Blown Up Rifle, Lessons To Be Learned.

[Boatninja]

Baron23 & Haney, It seems like their are always a few guys that will start their own debate in someone else's thread.
He was shooting from a bench with bipod and squeezing a rear bag with left hand so only sustained a 2" long cut on his arm and small cuts on his face if he would have been shooting with left hand forward he would have had far more serious injuries. When he brought the parts over yesterday he was still shook up pretty obviously.

 

[msgriff]

The damage reminds me of how effective cartridge traps were (or can be).

 

[JoshPutman]

Actually reading the label on the container would have prevented this.

Glad he is ok. He got damn lucky.

 

[OkieMike]

Same, only one canister sitting next to the CM, and the hopper is always emptied after I'm done for the night. Hopefully a side effect is limiting humidity impacts as well.

Same. The humidity aspect was actually more of the motivation... Just makes sense to me for the powder to spend as little time outside of the container as necessary.

I don't run a CM. I use a Lyman Gen 6. And it breaks down nicely for easy cleaning. And I clean it everytime... Not only for safety. But I see nothing good coming from leaving errant kernels of powder inside to abrasively grind the internals.

Someone mentioned storing powder in a separate room. That's not a bad policy if you have the space. I don't, so it all gets stored on a shelf next to the bench. Primers are stored on the opposite side of the room as far from the powder as it can get... Just one of those precautions I take.

Mike

 

[MtnCreek]

That’s amazing.

One time I was loading 9mm with N320 and swapped over to load 6.5 cm with H4350. The problem was I couldn’t remember what powder was in the chargemaster lol.

H4350 and N320 look very similar to the naked eye.

Needless to say my impact didn’t explode when I pulled the trigger but I was a little nervous.

Kinda of like those moments where you know you locked your car but your not sure if your car is locked?

If that happens again you should consider testing it in the faster powder cartridge. If the bullet clears the barrel and sounds/feels normal, its pistol powder. If not, it's rifle powder.

When testing in the rifle, if bullet clears barrel and sounds normal, it's rifle powder. If rifle blows up, its pistol powder.

 

[AllenOne1]

More Pictures
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The next time someone asks about pressure signs, well there you go.

 

[Doc68]

It'll fit back together ... welded joints are even stronger than the original ... so I'm told.

No, that's broken bones

Doc

 

[Rocketvapor]

I've seen people not be specific when talking about CFE powder.
I've ordered some of each in the past.

 

[Conaso]

I've seen people not be specific when talking about CFE powder.
I've ordered some of each in the past.
View attachment 7973053

In a rifle that is known as BANG, bang, and  BOOM!!!

 

[spife7980]

I've seen people not be specific when talking about CFE powder.
I've ordered some of each in the past.
View attachment 7973053

Well context makes it pretty clear what each are intended for.

 

[Rocketvapor]

Toss the cheapest one in your cart and go.

 

[Boatninja]

Actually reading the label on the container would have prevented this.

Glad he is ok. He got damn lucky.

Err, um yes I suppose you’re right……

 

[Near miss]

All this yapping and still we do not know what MV his load got?

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

My day did not come. I was loading .223 rounds for a very expensive and rare Kimber Predator bolt action handgun. Half way through the loading process, I did a double check. Instead of Win 748, I was loading Win 296. Pulled the twenty bullets, loaded the correct powder and had a good shooting session the next day. (Rather than blown gun and destroyed right leg (shooting Creedmoor position)

 

[Boatninja]

I'm still hoping

All this yapping and still we do not know what MV his load got?

Barrel and handgaurd got about 15FPS

 

[Mr.BR]

Welded guns-r-us still around

 

[acudaowner]

what not to do ever well at least unless you wanna blow up your gun too ignorance loves company .

 

[Boatninja]

what not to do ever well at least unless you wanna blow up your gun too ignorance loves company .

That is the whole point of the post," Lessons to be Learned". He never once tried to justify or defend making a near fatal mistake and as I said is a very experienced and conservative handloader. Being careless by not looking at the label? Being ignorant for not knowing there were three varieties of CFE223? Just all food for thought. Many lessons to be learned.
I believe there is a big difference between being careless and being ignorant. I was once told that you only show your ignorance when you open your mouth.

 

[bax]

Having seen two guns blown apart with injuries, I am very happy that the shooter received only minor injuries. Once again small mistakes can have big consequences.

I'm wondering about my understanding of the pressure vectors when the trigger is pulled. Ok, so the primer fires up a lot of pistol powder, there is a huge pressure spike. Since the case is mostly long and thin, most of the pressure is sideways, not back against the bolt face. Is that statement true?

I can imagine that the pressure sheared off the bolt lugs because they are visible in the picture. And now the bolt is moving toward the shooter. Why would the bolt carrier be torn in half? I do not doubt that it is - that is clear in the pictures. With the bolt torn away, the space to hold the expanding gas cloud is much larger so the pressure should drop really fast. Considering the pressures and velocities, except for its mass, there is nothing preventing the bolt carrier from going straight back toward the shooter. Why is the bolt carrier torn apart?

 

[Rocketvapor]

The pressure was obviously higher than the bolt lugs could take. Carrier went back and the front went UP when the upper split.
Broke the carrier with the back end inside the tube.

 

[fdkay]

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The charging handle, grip and stock look okay, not a total loss

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

Regarding loading areas. Cans of powder look alike. Worse, some cans are color coded and the colors are very close.

In my old age, i keep one type of primer and one type of powder out and on the bench at a time. Still, I double check the powder, the charge weight, the primer type and the bullet type and weight and caliber before starting, Then, when I am half way finished, I check everything again. It just seems the safe way to keep rifles together and hospital visits (as well as permanent injuries) to a minimum.

