Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

#101
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

People need to remember one thing: None of this shit happens if you do what your told when confronted by a LE officer. If you have a bitch, tell it to your lawyer or the judge. The officer is not there to argue with you nor should he.

Everytime this comes up people always want to blame the cops but as stated above "NONE" of it would ever happen if they kept thier mouth shut and done what they were told. They are the ones that start it and then bitch when they get taken down for it.

A police officer can use "Whatever force necessary to affect the arrest" When I started in LE we weren't tought shit. Then officers were getting hurt trying to make arrests so we were tought "Come alongs" more for passive resistance. Then it was verbal Judo to become more politically correct because of law suits.

Now I see they are teaching full fleged martial arts including kicking to try to keep officers from getting killed.

People need to remember that everytime an officer goes to make an arrest there is a gun invlolved, "HIS" When I was on over a third of all officers killed were killed with their own weapon.

Now days they have a lot better holsters but in my day it was not uncommon to have you gun on the floor or ground after an unrully arrest. Society has changed there are a lot of assholes out there now. When I was a kid if a cop told you something it was yes sir and no arguments period!!
 
#102
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

From some of the comments I've seen here its pretty apparent that some don't understand the Use of Force Contiuum. This is what ours looks like and is the one accepted by the National Institute of Justice: http://www.nij.gov/topics/law-enforcement/officer-safety/use-of-force/continuum.htm

Looks like this:

1.Officer Presence

2.Verbalization

3.Empty Hand Control
Soft-Grabs, holds, and joint locks
Hard-Punches, kicks

4.Less-Lethal
Chemical- Pepper Spray
Taser
Blunt Objects-Baton, Bean Bag projectiles

5.Lethal Force

We are taught that in a crowded situation like what existed in this case, pepper spray should be avoided if possible. Bystanders will be affected by the spray. Taser comes after hard empty hand control, so if the punch didn't work, that would be the next option.

I wasn't there so I am not going to second guess the guys actions. Just based on what I saw, what he did was justified.

And to all you guys calling him a pussy because he punched a girl, put on a uniform, hop in a patrol car and put yourself in that situation sometime.

My view from the cheap seats.

Rob Opp
 
#103
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: raptor99</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
A police officer can use "Whatever force necessary to affect the arrest" </div></div>

Ummm, thats not 100% true.

An officer can use whatever force is <span style="font-weight: bold">reasonable</span> and necessary.

If shooting her was necessary to get her in custody that would not be justified because its not reasonable.
 
#104
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tac243</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">She got what she deserved. The officers were trying to remove another person from the premise and she stepped in and interfered. I don't know if I would ever punch a female like that, but I wouldn't discipline the officer for it.</div></div>

that cop needs his fucking ass kicked thats a bullshit move its not professional... theres ways of taking care of that << pepper spray >> he should lose his job and hope she dont sue that department...</div></div>

First pepper spray in a crowded dinner would be a very very bad idea. As for other "ways" if he used a baton you would all say he beat her with a stick, a tazer, well that would be a little hard in that crowded area to do properly and at that close with a thin dress the probes are going into skin. She was a jerk who hit a cop and you all are defending her. Try being a cop first. I'm not saying he was perfectly right but I would settle for a letter of counseling. Her I would put in jail for assault.
 
#105
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob Opp</div><div class="ubbcode-body">From some of the comments I've seen here its pretty apparent that some don't understand the Use of Force Contiuum. This is what ours looks like and is the one accepted by the National Institute of Justice: http://www.nij.gov/topics/law-enforcement/officer-safety/use-of-force/continuum.htm

Looks like this:

1.Officer Presence

2.Verbalization

3.Empty Hand Control
Soft-Grabs, holds, and joint locks
Hard-Punches, kicks

4.Less-Lethal
Chemical- Pepper Spray
Taser
Blunt Objects-Baton, Bean Bag projectiles

5.Lethal Force

We are taught that in a crowded situation like what existed in this case, pepper spray should be avoided if possible. Bystanders will be affected by the spray. Taser comes after hard empty hand control, so if the punch didn't work, that would be the next option.

I wasn't there so I am not going to second guess the guys actions. Just based on what I saw, what he did was justified.

And to all you guys calling him a pussy because he punched a girl, put on a uniform, hop in a patrol car and put yourself in that situation sometime.

My view from the cheap seats.

Rob Opp </div></div>

You must have missed the part in the constitution about allowing shrill, drunk bitches hammer on you while trying to affect an arrest.

Jesus, I can't believe anyone is dismayed at the actions of this officer; if the female looked awful, I doubt most of the horndogs angling for pity-pussy would be so empathetic!

This is like the armadillo eating thread elsewhere in the 'pit': Someone had to tell us we shouldn't strike a cop?
 
#106
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

Back to the fact: it was a little chick. If you gotta punch a little chick to control her you do not posess the minimum skill for your job.

I tell you what, I think she showed more character trying to protect her friend then Jumbo with his inability to control two little chicks in a frickin IHOP. Talk about tactically ineffective, good thing it wasn't a big chick or he would have had his big ass handed to him.
 
