Can I use this powder?

[bax]

Hi guys,

8 pounds of vintage H1000. Metal cap. Note the reddish "rust" around the cap. Good? Or, not good? Smells like acetone, does not smell sour.

 

[b6graham]

there's a difference between 'can' and 'should'

 

[B y r o n]

The outside of the container is more a view of the storage environment but does not indicate the condition of the powder inside. I say load some rounds and see the results.

 

[FWoo45]

Sure. Might be a little less potent though. Better fill the cases to the brim and scrape em off with a butter knife. Video you shooting your first group.

 

[culater]

I'll buy it off you for that price and give a try. Look like you in Michigan, so I'm I send a message if you looking to sell it

 

[Yondering]

Pour out a handful of that powder onto a plate or something and post a picture of that. Keep an eye out for any clumping or color/texture differences.

 

[Kadams1563]

You could always fry it out in the oven. But I bet it shoots just fine.

 

[bax]

Sure. Might be a little less potent though. Better fill the cases to the brim and scrape em off with a butter knife. Video you shooting your first group.

Some time ago, I watched Skip Otto do that with Vit 133 in 6ppc cases. He was trying to minimize flight time. It sort of worked but it was hard on barrels. I'm not sure how many times he did it. It might have been just once but it seems to me that he did it for a couple national matches. He was from Western Colorado and the thicker air down in the flat lands messed up his wind calls.

 

[bax]

Pour out a handful of that powder onto a plate or something and post a picture of that. Keep an eye out for any clumping or color/texture differences.

I asked Hodgdon. They sent the attached doc (original was in Microsoft Word format).

It says that bad powder will contain reddish clumps and smell sour (acidic) instead of smelling of acetone. They also said to pour some on a sheet of white paper and look for red dust. I have no red clumps or dust and it smells of acetone. I will make a few rounds, loaded down a little, and see what happens. I bought it in Denver in 1998.

 

[Fig]

Powder can get ruined by moisture, but if kept cool and dry it will last several lifetimes. LOL "vintage H1000". I think that was commercially introduced in the 1980s. For me "vintage powder" Is my grandfather and dad, and it starts before I was born. I still load out of paper and tin kegs of old powder like Herco, Unique (dirty), Green Dot, and Dupont #4, that have been stored cool and dry for 70+ years. Some of it is a bit slower than the published specs from 1965/1971 (the books I have that list them), but it works just fine. Some of it you can still buy, but it's been reformulated.

There is absolutely NO danger in shooting old powder as it will NOT become MORE potent. Worst case it's kaput and causes a squib, but that is the worst thing that can happen. When you are working up a load with it do not begin at the start charge, but rather in the middle between the min and max load.

 

[bax]

Powder can get ruined by moisture, but if kept cool and dry it will last several lifetimes. LOL "vintage H1000". I think that was commercially introduced in the 1980s. For me "vintage powder" Is my grandfather and dad, and it starts before I was born. I still load out of paper and tin kegs of old powder like Herco, Unique (dirty), Green Dot, and Dupont #4, that have been stored cool and dry for 70+ years. Some of it is a bit slower than the published specs from 1965/1971 (the books I have that list them), but it works just fine. Some of it you can still buy, but it's been reformulated.

There is absolutely NO danger in shooting old powder as it will NOT become MORE potent. Worst case it's kaput and causes a squib, but that is the worst thing that can happen. When you are working up a load with it do not begin at the start charge, but rather in the middle between the min and max load.

I am shooting a 300 PRC with Berger 230s, Lapua brass, and federal 215M. It seems to like new H1000 77.0 grains.

I made 15 each 76.9, 77.0, and 77.1 and 5 rounds of 77.2 using new H1000. I plan to shoot them on Saturday. I plan to work my way out to 1k using 76.9 then shoot a group. Then change to 77.0 and shoot a group. Then change to 77.1 and shoot a group, then 77.2 and shoot a group. In workups so far, all of those shoot to approximately the same point of impact within 0.2 mil. Based on the groups, I will pick a load.

I also made 10 rounds 76.7 using the "vintage" powder. I will use rounds 1-5 to foul the barrel and record a zero then move to the 76.9. If the old powder is shooting okay and after I shoot the 77.2 set, I may take rounds 6-10 and shoot a 1k group. That should give me a comparison between old powder and new powder.

When I installed the barrel, I took 50 cases out of a new box of brass and started shooting. After a recent trip, I found 6 cases about to have a head separation - shiny ring, groove you can feel with a fingernail - the normal signs, so I retired the batch. At that point, the barrel had exactly 800 rounds through it so those cases had done 16 full cycles including anneal, full length size, expand neck with mandrel, and trim. Primer pockets were still tight. In those cases I had always shot either IMR 7828 (usually 72.14 grains) except for one pound of RL-26. Not important to the powder test, just a data point. I am a fan of Lapua brass for this gun. At the loads I tested, H1000 doesn't generate as much pressure as RL26 - using the Hornady comparator, fired RL26 cases measured 0.001 to 0.002 longer than the H1000 cases.

 

[Fig]

That is a very good use for that powder!

 

[bax]

Regarding 10 rounds of "vintage" H1000 powder at charge 76.7, the old stuff shot the same as the new stuff. At 1k the POI was pretty close to 76.9, 77.0, and 77.1. As I went up from 76.9 to 77.2 I had clicks and showed a tiny bit of ejector dimple - more powder, more click. I'm going to go back to 76.5, 6, and 7 and see how they group on paper at 500.

About clicks ... I don't understand.

I was thinking that the click happened when the bolt was rotating around the case head and shearing off the brass that extruded into the ejector hole. I was thinking that the bolt head was rotating around the brass and the brass was fixed in the chamber. But if that is the case, why does the bolt head rotate 60 degrees before shearing the brass? The brass extruded into the ejector in the down position, why would the bolt rotate before cutting the brass?

Alternatively, suppose the the brass and the bolt head are locked together. When I lift the bolt, the bolt head and the brass together rotate 60 degrees around the chamber and then it clicks. Does that mean that the brass stopped so that the bolt head could cut the brass? Why did the brass stop and lock in place so that the bolt could continue to rotate and cut the extruded brass? It was rotating, why did it stop rotating?

I think that both of those are wrong but I can't figure out what makes the click happen while explaining that the extruded brass seems to be sheared off by the bolt-face.