Rifle Scopes Dissapointed in my Bushnell DMR2!!!

[LongRangeJunky]

You might want to tune down the big stories, when earlier in this thread you claimed the reticle [which has 8 mils of windage] was not enough for a 10 mph wind at 700 yards with your 6.5 creed.

There is an obviously problems here with your scope. You could very easily send it to Bushnell and have it fixed, and find out it demonstrates a great value. Good tracking, good glass, good feature set.

I can't imagine the DMRII should be priced for less than the TX5i, after running them side by side this year. I would like to see this 800 dollar optic that compares with the DMRII or the TX5i.

I explained myself VERY poorly here and I will gladly eat my words on the reticle and windage part. I ran my numbers in my ballistic app for a 10 mph 90 degree crosswind and the numbers I was getting were far greater than what the reticle design could accommodate for wind holds. I must have entered something wrong (bc/ velocity, etc.). That is MY FAULT. All the other issues are not.

 

[Eric32]

Does your windage turret have a wobble to it, when in the unlocked position? i have one as well and it wobbles a lot when i grab it, it moves towards the lenses in both directions if that makes sense.

 

[LongRangeJunky]

Does your windage turret have a wobble to it, when in the unlocked position? i have one as well and it wobbles a lot when i grab it, it moves towards the lenses in both directions if that makes sense.

I shipped it back today. I cannot recall having that issue. What I did notice that was exceptionally annoying was a major difference in the elevation and windage "clicks". The elevation turret was consistent and sort of had a smooth click-click-click going on. The windage knob had a really rough ratchety adjustment like they were two totally different knobs. I thought that was a little odd.

 

[Eric32]

same with mine, i am throwing on a friends BR rig with a hood checker to test for shift in 100 yard zero. if it fails that i am asking for another model.

 

[ICU22250]

I shipped it back today. I cannot recall having that issue. What I did notice that was exceptionally annoying was a major difference in the elevation and windage "clicks". The elevation turret was consistent and sort of had a smooth click-click-click going on. The windage knob had a really rough ratchety adjustment like they were two totally different knobs. I thought that was a little odd.

You will find the difference in feel between elevation and windage on alot of different scopes.. I've seen this on NF as well.. I'm not sure if it's intended that way because they want the windage to be tighter on purpose, because alot of people hold wind and don't want the windage knob to get moved accidentally. Don't know the whole purpose behind it, but as long as it's solid and I can feel the clicks, I don't mind if it's a little bit tighter myself..

 

[LongRangeJunky]

You will find the difference in feel between elevation and windage on alot of different scopes.. I've seen this on NF as well.. I'm not sure if it's intended that way because they want the windage to be tighter on purpose, because alot of people hold wind and don't want the windage knob to get moved accidentally. Don't know the whole purpose behind it, but as long as it's solid and I can feel the clicks, I don't mind if it's a little bit tighter myself..

Im not saying it is necessarily a problem at all! But that in conjunction with other parts of the reticle illuminating when it should not, very poor clarity (for me at least), and tunneling from 3.5 to about 5-6 power all made me feel as though this is not worth what I paid for it. Its ridiculous how many guys got butt hurt by this thread (not saying you are). It was a true dissapointment. Again, from a size/shape/weight perspective, it is my favorite scope out there! I just wish the other features were more refined and if they were, I would have been very very excited. Trust me I was sick to return it. My dream rifle gets here any day and I will not have glass for it until I get a refund and order a new optic so I'm just going to have to look at my new DT Srs. Trust me, I did absolutely everything I could to love it.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

 

[m6z]

It really sounds like you got a turd. Have you decided on the replacement?

 

[Eric32]

So I called Bushnell today if you have any wobble in the windage knob in the unlocked position at all send it back.

 

[lennyo3034]

So I called Bushnell today if you have any wobble in the windage knob in the unlocked position at all send it back.

That applies to me. Mine definitely does.

 

[Glassaholic]