 

[Alabama556]

I blew up a Remington 700 chambered in 300 whisper. ( before 300 blackout was a thing). It was 100% my fault. I put a double load of AA#5 behind a 220 grain match king. Blew the bolt apart. It had a Sako extractor installed in the factory Remington bolt and the bushing that was soldered came apart. The extractor blew in half. The floor plate on the bottom of the magazine blew out and cut the hell out of my arm. The case was blown partially apart.

I still have tiny pieces of brass in my forearm.

I am lucky I was not hurt. Pure luck that I was just shooting through a chronograph so I did not have the gun on my shoulder. Could have lost an eye.

Took apart 150 rounds the next day and they were all fine. Looks like I just messed up on 1 but that’s all it takes.

Changed my loading practice for the subsonic rounds. I now weigh every loaded round before it goes in the box.

Luckily a new ptg bolt fixed the gun and somehow my suppressor did not come apart ( aac Tirant 9).

I am proud to share this story with the hope it helps just 1 person if not more.

 

[whatsupdoc]

I've seen people not be specific when talking about CFE powder.
I've ordered some of each in the past.
View attachment 7973053

Stupid Labeling, should of been BLKCFE 223CFE and PistolCFE. Easy to mistake the 223 and pistol.

 

[bax]

I still have tiny pieces of brass in my forearm.

If the charge is small enough, the weight variation between loaded rounds may make a double charge tough to pick out. When choosing powder, try to pick one where a double charge won't fit into the case. New bolts are expensive - eyes are something else.

I have told this story before. There used to be a shooting range just south of the highway about halfway between Denver and Boulder Colorado. I was there one day shooting bowling pins when there was a big boom. Guy two benches down blew up his rifle. He is dancing around, jumping into the air - he is very excited. When the weapon blew up, he caught a lot shrapnel. His face is a little bloody. He is wearing a white tee shirt, it has many little specs of blood on it. He calms a little but he is still being pretty noisy, shouting that we should not take handloads from friends. We collected his stuff and got him to a car. I recall that we got someone - maybe his wife, maybe a friend, I don't recall now - to take him to an ER to pick the bits out of his hide. I took away little self-defense things from it - like the idea above about powder charges and not taking handloads from friends.

 

[WindstormSCR]

If the charge is small enough, the weight variation between loaded rounds may make a double charge tough to pick out. When choosing powder, try to pick one where a double charge won't fit into the case. New bolts are expensive - eyes are something else.

depends on how pedantic you are about sorting cases and projectiles by weight I suppose.

for my match ammo I do actually sort by weight for consistency, so a double charge would be easy to detect

 

[Alabama556]

depends on how pedantic you are about sorting cases and projectiles by weight I suppose.

for my match ammo I do actually sort by weight for consistency, so a double charge would be easy to detect

My loads are within 2-2.5 grains once loaded. A double load would be 7.4 grains over.

I recently switched to Norma brass so the 2-2.5 will go down as that brass is pretty consistent.

2.5 over won’t blow a gun up but 7.4 will.

It is a risk I take to load the quietest load possible.

I also seat each bullet after I fill the case with powder. Before, I would fill a block of cases and then seat the bullets.

I only load 2-300 per year so I can really take my time when loading these rounds.

 

[brianf]

I blew up a Remington 700 chambered in 300 whisper. ( before 300 blackout was a thing). It was 100% my fault. I put a double load of AA#5 behind a 220 grain match king. Blew the bolt apart. It had a Sako extractor installed in the factory Remington bolt and the bushing that was soldered came apart. The extractor blew in half. The floor plate on the bottom of the magazine blew out and cut the hell out of my arm. The case was blown partially apart.

I still have tiny pieces of brass in my forearm.

I am lucky I was not hurt. Pure luck that I was just shooting through a chronograph so I did not have the gun on my shoulder. Could have lost an eye.

Took apart 150 rounds the next day and they were all fine. Looks like I just messed up on 1 but that’s all it takes.

Changed my loading practice for the subsonic rounds. I now weigh every loaded round before it goes in the box.

Luckily a new ptg bolt fixed the gun and somehow my suppressor did not come apart ( aac Tirant 9).

I am proud to share this story with the hope it helps just 1 person if not more.

100% on process and QC on your bench

i never understand why people shoot a cartridge that there is a question about...just pull it

not sure what powder is in the hopper...dont be a poor and toss it

possibly saving 50$ in powder but destroying a 500$ action, never mind the personal injury possibility...they might need a new calculator

 

[Rocketvapor]

I sort brass (bullets and primers ).
At least each row of ten cases in the block are really really close usually 20 plus sighters matched.
As I go through the reloading process, size, trim, prime, etc., I flip the cases over to keep track of progress.
(100 round ammo box)
Primers up by the time I get to charging (culling any with upside down primers ). Each charged case is put in the block and an upside down projectile added. My load density wouldn't allow a double charge.
After I'm done charging I take each case and put in the shell holder, then flip the bullet and seat.
Each loaded round will easily be within a grain total weight.
This takes care of charge variance but will NOT cover wrong powder choices.

 

[OkieMike]

I've gotten into the habit of placing a bullet point down in the case mouth after I dump the charge in and pull the funnel.

Works well with rifle cartridges.

It would probably work on pistol/straight wall stuff too but I haven't tried it with them yet.

Mike

 

[Sdvldog1371]

I'm seeing more of this happening lately. I'm glad it didn't turn out to be a "Final Destination" moment for the shooter. Also, that he didn't lose anything except momentary sphincter tension.