I like both reticles but have never shot behind either one. I can get both for around same price. What is the consensus around here between the two. TIA.
Rifle Scopes Burris XTR 3 vs Bushy XRS 2
- Thread starter sanpedroranch
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I was in your shoes. Went with Bushy because it had been out longer/appeared more proven. The deal GA Precision had with the Kestrel and the scope was too good to pass up for me.
I really enjoy this XRS II, more so than my Gen 2 Razor.
https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...r2-for-a-steal-on-midway.7028830/post-8941013
https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/team-rcbs-bushnell-introduction.7019655/post-8992758
https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...l-hdmr-ii-cr-close-range.7035540/post-8986680
Put these together and I get they're being discontinued (no new stock) with a replacement coming next year.
^How fine is the SCR2 at different magnifications? Can you compare to some others in the normal consideration set? And finally an apples to oranges comparo... is it as fine as the S&B LRR?
I've owned both. I'd buy the XTR3 again before the XRS2.
I'm surprised the XTR3 hasn't taken off as it is a beautifully executed scope. Great mag range, optically very nice, great feeling turrets, made in USA. Only downside is the lack of illumination which isn't a feature I use enough to be an issue. The Burris punches above its price class but LOTS of competition in the price range.
Sounds good, thanks - my eyesight is still good and most ffp reticles seem thick at higher mag. I'm going to order a few scopes to compare (and keep one or two) - was going to be S&B and March HM only, but think I will include this one as well. I have some LOW scopes already, and wanted to experience the "alpha" stuff to compare. If they don't immediately elicit a "wow", they'll be going back and perhaps I'll keep the XTR3.
So any new info on illuminated reticle and is there a hide vendor that I can purchase one of these from? illum is not a deal breaker but if its coming out tomorrow......
I’ve only had the LRR-Mil in the Schmidt 5-45. I’ve had the SCR2 in both the 3.3-18 and 5.5-30 and I can say I like the SCR2 in the 5.5-30, it seems “thicker” and more usable even at lower mags. Compared to the LRR-Mil in the 5-45, the SCR2 in the 5.5-30 is “better” because it’s thicker and easier to pick up in low light and/or high contrast situations, keep in mind this is personal preference and based on my observations.
I think the reason the XTR III has not caught on is because of the lack of illumination, Burris dropped the ball on that one. The SCR2 reticle in the 3.3-18 is also very thin and not ideal IMO. Once Burris offers illumination and thickens up the SCR2 in the 3.3-18 we will start hearing a lot more chatter about these scopes. Until that happens they remain a hidden gem for those who do not care about illumination.
^Thanks, I bought one a while back now and do like it a lot. Have a Mark 5HD PR2 incoming this week to compare. Would've liked a S&B with MSR2, but learned about the tariff and Eurooptic's exclusive contract with them, adding 2-3K to the prices. Would go ZCO or TT before that.
I have been eyeballing the PR2 Mark 5 as im looking for a mid priced optic, the only thing that worries me is will the Leupold hold up and track... I have read in different places of Leopold tracking issues in the past, not so sure about the Mark 5. It almost makes me wanna get another one of the porker Razor gen 2's because I just feel like I can trust them more as I've owned them in the past... Also have some interest in the XTR III 30X.I agree with Bill on the illumination. They REALLY need to get it to market.
And I have to add, I shot a regional club match yesterday with 55 guys in attendance and plunked my 30x XTR3 down next to some Luepy MK5 guys (they asked, not me) to say they were surprised at the comparison is putting it mildly. I think I sold a scope or two yesterday.
I agree with Bill on the illumination. They REALLY need to get it to market.
And I have to add, I shot a regional club match yesterday with 55 guys in attendance and plunked my 30x XTR3 down next to some Luepy MK5 guys (they asked, not me) to say they were surprised at the comparison is putting it mildly. I think I sold a scope or two yesterday.
Your comments also pushed me over the line to buy one last year... but I jumped at the non-illuminated version in order to get the thinner reticle. That was a major differentiating characteristic / selling point for me.
Do you know how much crossover there is with Burris and Steiner? Can you compare the M7xi to the XTR3? I really like the MSR2 reticle...
I'm hanging out for the thicker SCR2 reticle for competition purposes.
Based on the few reviews that are out there I don't see why the reticle is so thin in the 3.3-18 model, when you are limited to 18x magnification having a super thin reticle the same as the 5.5-30 seems crazy to me.
I know Burris isn't the only company that does this but I see no good reason why it's become the norm and can see lots of good reasons to make the reticle thicker in the lower magnification models. It makes it feel like the lower mag models are an after thought.
I just looked at the line thickness... it's .02 mil thick? I can see a lot of people holding out for the thicker illuminated version if that's the case.
Is there any information about the line thickness of the new illuminated scopes? The MSR 2 .04 line thickness is perfect in my opinion.