OP, it sounds like you may have got a bum DMR IIi based on what I've read through this thread. I think the Hide has given you some good advice, first, check with Bushnell, their warranty is one of the best in the business. I had the original DMR and similar to your story that is what got me into the custom rifle gig, it sat atop a Surgeon with a Bartlein chambered in 7WSM, at the time it was the best scope I could afford (or so I thought) and I paid $1250 for it. Is the DMR IIi worth more than the original, well the new one has illumination, it has 10 mil turrets, the turrets are a tad lower profile and the glass has better multicoating. The reticle, the feel of the turrets, the performance of the illumination is all subjective and we all have our differing opinions. Sounds like you bought the scope for its magnification range and short length and hoped the glass would be as good as Nightforce ATACR and Vortex Razor Gen II but that is simply not the case. In general, you get what you pay for in the optics world and often times we have to make compromises based on our budget and needs. The fact that you bought a scope hoping it would be something more is not surprising, that has happened to me multiple times. I bought the Steiner T5Xi 5-25x56 when it was first announced being bedazzled by the marketing hype of "German precision made in the USA" I had very high expectations and was sorely disappointed. I agree with many others on the forum, with such strong feelings with your first impressions I don't think you'll ever be happy with this scope. I understand the dealer you bought it from has a high restocking fee, but you'll still get more than trying to sell it as used is my guess. I would contact your dealer and ask them if you return it and buy another scope from them would they consider refunding the restocking fee, or just cut your losses and get your money back minus the restocking fee and then buy from a Hide vendor as I can just about guarantee every Hide vendor would have sold you the DMR IIi for less than $1600 (PM me if you'd like some references). If you want "short" there are not that many options with scopes over 16x magnification, the best of course is the Schmidt & Bender Ultra Short series, but you'll have to save up more coin for those, but they are the best. I would also join the many others who have recommended the Vortex Razor AMG, I also own one of those and can tell you the glass is definitely better on the AMG over the DMR IIi, the reticle is superior, it has locking turrets and locking illumination, the turret clicks are nicer and eye box is better, but it is a longer scope and has a higher low end magnification, but don't always go by the magnification rating, take a look at the Field Of View (FOV) specs and you might be surprised that not all scopes are created equal, I tend to lean towards scopes that have greater FOV at the bottom end. My type of shooting involves, paper, steel and hunting and its the latter that controls the minimum FOV because I like hunting Elk and I've decided that 20' FOV at the bottom end is my comfortable limit, the Vortex AMG comes in at 20.4' even though it is 6x magnification (better than some manufacturer's 5x scopes). I reviewed a bunch of these scopes earlier this year - https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...t-low-light-tactical-scope-evaluation-part-ii and while I felt the Bushnell DMR IIi was a definite improvement over the original, I also felt no other scope compares at this price range and magnification range and length (that being said, I think $1600 for a DMRIIi is overpriced). Frank disagrees and says there are other scopes in this price range that are "better" but he is unwilling to say which ones, though I have to wonder if they have the same magnification range and are just as short because that is the reason why a lot of shooters choose the DMR II, are there scopes with better glass, certainly, are there scopes with better reticles, I think so, but I don't know of any other scope under $2000 that offers all that in one short package. Good luck with your journey, I share your frustration with hoping you'll get what you expected but sometimes that's not the case. My final thought is to once again reiterate that your next scope purchase should be from a reputable Snipers Hide vendor, they are awesome to deal with and can give some great advice and most of them will work with you to make sure you are happy.

 

[JCIN]

I am a "newer" shooter in the sense that I have not owned countless high end optics to do a true comparison. But I have been shooting and hunting since I was in diapers. I have competed on the state level in shotgun shooting sports, and have killed elk in Colorado to mule deer in Wyoming to whitetail in Virginia. I am not that new. I really got into long range shooting when the RPR came out. I got one of those and a Vortex PST and have had a ton of fun, making it out to 900yards with great success on a few occasions and killing many whitetail around 300-400 yards with it.

I have been saving my pennies for this day for almost 6 years to get my dream rifles and optic. I just spent $5,650 cash for my dream DT SRS A1 with a custom 6.5CM barrel. I paid $1,600 cash for the Bushnell DMR2 I THOUGHT would be a great value given all the marketing material and information I have found.
I have had my hands on NF ATACRs and Vortex RZR Gen 2s. I KNOW how they look, feel and what kind of clarity I get with them. The DMR2 caught my eye as a more affordable but still excellent option. This thing is ABSOLUTELY NOT worth $1,600. Period. You can bitch all you want about a "new" shooter who doesn't know anything not being able to fix their own problems.
How about the problem of false advertising? You cant trust a single F*ing review around here because I bet 99% of these guys are paid to do their stupid biased reviews. The only way I know how to generate some actual real world honest responses is by posting a thread like this. Every review of every damn optic out there says "Its the best I have ever used in this price range". Now I have no glass, my rifle will be here any day.

I took the DMR2 out to a field last night. Spotted some deer and cows about 4-500 yards out. I could not at all see myself taking a shot at that distance with the dmr2 because the deer was so poorly defined! I know for a fact my PST would let me take the shot because I have done it about five times at that distance! Either something is wrong with this thing, or it is exactly as Lowlight said... "An $800 optic with a $1,600 price tag".

So you didn't really want a solution when you posted you just wanted to vent. You bought something that you had zero experience with so you could save some money, it's not what you expected and you don't have enough experience to know if it's broken or not.