#107
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Back to the fact: it was a little chick. If you gotta punch a little chick to control her you do not posess the minimum skill for your job.

I tell you what, I think she showed more character trying to protect her friend then Jumbo with his inability to control two little chicks in a frickin IHOP. Talk about tactically ineffective, good thing it wasn't a big chick or he would have had his big ass handed to him. </div></div>

That makes about 8 references of "little chicks"

"Little chicks" can be quite fiesty.
 
#108
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

TOPO< I'm still waiting for you to tell us all how it should be done. Start with trying to get the original offender out of the booth and go from there. I am curious how a person with your insight and intelect would handle this situation. You have established that the cop was fat and the girl is skinny. Break it down how it should be properly handled so I can make sure and do it "right" the next time.
Thanks in advance,
Patrick
 
#109
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DODGE268</div><div class="ubbcode-body">TOPO< I'm still waiting for you to tell us all how it should be done. Start with trying to get the original offender out of the booth and go from there. I am curious how a person with your insight and intelect would hand this situation. You have established that the cop was fat and the girl is skinny. Break it down how it should be properly handled so I can make sur eand do it "right" the next time.
Thanks on advance,
Patrick </div></div>

Yes, please do. And don't forget to apply the Use of Force Continuum to whatever method you decide to use. If you jump a level make sure you explain why, both the prosecutor and the defense attorney are going to want to know why.
 
#110
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

I'm just curious what the big hurry was on the part of the cop?

The original woman he was trying to arrest was trapped in a booth. She wasn't going anywhere. Why not just give it a minute, and try to explain what she had done wrong, and why she needed to cooperate? Perhaps being a little less "large and in charge" would have diffused the situation. Seeing as she apparently walked (ran), one has to wonder why the cop was going after her in the first place.

Judging from the cop's physical appearance and actions, I can't help but wonder if he's harboring a grudge from being bullied as a child. He saw someone he knew he could dominate, and he snapped. If that female had been a guy that looked like he was capable of kicking the cop's ass, I doubt that he would have attempted any kind of physical confrontation.

I'm not excusing her behavior, but let's face it - what that cop did was pretty extreme. Lots of women behave badly while being apprehended, but I doubt if 1 in 100,000 get punched in the face.
 
#111
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

The problem is we see a minute and a half of the confrontation and only what the person taking the video wants us to see. Unless you were there you don't know that he did not explain, at length, what she had done wrong.

I find it amusing that from the short video we see, with no other information provided that it can be extrapolated that the officer was bullied as a child, decided that he could and would dominate the female and snapped. As well as determining that the officer would have done something different if the female had been a guy.
 
#112
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">She got what she deserved. The officers were trying to remove another person from the premise and she stepped in and interfered. I don't know if I would ever punch a female like that, but I wouldn't discipline the officer for it. </div></div>
It looks bad, but I agree with paulosantos. The officer was trying to remove another person and was interfered with. Imagine how this could escalate if all of the guy's friends stepped in to prevent him from being arrested or ejected. I think you have to end the interference immediately and keep it from growing. I wonder what was in the mind of the girl in the black dress, if anything? Don't mess with the police unless you can tolerate the response. In the end she looked OKay, the officer hit her with only a glancing blow at the table.
 
#114
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dbsinh20</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm just curious what the big hurry was on the part of the cop?

The original woman he was trying to arrest was trapped in a booth. She wasn't going anywhere. Why not just give it a minute, and try to explain what she had done wrong, and why she needed to cooperate? Perhaps being a little less "large and in charge" would have diffused the situation. Seeing as she apparently walked (ran), one has to wonder why the cop was going after her in the first place.

Judging from the cop's physical appearance and actions, I can't help but wonder if he's harboring a grudge from being bullied as a child. He saw someone he knew he could dominate, and he snapped. If that female had been a guy that looked like he was capable of kicking the cop's ass, I doubt that he would have attempted any kind of physical confrontation.

I'm not excusing her behavior, but let's face it - what that cop did was pretty extreme. Lots of women behave badly while being apprehended, but I doubt if 1 in 100,000 get punched in the face.


</div></div>

I think you left out small penis. LOL.
 
#115
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

If you watch the video the female clearly was interferring with the officers and SHE was the one that was pushing on him, he tried to push her out of the way, and then when she came at him, she got nailed. I wasn't there, and he dealt with the threat accordingly. Who knows, she might have had a knife in her hand, it is a restaraunt.

One thing is for certain, that chick can take a punch. Wresting chicks is hard, I have been trying for years but they all run away screaming :0. That last part was all BS, sorry.
 
#116
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think you left out small penis. LOL. </div></div>

Well that was a given since he was wearing a badge...
grin.gif
 
#117
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob Opp</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I find it amusing that from the short video we see, with no other information provided that it can be extrapolated that the officer was bullied as a child, decided that he could and would dominate the female and snapped. As well as determining that the officer would have done something different if the female had been a guy.</div></div>

Would you find it more believable that he was an all-state wrestler that started an uncontrollable junk food binge a few years ago? Or perhaps that he's always been a little on the husky side? We already know that a department that hires the morbidly obese must have some pretty high qualification standards for their officers.