Nice, maybe they'll be available this year?
I hope Ilya gets one. He said he was waiting for an illuminated version of the XTR III before he reviewed one.
Just looking through the Mark 5 pr2 for the first time side by side w/ XTR3 30 and Trij/Delta 5-50. Up to 3700 yards in sun, haze, medium mirage. IQ really close between Trij and Mk5, with edge to Mk5 in these conditions. Trij with less contrast but neither with better resolution. Mirage they tie, both cut through really well. XTR3 trails behind both scopes in resolution and mirage, but has the big FOV, which can be perceived as IQ on first glance. Compared to the NX8 I returned, all 3 are at least a step above. Mark 5 is also only 30 oz, so a legitimate competitor to the NX8 in weight, but blowing it away in IQ dept. Will post more as impressions develop / and certainly if they change.
Sorry I have to change this for apples:apples - was looking at XTR3 and Trij at 30X with Mark5 @ 25X
With all 3 at 25X, resolution XTR3=Mk5 and Trij a bit ahead of both, but the contrast of the Mk5 still a bit better than Trij, image less washed out...
Sorry I have to change this for apples:apples - was looking at XTR3 and Trij at 30X with Mark5 @ 25X
With all 3 at 25X, resolution XTR3=Mk5 and Trij a bit ahead of both, but the contrast of the Mk5 still a bit better than Trij, image less washed out...
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I'm sure my opinion holds very little weight to the folks in Greeley, but those line thickness sound perfect (more or less).
Could maybe go to .06 on the 3.3-18 but .05 would be sweet.
If it's the same .035 in the 3.3-18 I'll be most displeased.
4-32 - honestly, the XTR3 is the better option. Leupold if you don't mind less FOV, but it's an extra 2mils plus @ 25X - big difference. XTR3 is 32 oz.
I like the Mark 5 but doesn’t parallax down far enough.. I was looking at the XTR 3, NX8 and the Tract has peaked my interest lately..The resale on the XTR worries me some if I don’t like it.
From everything I've tried, they're all splitting hairs with IQ, from the Chinese Ares ETR to the Razor G2 and XTR3 and every LOW scope I've looked through. I said screw it and ordered a ZCO to finally see the light 
I have to somewhat agree, anything above $1000 has glass that is more than capable for what most people use their rifles for.From everything I've tried, they're all splitting hairs with IQ, from the Chinese Ares ETR to the Razor G2 and XTR3 and every LOW scope I've looked through. I said screw it and ordered a ZCO to finally see the light
Above $1000 I'm more concerned about reticle, turret features and other features.
I have a Delta Stryker which I 95% love, turrets, glass etc, but the narrow FOV and aparent FOV really bug me.
The huge FOV on the XTR3 is what appeals to me but I'm not keen on super fine reticles as I like to use my scopes on fairly low magnification when practical.
^Yes, this is completely unnecessary for me - but a very interesting and enjoyable hobby. 3D billiards at a mile.
Do you see the possibility of Burris creating a tactical hunter reticle with the same theme as the Bushnell G2H? Throw that into a 3.3-18 XTR3 with illumination & it would sell like hotcakes. This combination would have very few competitors. It's almost a sure bet.I had a good conversation with the Burris brand sales manager today. I was actually trying to get my hands on one of the prototypes to play with it. But these aren't apparently a full scope in the manner that they prototyped the XTR3 when it was under development. These are more basic just to test the illumination and switch.
But I did find out the goal is to have the illuminated versions on the market this summer. I'm sure they want them out before hunting season. The official thickness of the new reticle is, and I quote," its a smidge thicker "
And I got on the list to get one out of the first batch release. So I'll be able to drop a teaser here as they are hitting the market.
And I have to agree with the glass assessment above. Ive compared the XTR3 to everything I can get my hands on in its price point. I know a shooter who thinks the MK5 is better in every way except FOV, and I have another friend who sold both his MK5s for XTR3s and likes them much better. Ive seen it go both ways with multiple brands. The are so close on so many ocassions that glass simply isn't the tipping point. Reticle, FOV, DOF, parallax, eyebox, turrets, etc, all seem to be the features that will create separation from the other brands. The added caveat of a few of the brands being built in the US should carry some weight as well.
Just to update, I received the ZCO 527 mpct3 and have looked through it side by side at different ranges and light conditions for the last couple of days, from 100-3700 yards. Wow. If the difference between the NX8 and XTR3 is 10 pts, then XTR3 to ZCO is 25 pts. Is it 2 XTR3's? That's like asking if a Ferrari is worth 2 Vettes. Yes, but do you need all that? I certainly don't, but I definitely like it. Still questioning whether to keep it or offload to one of you guys and buy another XTR3.
I sold my xtr3 and moved to a xrs2. I had issues with the glass in the Burris. In my opinion the xrs2 is far superior.