Now after talking shit about the product and the company in public you sent it in for them to look at. You may have been shooting shotguns and elk at a state level since Truman was in office but your problem solving skills need some work.

 

[Steel Rain]

I have a list, and can answer this ^^^^ in a very pointed way, however, lately people like to "Rat" me out to companies when I drop some fact bombs that don't align with marketing.

So I will not post my list, but it's out there, go to SWFA and cruise the listing you can find them.

You can realistically spent about $250 less and get more in a lot of these cases. The $999 to $1250 price range has some nice options hanging around.

So don't ask because I am not opening myself up for back door attacks sent to these companies.

LL,

Your integrity and wiliness to speak the truth separates you from and elevates you above sooo many other experienced professionals in your field.
LEGIT product reviews are almost impossible to find. We see the marketing stuff companies put out and its mostly bullshit.
Please continue to put out HONEST and TRUTHFUL information, REGARDLESS OF HURT FEELINGS.

 

[DOL23]

LL,

Your integrity and wiliness to speak the truth separates you from and elevates you above sooo many other experienced professionals in your field.
LEGIT product reviews are almost impossible to find. We see the marketing stuff companies put out and its mostly bullshit.
Please continue to put out HONEST and TRUTHFUL information, REGARDLESS OF HURT FEELINGS.

I'll second this.

As a newish member the reason I come here is to read the pointed and honest reviews. Forums are a huge resource for shooters who don't have the ability to handle multiple thousand dollars optics before purchasing. If we cower to these companies that don't like facts/opinions on their products then these resources become useless. Not to mention it's another method to keep them honest, if they don't want bad reviews then don't make shit products with misleading marketing (that statement has nothing to do with Bushnell, personally, I think OP is being rather dramatic and/or received a lemon).

 

[Glassaholic]

I have a list, and can answer this ^^^^ in a very pointed way, however, lately people like to "Rat" me out to companies when I drop some fact bombs that don't align with marketing.

So I will not post my list, but it's out there, go to SWFA and cruise the listing you can find them.

You can realistically spent about $250 less and get more in a lot of these cases. The $999 to $1250 price range has some nice options hanging around.

So don't ask because I am not opening myself up for back door attacks sent to these companies.

I am curious about this Frank. Let's say you tell somebody that Brand X is a piece of junk that doesn't track. Are Hide members (or trolls) then sending emails to Brand X telling them that Frank from Snipers Hide had something bad to say about their scope? My question is, so what? You're telling the truth about a product and educating a community, what can Brand X do that has caused you to not want to post the truth on the Hide? Or is it that Brand X is a sponsor of Snipers Hide and you will lose your sponsorship if you speak truthfully (err, poorly) about them? I'm a little concerned that you would not be willing to share your thoughts and opinions to better educate the community because of the backlash of some manufacturer...

 

[Lowlight]

It's about the spin they put on it ... there are companies that truly work to improve their products, and there are companies that feel they do no wrong.

If this was about sponsorship Bullets.com would be an advertiser, I have no problem telling companies NO over principle whether they agree or no

I call it as I see it, But I am not volunteering more to give fuel to any potential fire.

I give honest reviews, I also give companies a chance to correct a problem if I see it. I always attempt to be fair first and foremost, but there is an undercurrent in this industry to tear guys up who disagree. As I wrote they want to shoot the messenger and I have no interest in it.

Look at the PRS crap, they spun that out of control in order to make me the villian. Yet this week I took several screenshots of PRS members proviing my point over and over. In their own groups they will say shit that shows their true colors, even if in public they pretend to know nothing about anything I said in those two letters. They would rather paint me as the problem acting like they never see it, then in the same breathe go to their private groups and reinforce the attitude.

Bushnell has banners on here, I gave my opinion, that should be a clue.

SO Bill, my question to you is, why do I need to explain myself further ? Guys who have bad opinons of me will not be swayed by it.

 

[SubOptimal]

I have read a lot of Frank's reviews and find him to unbiased in his opinions on how a particular product performs. If anything, his experience and skill can tend to make things sound better than than they are.
My experience with Bushnell service has been nothing but stellar.
OP, go to their website and hunt around. There is a link on there to service and they will follow up with you quickly. The link allows you to state your issues with the scope and why you are not satisfied. In my case, I had broken the elevation turret on my H2DMR due to my clumsy attempts to get a 100 yard zero with 40MOA worth of cant and then set a zero stop. I explained this in my note to them, taking full responsibility for the problem. They asked me to send the scope in and I did. I got an update from them stating that the scope was in testing about a week after they received it. A week later, another email shows up that they were shipping me a new scope and that very afternoon, the UPS guy knocked on my door with a box. Brand new scope with no issues. Also no cost for the return shipping. They also included a report on what they found with my old scope. Not only that, the new scope was in FDE which nearly matched the Ceracoat on my rifle, the old scope was black.

