Barrel choices and questions on .284 win build

[TwoNiner]

Hello everyone! I'm a newbie here looking to do my first custom bolt action build. I'm from the AR world and looking to stretch my legs past what .223 gives me in a 16" barrel.

This rifle will be for long range target shooting out in the California Mojave desert. After a lot of research I've decided on the .284 Win cartridge to take advantage of 7mm ballistics. From what I have read .284 seems to have a good combination of barrel life, round cost, moderate recoil over some of the bigger kids on the block like the 300 winmag.

I'm looking to buy a surgeon long action 1086/r for this build, but I'm overwhelmed with barrel choices. I've heard a lot of names out there like Krieger and Bartlein and Brux and so on, but I will admit I have no idea what is what and who is who. All I know is that I'd like my rifle to be manageable in weight as I will be carrying it in the desert to various shooting points, through sand, around thorny bushes and sometimes over rocky terrain. I am willing to sacrifice some rigidity/performance for mobility.

So from your experience, what barrel would be good for my application? What barrel length, twist rate, and profile would you recommend? And of course where can I buy such a barrel? I've taken a look at say, Krieger's online website (which sort of sucks) and its really hard to come up with what contour is right for my application without feeling it in my hands.

Regarding barrel length and twist I should probably mention that I plan to handload--at first with whatever I can get my hands on considering how difficult everything is to get right now--but upon scanning the hornady catalog I'd like to try out some of the heavier bullets like the 162gr a-max, or sierra's 180gr MK.

Speaking heavy bullets, how much velocity will they peel off? Do you really have to get extreme with the loads to get these heavy rounds moving fast out of your barrel? And does this contribute to significantly more recoil and barrel wear? I am new to hand loading so I will probably start out conservative.

And one last question! Would it be worthwhile to have the barrel threaded for a brake to be added in the future?

Thanks guys and I really appreciate any help you can offer! Also if you can recommend any builders that don't have too crazy of a wait time that would be swell.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Barrel choices and questions on .284 win build

Don't stress over barrel maker, they're all good.

Sounds like you want a medium Palma contour. Excellent balance of thickness and weight. Get a 1-8.5 twist. 1-9 will be OK too, but 8.5 is better. Figure a MINIMUM of 25" for the 284. They get hurt bad by short barrels. I've had 25.5", 30" and now 28". Figure ~45fps/inch. Bummer, I know.

For all but the most demanding ranges and shooting, the 162amax is fabulous. Hard to beat it until your out past 1000 yards. The 175 and 180 sierras are great too, along with the berger 168 vld, 180 vld and of course the king, the 180 Berger hybrid. I use the 175smk because of cost, loading forgiveness and my barrel doesn't like 162s. Figure on ~2950fps with 162s, 2875 with 175s, and 2825 with 180s, from ~26-27" bbl.

Figure on either H4350 ,H4831sc or Reloader 17, with the H4831sc being most popular. Forget the notion of buying ANY loaded ammo. Doesn't exist for what we do.

Absolutely have your muzzle threaded. Go ahead and put a brake on it too. 284 recoil isn't bad, but a brake helps spot shots better, plus you can put a can on it later, plus it will help resale value if you choose to sell.

Welcome to the hide, thanks for a well-posed first question.

ETA: Fill out your profile, including your location. Lots of good builders here, we can suggest better if we know your location.

 

[TwoNiner]

Re: Barrel choices and questions on .284 win build

Turbo54,

Thank you kindly for your informative reply. It looks like I came to the right place! Profile updated. Unfortunately I live in CA so I can't own a can, but I tell myself that being a second class citizen helps build character.

I have no experience with muzzle brakes. The closest is a compensator (a BattleComp 1.0 which I bought for my AR that I think was a waste of $150 because I could not tell any difference between its muzzle rise and a normal flash hider). If I understand correctly, brakes help reduce felt recoil by directing gas rearwards and gelling your noodle in the process, right? How does that alone help you trace your bullet? Do some brakes direct gas upwards to help reduce muzzle flip? I tend to shoot my rifles a lot when I do get the chance--taking advantage of all the daylight I have--so I'd like to avoid anything that would fatigue me before lunch.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Barrel choices and questions on .284 win build

Spend some time reading about muzzle brakes. They are very effective . Some models vent gas perpendicular to the bore, some direct it somewhat rearward. Some have vents all the way around, some just out the sides, and some additionally vent out the top.

For our purposes, where prone shooting is common, the type that vents out the sides (and also the top in many cases) are popular because bottom ports kick up a lot of leaves, dirt, snow, dust etc etc, which is obnoxious.

There are two main components to recoil. One is the straight back reaction of the rifle, the other is muzzle climb. Reducing either will help to avoid your sights/scope from leaving the target, making it a lot easier to watch your bullet's impact.

I can do this no problem with my unbraked 308, as close as 100 yards. With my 284, I had to be 300-400 yards out to watch impacts, without a brake. 100 yards no problem with the brake.

Have your smith make/install a thread protector that covers the muzzle threads and makes the barrel look normal for the times you choose not to use the brake.

 

[RobG]

Re: Barrel choices and questions on .284 win build

Turbo pretty much said it all. From what you describe, I would go a 28" tube. Its free velocity as they say. All the major brands turn out quality tubes, just find one that fits your needs and buy it. Bugholes is a vendor here and has a decent selection usually in stock.

Thread it for a brake. I see no reason to not unless there are restrictions where you shoot. I have run the Badger FTE and now a RAD brake from R&D precision. Either works well although I prefer the smaller profile of the R&D.

I also run the 175 smk with H4350. I get 2780 from a 26" Obermeyer which is on the lower end vel wise but, accuracy is very good.

You didn't specify but, the .284 feeds great from AI 300 win mags. They are plenty long enough to seat the bullets as far as needed.

 

[rusty815]

Re: Barrel choices and questions on .284 win build

I have a 25.25" 284 barrel that I use on my Savage long action, I was recommended this length from my smith who has a lot of experience with the 284, he said that's the minimum he would go, although it can still perform well with shorter barrels, 25" is minimum for any long range work. He has a shorty 284 with a 20" barrel that gets a hair under 2900fps with 162gr. AMAX's, that's about what you would see with a 7mm-08 with a 26-28" barrel. I get about 3050fps with the 162's and Reloader 17, and I get about 2850fps with the 180's. Most guys with 28" barrels can get close to 3000fps with the 180's, it depends on what kind of velocities you want to see, I am satisfied with anything over 2800fps with the 180's.

As far as barrel manufacturers, I use a Benchmark 5R 1 in 8 twist barrel throated for a long action I went with an 8 twist so I can see what kind of velocities the 284 can get with the 195gr. Bergers when they come out), any barrel manufacturer I think would work well, I recommend Mcgowen if you are building off a Savage action since they make prefits and are a great value, but any barrel manufacturer can make you a great barrel.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Barrel choices and questions on .284 win build

Disagree somewhat with the above, in particular, the velocities indicated.

First off, in the world of "284 Win" velocities, you've got two categories: the regular powder velocity and the Reloader 17 velocity. They can be VERY different.

While I personally didn't find RL17 to do anything H4350 couldn't, there is lots of data out there showing some people approaching 2900 with 180s. From long barrels.

Don't think for even a picosecond that you're going to get anywhere close to 3000fps with a 180, even with a 30" bbl. With a 26-28" bbl, a reasonable expectation is between 2750 and 2825.

Bear in mind 7wsm achieves ~2950-3050 from 180s, and those burn 15+gr more powder than a 284.

That said, a .6 BC 162 @ 2950-3000, or a .67 BC 180 @ 2800 is a helluva performer well past 1k yards.