He couldn't even wait for his partner, who was stepping in to assist when he threw that punch. That pretty much covers the patience part.

And by the way, if this isn't a textbook case of someone snapping, I don't know what is. He was so consumed by events, that his original target ran off. Of course we could cloak his actions with something PC like "a lack of proper training".

And not just "a guy". I'm talking someone who looked intimidating. An adult version of the kid that used to steal his lunch money and give him a wedgie.
 
#118
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

Moral of the story is.... it's on video and the public will view it as police brutality. Especially because it's a woman he will face some suspension time and she will probably sue the department and win.
 
#119
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

What we really need to see is the events that led up to this exchange. Without that it is difficult to form a solid opinion on what was actualy occuring.
 
#120
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Clydesdale</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: davidj</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Clydesdale,
I think you are a horse's ass. Nobody deserves to be treated that way. </div></div>
Thats what you weak minded pussies what to think, but there are people in this world that deserve far worse things done to them than this. The world should be all hugs and kisses, but its not and if you do stupid things like put your hands on a cop while he is trying to do his job then you're a moron. </div></div>

You're calling someone else a pussy? If your ability to subdue a little drunk chick is limited to punching her in the face, you have just demonstrated a complete INABILITY to effectively execute your job as a police officer. Someone show me where your ROE state when you need to punch a woman in the face, <span style="text-decoration: underline">please</span>. The whole resturant was not rioting, two little women were acting up, just punch them. Coward. You're trusted to use the apparent empty space between your ears to correctly assess a situation and use reasonable force, if you're incapable of handling a little woman you have no business wearing a badge. If you're so bitter as a cop to where you say "I'm punching anyone who puts their hands on me", seek professional help because you have issues to resolve. </div></div>

TOPO go get someone that can read and explain this post to you.

Hey dumb fuck I'm not a cop and I even said I wasn't. So I guess you are right I have no business wearing a badge. Thanks for displaying to everyone your lack of comprehension skills.
 
#121
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I do not, nor have I ever "cop bashed". Jumbo in the video apparently did not have the skillset to subdue a woman much smaller then he was. Fail. Because of this lack of ability he had to resort to excessive force. Fail. Subduing and arresting suspects are squarely within his job title, if he cannot do it professionally and execute it with the proper force, he does not meet minimum requirements for that position. Thats how real jobs work everywhere. Does it state in your ROE to punch chicks if you're too inept to subdue them?

He wasn't being shot at. It wasn't a riot. It was little drunk chicks in dresses at an IHOP, not 200# biker chicks with chains.

Do we need to start building the ovens now? With this mindset SOMEONE will "deserve" that too pretty soon. </div></div>

He didn't "punch" her, he used an American Boxing technique called "The Jab".

I would like to put TOPO-Sniper and Ch'e in a unit for a Fri/Sat night shift. Some of the toughest "people" to arrest happen to be women. They can be very difficult. Ch'e is not giving them any credit for the damage they can do. I would take a "Jab" over OC or Taser any day. Many LE get hurt badly trying to be gentle with chicks and they/we pay for it in the end when they are on med leave/retirement. Just handle the person who is the threat.

Amazingly, many of these people who say the cops are out of line are the same ones who would say, "oh well, if there are women and children in that Afgan village when the missiles hit, they should know better than to co-mingle with the Taliban".

The comments about the ovens is so over the top. Give me a break. Amazing how emotional people get on the Internet.
 
#122
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bottom line, when someone is resisting arrest, don't dare put your hands on a cop... Then you just interjected yourself as part of the problem.


The biggest problem I see here, is that more of you don't find anything wrong with the blatant disregard these people had for the officers. </div></div>

Well said.... Damn well said...
 
#124
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

Socalsheepdog we happen to view the way this officer acted as being inappropriate - no problem with sorting her out but its how one goes about it and I an others felt he did it wrong.
As soon as she put her hands on him he could have stood back reaccessed his options with his fellow officers and created a game plan with them and not alone -violently I might add.
Just because he wears a badge doesn't mean he should take a thuggish attitude .That badge sure doesn't make him faultless in his actions and judgements -and he fucked up.
I have no doubt at all about what an officer has to deal with daily and for his/her own safety it is how smart they go about their job that keeps them safe -one way is not throwing fuel onto the fire
 
#125
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

So Che, you are saying that while hands on with a resisting suspect, I get attacked from the side. At this point I turn and push/slap at the atttacker. The attacker now begins to throw punches at my head. So in your world, I let go of the resisting suspect, step back, take a moment and then decide what to do? What friggin world do you live in? What the oficer now has done, in your scenario, is established in a room full of possibly violent drunks that have already established that they are willing to commit a felony in defense of their friend, is that if you hit him he will let go and back off. I think that is a very dangerous precident to set in that particular situation. Where I live striking an officer is a felony so what he did would have been the right thing to do. He disengaged from what was probably a lesser charge, we don't know because we've never seen what led up to this moment, and did what he should have and engaged what is now a felon. The assault on a police officer, which is what she did, regardless of your feelings about her size, gender, etc. is a serious charge in any jurisdiction that I know of, probably in NZ as well. I don't remember reading in any of the statute books that the assault can only be made by a big scary man, but hey, maybe things are different where you live. If it is, I feel for the cops that work there.
Patrick
 
#126
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Back to the fact: it was a little chick. If you gotta punch a little chick to control her you do not posess the minimum skill for your job.