 

[samnev]

I have read and seen many of Frank's reviews over the years I've been a member and found them to be spot on when I purchased a product based on his review. Enough said, keep up the good work Frank. To Frank's doubters I consider their comments " A tale told by a fool full of sound and fury signifying nothing" With apologies to Shakespeare for borrowing his work.

 

[Glassaholic]

It's about the spin they put on it ... there are companies that truly work to improve their products, and there are companies that feel they do no wrong.

If this was about sponsorship Bullets.com would be an advertiser, I have no problem telling companies NO over principle whether they agree or no

I call it as I see it, But I am not volunteering more to give fuel to any potential fire.

I give honest reviews, I also give companies a chance to correct a problem if I see it. I always attempt to be fair first and foremost, but there is an undercurrent in this industry to tear guys up who disagree. As I wrote they want to shoot the messenger and I have no interest in it.

Look at the PRS crap, they spun that out of control in order to make me the villian. Yet this week I took several screenshots of PRS members proviing my point over and over. In their own groups they will say shit that shows their true colors, even if in public they pretend to know nothing about anything I said in those two letters. They would rather paint me as the problem acting like they never see it, then in the same breathe go to their private groups and reinforce the attitude.

Bushnell has banners on here, I gave my opinion, that should be a clue.

SO Bill, my question to you is, why do I need to explain myself further ? Guys who have bad opinions of me will not be swayed by it.

Thank you Frank, there is no need to explain yourself further, you have explained it fully . Without the background I wasn't sure where the pressure was coming from to cause you to not want to give your honest opinion on something, that's what concerned me, but it makes more sense now. I apologize if I sounded accusatory, that was not my intention, just surprised that you felt you could not share your honest opinion on your own website. And boy, what you say at the end about guys who have bad opinions is spot on, especially in the internet community, I have often thought that much of the banter that happens on forums is because we are not talking to each other in person and we tend to formulate opinions before we understand the context. I've only met you once for coffee but I could tell you're a man of good character who doesn't BS, maybe that rubs some people the wrong way, but I appreciate your straight forward approach. Say no more and keep up the great reviews and help for the community, I certainly appreciate it and I know many others do as well.

 

[Eric32]

Frank,

any chance i can get a hint to where the list is located?

 

[Birddog6424]

Frank,

any chance i can get a hint to where the list is located?

There was a thread a handful of months back where posters chimed in and listed their three favorite scopes in the sub $1000 category, 1000 to $1500 category, 1500 to $2000, etc etc.

Frank posted a list there.

I have no link to it though, you'll have to look for it.

 

[Xander3Zero]

I have had my DMRII (non-illuminated) for about a month now, have taken it to the range multiple times. I dont have a lot of experience behind high quality ($1000+) glass, but I did get to compare it to my buddy's Razor HD 5-20 gen 1, and I thought it was very comparable. I like the design and aesthetics of the DMR better, but I think the feel of the turrets of the razor are a little nicer. Glass seemed about equal between the two, but I liked the reticle of the DMR better. The non-illuminated reticle has a very fine center crosshair which is great for precision shooting.

There is tunneling from like 3.5 power to 4 power, which is weird but I dont use that magnification range often. My only other complaint would be about the locking windage knob. When it is in the locked position it does take a little finagling to get it to unlock (push it towards locking position before trying to unlock). Other than that, I've been very happy with the other features, such as the zero-stop which was easy to set and seems rock solid.

Edit: Just double checked and mine only has tunneling from 3.5-4x, which is barely noticeable given how small of the magnification range it affects.

 

[entropic86]

I've had several non-illuminated DMRIIs. They are great for the money and available for $1200 used but like new. They have all tracked well, fairly clear, turrets and knobs smooth, good build quality, the tight eyebox thing has always been a small issue until I get it set up just right on my rifle. Just had one out at GAP Grind and my data was spot on all weekend. Bushnell Illumination has always been disappointing though.

 

[Monstershot]

There was a thread a handful of months back where posters chimed in and listed their three favorite scopes in the sub $1000 category, 1000 to $1500 category, 1500 to $2000, etc etc.

Frank posted a list there.

I have no link to it though, you'll have to look for it.

Unfortunately that was on the old scout site and unless my search skills suck it's gone...they probably suck. Redo?

 

[emiguy]

$6,000 gun deserves S&B

 

[Eric32]

Unfortunately that was on the old scout site and unless my search skills suck it's gone...they probably suck. Redo?

its gone i found tid bits but not enough to put a list together. only thing was frank likes the 3-20 S&B short and thats it.

