Best Grain Bullet for 300 Win mag, shooting 1000+ yards

[Weapon_50BMG]

I tried the search function but could not really find a good answer. Looking for a little help, taking a long distance shooting class with my 300 win mag. Since it's so hard to source ammo and projectiles, trying to narrow my search. I will be hand loading my rounds and have some pretty good load data on a few rounds, but I've only taken them out to 1000 yards. The class offers shots out out 1 mile, I have some Lapua 220's that groups really good for me. Anyone have insight on how they will perform past 1000 or should I go lighter? Thanks!

My Set-up:
Defiance Deviant Action
26" Proof Carbon fiber barrel 1-10 twist
Triggertech Special
Grayboe Renegade with adjustable cheekpiece
Badger 20 moa pic mount
Nightforce Ultralight 6 screw rings
Nightforce ATACR 5-25 Mil-xt
Dead air Muzzlebrake
Dead air sandman L

 

[BLKWLFK9]

Berger 215s get my vote. The 230s need more ass like from a norma/RUM.

 

[2muchcowbell]

I'm starting to work up a load with the Berger 208 LRHT's, and the ballistics seem to be incredible. Pushing it at around 3090 fps out of a 26" barrel and a density altitude of 4300 ft, my Kestrel says the bullet won't go transonic until 1743 yds and won't go sub until 2060 yds.

 

[White Death]

230gr berger all day

 

[NCHillbilly]

Haven't had a chance to shoot them yet, but hoping later this week to try some nosler 210 rdf's over imr 8133. Should be just north of 2950 mv. These things have a crazy high G1 bc (701), so fingers crossed they'll get to a mile.

 

[Chickentoast]

Berger 220 lrht or Hornady 225 eld-m if you've got the throat to seat them out and get enough powder in there.

 

[rustyinbend]

I'm getting excellent results in my 300 Win Mag with Berger Hybrid 200.20x bullets. My testing is showing that bullet exploits a sweep spot between velocity and accuracy.

 

[jbailey]

I love the 198gr Flatline - 3200fps from 30cal mag, 0.83ish G1 BC, super consistent on the vertical plane thanks to the low BC variation due to tiny differences in shape. However, you are on the ragged edge of stability with your twist.

In your twist, I also like the 215gr Berger, very well known performer. And the 208gr Berger sounds like another good choice.

200grains of Cu and Pb make nice splash at 1 mile and think you will be glad you have that mass when you get out that far, especially with you being a relatively new shooter at that distance (I'm assuming this by your text, apologizes if not the case, and no offense intended).

 

[Fig]

1000 yds with 230s too easy drill sergeant. The 230s under a moderate charge of H1000 fly as true for me as a 6mm out of my comp stick with a few thousand pounds more energy in them. They’re not lasers, but they’re high BC and keep on trucking.

It’s no ELR cartridge, but it’s accurate as hell out to any distance I can actually see.

 

[Aftermath]

I use the 210 Berger VLD's in both the Hunting and the Match version in 2 different 300 WINMAG rifles. Both are 1:9 twist 26" Brux barrels with chambers cut by the same guy with the same reamer in an attempt to be able interchange the ammo...it worked!! Leave the barrel 2950 fps, still going 1637 fps at 1000 yards.
I recently had a 30 Nosler built and have been shooting the same with it. I was hoping to gain some velocity but that 2950 fps seems to be the sweet spot for accuracy with these 210 VLD's.

 

[BLKWLFK9]

If u want to extend your range with a win mag, look at the PVA solids. They've got a solid for almost every twist rate.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

This is one of those situations where you decide whether you want to be in the "speed kills" camp or the "more mass to see impacts" camp.
Back in the day the answer was really easy....only the heavy bullets had proper BC's but with todays monolithics and some jacketed bullets you can get really good BC numbers in a lighter weight bullet.

There is just no way I would run anything larger than a 215gr in a 300WM; shit..I don't like anything heavier than that in a 300NM.

Just look at the pressure problems the USN heavy 300WM ammunition has a tendency to have...because they want the mass and the speed but didn't design the entire package to function as 1 unit.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[BLKWLFK9]

Hi,

This is one of those situations where you decide whether you want to be in the "speed kills" camp or the "more mass to see impacts" camp.
Back in the day the answer was really easy....only the heavy bullets had proper BC's but with todays monolithics and some jacketed bullets you can get really good BC numbers in a lighter weight bullet.

There is just no way I would run anything larger than a 215gr in a 300WM; shit..I don't like anything heavier than that in a 300NM.

Just look at the pressure problems the USN heavy 300WM ammunition has a tendency to have...because they want the mass and the speed but didn't design the entire package to function as 1 unit.

Sincerely,
Theis

Exactly. That is why I also suggested the 215s for the jacketed option.

