Best Precision AR10 (In your opinion(s))?

[cptpizzo]

All,

I'd like to make a choice in the next few weeks on a new precision LR AR10 (308Win/7.62) but wanted to get some Hide opinions on which one and why?

I know there are specific rifle platforms for different applications, but mainly curious as just the long range AR 10 for range use, 500-800yds, etc.

Les Baer vs JP PSC12 vs GAP 10?

I was leaning JP, but I heard Les Baer gaurantees sub 1/2 MOA.

Thoughts?

Thanks all for your opinions!

Alex

 

[jaycoux]

For all out accuracy I would have to lean gap-10. PredatOBR and JP LRP-07 would be a nice choice as well.

 

[Black max]

My thoughts are use the search box at the top of the page... There are thousands of posts on what your looking for.

 

[cptpizzo]

My thoughts are use the search box at the top of the page... There are thousands of posts on what your looking for.

I figured there were many posts on one over the other, just wasn't sure if all three were grouped in one post for comparisons.

But, I'll take that advice and do some more searches and reading...

 

[Fatorangecat]

How dare you ask questions on a forum! Use the search function...these Internet marksmen don't have time to share their opinions! Good luck dude.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

All,

I'd like to make a choice in the next few weeks on a new precision LR AR10 (308Win/7.62) but wanted to get some Hide opinions on which one and why?

I know there are specific rifle platforms for different applications, but mainly curious as just the long range AR 10 for range use, 500-800yds, etc.

Les Baer vs JP PSC12 vs GAP 10?

I was leaning JP, but I heard Les Baer gaurantees sub 1/2 MOA.

Thoughts?

Thanks all for your opinions!

Alex

Well Alex, according to this thread http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/snipers-hide-semi-auto-rifles/244510-gap-challenge.html Les Baer guarantees not only 1/2 MOA (whatever that means), but also 15,000 plus round count barrel. Many of the Hide members were curious and ended up crashing the website with questions and emails, making it difficult for people to even order one.

Coming from personal experience on a GA Precision Rifle (not the GAP-10) and seeing two GAP-10's run in our local steel matches, I would recommend the GAP-10. They have excellent customer service and all GAP rifles are held in high regard here.

However, the JP rifles are also really great, but I have no experience with them.

Are you sure you want a precision AR-10? Going out past 600 yards you might want a bolt gun. While all of the above rifles are really nice, they will not be able to equal the accuracy of a bolt action rifle.

Just my thoughts. Let us know what you eventually decide!! We are always curious to find out how these threads ultimately work out for the OP.

 

[ORD]

Yup...this horse has been beaten many times long after the poor thing was dead!!

Joking aside, and speaking from experience with all of the above, you'll not go wrong with any of them. It truly comes down to what you want, specifically, as to which will be the best of three. All have their specific advantages/disadvantages, but in capable hands with suitable ammo, all are capable of outperforming the vast majority of shooters out there. The real question becomes not one of not whether the rifles are 1/2 MOA capable (or better), but is the SHOOTER so capable on a large-frame gasser? That is the REAL limiting factor in the equation with any of the above.

The other thing to consider is how long are you willing/able to wait. Off hand, the JP will likely have the shortest lead time of ~8-12wks (maybe shorter depending on what route you take...maybe a bit longer), the GAP-10 will be 10mos or so out if ordered today, and the LB...well...let's just say that Les has never been one to rush, but it'll be on par with the GAP, perhaps a bit less...likely more)!

 

[cptpizzo]

How dare you ask questions on a forum! Use the search function...these Internet marksmen don't have time to share their opinions! Good luck dude.

Haha! I hate making rookie mistakes like this and don't mean to "ask for answers without doing the work first". Being a flight doc, it's frustrating when others take the easy way out in training.

Anyways. All is good. I'll post back with my experiences on the decision process.

As for bolt rifle, I'm working in that too. Got some good advice from some folks here and working toward that end. I just like to have a "precision" AR as well.

Thanks all!


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[Scottmilk9]

My shameless plug; Specialized Dynamics.

 

[cptpizzo]

My shameless plug; Specialized Dynamics.

If anything, I've provided you the opportunity to get a plug in! Lol


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[jimmykm21]

I don't own either of the ones you listed , I have an Armalite AR10

But I do know someone that bought a Les Baer match AR15 and I shot it a few times .

All I said was holy shit the first time I saw and shot it. I know an AR15 or an AR10 is not made for looks but Les Baer rifles are fricking beautiful looking
with their attention to detail . From the finish down to the parts fitted together. As to the accuracy of the one I shot it was a laser at 100 yards which was the range I shot it at.
You pay a premium price for them but they are very nice rifles from what I experienced shooting one.

