Device. No doubt this time it saved him, much like it would have saved Senna.

 

[Jethro3898]

I’m here to tell you, the two safety guys that rushed to the car (one to extinguish the flames and the other to dive into them to pull Grosjean out) are complete studs.

The footage they are now airing is out of this world.

Just absolutely amazing. That was a heck of an impact and a total inferno.

 

[Jethro3898]

I agree with you Bytor.
I am surprised how much this one shook me up.