Coup De Grace vs Nucleus or Origin

[pik3ee]

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I have read the post on the new coupe d grace action coming out from American Rifle Company. I am putting together a prs type rifle on a remington clone action with savage barrel threads.
Are the new features a significant real world improvement on the nucleus gen 2 or the zermatt origin?
Are the improvements worth the unknown wait times as the other actions are available now?
More importantly are the improvements with the tradeoff of the unproven nature and bugs that pop up on a new designs and products?
I am interested in the option of using factory savage barrels, Are the designs of any of the actions better for this? I know the cdg is designed for conical breeches and not sure if this is a negative for that action for my wants?
Thoughts?

 

[spife7980]

If you want to use savage barrels then get one that accepts them by default: nucleus or origin

 

[TheOE800]

Conical breech means Savage barrels do not by default work.

 

[Tokay444]

Why the Savage barrel stipulation? Seems like pigeon holing yourself.

 

[pik3ee]

Why the Savage barrel stipulation? Seems like pigeon holing yourself.

This is something that I am wondering about too. Is the choice to stick with a savage tenon limiting my action choices in a real world way. I really dont understand the tradeoffs with all of the custom actions available. I just got back into shooting after a fifteen year or so break and the choices were much simpler and limited then. I have several savage actions and a chassis already. I like the option of experimenting with new cartridges in the savage platform and having the ability to use the same barrels on the custom. I don't know if this is worth pigeon holing myself to a few actions or not? I would really like to hear some opinions on that too.

 

[spife7980]

Get an origin or nucleus then? Not a big deal. Savage just isn’t comparable with the coup

 

[b6graham]

origin or nucleus take savage barrel nut style barrels if you like that route for whateverreason

origin has a pretty big selection of prefits from proof which is a big advantage

 

[RFutch]

I have a solution to it all. Sell the savage and buy an Origin for your savage barrels. This is kind of how I started out in customs and couldn't be happier now.

Also add the CDG to the mix, because lets face it, its a crazy good deal and its gonna be bad ass.

Doing this will ensure you dont have to stop playing with different stuff and it will also cover your bases if you want to go all out on a build.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

It's always been damn hard to beat an Origin. Out of the actions I have and the ones I've gotten rid of, I still kept my origin, though I have a Zeus and 2 Valors as well. The Origin works really well and leaves you the most options to run whatever, and to pick up used barrels ect. And they have outstanding CS and are reliable. That ARC cdg sounds cool as hell and pretty much all their stuff is legit but the conical barrel thing kind of makes me shy away honestly. That's probably just me but if you want it to take savage barrels with a nut, the Origin seems like the obvious answer

 

[brianf]

its prs not f class, the action doesnt matter as long as it feeds 100%

guys place high in matches with factory ammo, a certain custom action wont make a difference

buy whats in stock and shoot tomorrow

 

[Tokay444]

This is something that I am wondering about too. Is the choice to stick with a savage tenon limiting my action choices in a real world way. I really dont understand the tradeoffs with all of the custom actions available. I just got back into shooting after a fifteen year or so break and the choices were much simpler and limited then. I have several savage actions and a chassis already. I like the option of experimenting with new cartridges in the savage platform and having the ability to use the same barrels on the custom. I don't know if this is worth pigeon holing myself to a few actions or not? I would really like to hear some opinions on that too.

Your chassis isn’t going to fit a Rem700 clone.

 

[pik3ee]

Sorry I wasnt clear. I have an mdt oryx for the savage and an xlr that currently has a b14r 22lr, that the custom action would be for.

 

[The D]

Any action can have a shoulder-less barrel made for it and be a “savage style” barrel by default.

The beauty of custom actions from companies like Zermat and ARC(and others, of course) is that they are machined well enough that any good barrel maker can machine one just by looking at the blueprint. All you need are the proper tools to swap the barrel and you can experiment all you want. And if you want maximum flexibility, think of those contortionist girls that can sniff their own butt and shoot a bow with their feet, buy an ARC Coup or Mausingfield. Both of those are available with 6 different interchangeable bolt heads, .378 to .588. That gives you hundreds of options to play with

 

[Rio Precision Gunworks]

If you decide to go with a Nucleus, shoot us a PM. We are about to blowout 20 or so short actions we have on the shelf before the CDC actions start rolling out.

 

[MilSpecOkie]

I have Nucleus 1, 2 and Archimedes. The Nuke 2 is a heck of an action for the money, same with the Archimedes. Both can take shouldered prefits or Savage barrel nut barrels. I’m very curious about the CDG so I’ll be getting one of those too. I think ARC is underrated personally. I have a feeling Ted feels the same so he is going to try sell a boatload of CDG to make people pay attention.