 

[Fatorangecat]

If your looking at a gas gun and a bolt I'm going to assume you haven't had a lot of experience with them. If I'm off base disregard this comment. If you haven't shot a full flavored semi it is very challenging. Learning fundamentals on a bolt first would eliminate some frustration. I can shoot lights out with a bolt and if I lose my focus for a second the gasser is done.

 

[cptpizzo]

If your looking at a gas gun and a bolt I'm going to assume you haven't had a lot of experience with them. If I'm off base disregard this comment. If you haven't shot a full flavored semi it is very challenging. Learning fundamentals on a bolt first would eliminate some frustration. I can shoot lights out with a bolt and if I lose my focus for a second the gasser is done.

I agree 100% with this...

You're not off base that much as I am relatively new to the AR/bolt rifle platform. I have plenty of M9 experience as a flight doc, but very limited experience with the AR/rifle platform as I usually only get trained on these rifles prior to deployments.

I do own a POF P308 and Savage, mostly because these are my first rifles to get trigger time on. A hide member gave me some great advice that I am looking into and trying to "upgrade" slowly as funds dictate. I am glad I came across this forum as this has helped me out tremendously and any advice to me is great advice.

Alex

 

[redirt78]

I'm just curious with what kind of results you've had out of your P308, how do you have it set up? Also wondering what savage you have and how it is set up, results with it and distances shot with both? What ammo have you used with both of them?

 

[cptpizzo]

I'm just curious with what kind of results you've had out of your P308, how do you have it set up? Also wondering what savage you have and how it is set up, results with it and distances shot with both? What ammo have you used with both of them?

I'll PM you.

 

[Smcarroll]

My opinion? My lwrc repr is the best. I am pretty sure its mostly just the shooter.

 

[Millionaire]

I had the same question back in October of 2013.

I chose the GAP-10 after my research.

The only downside is the lead time.

I am in month 5 of 12 quoted at the time of order.

Patience is a virtue

 

[SWThomas]

Gap-10.

 

[jevan126]

You can't go wrong with any of the three you picked, the difference will be which feels better to you. The JP LRP-07 is the lightest of the three and one of the softest shooting rifles I have ever shot.

 

[hlee]

Check out the 100 yard 5 round x 6 group shoot out threads. I think there are 3 of them. See what is placing in the top 10. It may not be definitive, but it is a pretty good place to start. And, you have less fan bias...

 

[Black max]

How dare you ask questions on a forum! Use the search function...these Internet marksmen don't have time to share their opinions! Good luck dude.

Dude!!! The same questions get asked here daily...

 

[jevan126]

hlee that does not mean a thing, the only TRUE way to test accuracy is in a VICE or Ransom Rest. There are way to many factors that come into play, everything has to be as equal as possible.

 

[KillShot]

Here we go, again and again...

 

[BCP]

Haha! I hate making rookie mistakes like this and don't mean to "ask for answers without doing the work first". Being a flight doc, it's frustrating when others take the easy way out in training.

Anyways. All is good. I'll post back with my experiences on the decision process.

As for bolt rifle, I'm working in that too. Got some good advice from some folks here and working toward that end. I just like to have a "precision" AR as well.

Thanks all!


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Budget, it all begins with a budget...how much money you can spend on these hypothetical rifles will dictate what you can get...

 

[elfster1234]

good thing there is only about 3 billion threads on this very topic. jk

 

[jasonfaz]

I built a couple using JP PSC-12s and their super match barrel/bolt combos. I've been EXTREMELY happy with the decision to go that route...

 

[springer01]

Curious as to why the POF isn't working out for you? I have never shot any of the others mentioned in your OP, but I feel my POF308 would not be far behind if not in the same league.

Well minus the 15k round Les Baer super barrel!

 

[BravoSierra]

I asked myself the question 18 months ago. But each seems to he a trade off from what i really wanted, so i built it myself. Lilja .260 barrel, JP bolt and BCG, Syrac gas block, Timney trigger, adjustable buttstock/Magpul STR and a SAPR, SAS brake and can, all in FDE. Only way that i was going to drop that kind of coin and guarantee that i was going to be happy with the outcome was to do it myself. It was fun, but if you have it in your mind to just buy the completed product then i cant blame you and feel that JP and GAP are fantastic pieces of work.

 

[a1-equipment]

I have a baer monoltith with 26" and enforcer brake just shoots amazing. Groups with 175 fgmm are .28-.33 at 100all days and 1.30-1.4 at 300

 

[jevan126]

a1 with that kind of shooting you should enter Elfster's 100 yard and 300 yard shootout. If you can shoot that all day then you will kick ass and win by a landslide, no problem.

 

[BillyGoatMachine]

Forget the three choices you posted. Even though they are superb rifles, you really should consider one of these….