 

[Xander3Zero]

That applies to me. Mine definitely does.

Mine kind of has this wobble that you speak of, but I can't imagine how it could be avoided? It seems like the slight wobble in the unlocked position is because it can "wobble" or "move" towards the locked position. Like there is no "detent" holding the knob in the unlocked position so it is free to wiggle a little bit towards the locked position. I am not sure if its worth sending the scope back for something like this, I would find it hard to believe that this is a defect and that a new scope will fix the problem.

Given the lifetime warranty, its probably safe to use it and keep an eye on it, if it ever becomes an issue, you can still send it back. Also I'd hate to send back my primary scope and be waiting for weeks only to find out they send me a new scope with the same issue... I would be curious to see if others with this scope has absolutely zero play in their windage turret while in the full unlocked position.

 

[Eric32]

I played with a buddies ERS scope and it had zero play in it, so i sent my back but i fear USPS lost my scope no tracking info since it departed my local PO. So this will be an adventure.

 

[MWM-5150]

I would be curious to see if others with this scope has absolutely zero play in their windage turret while in the full unlocked position.

I have a DMRII-i and its as tight as a drum. No "wobble" in the turrets at all, and the more I've used them, the better they feel. So far its been an outstanding optic. My only minor complaints would be:
1) The detents in the illumination knob are not very distinct. The transitions between on-off are difficult to feel. I hardly ever use it, so it really doesn't bother me and it seems to be something that has improved with use.
2) (this is difficult to explain) Objects that are out of focus (say at <100yds, when I have my parallax set for a target at a greater distance) exhibit a lot of CA, and this can sometimes be a little distracting. Objects in focus are very clear and exhibit little to no CA. This varies with color and light conditions and is much more pronounced when its very sunny.

Sounds to me like the OP had a lemon because my scope exhibits none of those issues. The numbers do partially illuminate (little tiny bits) but I can only tell if I'm at MAX magnification and MAX brightness. At lower magnifications (8-18x), and lower brightness settings I don't see any number illumination at all.

If one were so inclined to shop around, this scope can be had for around $1200 NIB. If were stuck at spending $1600 for it though...I would probably be considering a G1 Razor or saving more for a G2.

 

[Eric32]

i got it thu the MIL program so i paid less, but still it annoying on a retail value scope of $1600.

 

[Xander3Zero]

i got it thu the MIL program so i paid less, but still it annoying on a retail value scope of $1600.

I too paid significantly less than retail, and the slight wiggle in the windage knob appears to be only cosmetic and have no affect on function. I would be curious to see how Bushnell will take care of you, and to see if they send you a new scope with a solid windage turret.

 

[Eric32]

i know it is a cosmetic issue but that still doesnt make it right. but i hope they do the right thing if not i will be selling it. And going with a Gen 2 Razor and calling it a day

 

[SilentStalkr]

Honestly, I am kind of shocked to hear this. I have spent time behind all kinds of scopes from Nikon to S&B, Khales, NF, the list goes on and on. With that being said the only scopes I own now are Bushnells. In fact, I think I am down to only using the elite tactical ERS and XRS models on all of my bolt actions, if I am not mistaken. From my experience they are an excellent value. They are every bit as good as any of the higher end scopes I have used that cost at least 2x as much. They have tactile turrets, track well and super clear glass with a good bit of eye relief, for me. I did have an issue with an XRS once and I shipped it back and they replaced it, no questions asked. I am truly shocked by what you are describing. That doesn't sound like the bushnell I know at all. Sounds like you may have inadvertently got something you shouldn't have. Maybe it was a floor model that people did who knows what with? I would send it back and send them your concerns. They have been very receptive to my feedback in the past. So, I encourage you to send it back and contact them. Good luck to you. I am going to follow this and see what happens.

 

[Eric32]

yea i sent it back in, but a shit luck as would have it. its lost in the current USPS system despite 1000 insurance and signature.

filed a claim with USPS but i am not hopeful to ever see it again

 

[Xander3Zero]

yea i sent it back in, but a shit luck as would have it. its lost in the current USPS system despite 1000 insurance and signature.

filed a claim with USPS but i am not hopeful to ever see it again

hopefully it will turn up, and bushnell will take care of you. please let us (me) know if you ever get a replacement and if it has a solid windage turret lol. I am so torn about mine now, whether its worth dealing with bushnell and shipping my scope back to them or not... wish I had never read this thread haha!

 

[Eric32]

do a windage test make sure it tracks, zero the windage to your load, and never fucking touch it agian an hold for windage if you need it.

