Cracked Sphur Mount

In all fairness, you see a microscopic number of people doing stuff either for the first time or in very limited settings. Even at a match where equipment CAN break, most people are triple checking things prior, they hyper obsess before showing up, the average shooter is not doing that.

And as noted, we pull, EVERY SINGLE SCOPE in our classes to look at the set up, we check prior so we can fix any issues up front, so tell me you are looking at stuff with the same degree as we are ? I have receipts, do you ....
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We look at this stuff every week, everyone else just talks and speaks bout the one time ...
 
Sphur was my go to mount but now no thanks to many issues. The warranty is great but would rather not need to use it There are other mounts that are just as good that don't break. The last mounts I bought were 2 ARC and 2 ERA-Tac adjustable mounts and they both have been flawless. I have not seeing the new design up close but judging from this thread not worth the money.
 
Oh - so now the clamp bar is supposed to break. It's a feature, not a bug. Cool. That's way better than these other shitty mounts and rings that I have on a couple dozen other guns that simply don't break when torqued to 65 in-lbs.

I'm going to spend the rest of the afternoon redesigning a bunch of things so that some proprietary component that's only available through one vendor breaks before the $0.25 fastener (which also happens to be one of the most consistent and reliably-produced commodity component in the world) reaches its maximum preload like we've known how to do for about a century.
Joke is on you. The fastener is also somewhat proprietary and equally shitty. That why you need to be smarter than the engineers and pay $100 for a set of titanium screws.
 
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We built our Test Fixture and actually carry it to every class because we saw the need and the problems

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Find me an Instructor Team that is in the shooter's space like we are, for almost every shot ?

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We watch the SHOOTER more than the target, we live in your space shot after shot, so we se it all
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But I get it, we aren't the comp guys, I stopped going, so my observations don't matter to the Barricade Benchrest Crowd, you didn't see it so it must not be happening
 
Clearly you are not very smart... too funny, the guy arguing a losing point doesn't get it
He'd rather die in a grave he dug himself than admit he's wrong.

@DeathBeforeDismount it's still amazing to me how wrong and confident you can be.
Like it's proven those mounts break all the fucking time.
I guess you can blame it on the user because he's to stupid to buy a mount that doesn't break
How many broken ARC or MDT mounts do you hear about?
 
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Sphur was my go to mount but now no thanks to many issues. The warranty is great but would rather not need to use it There are other mounts that are just as good that don't break. The last mounts I bought were 2 ARC and 2 ERA-Tac adjustable mounts and they both have been flawless. I have not seeing the new design up close but judging from this thread not worth the money.
They all have issues if you drill down enough. Bobro, Leupold, ADM, Larue, ARC and many others fail too. There are alot of newer entries into market using similar designs from MPA to MDT to A419 and Grey ops. The Badger Condition ones are very ni

Unless you go to ultra old designs like Badger unimounts which were bomb proof. But people liked to hang stuff off their gun. Right now, Spuhr has the best ecosystem and the most options for things like diving boards, send it mounts, ect. Others are catching up.

If i wasn't so heavy invested in spuhr and buying new today, I would be going with grey ops. But you are looking at replacing like 4+ systems (mount + accessories) so at $500+ a pop, that is switching out over $2,000 worth of mounts for what? Something new that does the same thing.

The point is, you can make a spuhr work without failure. I don't recommend them for new purchases because the prices have gotten insane in the last year with the US customs duties now applied. You can still snag used ones from Mile high on GB for awesome prices and they will work, if you take care to not overtorque them. For guys who already own them, there is a path to success.
 
That is the Competition crowd in a nutshell,

They argue losing points and then quietly hide the conversations or change the narrative

Don't be fooled these guys follow a liberal playbook when it comes to internet arguments, they dogpile, shout down, shoot the messenger but never admit wrong
 
They all have issues if you drill down enough. Bobro, Leupold, ADM, Larue, ARC and many others fail too. There are alot of newer entries into market using similar designs from MPA to MDT to A419 and Grey ops. The Badger Condition ones are very ni

Unless you go to ultra old designs like Badger unimounts which were bomb proof. But people liked to hang stuff off their gun. Right now, Spuhr has the best ecosystem and the most options for things like diving boards, send it mounts, ect. Others are catching up.

If i wasn't so heavy invested in spuhr and buying new today, I would be going with grey ops. But you are looking at replacing like 4+ systems (mount + accessories) so at $500+ a pop, that is switching out over $2,000 worth of mounts for what? Something new that does the same thing.

The point is, you can make a spuhr work without failure. I don't recommend them for new purchases because the prices have gotten insane in the last year with the US customs duties now applied. You can still snag used ones from Mile high on GB for awesome prices and they will work, if you take care to not overtorque them. For guys who already own them, there is a path to success.