I tell you what, I think she showed more character trying to protect her friend then Jumbo with his inability to control two little chicks in a frickin IHOP. Talk about tactically ineffective, good thing it wasn't a big chick or he would have had his big ass handed to him. </div></div>


The mistake you are making.....an understandable mistake though, is you are thinking of her in terms of a girl.

When a cop tells you to leave the property, you just do it. You dont sit and debate with them, argue with them....and you certainly dont hit them.

There is no boy/girl when someone hits you and resists arrest.

The law is black and white, chivalry does not exist in that scenario.

The cop was justified and will receive no suspension or other forms of punishment, count on that.
 
#127
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shibby</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Plain facts people. What would you say if it was another male? Continuum of force? Definitely. OC might have been an option, but it also has possible adverse affects. If a woman doesn't want to be handled like a man then they should act like a lady. I'm sorry, but she put herself in the situation, she got what she had coming. You have to take your feelings for gender out of the situation, and just analyze the situation. Yeah its someones daughter, or wife, hopefully you would have brought them up better, or not made such a silly mistake for marrying the crazy woman. Just my $.02. People need to take responsibility for their own actions, think out the possible consequences of their actions, and be prepared to accept them. </div></div>

Bravo Shibby.... Bravo. </div></div>


JRose, tell these bitches that are whining about a drunk bitch getting a love tap, don't bring that shit to Bham! She got what she deserved. She put herself in a mans place and put her hands on an officer, two big no no's. She better be lucky that was all she got. As a side note, that cop hit's like a bitch!
 
#128
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

*** I just posted this on another thread regarding this video, but felt to keep the discussion in one place it is best in this thread.***


The end all truth of it is that outside of the Criminal Justice Judicial system most people are to ignorant to understand how things really are in the world. This is because of a lot of reasons, but mostly the lack of understanding and arrogance. So an unenlightened individual like TOPO-Sniper there comes along a video like the one of the Officer striking the female and he jumps on the proverbial band wagon and shows his ignorance, or more correctly his lack of understanding.

What most citizens don't fully understand is what it's truly like to fight and deal with combative individuals. And no that school yard fight you got into in high school doesn't count.

Most people, (TOPO included apparently) truly have the belief that everyone and every situation can be "talked down" or "handled differently". But the biggest thing is, that they don't get the fact that in that situation, according to the Judicial system they voted for, it is acceptable in to strike that female in the manor in which he did to lawfully eliminate the threat she was posing, yes there are alternatives, but not necessarily more effective ones.

People just truly don't care to, or want to understand that in a video like that of the Officer striking the female there is more going on that you remotely understand. Again ignorance and a failure to understand, or an attempt to anyway. But this is nothing new, certain citizens like to complain, and continue to be narrow minded. Especially when it involves something that takes just a little thought process and understanding.

I could sit here and pick apart that video and explain in full understanding why his actions were called for, I could explain it in depth as to leave no doubt, but ignorant people will always be just that, by their choosing.

BESIDES that fact that it's a video, and I don't care what video you are watching but you can bet the farm that unless the camera is rolling minutes before the action and from multiple angles you don't have a damn clue whats going on. I find it funny how perfect of an example this situation is. The first video everyone sees starts with the fight already going, so you have NO CLUE what actually is going on, but don't worry folks the ignorant observant will judge regardless... SO after a barrage of ill advised, mis-informed comments, a SECOND video surfaces, and shows that with nothing more than a different angle, it inadvertently shows that the actions of the female to the Officer justified the Officer's response in full. BUT the ignorant close minded individual fails to see or understand that, and continues to spew negativity.

So now that I've tried to explain things in-hopes some may understand that just because they watch a video doesn't mean you have a flying clue about whats really going on as seen by the laws and Judicial system they voted for! But regardless those same people will respond to my post with negativity and further arrogance. Don't believe me? Just sit back and watch, they can't help themselves...
 
#129
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Socalsheepdog</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I do not, nor have I ever "cop bashed". Jumbo in the video apparently did not have the skillset to subdue a woman much smaller then he was. Fail. Because of this lack of ability he had to resort to excessive force. Fail. Subduing and arresting suspects are squarely within his job title, if he cannot do it professionally and execute it with the proper force, he does not meet minimum requirements for that position. Thats how real jobs work everywhere. Does it state in your ROE to punch chicks if you're too inept to subdue them?

He wasn't being shot at. It wasn't a riot. It was little drunk chicks in dresses at an IHOP, not 200# biker chicks with chains.

Do we need to start building the ovens now? With this mindset SOMEONE will "deserve" that too pretty soon. </div></div>

He didn't "punch" her, he used an American Boxing technique called "The Jab".