 

[Chickentoast]

I prefer to ride better BC slower, given the choice, even though it is akin to making lemonade. I think the lemonade making process is actually a big part of what makes this hobby fun for me. Understood it isn't a hobby for some, and their outlook must be entirely different, but I have to assume that's a tiny percentage of people.

 

[THEIS]

I prefer to ride better BC slower, given the choice,

Hi,

What do you do when the lighter weight projectile has a better BC due to the increased MV and design than the slower heavy?

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[JBarton]

I've been shooting 220gr ELDX out to a mile with awesome results. Running them at 2858fps with 75.8gr H1000 out of a 9 twist 26 inch bartlein. It's what I have been able to find and it works well for me.
Good luck and happy shooting.

 

[TigernLionGSP]

I'm starting to work up a load with the Berger 208 LRHT's, and the ballistics seem to be incredible. Pushing it at around 3090 fps out of a 26" barrel and a density altitude of 4300 ft, my Kestrel says the bullet won't go transonic until 1743 yds and won't go sub until 2060 yds.

What powder are you using and how much. I am using 208 eld s 75 gr H1000. 2884 ft

 

[2muchcowbell]

What powder are you using and how much. I am using 208 eld s 75 gr H1000. 2884 ft

Retumbo, 77.3-77.6 grains. I haven't yet settled on the final charge, but that window seems to give the most consistent velocities.

 

[Chickentoast]

Hi,

What do you do when the lighter weight projectile has a better BC due to the increased MV and design than the slower heavy?

Sincerely,
Theis

Show me the projectiles!

The only thing I found in 30 cal was the PVA 241gr, but it requires 7 twist, so I would need a dedicated barrel. Otherwise the 250 a-tip looks like the best bet for my ~100 grains o' capacity. I can get equivalent windage from a couple other monos, but not appreciably better, and they are all double the cost of the A-tips, or triple the cost of the LRHT's.

In 6.5, I have a Sherman MAX and wish I could get a 150+ grain mono, but they seem to all be 12Xgrains, and they can't beat the jacketed 153.5 lrht in the wind, even with the extra MV.

338 and above is another story, but I have yet to graduate to those...

In a non-magnum case, I can also see how it works, but if you can drive the heavies fast...

 

[Steel head]

Hi,

What do you do when the lighter weight projectile has a better BC due to the increased MV and design than the slower heavy?

Sincerely,
Theis

That’s the path I took

Yes there are two seating depths
Two different bullet weights

 

[jasent]

I really like the 210 vld’s for 10 twist 300wm. They’ve had no troubles at a mile for me and often more available than 215’s

 

[mudpig]

Tag

 

[THEIS]

Show me the projectiles!

The only thing I found in 30 cal was the PVA 241gr, but it requires 7 twist, so I would need a dedicated barrel. Otherwise the 250 a-tip looks like the best bet for my ~100 grains o' capacity. I can get equivalent windage from a couple other monos, but not appreciably better, and they are all double the cost of the A-tips, or triple the cost of the LRHT's.

In 6.5, I have a Sherman MAX and wish I could get a 150+ grain mono, but they seem to all be 12Xgrains, and they can't beat the jacketed 153.5 lrht in the wind, even with the extra MV.

338 and above is another story, but I have yet to graduate to those...

In a non-magnum case, I can also see how it works, but if you can drive the heavies fast...

Hi,

The 215gr .308 from Badlands Precision has better BC than the 230gr .308 Berger Hybrid is 1 example.

There is pretty no way to drive a heavy faster than you can drive a midweight.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Chickentoast]

^Their website only shows the 205 gr Super-dozer2, with .785/.402. 250 atip .878/.442.

Is the 215 grain a new projectile? The 338 and up ICBM's do look awesome. Wish they made heavier 264 and 30 cals... do you know if this is in the works?

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

You run the data on the real BC of those Atips?
IF the small caliber ones are like the BMG ones it might be pretty disappointing.

Yea, their website needs to be updated. Email and ask Jason to send you their new product spreadsheet.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[GIXXER2000]

I have been running the new Berger 208Hybrid and they are very good. Have shot out to 1500 so far with great results. I also shoot the 215Hybrids.

 

[Steel head]

I have been running the new Berger 208Hybrid and they are very good. Have shot out to 1500 so far with great results. I also shoot the 215Hybrids.

If they shoot as good as the 7mm LRHT I’m sure the 208 LRHT is an excellent option.
The ATip had the better BC but the Berger had the consistency.

 

[Chickentoast]

Hi,

You run the data on the real BC of those Atips?
IF the small caliber ones are like the BMG ones it might be pretty disappointing.

Yea, their website needs to be updated. Email and ask Jason to send you their new product spreadsheet.