What rail do I have if my XTR3 is zeroed at 100 yards, bottomed out? I took the scope out of the box, mounted it in ARC rings, and needed 1 click left to zero it... Thought it was a 20 moa rail, but must be more?
My ZCO 527 in ZCO rings required 12.3 mils up to zero @ 100 with a 20 moa rail. I've since thrown a 40 moa rail on there, but have yet to re-zero.
And... since no updates for a while, any more info re: illuminated versions / reticles / line thickness?
My ZCO 527 in ZCO rings required 12.3 mils up to zero @ 100 with a 20 moa rail. I've since thrown a 40 moa rail on there, but have yet to re-zero.
And... since no updates for a while, any more info re: illuminated versions / reticles / line thickness?
@Chickentoast I messaged Burris on their Facebook page last week asking when the illuminated model of the XTR3 would be and they replied saying it would be available next year and to stay tuned. I kinda feel really let down as some of the in the know guys here on the Hide expected it this summer. In Burris’s defense there doesn’t seem to be any real movement with any scope companies of late.
Been saying that for a couple years now, started to be the norm, sounds like it’ll always be “next year”. It’s too bad, they are great scopes but lack of illumination really hinders their appeal to certain shooters.
I had two XTRIII's and sold one in hopes of picking up an illuminated model this spring as everything was pointing to them being released this spring. Here I sit, still waiting..... I'll be honest, I'm looking elsewhere at this point. Burris puts out a nice product, but this illumination thing is getting old. I just don't understand how they can't get it incorporated into the optic, when the crapiest Chinesium POS has illumination.
I’ve said (jokingly, or so I thought) many times that the XTRIII wil be eclipsed by the competition’s next gen model before the illumination gets figured out. If there’s any truth to it being put off until 2022, I may just be right! I’d really like to try one, but the SCR is too thin for me without illumination, so I’m guessing the SCR2 will be the same. Maybe they’re leading us on and it’ll be ready sooner than we think, who knows!
I would be surprised if the competition "eclipsed" the XTR III, I have yet to find an equal (optically) from any of the competition at the under $2k price point. I've had the XTR III (both), the NX8 2.5-20x50, the Mark 5 3.6-18x44, the Tract Toric 4-20x50, the LRHT/LRHS 4.5-18x44, the PST II 5-25 and 3-15. To get better features than the XTR III I'd say the next scope(s) up are in another class, the Vortex AMG 6-24 and the NF ATACR line which is considerably more. Bushnell is coming out with the LRHS2 but without illumination, so scratch that, besides, one of the great features of the XTR III is the wide angle FOV that no other scopes (currently) come close to (except the NX8, more on that later). So while a Bushnell DMR III or the like may compete at an optical level I just don't see Bushy pushing the FOV barriers as they've always had fairly poor FOV characteristics, would love to be proven wrong but while I like Bushnell's DMR and XRS series they've always had their drawbacks with weight and the aforementioned FOV issues.
Bash, if you do not like how thin the SCR is then the SCR2 would really frustrate you as it is thinner than the SCR in the 3.3-18 scope. The thinness issue kept me from checking out the 5.5-30x56 for quite a while until I found a deal in the classifieds I felt I couldn't pass up and grabbed one, and so glad I did. In the 5.5-30x56 the SCR2 reticle is much more usable than it is in the 3.3-18, and the scope is for my rimfire trainer so I did not need illumination, this scope (the 5.5-30) continually impresses me every time I use it.
Birddog has said that sponsored shooters have already been using the pre-production illuminated XTR III scopes with great success, Burris was promising illumination in 2019, it's now 2021, and I realize we've had the stupidity that is called COVID affecting things, but taking 3 years (or more) from the time the first scope was released? The NX8 was released with illumination to start with (as most other scopes are), and even though the 2.5-20x50 may eclipse the XTR III in FOV, it is an optical abomination that shouldn't have been released to the public, but because it has NF on the side, many will sing its praises even though it doesn't hold a candle (optically) to other scopes; in all fairness it does have excellent center resolution, but a little over half way out of center it is like looking through a coke bottle with significant image distortion. I detailed this in my review below
Rifle Scopes - Burris XTR III 3.3-18x50 mini review and comparison to Nightforce NX8 2.5-20x50
Backstory The Burris XTR II has been the top of the line offering from the Greeley, CO sport optics company for many years now. Initial manufacture of these scopes had some issues optically, but Burris was able to rectify those over time and the latest XTR II is a pretty well refined scope for...
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I actually really like the thin lines of SCR2 and it's on a 3.3-18.
I don't have any issue finding the reticle and much prefer shooting with it than my Steiner 5-25 with an MSR reticle (in competition)
I will say that both the thin lines of the SCR2 and thick lines of the MSR both have merits.