I would like to put TOPO-Sniper and Ch'e in a unit for a Fri/Sat night shift. Some of the toughest "people" to arrest happen to be women. They can be very difficult. Ch'e is not giving them any credit for the damage they can do. I would take a "Jab" over OC or Taser any day. Many LE get hurt badly trying to be gentle with chicks and they/we pay for it in the end when they are on med leave/retirement. Just handle the person who is the threat.

Amazingly, many of these people who say the cops are out of line are the same ones who would say, "oh well, if there are women and children in that Afgan village when the missiles hit, they should know better than to co-mingle with the Taliban".

The comments about the ovens is so over the top. Give me a break. Amazing how emotional people get on the Internet. </div></div>

Don't try and sugar coat it. It was a punch.
If women are so hard to subdue then maybe you just need to shoot every guy you see!
Like I wrote before we don't know what set this stage.
 
#130
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lofty</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Back to the fact: it was a little chick. If you gotta punch a little chick to control her you do not posess the minimum skill for your job.

I tell you what, I think she showed more character trying to protect her friend then Jumbo with his inability to control two little chicks in a frickin IHOP. Talk about tactically ineffective, good thing it wasn't a big chick or he would have had his big ass handed to him. </div></div>


The mistake you are making.....an understandable mistake though, is you are thinking of her in terms of a girl.

When a cop tells you to leave the property, you just do it. You dont sit and debate with them, argue with them....and you certainly dont hit them.

There is no boy/girl when someone hits you and resists arrest.

The law is black and white, chivalry does not exist in that scenario.

The cop was justified and will receive no suspension or other forms of punishment, count on that. </div></div>

Unless you are rich, a man getting a divorce, etc etc etc. There is no black and white and you know it! There is a lot of discretion. Call it like it is!
 
#131
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Socalsheepdog</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I do not, nor have I ever "cop bashed". Jumbo in the video apparently did not have the skillset to subdue a woman much smaller then he was. Fail. Because of this lack of ability he had to resort to excessive force. Fail. Subduing and arresting suspects are squarely within his job title, if he cannot do it professionally and execute it with the proper force, he does not meet minimum requirements for that position. Thats how real jobs work everywhere. Does it state in your ROE to punch chicks if you're too inept to subdue them?

He wasn't being shot at. It wasn't a riot. It was little drunk chicks in dresses at an IHOP, not 200# biker chicks with chains.

Do we need to start building the ovens now? With this mindset SOMEONE will "deserve" that too pretty soon. </div></div>

He didn't "punch" her, he used an American Boxing technique called "The Jab".

I would like to put TOPO-Sniper and Ch'e in a unit for a Fri/Sat night shift. Some of the toughest "people" to arrest happen to be women. They can be very difficult. Ch'e is not giving them any credit for the damage they can do. I would take a "Jab" over OC or Taser any day. Many LE get hurt badly trying to be gentle with chicks and they/we pay for it in the end when they are on med leave/retirement. Just handle the person who is the threat.

Amazingly, many of these people who say the cops are out of line are the same ones who would say, "oh well, if there are women and children in that Afgan village when the missiles hit, they should know better than to co-mingle with the Taliban".

The comments about the ovens is so over the top. Give me a break. Amazing how emotional people get on the Internet. </div></div>

Not saying anyone here is right or wrong, but I can jab harder than most people can punch. I think most boxers can. In fact I've knocked a guy out in the ring with a jab before. And Jabs don't come from the strong side... ever. That would be a straight or a cross
 
#132
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob Opp</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The problem is we see a minute and a half of the confrontation and only what the person taking the video wants us to see. Unless you were there you don't know that he did not explain, at length, what she had done wrong.

I find it amusing that from the short video we see, with no other information provided that it can be extrapolated that the officer was bullied as a child, decided that he could and would dominate the female and snapped. As well as determining that the officer would have done something different if the female had been a guy. </div></div>

True statement.
 
#133
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stefan73</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lofty</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Back to the fact: it was a little chick. If you gotta punch a little chick to control her you do not posess the minimum skill for your job.

I tell you what, I think she showed more character trying to protect her friend then Jumbo with his inability to control two little chicks in a frickin IHOP. Talk about tactically ineffective, good thing it wasn't a big chick or he would have had his big ass handed to him. </div></div>


The mistake you are making.....an understandable mistake though, is you are thinking of her in terms of a girl.

When a cop tells you to leave the property, you just do it. You dont sit and debate with them, argue with them....and you certainly dont hit them.

There is no boy/girl when someone hits you and resists arrest.

The law is black and white, chivalry does not exist in that scenario.

The cop was justified and will receive no suspension or other forms of punishment, count on that. </div></div>

Unless you are rich, a man getting a divorce, etc etc etc. There is no black and white and you know it! There is a lot of discretion. Call it like it is! </div></div>

Thats untrue.

Maybe thats true in the courtroom unfortunately....not at street level however.

Discretion goes out the window the moment someone lays their hands on you. I would have punched Bill Gate's wife the same way.
 
#135
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kinsman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not all cops are this bad. It's only 96% that give the others a bad name..... </div></div>

We think the same thing about you guys.
 