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...243740-spartan-precision-semi-auto-308-a.html

 

[FALex]

go with the JP, you will absolutely love the damn thing. It is one of the most soft-shooting rifles I have shot. The weight and recoil impulse were both very appealing to me. Additionally, I don't think there is a better AR trigger than the JP trigger.

 

[Km22]

Have GAP build you an upper for your POF.

 

[Fenix Mike]

I'm very happy with my armalite sass, first time out it was shooting .38-.68 inch groups at 100 with amax 168s. They were just 3 shot groups while I was getting the zero set and getting used to the Geissele trigger, but I was just using a bipod and monopod since the range decided to get rid of all their bags for people to use and I didn't bring one. I'm sure with optimum conditions it would have been more consistent, but the monopod sucks on a concrete bench. It shot just as well to 1000 meters after, and I think with more trigger time it will be a real tack driver. I didn't bring enough ammo to sit at the range and knock some 5 shot groups out after I was done setting it up, but next time I fly home I will for sure! I'm also patiently waiting for the sig 716 Dmr to be released, should be promising for a mass produced rifle. Only downside to the sass is it's a tank... Half mile walk to our spot where the 1000 meter steel is and at 16lbs with the scope, suppressor, bipod etc, it can get heavy!

 

[samnev]

Hi Mike,
I also am very happy with my Armalite AR10 with a Noveske SWS rail, N6 SS barrel and Geissele trigger. It also shoots similar groups to your SASS. with 168 grain SMK's. With groups that good Ive asked myself if I will be gaining that much for the big money out lay for the rifles mentioned. I have often thought about getting a GAP or a JP but never could convince myself it was worth the $$$ out lay for a small increase in group size or bragging rights. I also agree the Accu-Shot monopods are useless on a concrete bench. So I went back to my rabbit ear rear bag. Good luck to the OP with your decision.
Sam

 

[cptpizzo]

Hi Mike,
I also am very happy with my Armalite AR10 with a Noveske SWS rail, N6 SS barrel and Geissele trigger. It also shoots similar groups to your SASS. with 168 grain SMK's. With groups that good Ive asked myself if I will be gaining that much for the big money out lay for the rifles mentioned. I have often thought about getting a GAP or a JP but never could convince myself it was worth the $$$ out lay for a small increase in group size or bragging rights. I also agree the Accu-Shot monopods are useless on a concrete bench. So I went back to my rabbit ear rear bag. Good luck to the OP with your decision.
Sam

Sam,

I have the same convictions you have with spending the extra cash for apparently minor improvement of grouping. However, there always is that inner struggle wanting the best! As of now, reading everyone's post, I'm in the middle between GAP and JP. GAP because I already have a P308 lower, but I am not thrilled with the POF style handguards/rails. Love the JP style, but obviously more expensive considering I don't already have the lower...

In any event, I went out yesterday to the range to sight in a new scope for my P308 and will post the results here. By the way, if anyone is interested, I used the Meopix by Meopta which is an iphone adapter to the spotting scope. Although not perfect, it does give me the opportunity to spot myself and take the pics of the target! Pretty cool for the money.

Anyway, here is the pic. Bottom diamond center is the P308 after sighting in the NF. Upper Diamond is the Savage 10FP 308 sighting in the NF F1. All at 100yards using Federal Match 168gr ammo. I probably left out more specifics as I am a rookie here, so feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer. FYI - I am sure that last shot that is about an inch high is not the P308 but more Operator error

 

[Mike]

I am in the 'Ham and if you want to get together at Brock's Gap or somewhere we can talk about the ins and outs and the differences.

 

[cptpizzo]

I am in the 'Ham and if you want to get together at Brock's Gap or somewhere we can talk about the ins and outs and the differences.

Mike,

Definitely! Thanks so much for the invite. I too am a member at Brock's Gap - awesome to see so many Hide members close by.

Anyway, I think that would be a great opportunity for me.

Thanks again,

Alex

 

[Wild Geese 1]

All,

I'd like to make a choice in the next few weeks on a new precision LR AR10 (308Win/7.62) but wanted to get some Hide opinions on which one and why?

I know there are specific rifle platforms for different applications, but mainly curious as just the long range AR 10 for range use, 500-800yds, etc.

Les Baer vs JP PSC12 vs GAP 10?

I was leaning JP, but I heard Les Baer gaurantees sub 1/2 MOA.

Thoughts?

Thanks all for your opinions!

Alex

For lasting accuracy go with a Les Baer they will shoot generally better than most shooters, and THAT IS 5 SHOT GROUPS, he does have a long wait but his guns are the best. I have a monolith 24 inch .308, and 24 inch .264, with a .223 coming, ( The wait I Was told is 10 to 12 months when I ordered it).