Not worth the hassle.

 

[Xander3Zero]

do a windage test make sure it tracks, zero the windage to your load, and never fucking touch it agian an hold for windage if you need it.

Not worth the hassle.

haha well put

 

[Brux]

This whole thing is very surprising. I also have 2 of the Elite Tactical scopes and I have run the shit out of them with the turrets and never a hick up out of either one. But not to say that you did not get a bad one. With that being said I have seen NF,S&B,swarovski scopes go bad also,and Leopold. Shit happens just deal with it.

 

[Carl_Ross]

I’m a little surprised at all the negative comments as well. I’ve run first a DMR and more recently an HDMR II almost exclusively for the last 5 years of competition. I did use a 3-18 Gen II Razor briefly, but switched back to the Bushnells. I bought both used, and despite plenty of abuse have probably only lost a couple hundred in value each.

They’ve been great scopes for me, have functioned perfect, and have just been overachievers. There’s not a scope I’m aware of that goes for less than ~ $2,500 on the used market that I’d trade my HDMR II for. Your mileage may vary and OBVIOUSLY not everyone feels the same way, but I’m very happy with mine.

 

[Eric32]

yea i am not saying bushnell are terrible scopes or the DMR2 is shit, i am just upset that i got a lemon scope. and sending it back it gets lost by USPS.

that scope has what i think to be the perfect reticle for matches and hunting application's and even some F-class matches as well. if they opended the center to a dot would be my only minor change.

the scope when i had was super bright just like my 5-20 HD from SWFA. the clicks were great and the picturr stayed bright at 20x.

i just want my DMR2 not to be lost in the mail and not to have issues with the windage turret locking up and moving side to side when i do have to dial some windage.

 

[Carl_Ross]

Getting a lemon would indeed suck. I’ve had it happen before (not with Bushnell) and wasn’t happy about it either. I’m more referring to the idea that there are numerous better options in the $1000 range, if there are I haven’t seen them. And I’ve used many of the popular options.

It also sucks that your scope is stuck (or lost) in shipping limbo, but that isn’t really specific to THIS scope, beyond the fact it needed to go back which opened up an additional exposure to shipping issues.

 

[Eric32]

I TAKE BACK ALL THE BAD THINGS I HAVE SAID ABOUT USPS!!!! My scope arrived on the 9th of OCT at bushnell, a week late but it's there!!!!!! The tracking number still shows it as departing my local Post office. Man, what a friday day surprise my weekend just got better.

***Update: They found my scope wasn't returning to zero like i found out and the windage knob is also jacked up. They are replacing it with a new one.

SO if your windage knob is acting funny also check it for return to zero and tracking issues.

 

[steve123]

I TAKE BACK ALL THE BAD THINGS I HAVE SAID ABOUT USPS!!!! My scope arrived on the 9th of OCT at bushnell, a week late but it's there!!!!!! The tracking number still shows it as departing my local Post office. Man, what a friday day surprise my weekend just got better.

***Update: They found my scope wasn't returning to zero like i found out and the windage knob is also jacked up. They are replacing it with a new one.

SO if your windage knob is acting funny also check it for return to zero and tracking issues.

So much for Friday the 13th being bad luck! What a relief, aye ?!

 

[Eric32]

yea, i got the postcard from bushnell today. friday the 13 is great

 

[morganlamprecht]

Honestly, I am kind of shocked to hear this. I have spent time behind all kinds of scopes from Nikon to S&B, Khales, NF, the list goes on and on. With that being said the only scopes I own now are Bushnells. In fact, I think I am down to only using the elite tactical ERS and XRS models on all of my bolt actions, if I am not mistaken. From my experience they are an excellent value. They are every bit as good as any of the higher end scopes I have used that cost at least 2x as much. They have tactile turrets, track well and super clear glass with a good bit of eye relief, for me. I did have an issue with an XRS once and I shipped it back and they replaced it, no questions asked. I am truly shocked by what you are describing. That doesn't sound like the bushnell I know at all. Sounds like you may have inadvertently got something you shouldn't have. Maybe it was a floor model that people did who knows what with? I would send it back and send them your concerns. They have been very receptive to my feedback in the past. So, I encourage you to send it back and contact them. Good luck to you. I am going to follow this and see what happens.

bushnell should send you a check after this fluffer post lol

 

[SilentStalkr]

Ha. I wish. I’m just giving credit where it’s due man. That’s all. As I stated I have used many different scopes and there are arguably some better, but not in their price range. All of my elite tacticals have been every bit as good as any of the scopes costing 2x as much that I have ever had or used. Somepeople get it in their head that more expensive means better and most times I would agree but from my experience that is simply not always the case.