#137
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

Bottom line, anyone who gets in the way of an arrest (right or wrong - it's not for you or the police to decide, that's for the judge/jury to decide) needs to be restrained and detained. It doesn't matter if it's a 30 year old guy, a 60 year old woman, or a 12 year old kid. There's reasonable force that can be used in any situation.

In my opinion, it looked like the officer lost focus, slapped the woman, then took a swing at her when she started hitting him. If she'd scratched him and damaged his eyes, what use of force would be justified? Nobody's ever right all the time, not even women, and I definitely wouldn't want to be working as an officer in some areas where you have just as much of a chance of being shot by a 14 year old kid, a 21 year old guy, or a 40 year old woman.

What level of force would be justified if she started swinging at you:
erin-toughill%202.jpg


What level of force is justified once you find out she's Erin Toughill and has a 10-4-1 MMA record?
 
#138
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spazz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bottom line, anyone who gets in the way of an arrest (right or wrong - it's not for you or the police to decide, that's for the judge/jury to decide) needs to be restrained and detained. It doesn't matter if it's a 30 year old guy, a 60 year old woman, or a 12 year old kid. There's reasonable force that can be used in any situation.

In my opinion, it looked like the officer lost focus, slapped the woman, then took a swing at her when she started hitting him. If she'd scratched him and damaged his eyes, what use of force would be justified? Nobody's ever right all the time, not even women, and I definitely wouldn't want to be working as an officer in some areas where you have just as much of a chance of being shot by a 14 year old kid, a 21 year old guy, or a 40 year old woman.

What level of force would be justified if she started swinging at you:
erin-toughill%202.jpg


What level of force is justified once you find out she's Erin Toughill and has a 10-4-1 MMA record? </div></div>
"
If it was Erin Toughill id first let her for "free" get me on my back --then we might have a little struggle with her while warning her of course that I will have to spray her with my KY bottle if she resists,the suggest she slips into my manacles.Defiantly no punching
 
#139
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

All of you "X-spurts" who said the LEO did wrong......
How much time have you spent in a black and white?
smirk.gif

It's simple folks...IF, you don't want to get punched, DON'T fight the cops or anydangbody else for that matter.
A face punch is one of the fastest ways to stop fight.
The LEO in that vid did no wrong.
LG
 
#141
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

I think she got what was coming to her, and what wasn't mentioned (unless I missed it) is when she started hitting him it looked like she had keys, a phone or something else in the hand that she was striking him with. Just my $.02
 
#142
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

"Not all cops are this bad. It's only 96% that give the others a bad name....." Kinsman

"We think the same thing about you guys." paulosantos


Here is the heart of the problem, it only took 7 pages to be disclosed. There is little respect left for one another in this country. Both civilian and LEO could stand to lose some attitude. IMHO it is only going to get worse for both sides in the future. You never know, one day your life may be saved by someone from the other side, can't count on it but it's possible.
 
#143
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lofty</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stefan73</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lofty</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOPO-sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Back to the fact: it was a little chick. If you gotta punch a little chick to control her you do not posess the minimum skill for your job.

I tell you what, I think she showed more character trying to protect her friend then Jumbo with his inability to control two little chicks in a frickin IHOP. Talk about tactically ineffective, good thing it wasn't a big chick or he would have had his big ass handed to him. </div></div>


The mistake you are making.....an understandable mistake though, is you are thinking of her in terms of a girl.

When a cop tells you to leave the property, you just do it. You dont sit and debate with them, argue with them....and you certainly dont hit them.

There is no boy/girl when someone hits you and resists arrest.

The law is black and white, chivalry does not exist in that scenario.

The cop was justified and will receive no suspension or other forms of punishment, count on that. </div></div>

Unless you are rich, a man getting a divorce, etc etc etc. There is no black and white and you know it! There is a lot of discretion. Call it like it is! </div></div>

Thats untrue.

Maybe thats true in the courtroom unfortunately....not at street level however.

Discretion goes out the window the moment someone lays their hands on you. I would have punched Bill Gate's wife the same way. </div></div>
Internet is one thing. So you are saying that you would have punched some congressmans wife? Your police chiefs or a fellow officers wife??

Maybe its true and maybe you would, but I doubt the rest of the LE org follows your example. People talk a big game especially here on the net when it really isn't their ass on the line.
 
#144
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spazz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In my opinion, it looked like the officer lost focus, slapped the woman, then took a swing at her when she started hitting him. If she'd scratched him and damaged his eyes, what use of force would be justified?</div></div>

What most don't understand is the officer does not have to wait for the damage to happen before he raises his level of force. LEO, by policy (most agencies these days) get to go directly to the force necessary to make the arrest or stop the fight. We don't know what damage the suspect was planning to do but we know the intent to do harm was there so the officer took action to stop it.

As far as my Jab comment, I was trying to be funny in room with a lot of mud flying.
 
#145
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Polytrauma</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"Not all cops are this bad. It's only 96% that give the others a bad name....." Kinsman

"We think the same thing about you guys." paulosantos


Here is the heart of the problem, it only took 7 pages to be disclosed. There is little respect left for one another in this country. Both civilian and LEO could stand to lose some attitude. IMHO it is only going to get worse for both sides in the future. You never know, one day your life may be saved by someone from the other side, can't count on it but it's possible.