 

[karagias]

Buy the Coup. The fact that it's optimized for use with the AI AW mag coupled with a highly evolved feature set really sets this thing apart. And at $900, all I can tell you is get in line.

Ted

 

[30338]

Ted, is the preorder going to be open for lefthand actions also? Thank you

 

[Delicatessen]

I have several and so far prefer the archimedes so the CDG would probably be nice….alternatively you can look for remaining archimedes actions if you don’t want to wait. Personally I am waiting for the hunting variant and or a medium action.

 

[Supersubes]

Their site wont even come up anymore.

 

[xfyre101]

for the love god, if you're already going the custom build route, dont get savage barrel. get an actually decent one

 

[The D]

for the love god, if you're already going the custom build route, dont get savage barrel. get an actually decent one

Don’t think he’s talking about an actual savage barrel. He’s talking about the fact that some actions use a thread pattern that’s the same as a savage.

 

[FredHammer]

for the love god, if you're already going the custom build route, dont get savage barrel. get an actually decent one

Savage barrels have been some of the most accurate barrels amongst the factory offerings category. I've not owned a Savage I couldn't get to print 1/2 MOA with some 1/4 MOA. If there is anything wrong with a Savage it isn't their barrels, it's their actions not feeding at all, or reliably from a detachable magazine. Then the ridiculous claims that the feeding problem doesn't exist. I cracked the code on the feeding problem so I have no worries buying a Savage rifle. I know it will at least shoot.

 

[Supersubes]

Savage barrels have been some of the most accurate barrels amongst the factory offerings category. I've not owned a Savage I couldn't get to print 1/2 MOA with some 1/4 MOA. If there is anything wrong with a Savage it isn't their barrels, it's their actions not feeding at all, or reliably from a detachable magazine. Then the ridiculous claims that the feeding problem doesn't exist. I cracked the code on the feeding problem so I have no worries buying a Savage rifle. I know it will at least shoot.

You may not have a problem with them, but we’ll all think less of you.

 

[FredHammer]

You may not have a problem with them, but we’ll all think less of you.

Now that is fuckin funny!

 

[Forester12]

I was in a similar situation. I had been waiting to see what the Aero Solus looked like, so I could compare it to an Origin. I liked the controlled round feed and the proven track record of the Origin, then the CDG came out. I spent the last couple weeks on the fence between Origin and CDG but ultimately went with the CDG. I don't know if it will be a real world improvement but ARC has really been innovating and the trigger hanger looks like it will make it easier to fit a trigger, and the pivoting bolt seems like it will do all the extraction and therefore make the bolt lift lighter, hard to say for sure unless you have the two side by side. I was also concerned about the barrels but after giving it some thought, I decided to not worry about it, looks like there are already a handful of companies willing to offer prefits. With a high quality action I'm going to want a high quality barrel. The CDG is unproven and I'll have to wait a few months or more but I'm willing to wait, and gamble that it will be worth it.

 

[midwestoffroad]

Proof Prefits are a better option over savage barrels at a slightly higher price point. The Origin has been a great Action. That said I have a CDG ordered

 

[rijndael]

I hope Proof reconsiders making CDG barrels.

 

[FredHammer]

I hope Proof reconsiders making CDG barrels.

I'm working on a solid barrel source for the CDG, Nucleus, SOLUS...If I can convince them we should have a premium barrel source for all these of the stainless variety.

 

[Supersubes]

I hope Proof reconsiders making CDG barrels.

Did they say they wouldn't be?

 

[midwestoffroad]

In the CDG post. Someone had a reply from proof that they had no intentions. But I take that as that person didn't know what the CDG even is. .

Proof is so far backlogged now (I was quoted Dec for the barrel I ordered in oct) and I'm still waiting. I'd assume it will be awhile before availability if they choose to offer them

 

[Tokay444]

Did they say they wouldn't be?

Depends who you talk to and what day of the week it is.

 

[Supersubes]

In the CDG post. Someone had a reply from proof that they had no intentions. But I take that as that person didn't know what the CDG even is. .

Proof is so far backlogged now (I was quoted Dec for the barrel I ordered in oct) and I'm still waiting. I'd assume it will be awhile before availability if they choose to offer them

Depends who you talk to and what day of the week it is.

As long as they're doing Q Fix prefits, it would seem that anything is possible. Not a dig, i love my fix and sell lots of parts for them, but that’s a niche rifle in a room full of niche rifles.