Sincerely,
Theis

Out to 1500 the a-tips required .15 mils more elevation than calculated. The Berger 220 lrht's required 0.5 mils more elevation than calculated at the same distance. I expect @ 2K that would get worse, but as long as I know the curve.

I will get in touch with Badlands, thanks.

edit: Badlands said the 215 is the solid version of the 205 Dozer2, otherwise, site is up to date

 

[Weapon_50BMG]

I appreciate everyone's input and a lot of you seem to love the Berger 215's. I'm going to do a little more research into some of the other options laid out in this thread. I'm sitting on about 800 of the Lapua Scenar L 220's so I may have to go with them if I can't find any of the Berger 215's or some of the others listed to give them a try and see if my gun like them. Looks like everyone loves stuff north of 200 gr for 1000+ yards, so that kinds of answered my question.

 

[Chickentoast]

I appreciate everyone's input and a lot of you seem to love the Berger 215's. I'm going to do a little more research into some of the other options laid out in this thread. I'm sitting on about 800 of the Lapua Scenar L 220's so I may have to go with them if I can't find any of the Berger 215's or some of the others listed to give them a try and see if my gun like them. Looks like everyone loves stuff north of 200 gr for 1000+ yards, so that kinds of answered my question.

FYI the Berger 220 lrht is apparently the 215 with a pointy snoot to get the better BC. Just shoot your Lapuas - when you switch to a better projectile later, you'll be a better shooter and your hit % will go up.

 

[JBarton]

I've shot the 220gr scenars with great results. A little more drop than the 220gr ELDX but they are pretty consistent. I am actually able to achieve higher speeds with a little less powder 0.2gr than the ELDX.

 

[jbailey]

I appreciate everyone's input and a lot of you seem to love the Berger 215's. I'm going to do a little more research into some of the other options laid out in this thread. I'm sitting on about 800 of the Lapua Scenar L 220's so I may have to go with them if I can't find any of the Berger 215's or some of the others listed to give them a try and see if my gun like them. Looks like everyone loves stuff north of 200 gr for 1000+ yards, so that kinds of answered my question.

yeah man, rock what you got and is working for you. No need to go changing things if you have something good. If you have a 220 Lapua low SD load with good precision, changing to any of the Bergers ain't going to offer a huge upgrade. The big upgrade is improving your own skills and you can always setup to better bullets in the future.

Also, remember these errors all tend to compound with flight time. Typically the faster you get a round to target the better. And then getting the next round off with a good correction BEFORE the wind changes is huge. Don't send a round, see splash and dick around for 2 minutes discussing things. Get the next round in the air so its not "wind blind" like the first one was.

 

[Weapon_50BMG]

I've shot the 220gr scenars with great results. A little more drop than the 220gr ELDX but they are pretty consistent. I am actually able to achieve higher speeds with a little less powder 0.2gr than the ELDX.

Would you mind sharing your load data ?

 

[JBarton]

I'm running 75.6gr of H1000 for the scenars (2888fps) and 75.8gr of H1000 for the eldx (2858fps) . My eldx coal is 3.524" can't remember my cbto or the either for the scenars. Have both about 0.015" off of the lands. I'm running a26" 9 twist 5 groove bartlein so obviously use caution because this is a load for my rifle.

Would you mind sharing your load data ?

Scenars after re-zero with eldx at 100 yards and 30+ mph winds. They shoot a little faster which shows but do well. Also had over 1300 rounds on the barrel. I

 

[VargmatII]

I used to run Hornady ELD-X 212 grain and now I run Lapua Scenar L 220 grain over a good dose of VV N170 powder and 3.54" COL. They do 2810 fps in my 29" Jury barrel and shoots great.

 

[phlegethon]

There is just no way I would run anything larger than a 215gr in a 300WM; shit..I don't like anything heavier than that in a 300NM.

There was this analysis where the 230 Berger came out on top (granted, it's just three different bullets). There are a lot of variables here, the actual velocities achieved at a given pressure, the BCs (yes, as you say, the actual BC for the given speed) and the BC decay rate, all for each bullet.

Weapon Employment Zone (WEZ) Analysis of the XM-2010 Rifle With Various Ammunition Types - Applied Ballistics

By: Bryan Litz, Applied Ballistics LLC Background The 300 Winchester Magnum is a well established cartridge in the US arsenal. Recent modernization initiatives focused around rifles and ammunition are advancing the effectiveness of this proven cartridge. This Weapon Employment Zone (WEZ)...

appliedballisticsllc.com

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

LOLOL, notice they did not compare it to any monolithics.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[phlegethon]

Hi,

LOLOL, notice they did not compare it to any monolithics.