</div></div>

Funny how it goes both ways isn't it? Not really.

We have forgotten that LE is "of" the people and "for" the people and so has in many peoples eye the LE org, as can be evidenced by the above post.
 
#146
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

HAHAHA

The bitch got what she deserved. Next time she'll think twice before interfering with an arrest or taking a swing at a cop in uniform.

It's been my experience when dealing with perps that women tend to escalate things way more than guys do. She acted like a savage and was treated accordingly.

Being a punching bag for people ISN'T part of the job.
 
#147
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Slapchop</div><div class="ubbcode-body">HAHAHA

The bitch got what she deserved. Next time she'll think twice before interfering with an arrest or taking a swing at a cop in uniform.

It's been my experience when dealing with perps that women tend to escalate things way more than guys do. She acted like a savage and was treated accordingly.

Being a punching bag for people ISN'T part of the job. </div></div>

She must be a RedSox fan.

We're pretty annoying!
laugh.gif
 
#148
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

1st of all, if you watch the video second by second, her hand was on the officers left shoulder when he struck her, she was not striking the officer (initially). She was also looking at officer 1, not bitting him (as someone alluded to).

2nd: What is officer 2 doing? He is behind officer 1, his hands/arms are around officer 1. WHY?

3rd: After officer 1 slaps her, she retaliates, and starts swinging. Obviously this is not a wise decision.

4th: How the hell can anyone say that is a legitimate attempt to detain someone? Trying to pull someone over a table?

Now, perception is reality, so...... what was the intent of the woman that was struck?
Was she interfering? Possibly. Why? who knows?

Is it possible to say she is in a position of neutrality?

ie: similar to the position you would be in trying to keep people separated? It could be viewed as such. One could argue the individual in the booth was having a medical condition that prevents her from obeying orders. From what we saw she was not combative.

Have officers ever been dispatched to a scene of someone not coherent? Could it be diabetic shock? Is that a plausible reason?

The FACT is YOU/WE don't know, and CAN NOT say for certain. No one's opinion of what happened matters, LEO or civi's, because none of us was there.

We do not see what initiated the conflict, the fact is, LE was called (unless they were dining) for a reason.

IF some one see's something different than what I saw in the video, lay it out, and I'll re-review the video.



 
#149
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<span style="color: #FF0000">Well lets take a look at these statements....</span>

Teggy1 said:
1st of all, if you watch the video second by second, her hand was on the officers left shoulder when he struck her, she was not striking the officer (initially). She was also looking at officer 1, not bitting him (as someone alluded to).

2nd: What is officer 2 doing? He is behind officer 1, his hands/arms are around officer 1. WHY? <span style="color: #FF0000">What does this have to do with the actions of the female??? But since you brought it up I would have had a word with my partner after wards...</span>

3rd: After officer 1 slaps her, she retaliates, and starts swinging. Obviously this is not a wise decision. <span style="color: #FF0000">Agreed, and in doing so she opened a can of whoop ass that she was not smart enough to leave shut.</span>

4th: How the hell can anyone say that is a legitimate attempt to detain someone? Trying to pull someone over a table? <span style="color: #FF0000">Well here is a perfect example of how video doesn't tell you everything, go watch the second one and it clearly shows the first female he is trying to get at is evading him and pulling away to the other side of the table, and besides the Officer is not reaching across the table, he is reaching down the length of the seat, maybe watch the video before posting inaccuracies...</span>

Now, perception is reality, so...... what was the intent of the woman that was struck? <span style="color: #FF0000">Pretty obvious, to interfere with a lawful arrest...</span>
Was she interfering? Possibly.<span style="color: #FF0000">POSSIBLY?!?! Are you kidding?!?!</span> Why? who knows?

Is it possible to say she is in a position of neutrality? <span style="color: #FF0000">It don't matter what her take is, get the fuck out of the way. I don't care if she likes that fact her friend is getting arrested, she has NO business getting herself involved PERIOD!</span>

ie: similar to the position you would be in trying to keep people separated? It could be viewed as such. One could argue the individual in the booth was having a medical condition that prevents her from obeying orders. <span style="color: #FF0000">Don't care if she has a medical condition, Officers can't go around asking every junkie and out of control ass hole if they have a medical condition while the Officer is being assaulted, and I'm sure they are not yelling 'she has a medical condition' at least it doesn't sound like it to me!</span> From what we saw she was not combative. <span style="color: #FF0000">Again, she is interfering, in a situation that is quickly escalating, The law states that what she did there initially is defined as assault besides interfering, look it up, it's your law...</span>