See closest you get, he was insulting all of you a minute ago, now there are options for success but you need to seek them out

Disingenuous piece of shit these guys are, don't' let them fool you

not nearly as smart as they claim to be, just loud and insulting
 
He'd rather die in a grave he dug himself than admit he's wrong.

@DeathBeforeDismount it's still amazing to me how wrong and confident you can be.
Like it's proven those mounts break all the fucking time.
I guess you can blame it on the user because he's to stupid to buy a mount that doesn't break
How many broken ARC or MDT mounts do you hear about?
I know of 5 broken ARC Mbrace mounts, Seen 3 with my own eyes and 2 were fellow competitors. One user even had 2 broke. Call ted and ask him about the ones he gave full refunds on.

I dont know of any MDT mounts breaking but they are not a poor design like the ARC's so I would assume they hold up great.
 
They all have issues if you drill down enough. Bobro, Leupold, ADM, Larue, ARC and many others fail too
Hmm. I notice you didn’t list NF , ZCO , Geisselle , Badger

S
wasn't so heavy invested in spuhr and buying new today, I would be going with grey ops. But you are looking at replacing like 4+ systems (mount + accessories) so at $500+ a pop, that is switching out over $2,000 worth of mounts for what? Something new that does the same thin
so you know they are inferior. You’re just cheap.

Got it
 
I know of 5 broken ARC Mbrace mounts, Seen 3 with my own eyes and 2 were fellow competitors. One user even had 2 broke. Call ted and ask him about the ones he gave full refunds on.

I dont know of any MDT mounts breaking but they are not a poor design like the ARC's so I would assume they hold up great.
5 is more than I would have guessed, might even actually be able to blame those on user error but I don't care enough to look into it.
How many spuhrs? I bet I can find 50 on this site with one search and way more if you actually cared to look.

At this point you've admitted you wouldn't buy another one or recommend them so that's good.
 
Can you convert "45lb lbs" to ugga-duggas? That's the only torque spec that I understand.

Doing my own engineering over here, I would like to note that the 45 in-lb spec (which converts over to 5 N-m) is about 30% lower than the spec for a M5 bolt of Grade 8.8 and a full 50% lower than that of a Grade 10.9. This sort of under-specifying of fastener torque possibly indicates that the mechanical design of the mount is already inadequate to handle the potential clamp load of the fastener, or at the very least suggests that broad margin has been provided to minimized the likelihood of broken fasteners during installation at the expense of performance. Either way, the shit shouldn't be breaking even with a torque wrench of poor quality, and if it's user error from incorrect units as you suggest then we should be seeing the fastener yield which does not appear to be the case.

I've got one Spuhr because it was the only option that provided the desired angle to optimize scope travel on that particular rifle. It's worked fine and I'll continue to use it, but future purchases will Badger or Nightforce Unimounts because they have no apparent issues accepting reasonable torque values for the provided fasteners.

When someone was saying the 45 in-lb spec is too much I was going to suggest to look up the recommended torque specs for unplated, plated, and black oxide grade 10.9 low head M5 socket head cap screws and note that Spuhr's specified 45 in-lb is actually on the conservative side per the various hardware manufacturers torque guidelines, but I see you've already beaten me to it. Don't forget though Spuhr uses low head fasteners on the clamp bar which have a much lower specified torque than regular height head socket head bolts (which I think you referenced)-- but 45 in-lb is still on the conservative side for a low head 10.9 M5 unless you slather it in grease or anti seize and significantly change the k factor from the manufacturers testing charts.

You want enough elastic deformation in the fastener when tightened to "spring load" the joint, and higher strength/grade screws will require a higher torque and create a higher clamp load to achieve that. If spuhr wants to reduce the clamp load and stress on the clamp bar but still have adequate elastic deformation of the fastener they could switch to grade 5.8, 8.8, or 9.8 or even drop the fasteners a size down to M4 and reduce the torque spec accordingly. You'll then have adequate stretch on the bolt to tension the joint to absorb shocks and resist loosening but with a reduced overall clamp load on the clamp bar. Unfortunately the lower grade fasteners have a lower yield strength so now there's a greater chance of them stretching or breaking if you were to say bang the scope and mount on a barricade or something.

At this point IMO Spuhr might want to consider keeping the grade 10.9 or 12.9 M5 screws and going to a stronger clamp bar material or design (or both)... that would be my suggestion. This problem has persisted for over a decade now through at least 2 and possibly 3 revisions of clamp bar design. It's still not solved, which is why I sold off all my Spuhrs even though I really liked their 45 degree ring split for the great visibility of the turrets (ignoring the other design issue of using flat head screws for the ring caps...)