Sincerely,
Theis

Indeed. As we were discussing recently, the lack of good data (objective, publicly available) on monolithics is pretty frustrating. I'd love to test more but there is only so much time and money.

 

[Fig]

Monos have pretty much been proven to be superior. They're also a lot more $$$$$.
My .300 is a GA Hospitaler with a heavy 1:7 twist barrel, so it's made to shoot heavies.
I got a deal on several cases of the Berger 230 Hybirds, and that is why I shoot them. It will be a long time before I run out and care to try something different.

 

[CNC-Dude]

After a few weekends of load development in my WinMag, I found a pretty decent load. 215g Bergers with 76.0g of Retumbo. Gave me a .29 MOA so far. The white circle around the group is a dime! My COAL is 3.745".... .025" jump seemed to be the magic number it liked!

 

[Slides]

Isn't talking about monolithic bullets a waste of time if he has a 1:10 barrel?

 

[220wyo]

I run 215 Bergers in a 1/9 28” at 3030 fps with 77 gr of h 1000 at a really long coal. I know there may be better options but these work great on elk and steel way out there.

 

[kb300w]

I have had very good luck with Hornady 225 ELD-M and H1000. Not gonna lie, both are very hard to find right now.

 

[TRPrecision]

I have no problem getting to a mile with 208ELDM over either 77.2g H1000 or 75.4g 7828ssc. That gets it done with only a 24" 1/10 twist barrel.

 

[powerspc]

Berger 215s get my vote. The 230s need more ass like from a norma/RUM.

This guy ^ Berger 215's and H1000

 

[Bandit320]

225 ELD-M with H1000 in Norma cases. Great combo.

 

[Straw Hat]

I have a Savage model 112 .300 win mag. I have mainly used it for hunting but have load the will gong steel at 800 yards. 165 nosler accubond, 71 gr IMR4350 with 3230 fps. But it is a single shot so my coal is 3.512.

 

[Weapon_50BMG]

I'm running 75.6gr of H1000 for the scenars (2888fps) and 75.8gr of H1000 for the eldx (2858fps) . My eldx coal is 3.524" can't remember my cbto or the either for the scenars. Have both about 0.015" off of the lands. I'm running a26" 9 twist 5 groove bartlein so obviously use caution because this is a load for my rifle.

Scenars after re-zero with eldx at 100 yards and 30+ mph winds. They shoot a little faster which shows but do well. Also had over 1300 rounds on the barrel. IView attachment 7578199

It’s been a bit and I thought I’d update you on my journey too, with a lot of help from this thread my load development landed really close to yours. Here’s my setup:
Defiance Deviant 300 win Mag, Proof Carbon fiber 26” 1-10 twist barrel, sitting in a Grayboe Renegade
Final load : Lapua Brass, Lapua Scenar L 220’s, 75.8 Gr. of H1000 running @ 2920 fps
Before attending my long range class, I zero’d at 100 yards this is an 8 shot group.
the class was amazing and it got to the point that making 750-1000 with hits in the vitals on life size elk and mule deer was super easy. The range included shots at 1250, 1450, and the 1 mile shot of 1760. With some help from my spotter made my hit at a mile(2’x2’ target) on the 4th shot. Really appreciate all the great info in this thread and it really helped me with my load development on my gun. Looking forward to getting out and shooting more long range now!

 

[JBarton]

A

It’s been a bit and I thought I’d update you on my journey too, with a lot of help from this thread my load development landed really close to yours. Here’s my setup:
Defiance Deviant 300 win Mag, Proof Carbon fiber 26” 1-10 twist barrel, sitting in a Grayboe Renegade
Final load : Lapua Brass, Lapua Scenar L 220’s, 75.8 Gr. of H1000 running @ 2920 fps
Before attending my long range class, I zero’d at 100 yards this is an 8 shot group.
the class was amazing new it become got to the point that making 750-1000 with hits in the vitals on life size elk and mule deer was super easy. The range included shots at 1250, 1450, and the 1 mile shot of 1760. With some help from my spotter made my hit at a mile(2’x2’ target) on the 4th shot. Really appreciate all the great info in this thread and it really helped me with my load development on my gun. Looking forward to getting out and shooting more long range now!

View attachment 7615093

Awesome results. I've thought about doing some training. Where did you do your class and what's a rough price

 

[Weapon_50BMG]

A

Awesome results. I've thought about doing some training. Where did you do your class and what's a rough price

My buddy purchased a custom 28 Nosler from Fierce Firearms (Redmond, UT) and they offer a long range class at their manufacturing location. He invited me along, the class is 2 days, lodging and food is included for $1500.00. It was very informative and really geared toward long range hunting shots but took us to the longer targets as well. I must say it must be nice to work there, they have a 1 mile range off the back patio of their building.