Just got the stock back from @jducos who put in a bipod pic rail, mlok inserts for a RRS tripod rail and sling point, as well as a flush cup in the rear. Really made the rifle usable for me. Good price and turn around time as well.
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…….Can't believe the military did not adapt these rifles in groves ? Mine will shoot .5 MOA groups…..
I agree, the rifle has it all, accuracy, durability, FN chrome lined barrel life, CRF Winchester action and safety. Being a pre-64 model 70 guy for many many years, and these are perfect match for me. As to why the military didn’t go for it? Probably other factors “un-related to the gun itself” (price/politics, etc.)
FN was always behind the ball and probably still is. I think they prioritize their other markets over civilian which I understand. They've always struggled with certain lines and the SPR was definitely one of them. Everyone knew they were quality but countless people asked them for updated features and calibers to no avail. All manufacturers do it but FN could have locked up a pretty solid chunk of market.Agree. I own 2 times as many M70s as 700 pattern rifles.
The 700 was cheap to produce and easy to work on. The flat bottomed m70 was neither cheap or(comparatively) easy to work on. I wonder if winchester hadn't went push feed in 64 if the m40 would have been built on the m70 as Carlos wanted. Would it have been a markedly improved rifle? I doubt it, but I would have liked it more.
FN makes (obviously) almost all of the machine guns for the US military... I'm guessing from a business standpoint, they're not too worried about a few thousand bolt action rifles.
For what it's worth, I own [and love] an SPR.
I get this, there's a lot of innovative stuff FN or winchester could have done.FN owns Winchester, they could have just let them release it and helped keep Winchester relevant in the market. I mean hell even Browning has started making tactical target rifles but Winchester, who already had the basis of the SPR, still hasn’t over a decade later.
I love my Model 70’s but their reluctance to release an upgraded target model is the reason I moved on from them and into the custom marketUT!
I agree 100% and FN/Winchester/Browning is gonna do what they feel makes them money at the end of the day. But how the HELL does the leading lever action gunmaker release a new straight walled cartridge (350 Legend) and only chamber it for bolt action and semi auto rifles? Whomever is leading their innovation department needs to be fired.I get this, there's a lot of innovative stuff FN or winchester could have done.
However, people still be buying regular ass model 700s, like their most basic and cheap ones, only to upgrade them make them better.
I'd take an m70 over a 700 all day everyday. You're already starting with a much superior action soooo...
I guess what I'm saying is, the fact that they didn't innovate much shouldn't be a deterring factor.
I disagree because the more relevant and popular the guns are the more the aftermarket will support them. In reality it was a bunch of different things but if FN had put more effort into them they could have taken more of the market which would eventually lead to more aftermarket.I get this, there's a lot of innovative stuff FN or winchester could have done.
However, people still be buying regular ass model 700s, like their most basic and cheap ones, only to upgrade them make them better.
I'd take an m70 over a 700 all day everyday. You're already starting with a much superior action soooo...
I guess what I'm saying is, the fact that they didn't innovate much shouldn't be a deterring factor.
I disagree because the more relevant and popular the guns are the more the aftermarket will support them. In reality it was a bunch of different things but if FN had put more effort into them they could have taken more of the market which would eventually lead to more aftermarket.
You clearly haven't looked. I can buy one that takes AI mags right now if I wanted.How 'bout readily available detachable box magazine bottom metals? Haha
No one's gonna give them for free!Exactly... You can buy one.
Sorry, I meant you can buy ONE, and only ONE... Like there's only one option... Well two, if you're feeling generous.No one's gonna give them for free!
I'm not arguing which is more relevant or has more aftermarket support. The r700 is probably higher in those regards. I still think the m70 is a better rifle so I personally would prefer to build on it.
Regardless, there is more than enough support for m70 rifles.
View attachment 7967149View attachment 7967152
Anything you could need, they make for it.
Sorry, I meant you can buy ONE, and only ONE... Like there's only one option... Well two, if you're feeling generous.
Much as I like my SPR, I haven’t found a 2-stage that’s field-worthy and doesn’t cost a fortune…
That chassis is no longer offered for a M70. Only PT&G makes a DMB kit, and it requires modified magazines, almost Noone makes a trigger, manners doesn't even list them for a inlet, so yeah, pretty much "good enough"...I'm not arguing which is more relevant or has more aftermarket support. The r700 is probably higher in those regards. I still think the m70 is a better rifle so I personally would prefer to build on it.
Regardless, there is more than enough support for m70 rifles.
View attachment 7967149View attachment 7967152
Anything you could need, they make for it.
That chassis is no longer offered for a M70. Only PT&G makes a DMB kit, and it requires modified magazines, almost Noone makes a trigger, manners doesn't even list them for a inlet, so yeah, pretty much "good enough"...