Ive also ran and had good luck with Nikon and Leupolds and sent them some feedback. Both were very receptive to my feedback and ran with it. Leopoldo has since made huge strides from the scope I sent them feedback on many years ago. However,’I still don’t think their stuff is anywhere near the quality of the Bushnell Elite line. That’s just been my experience. Everyone has one. I’ll keep saving money and running my Bushnells. I must also point out that I have never paid full retail price for any of my stuff either. That makes a difference. I admit while I think the dmr is a good scope I wouldn’t have paid $1600 for it I don’t think.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

As I stated I have used many different scopes and there are arguably some better, but not in their price range. All of my elite tacticals have been every bit as good as any of the scopes costing 2x as much that I have ever had or used.

Uhm, what? How can you make these statements that contradict one another in back to back sentences? That makes no sense.

MAP on the DMR2 is $1550 for the base model with no illumination or Horus option which 2X the price would be optics with a $3100 MAP. The ERS and XRS you also previously referenced as being the only ones you own currently have MAP's of $1950/$2150 which 2X the price would be $3900/$4300 which is pretty much the extreme end of the top tier price range outside of a few exceptions. I understand this is MAP and you can get the Bushnells for less but you can get discounts off MAP on any of them so it's a fair comparison price wise based on your claims.

Either you're off your rocker with your evaluation if you have experience with a broad range of optics, or your evaluation lacks experience. It's one or the other.

I had a few DMR's/HDMR's and an ERS. I currently have a HDMR 2 and my experience differs greatly. The original DMR's and ERS's were borderline terrible to me. The pull up turrets blow, at least the ERS got a zerostop (although arguably the worst zero stop design of any optic I've ever used) and 10 mil turrets but they still left a lot to be desired. The DMR's 5 mil non zero stop that easily move up and down? Good luck with them is all I can say. It was so easy to get lost on revolution and the knobs moving up and down so easily so I had to constantly make sure the knob is all the way up to even be able to trust the indicator lines. Beyond the turrets, the glass was mediocre as best in all but one. Two of the DMR's got dark and cloudy up top so the optic was basically useless above 18x and even below that was meh, I certainly wouldn't want to use it in low light or behind a NV clip on. The ERS was a touch better, it was actually serviceable up to 21x but again nothing great. One DMR actually had surprisingly nice glass but based on my other experiences and talking to others who have them, I got a unicorn.

As far as the HDMR 2, I like it. At street price you can actually get them for I don't think you can beat them. Everything works as it should and the glass is good but still not great and certainly doesn't begin to compare to the top tier stuff. The turret, parallax, and magnification are good (way better than the previous bushys) but are just good, not great or amazing like higher end stuff. I'd buy it again at street price, and I don't plan on getting rid of mine but I also don't plan on getting anymore. There's no way I'd pay the $1600 MAP that my model has, it's not worth that. At that price you're too close to what you can get better options for, and at or over what you can get used options for that are also better.

I'd consider revising your inaccurate statements so that you don't mislead potential consumers. You're accounts are not accurate nor are they even reasonable based on the portion of your last post that I quoted here.

 

[SilentStalkr]

Dude, first off, I am not revising my statement. Just because your experience differs from mine doesn’t make mine any less valid. Second, you know nothing about me, who I am or what I do or any experience that I may or may not have. I am calling it like I see it. And, my statement that you quoted is not contradictory at all. I stated that there are some scopes out there that are arguably better than the ers and xrs models that I have. I didn’t specify which ones. I then stated that mine have been every bit as good as some I have had and or used that are 2x as much. Again, I didn’t specify. I didn’t say they were better than every scope costing 2x as much but I can tell you they were every bit as good as some of the much higher end scopes I have had in every arena aside from a NF Beast. That was some of the clearest glass I have ever seen. But it’s not even in the same ballpark price wise. Then I stated that I didn’t think there was anything better in the same price range, that I personally have used, which is true. I also said that I didn’t pay full retail for mine. I paid $1050each for pretty much all of mine and there is no other scope remotely out there in the same league for that kind of money. Sorry. I have tested many and unless you want to pony up $3000 or so then I haven’t come across anything yet that comes close. Even then the bushnells I have can play side by side with the big boys. At $1050 each, I don’t think they can be beat.

correction, the xrs’s cost me $1050 each. I paid $900 for the ERS’s. If you can name a scope better than either of those in that price range, I am all ears. I have probably used them at one time or another. Now if you want to argue that a Khales that is $3800 is better we can have that argument, but it’s not even in the same ballpark price wise and imo the elite series is every bit as capable. But that’s just my opinion. I can tell you from our testing it was every bit on par in performance with scopes costing much much more. Maybe I just got lucky and got some good ones. I don’t know, this is just my experience. And, if you recall I did have an xrs that had to go back that they replaced, no questions asked. The replacement has been spot on.