There would probably be a good market opportunity for third party steel clamp bars, and I'm surprised nobody has made them yet...

This was not always the case, it happened much later, and you can see the side plate changes over time

Adding screws, new side plate designs, the Spuhrs are good, just something changed with them

Been happening for at least a decade, or even longer. My first clamp bar cracked about 8 or 9 years ago, mount was probably a year old at the time. Plenty of posts going back to 2011ish showing cracked clamp bars and even cracked rings. The failures have always been there, it's just as more people started using spuhr you saw an increase in posts about the failures even if the overall failure rate stayed about the same.

The Gen 1 thin clamp bars on the 1.18 high mounts with minimal edge margin to the bolt holes were the worst for cracking in my experience, followed by the thin and tall clamp bars on the Gen 1 cantilever mounts that flexed a ridiculous amount when tightening.

Also, the head OD of the ring screws was reduced and the screw spacing slightly altered for the gen 2 ring caps to leave more material and edge margin around the screw heads as on the Gen 1 the countersinks for the 4x outboard ring screws left only a knife edge of material remaining that acted like a crack propagation point. I haven't seen nearly as many pictures of cracked gen 2 ring caps compared to cracked gen 1 ring caps, but it still happens, although based on pictures the rings fail at a much lower rate than clamp bar failures.

Hmm. I notice you didn’t list NF , ZCO , Geisselle , Badger

If this was still 2001 and we were all still using badger steel rings we'd probably never have threads about ring and mount failures... I'm pretty sure those things are invincible. We'd have lots more threads about lapping and ring marks though, lol
 
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Sample size of one, my one Spuhr aimpoint mount (bought in 2018), I torqued to Spuhr's spec with a fix-it-sticks torque limiter, then one day in 2023 at the range- 3 rounds of 5.56 in- my Aimpoint T2 fell in the dirt.


Milehigh sent out a replacement for the piece that broke, but I ultimately went with a different company for a new mount.


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Value ?

This is snipershide.

Looks and likes are why we buy stuff.

Value. Smh
This should get looks and likes think the group buy is still going?
 
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This should get looks and likes think the group buy is still going?
But muh Raptar Mars radius rail
 
Sample size of one, my one Spuhr aimpoint mount (bought in 2018), I torqued to Spuhr's spec with a fix-it-sticks torque limiter, then one day in 2023 at the range- 3 rounds of 5.56 in- my Aimpoint T2 fell in the dirt.


Milehigh sent out a replacement for the piece that broke, but I ultimately went with a different company for a new mount.


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No no no

It’s supposed to do that!

5 more inch lbs and your rail would have crushed
 
Joke is on you. The fastener is also somewhat proprietary and equally shitty. That why you need to be smarter than the engineers and pay $100 for a set of titanium screws.

Wow, the good news just keeps rolling in. At this rate, I'll have posted all my NF and Badger Unimounts in the PX by close of business today and have a $6k order from MHS on its way next week. And as a bonus, I can finally turn that bombproof 65 in-lb Seekonk T-handle torque wrench into the doorstop it's always been destined to become.
 
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Wow, the good news just keeps rolling in. At this rate, I'll have posted all my NF and Badger Unimounts in the PX by close of business today and have a $6k order from MHS on its way next week. And as a bonus, I can finally turn that bombproof 65 in-lb Seekonk T-handle torque wrench into the doorstop it's always been destined to become.
Think you might have misread that.

as a side note aren't NF mounts like 100 in/lbs on the cross bolts?
 
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They all have issues if you drill down enough. Bobro, Leupold, ADM, Larue, ARC and many others fail too. There are alot of newer entries into market using similar designs from MPA to MDT to A419 and Grey ops. The Badger Condition ones are very ni

Unless you go to ultra old designs like Badger unimounts which were bomb proof. But people liked to hang stuff off their gun. Right now, Spuhr has the best ecosystem and the most options for things like diving boards, send it mounts, ect. Others are catching up.

If i wasn't so heavy invested in spuhr and buying new today, I would be going with grey ops. But you are looking at replacing like 4+ systems (mount + accessories) so at $500+ a pop, that is switching out over $2,000 worth of mounts for what? Something new that does the same thing.

The point is, you can make a spuhr work without failure. I don't recommend them for new purchases because the prices have gotten insane in the last year with the US customs duties now applied. You can still snag used ones from Mile high on GB for awesome prices and they will work, if you take care to not overtorque them. For guys who already own them, there is a path to success.
I see TurdCutter is at it again.

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