I don't have any issue finding the reticle and much prefer shooting with it than my Steiner 5-25 with an MSR reticle (in competition)
I will say that both the thin lines of the SCR2 and thick lines of the MSR both have merits.
I really hope you’re right. I’ve been holding off to buy one - if it’s going to be another year I’ll likely go in a different direction.
I really want to wait on the xtr iii, it really has an impressive set of features and what looks like an excellent reticle for a decent price.
Not saying you did this but I did.. I was 1 click away from being able to zero at 50 on my rimfire..I thought I bottomed out but all I did was bump against the factory setting in the zero stop..I moved the zero stop and I was good to go..
Yes, same, I only have 21.5 mils up left from my 100 yd zero, so factory setting was likely set up for people running 20 MOA rails. Thanks.
I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on the XTR3 3-18 vs Mark 5HD 3.6-18. Most discussions focus on their larger magnification models. What’s the optical performance difference in the lower magnification ones? Which has better low light performance?I would be surprised if the competition "eclipsed" the XTR III, I have yet to find an equal (optically) from any of the competition at the under $2k price point. I've had the XTR III (both), the NX8 2.5-20x50, the Mark 5 3.6-18x44, the Tract Toric 4-20x50, the LRHT/LRHS 4.5-18x44, the PST II 5-25 and 3-15. To get better features than the XTR III I'd say the next scope(s) up are in another class, the Vortex AMG 6-24 and the NF ATACR line which is considerably more. Bushnell is coming out with the LRHS2 but without illumination, so scratch that, besides, one of the great features of the XTR III is the wide angle FOV that no other scopes (currently) come close to (except the NX8, more on that later). So while a Bushnell DMR III or the like may compete at an optical level I just don't see Bushy pushing the FOV barriers as they've always had fairly poor FOV characteristics, would love to be proven wrong but while I like Bushnell's DMR and XRS series they've always had their drawbacks with weight and the aforementioned FOV issues.
Bash, if you do not like how thin the SCR is then the SCR2 would really frustrate you as it is thinner than the SCR in the 3.3-18 scope. The thinness issue kept me from checking out the 5.5-30x56 for quite a while until I found a deal in the classifieds I felt I couldn't pass up and grabbed one, and so glad I did. In the 5.5-30x56 the SCR2 reticle is much more usable than it is in the 3.3-18, and the scope is for my rimfire trainer so I did not need illumination, this scope (the 5.5-30) continually impresses me every time I use it.
Birddog has said that sponsored shooters have already been using the pre-production illuminated XTR III scopes with great success, Burris was promising illumination in 2019, it's now 2021, and I realize we've had the stupidity that is called COVID affecting things, but taking 3 years (or more) from the time the first scope was released? The NX8 was released with illumination to start with (as most other scopes are), and even though the 2.5-20x50 may eclipse the XTR III in FOV, it is an optical abomination that shouldn't have been released to the public, but because it has NF on the side, many will sing its praises even though it doesn't hold a candle (optically) to other scopes; in all fairness it does have excellent center resolution, but a little over half way out of center it is like looking through a coke bottle with significant image distortion. I detailed this in my review below
Rifle Scopes - Burris XTR III 3.3-18x50 mini review and comparison to Nightforce NX8 2.5-20x50
Backstory The Burris XTR II has been the top of the line offering from the Greeley, CO sport optics company for many years now. Initial manufacture of these scopes had some issues optically, but Burris was able to rectify those over time and the latest XTR II is a pretty well refined scope for...
My specific use is on an AR10 for both hog hunting at night and target shooting (have access to a 1500y range and interested in getting into PRS). My wishlist of requirements (realize I’m unlikely to get all of them) is around 13” max length, sub 30oz weight, 4x or less low end, 15x minimum high end, wide FOV, illuminated, and a light tree/holdover reticle.
Ideally a reticle with a fast illuminated aiming point that’s both usable on low power for point shooting moving targets at as close as 30 yards and useable for holdovers at the top half of magnification. Most of my experience is shooting fast with LPVO’s (Kahles 3GR / Razor GenIII reticles) so something similar to those reticles is what I’m thinking (but obviously not exactly those). More of a DMR reticle than strictly a precision one which tend to overlook usability on the low end.
Unfortunately it appears the Mark 5HD and XTR3 are the closest optics to fit that role that I see. But Leupold has poor/limited reticle choices for holdovers and even more limited options in illuminated models, plus they charge a rediculous up charge for it. Then obviously the Burris hasn’t released an illuminated model yet, still don’t know what that reticle will look like.
So for the moment it appears there is no scope I’m aware of to meet the need of a lighter weight illuminated ultra short with a decent hold off reticle. Which seems like a category that should have more options given the popularity of DMR type AR15/AR10 builds.
Are there other optics close to this category to consider? Sorry for writing a book! Thanks.
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