@midwestoffroad what barrel did you order? I view ordering directly from proof like ordering directly from
Defiance(prior to the meltdown). Why wait a year when you could go through a distributor and have it in a few months?

 

[midwestoffroad]

It was off a 50% off Cert from a match. This was for a RimX 26"

 

[Codiekfx400]

Zermatt Origin all the way. People forget about the Nucleus when it came out having issues. And all the availability issues with the John Hancock.

 

[TheOE800]

Zermatt Origin all the way. People forget about the Nucleus when it came out having issues. And all the availability issues with the John Hancock.

Availability of John Hancock was ARC fucking PVA or a poorly written contract between the two and overpromised delivery by PVA. The Nuke’s two or three revisions and messy launch kept me away, for sure though there’s tons of threads since then and regarding the “present-day” Nucleus.

 

[Threadcutter308]

You may not have a problem with them, but we’ll all think less of you.

 

[Txhillbilly]

Zermatt Origin all the way. People forget about the Nucleus when it came out having issues. And all the availability issues with the John Hancock.

And then there are a lot of original Nucleus owner's that have never had a single issue with them. I have one of the first Nucleus action's made, and I still run the 16# firing pin spring in it. Never had a single light primer strike or FTF with it. I also installed a 16# spring in my Nucleus 2.0, and it hasn't had any issues either.

 

[Tremor3Guy]

I was in a similar situation. I had been waiting to see what the Aero Solus looked like, so I could compare it to an Origin. I liked the controlled round feed and the proven track record of the Origin, then the CDG came out. I spent the last couple weeks on the fence between Origin and CDG but ultimately went with the CDG. I don't know if it will be a real world improvement but ARC has really been innovating and the trigger hanger looks like it will make it easier to fit a trigger, and the pivoting bolt seems like it will do all the extraction and therefore make the bolt lift lighter, hard to say for sure unless you have the two side by side. I was also concerned about the barrels but after giving it some thought, I decided to not worry about it, looks like there are already a handful of companies willing to offer prefits. With a high quality action I'm going to want a high quality barrel. The CDG is unproven and I'll have to wait a few months or more but I'm willing to wait, and gamble that it will be worth it.

I made a couple videos of the Solus on YouTube. I sent it back and ordered a CDG after it wouldn’t headspace correctly on two origin barrels.

 

[Altoonabcm157]

I made a couple videos of the Solus on YouTube. I sent it back and ordered a CDG after it wouldn’t headspace correctly on two origin barrels.

Was this with shouldered prefits or you were having issues headspacing with the barrel nut?

 

[midwestoffroad]

Is the solus supposed to work with the shouldered origin barrels? I thought just a barrel nut savage/zermatt prefits

 

[Tokay444]

Is the solus supposed to work with the shouldered origin barrels? I thought just a barrel nut savage/zermatt prefits

What's an Origin barrel if not a Zermatt prefit?

 

[Altoonabcm157]

What's an Origin barrel if not a Zermatt prefit?

A non shouldered barrel with a savage small shank

 

[Tokay444]

So a nutted Savage barrel?

 

[PRSDietitian]

So, I was talking to my friend Greg Connoyer who uses a TL3 and thinks that when they say Zermatt Prefits, that they mean TL3. He said generally when barrel manufacturers think zermatt prefit, that they mean TL3

 

[spife7980]

A non shouldered barrel with a savage small shank

 

[midwestoffroad]

I went to Aero and watched the video

So it IS supposed to be compatible with the Origin Shouldered prefits and savage barrel nut.

That would be no to the TL3 I think someone mentioned

 

[midwestoffroad]

So, I was talking to my friend Greg Connoyer who uses a TL3 and thinks that when they say Zermatt Prefits, that they mean TL3. He said generally when barrel manufacturers think zermatt prefit, that they mean TL3

Origin only

 

[Tremor3Guy]

Was this with shouldered prefits or you were having issues headspacing with the barrel nut?

Shouldered. One was a prefit and one was chambered to 0 headspace on my origin action. After much communication with aero, I believe they built their headspace around the proof prefits. Other prefits may or may not headspace correctly. It’s not a huge deal if you reload as you set up your die for the chamber anyway, but mine wouldn’t close on go gauges.

 

[Tremor3Guy]

Is the solus supposed to work with the shouldered origin barrels? I thought just a barrel nut savage/zermatt prefits

Suppose to be both.

 

[FredHammer]

So, why not nut the daggum things and start shooting. Its the "easy button" for builds. Shouldered prefits are no more accurate than a small shank nut. The company I am working with said this exact same thing and don't want the hassle of customers running into trouble doing the dick dance of actions from different manufacturers having slightly different tolerances.