I absolutely love the m70/spr rifles. But FN gave about 0.2% of a shit about civilian markets and the platform did not live as long as it could have with a little development from either FN or winchester.
Looking at winchesters current line up and availability it appears they are barrels hanging on.
Basically, I wish someone would remake the CDI DBM. If I could just have that.....
I honestly think the window mags from MDT may just work without modifying them. They are made slimmer up front specifically for win70 actions. Although I haven't tried that combo so take that as you may.I believe that the front of mags has to be machined down for the PTG bottom metal because the front of the mag hits the bottom of the action.
I know manners WILL make a stock, and see no reason to ditch the McMillian.
My trigger is acceptable. It is not even close to the timney in my 700. It has been adjusted and I may try the spring.
Hell it's even hard to find a Pic rail that's not custom order or the Badger that's on it. I like the badger but options are nice.
This is my main rifle. I trust it. I shoot it well. Honestly I just want a DBM that accepts AICS mags and am willing to have the bottom machined to do it. I think it someone duplicated the CDI cut on a m70/spr the PTG kit would work fine. I may have to try it, but right now I am saving to rebarrel this damned thing. I'm 6000ish rounds in and the groups, while not horrible, are getting bad. I NEED .5 moa accuracy for F T/R and my scores are dropping.
I mean… my FN SPR with CDI bottom metal is always available for an absurdly high price!That chassis is no longer offered for a M70. Only PT&G makes a DMB kit, and it requires modified magazines, almost Noone makes a trigger, manners doesn't even list them for a inlet, so yeah, pretty much "good enough"...
I absolutely love the m70/spr rifles. But FN gave about 0.2% of a shit about civilian markets and the platform did not live as long as it could have with a little development from either FN or winchester.
Looking at winchesters current line up and availability it appears they are barrels hanging on.
Basically, I wish someone would remake the CDI DBM. If I could just have that.....
If you have the PDF send it to me. I will open mine up and order the PTG kit.I honestly think the window mags from MDT may just work without modifying them. They are made slimmer up front specifically for win70 actions. Although I haven't tried that combo so take that as you may.
I've tried other AI mags in my SPR and they all hit, except for these that I mention.
It may be worth a shot!
If not, then yeah, the bottom of the action where the magwell is will have to be opened up but most smiths can do that. I may have the PDF file somewhere that shows a drawing/blueprint of dimensions to machine the action.
If you have the PDF send it to me. I will open mine up and order the PTG kit.
I will also order some of the MDT mags when I order the kit.
I run standard AICS mags with my PTG DBM metal.
And it runs like an open sore.
In 25 years it has never had a feed issue.
Please keep in mind 2 qualifiers:
1) my action bottom has been milled
2) my action is a WIN M70sa
@Action Guy is an incredible source of knowledge and wisdom in regards to both the Winchester M70 and the FN
MDT still offers the ESS chassis for Win 70 short action and the FN actions. It feeds well from their metal magazines.That chassis is no longer offered for a M70. Only PT&G makes a DMB kit, and it requires modified magazines, almost Noone makes a trigger, manners doesn't even list them for a inlet, so yeah, pretty much "good enough"...
I absolutely love the m70/spr rifles. But FN gave about 0.2% of a shit about civilian markets and the platform did not live as long as it could have with a little development from either FN or winchester.
Looking at winchesters current line up and availability it appears they are barrels hanging on.
Basically, I wish someone would remake the CDI DBM. If I could just have that.....
I'm sure you could order that way. If you search for an hour you can find it eventually. You can't find it directly from the front page of the website nor directly from the ESS chassis page, you have to go to model specific accessories and order the base there. Here is the link where it shows available in the drop down.Not on their website. Is it something you have to call in for?
I believe you are correct.I believe there are 2 types of PTG bottom metals for m70 rifles. Do you have the wide mouth?
My PT&G mags are unmodified and work just fine with their DBM on my SPR.That chassis is no longer offered for a M70. Only PT&G makes a DMB kit, and it requires modified magazines, almost Noone makes a trigger, manners doesn't even list them for a inlet, so yeah, pretty much "good enough"...
I absolutely love the m70/spr rifles. But FN gave about 0.2% of a shit about civilian markets and the platform did not live as long as it could have with a little development from either FN or winchester.
Looking at winchesters current line up and availability it appears they are barrels hanging on.
Basically, I wish someone would remake the CDI DBM. If I could just have that.....
NopeIs your FN mag inlet on the receiver opened up for AICS mags?
I still can’t believe another company hasn’t bought out his design, patents if he had them, etc to keep bottom metal going. And not just for FN/Winchesters. He made bottom metal for a lot of bolt action rifles.The original factory bottom metal and 4 shot magazine were problematic (e.g. crap). Jeff from CDI come up with a wonderfully solution. Unfortunately his early demise reopened that problem.