Have officers ever been dispatched to a scene of someone not coherent? Could it be diabetic shock? Is that a plausible reason?
<span style="color: #FF0000">This statement makes you look like a complete fool, and tells me right away you have not the faintest idea of what a diabetic shock or any other medical situation looks like, honestly your really grabbing at straws here...</span>
The FACT is YOU/WE don't know, and CAN NOT say for certain. <span style="color: #FF0000">Yes we can know for certain, I can clearly see the female interfering with an lawful arrest, and I clearly could see the Officer give her a distraction slap to disengage her from the escalating situation.
</span>No one's opinion of what happened matters, LEO or civi's, because none of us was there. <span style="color: #FF0000">Your right there for once, none of the opinions matter, but when ignorant people jump on the band-wagons and start screaming BAD COP, BAD COP! It changes others perspectives of LEO's, which intern makes our job more dangerous and makes that chance of me coming back to my family each night just a little less... So yes LEO's tend to like to defend themselves from the negative onslaught that a fast growing number of misinformed ignorant public like to spew...END OF STORY...</span>
We do not see what initiated the conflict, the fact is, LE was called (unless they were dining) for a reason.

IF some one see's something different than what I saw in the video, lay it out, and I'll re-review the video. <span style="color: #FF0000">I did the best I could, now it's up to you to think about things more than one way, good luck...
</span>
Click to expand...
 
#150
Re: Cop punches girl in the face, recent video

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gunman_7</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="color: #FF0000">Well lets take a look at these statements....</span>

Teggy1 said:
1st of all, if you watch the video second by second, her hand was on the officers left shoulder when he struck her, she was not striking the officer (initially). She was also looking at officer 1, not bitting him (as someone alluded to).

2nd: What is officer 2 doing? He is behind officer 1, his hands/arms are around officer 1. WHY? <span style="color: #FF0000">What does this have to do with the actions of the female??? But since you brought it up I would have had a word with my partner after wards...</span>

3rd: After officer 1 slaps her, she retaliates, and starts swinging. Obviously this is not a wise decision. <span style="color: #FF0000">Agreed, and in doing so she opened a can of whoop ass that she was not smart enough to leave shut.</span>

4th: How the hell can anyone say that is a legitimate attempt to detain someone? Trying to pull someone over a table? <span style="color: #FF0000">Well here is a perfect example of how video doesn't tell you everything, go watch the second one and it clearly shows the first female he is trying to get at is evading him and pulling away to the other side of the table, and besides the Officer is not reaching across the table, he is reaching down the length of the seat, maybe watch the video before posting inaccuracies...</span>

Now, perception is reality, so...... what was the intent of the woman that was struck? <span style="color: #FF0000">Pretty obvious, to interfere with a lawful arrest...</span>
Was she interfering? Possibly.<span style="color: #FF0000">POSSIBLY?!?! Are you kidding?!?!</span> Why? who knows?

Is it possible to say she is in a position of neutrality? <span style="color: #FF0000">It don't matter what her take is, get the fuck out of the way. I don't care if she likes that fact her friend is getting arrested, she has NO business getting herself involved PERIOD!</span>

ie: similar to the position you would be in trying to keep people separated? It could be viewed as such. One could argue the individual in the booth was having a medical condition that prevents her from obeying orders. <span style="color: #FF0000">Don't care if she has a medical condition, Officers can't go around asking every junkie and out of control ass hole if they have a medical condition while they are being assaulted.</span> From what we saw she was not combative. <span style="color: #FF0000">Again, she is interfering, in a situation that is quickly escalating, The law states that what she did there is defined as assault besides interfering, look it up, it's your law...</span>

Have officers ever been dispatched to a scene of someone not coherent? Could it be diabetic shock? Is that a plausible reason? This statement makes you look like a complete fool, and tells me right away you have not the faintest idea of what a diabetic shock or any other medical situation looks like, honestly your really grabbing at straws here<span style="color: #FF0000">...</span>

The FACT is YOU/WE don't know, and CAN NOT say for certain. <span style="color: #FF0000">Yes we can know for certain, I can clearly see the female interfering with an lawful arrest, and I clearly could see the Officer give her a distraction slap to disengage her from the escalating situation.
</span>No one's opinion of what happened matters, LEO or civi's, because none of us was there. <span style="color: #FF0000">Your right there for once, none of the opinions mater, but when ignorant people jump and band wagons and start screaming BAD COP, BAD COP! It changes others perspectives of LEO's, which inter makes our job more dangerous and makes that chance on me coming back to my family each night just a little less... So yes LEO's tend to like to defend themselves from the negative onslaught that a fast growing number of misinformed ignorant public...END OF STORY...</span>
We do not see what initiated the conflict, the fact is, LE was called (unless they were dining) for a reason.

IF some one see's something different than what I saw in the video, lay it out, and I'll re-review the video. <span style="color: #FF0000">I did the best I could, now it's up to you to think about things more than one way, good luck...
</span>

-Chris
</div></div>

After watching the second video, I agree the officer was not trying to pull her across the table, as you stated.

Tell my why there are three people who attempt to mitigate the actions of officer 1? Woman in red top approaches from behind and to his left. Places hand on left shoulder and attempts to get his attention. 2nd- woman who got decked. 3rd, officer 2. After watching the second video, there is NO way you can say officer 2 is doing nothing else but attempting to stop what is currently happening. Same as the woman in red as well as the woman who got decked.
Click to expand...
 
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