DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

Svartur_Skuggi

Svartur_Skuggi

Private
Minuteman
Oct 22, 2010
22
0
51
Jefferson ; Texas
#1
Good Morning All;

I was looking at both the DTA SRS Covert Sniper Rifle and the Nemesis Arms Tactical Rifle as my two choices on my next rifle.

I have never shot either, but have read such good reviews on both.

I have spoken to the owner of Nemesis Arms and was very impressed by what he had to say about the build of the system. He took me through not only everything that was done to the rifle to make it such a fine choice; but he also took me through the history of the rifle and company itself. He was straight forward and very open to any and all questions I had.

I also spoke with a rep from DTA. Again; the rep knew his product inside and out. Was straight forward about what the rifle was able to do in each caliber offered.

Between the two; I am more inclined to buy the Windrunner at the moment. Although (like the Nemesis), DTA's rifle system has barrels that can be changed out as often as you'ld like, they didnt go the extra mile of nitration (not sure if thats spelled right). Now; I know there's some who say it doesnt matter, but when the hardness of the barrel is around 70 vs 40, the 70 is gonna have the most barrel life, with all being equal.
So Nemesis' barrels should last longer and they come at abetter price.
The other pro to Nemesis is that it breaks down to almost nothing.

Now as far as DTA's Covert System..... If your using the .308 short barrel, you have a duel working system. A rifle that can shoot 500-600 yards, plus a short enough system where you could use the same rifle to clear a building if need be. That part I love.
The other thing that DTA has going for it is that I can go from a 308 to a 338LM with no issues.
If you get the Nemesis System the largest round you can currently go up to is the 338 Fed.
So in this area, DTA has my vote.

The Nemesis System has a screw on / locking syestem for their barrels. The DTA has a locking key system that puts me a little in mind of my Blaser T2.
My Blaser locking system already has play in it, even though I torque it to specs.....this will lead to an unstable barrel that jiggles if I am understanding how the Blaser set up is keeping the barrel in place.
So; I am also wondering if the same issue can occur with the DTA Covert Rifle?

Does anyone here have any shooting time with either weapon? Someone that might help as far as how rugged both rifles are? Or if the locking system for the DTA will also end up with play in it over time, causing the purchase of another 3500.00 Chassis on top of the 2 barrel convertions I'll have to buy at 1500.00 each?
And am I correct as far as the DTA Covert being able to play two rolls with the short 308 barrel to clear a house if the need arised?

I want to that everyone for their input before hand.
And please dont fry the questioner LOL!

**Shane
 
#3
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

I don't know if I'd clear a house with a bolt action scoped .308, no matter how short.
 
#5
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

I'm thinking that it's more apples vs. tomatoes then apples vs. oranges on this. At least to me it is.

One is a bullpup-style bolt action while the other is a more traditional style(from the position of the action is relation to the shooter).

If it was a work related role(LEO, Fed, Mil) I would say the DTA, because out of the box, or case, it is ready to go. With the Nemesis I would say it would excel more in a recreational role, with a limited working role. The reason for that is the setup, but don't think of that as a disadvantage, because it's good if you just want to grab the rifle and go for a day at the range. It wouldn't be as cumbersome as a non-collapsible rifle inside a case so there is some ease to the shooter.

I see different strokes for different folks between the two. The only similarity would be the ability to switch calibers.

I'm also partial to the both of them, but they both excel at different things without a serious disadvantage sooo....

JUST BUY ONE AND BE HAPPY!!! LOL!
wink.gif
 
#6
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

DTA all the way.

The best feature of the DTA is a long barrel in a short package. Me being able to change barrels in less than 60 seconds is the next best feature.

The locking system you speak of, from Blaser, sounds nothing like the DTA. I have zero play in mine. I've never owned a Blaser so I can't say what type of play it has, but as far as the DTA theres no play in the barrel or locking system.

It does take some getting use to the ergonomics, but once you do it's awesome.

Hope this helps.
 
#7
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

Hi SvarturSkuggi,

I have the Nemesis Arms Vanquish (in the .308). I got mine with the 20 inch barrel. They (Nemesis Arms) also have a 16 inch barrel for the weapon. I use mine for Long Range target shooting. If I was clearing a structure I would go back to my AR platform in (5.56).

I have nothing bad to say about the DTA SRS Covert Sniper Rifle Chassis. After spending about a year researching different weapon systems, I went with Nemesis Arms.