In regards to your statement about the zero stop design, i 100% agree with you on that. That could certainly be improved upon and there are many designs out there on higher end scopes that I think are much easier/more intuitive to use for sure but that is just one aspect of the scope. I hope they address this on future designs.

With all that being said, you act as if you have some kind of testing to conclude that the Bushnell Elite Tactical scopes are not quite up to par by the sounds of it. Can I ask how you came about your opinion of them? What kind of testing went into it etc.? All I have to go on is my own experiences of many years of owning and selling, trading and borrowing stuff. I have never had 40 different scopes at my disposal at the same time to make some in-depth scientific analysis of how they all compare according to every test imaginable. But I have swapped scopes on and off the same rifle, zero’d them, done basic tracking tests, run them all the way up and back down etc. on most of them, just not all at one time. And I will admit I didn’t write down and compile all of this data. We may have shot 2-3 different ones at a time to compare to and then a year may have passed before we compared to another and at that point it’s based all off of memory. So, there is that. Again, this is just my experiences. If you have some data that I can see that would encourage me to trash them because your testing found this or that then I am all ears. I have an open mind. I never said they were the best scope around but they are very capable and I don’t know of anything remotely in the price range I paid that would compare. I would be interested to hear about more of your experiences with them.

 

[Arko]

Im sure the OP has moved on to newer and better scopes and is fully satisfied with something better than a $100 Barska but Id have to add that after reading only the first, very entertaining page of this thread Id almost guarantee that he got a lemon based on the samples Ive used and also on the one I have. Its a damned nice scope. Are there better? Sure there are but a Barska? Really? Come on. That was just mean man, mean.
An acquaintance of mine used his atop an AR 15 platform to win this years PASASS DMR series which includes multiple timed shot engagements from 100 to 900 meters, moving targets and hostage stages. I doubt a $100 Barska would allow that.
Dude, you either just got a lemon (possible) or there is something else going on at the little end of the scope (likely).

 

[morganlamprecht]

Ha. I wish. I’m just giving credit where it’s due man. That’s all. As I stated I have used many different scopes and there are arguably some better, but not in their price range. All of my elite tacticals have been every bit as good as any of the scopes costing 2x as much that I have ever had or used. Somepeople get it in their head that more expensive means better and most times I would agree but from my experience that is simply not always the case.

Ive also ran and had good luck with Nikon and Leupolds and sent them some feedback. Both were very receptive to my feedback and ran with it. Leopoldo has since made huge strides from the scope I sent them feedback on many years ago. However,’I still don’t think their stuff is anywhere near the quality of the Bushnell Elite line. That’s just been my experience. Everyone has one. I’ll keep saving money and running my Bushnells. I must also point out that I have never paid full retail price for any of my stuff either. That makes a difference. I admit while I think the dmr is a good scope I wouldn’t have paid $1600 for it I don’t think.

"I have spent time behind all kinds of scopes from Nikon to S&B, Khales, NF, the list goes on and on. With that being said the only scopes I own now are Bushnells. In fact, I think I am down to only using the elite tactical ERS and XRS models on all of my bolt actions, if I am not mistaken. From my experience they are an excellent value. They are every bit as good as any of the higher end scopes I have used that cost at least 2x as much."

i just hope no one reads this, buys a bushnell...then actually gets their hands on an ATACR, Gen 2 razor, Kahles, Schmidt, etc...theyll be disappointed AF lol

 

[5RWill]

"I have spent time behind all kinds of scopes from Nikon to S&B, Khales, NF, the list goes on and on. With that being said the only scopes I own now are Bushnells. In fact, I think I am down to only using the elite tactical ERS and XRS models on all of my bolt actions, if I am not mistaken. From my experience they are an excellent value. They are every bit as good as any of the higher end scopes I have used that cost at least 2x as much."

i just hope no one reads this, buys a bushnell...then actually gets their hands on an ATACR, Gen 2 razor, Kahles, Schmidt, etc...theyll be disappointed AF lol

Have to agree here. I'm a big fan of Bushnell, but i've not used one that matches or exceeds my SN-3, let alone a 624i, Gen II, or ATACR. The LRHS is impressive for what you can find them at. The DMR II i presume to be similar. The XRS II is the only one of the bunch i've looked through and actually considered to have top tier glass, i didn't get to spend a whole lot of time behind it but it was notably better than the Gen I ERS i was using that day. That's not to say the current models have bad glass but it's nowhere near scopes costing 2x as much. For 2x the price you can have S&B or TT and be done with it.