 

[Mike]

For lasting accuracy go with a Les Baer they will shoot generally better than most shooters, and THAT IS 5 SHOT GROUPS, he does have a long wait but his guns are the best. I have a monolith 24 inch .308, and 24 inch .264, with a .223 coming, ( The wait I Was told is 10 to 12 months when I ordered it).

Please enlighten us as to what make's his guns "the best" besides your bias opinion?

 

[Matno]

You can't declare one gun as the best unless you've tried every example of every gun. There's just too much variability from gun to gun. That said, in terms of fit, finish, and downrange accuracy, on average I'd be willing to bet that nobody makes guns that are BETTER than Les. My dad's will shoot 1/3 moa with FGMM, which is pretty hard to beat in a gas gun. There are others out there who achieve similar results though, so it would be more accurate to say Les Baer is "one of the best."

 

[Wild Geese 1]

Please enlighten us as to what make's his guns "the best" besides your bias opinion?

Excuse me for answering the question posted by the thread starter cptpizzo. I believe he started the thread something like Best Precision AR10 ( In your opinion (s))? He listed the rifles Les Baer vs JP PSC12 vs GAP10 I believe.

 

[ipsick]

Please enlighten us as to what make's his guns "the best" besides your bias opinion?

Just ask in the bigjake83 "Gap Challenge" thread about the lasting accuracy of a Les Baer, lol! Apparently the barrels are made out of adamantium and never wear out or lose accuracy.

 

[Mike]

Excuse me for answering the question posted by the thread starter cptpizzo. I believe he started the thread something like Best Precision AR10 ( In your opinion (s))? He listed the rifles Les Baer vs JP PSC12 vs GAP10 I believe.

You're excused. Opinions shared in the guise of blanket statements without at least some semblance of reasoning does nothing but show a blind bias and destroys credibility.

Now you've answered the OPs question, answer mine. What makes LB's "the best"?

 

[Wild Geese 1]

You're excused. Opinions shared in the guise of blanket statements without at least some semblance of reasoning does nothing but show a blind bias and destroys credibility.

Now you've answered the OPs question, answer mine. What makes LB's "the best"?

Since it is obvious that I am not much of a poster on here I'm more of reader shooter that I am a poster, I have tried to attach a picture of the two 5 shot groups that came with my Les Baer monolith .308. This picture, and the fact that the rifle will shoot the kind of groups that is seen in the picture, if the shooter does his job. That to me is what makes a Les Baer " THE
BEST" in my opinion.

Semper Fi

 

[Wild Geese 1]

You're excused. Opinions shared in the guise of blanket statements without at least some semblance of reasoning does nothing but show a blind bias and destroys credibility.

Now you've answered the OPs question, answer mine. What makes LB's "the best"?

While I am at it, there should be another picture attached of the two groups fired by Les Baer from my .264 LB, this rifle also will shoot these kind of groups if the shooter does their job, a different rifle made by Les Baer that shoots this well that reinforces to me in my opinion that Les is the best.

 

[Mike]

So what you're saying is your going to base your opinion solely on the fact that you have an LB rifle that shoots well. Congratulations, you have a well shooting rifle but again it does nothing to reinforce anything other than a bias opinion. I can guarantee you 100% that there are both GAP-10 and JP rifles that will do the exact same thing so there is nothing you have besides ownership in one of the rifles mentioned to support your claim of "the best".

 

[Wild Geese 1]

So what you're saying is your going to base your opinion solely on the fact that you have an LB rifle that shoots well. Congratulations, you have a well shooting rifle but again it does nothing to reinforce anything other than a bias opinion. I can guarantee you 100% that there are both GAP-10 and JP rifles that will do the exact same thing so there is nothing you have besides ownership in one of the rifles mentioned to support your claim of "the best".

Congratulations on being able to guarantee those rifles that you mentioned shoot that well, they are great rifles I will give you that well-built and they are accurate. I can say that without a shadow of the doubt since I have owned them and that was mentioned by another in this thread, I no longer own them because at least for me and my partner they do not shoot as well as the Les Baers that we own. Possibly it's our skill level that causes them not to shoot as well as the Les Baer again this is my opinion and until Obama takes it away from me I still have a right to my opinion and you have a right to yours. You are right about one thing I am biased, I am extremely biased towards accuracy.

 

[jevan126]

Wild Geese 1 I have shot all three of these rifle and own one, Les Baer is a very accurate rifle but it is not more accurate than a JP or a GAP. I own a JP LRP-07 and on a very good day I can shoot .25 @ 100 Yards also. All 3 of these rifles are without a doubt the most accurate AR's you can get. But on any given day either rifle could beat the other. So again what it comes down to is personal preference. I would be proud to own any of the other 2 any day.

 

[Km22]

For accuracy, I'd put a GAP-10 up against any semi auto.