I have found it to be dependable, accurate, and fun to shoot. When I take it out to the range, I always get a few fellow shooters going "Hey, what have you got there?"

After letting them shoot a few rounds at the 500 yard gong, they just have a big grin from hearing the lead make the 8 inch metal plate ring.

I have a machinist background and was very impressed with the detail in the quality of the product made by Nemesis Arms.

Let us know which one you decide on.
 
#8
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

I have an SRS and shot the Mini-Windrunner, which the Nemesis rifle is based on. Both are very accurate and multi-caliber capable, the SRS getting the edge on being able to go from a .243 to a .338LM. The SRS gets an edge in ergonomics, in my opinion as well - it's well balanced and comfortable. The Mini-Windrunner's stock felt a little weird to me when trying to shoot in a Hawkins position. But that's more of a personal issue - your mileage may vary.

Either way, like the AI vs DTA debate, I don't think you can go wrong with either rifle. You may in fact get both down the road
wink.gif
 
#9
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bm11</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't know if I'd clear a house with a bolt action scoped .308, no matter how short.</div></div> Exactly what I was thinking. There's versatility and then there's thinking you can clear a room with potential multiple bad guys and you have a bolt gun. Draw your sidearm and sling the rifle.
 
#10
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

+1 on DTA. I haven't seen (except on their Web site) or touched Nemesis Vanquish, but enjoy greatly my DTA. <span style="font-style: italic">I must admit that Vanquish packed in a briefcase is wicked!
smile.gif
I must see if I can do the same for my DTA. </span>

One more thing. if you love bullpups - go DTA without a second thought. If you hate bullpups and love AR15 kind of rifle - well, then it's probably Nemesis (unless you also want 338 Lapua)?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bm11</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't know if I'd clear a house with a bolt action scoped .308, no matter how short.</div></div>
But if you do it through the windows from a hide 600m away?
grin.gif
 
#11
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

Wow thanks for all the great input and advice.

From what I'm reading from everyone is that the DTA is an in-field duty system; where as the Nemesis is more of a "paper puncher".

So it looks like I will be going DTA Covert all the way.

The comment of "clearing a room" was made as a worst case situation. But all being normal I agree that would not be the best idea LOL.

Just gotta figure out how to hook up an inline sighting system on such a small railing set-up
wink.gif


Thanks everyone again, and if there are others with more input, by all means.....let it fly LOL

**Shane
 
#15
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: nobbie333actual</div><div class="ubbcode-body">has anyone tried to shoot DTA left hand</div></div>
I haven't practiced it. But shooting 308 feels fine, operating the bolt required me to lift my head from the stock (or get my own fist into my own teeth
smile.gif
). Perhaps there's a trick that I'm not aware of - and I intend to keep shooting right-hand, which works very well.
 
#16
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

I've shot the Nemesis with 308 and 243 barrels, and it was extremely accurate, but it never really fit me, so off it went. The biggest problem with a multiple barrel system is that while you can remove the barrel and put it back on and it groups the same, when I switched from 1 cal to the other it was way off. I basically ended up with a scope for each barrel on a quick mount. And it still never fit well enough to make me keep it. But it was a tack driver, especially the 243.
 
#17
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

Was the POI shift between calibers consistent? That's the way we deal with it on the SRS - the shift is repeatable, so you just make a note of it and reset your turrets when you change calibers. Of course this is complicated by a scope without adjustable turrets.
 
#19
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

I shoot the DTA SRS - There is no play, don't compare it to anything else you have seen. Swapping calibers has always returned to zero (each barrel has a different zero, but it has always returned for me).

If you care how it looks, then pick whatever floats your boat, but I can say for sure, the DTA will perform in the dirt, and the service there (and from the dealers I have dealt with) has always been first rate.
 
#20
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

Well;

I have decided to go with the DTA SRS Covert. Will be paying for it come pay day ( cant kill my "nest egg" in these times LOL ).
I would like to ask one more question.
The DTA Covert doesnt look like it will support an inline night system mounted to the front rail along with a full size scope. Does anyone know of a work around for this w/o having to invest in a night/day scope as I havent found one with the Horus sights? Maybe some links if possible?

Thanks for ALL the GREAT input;
Shane
 
#22
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

With a smaller scope like the horus blackbird, or the smaller nightforce scopes you can fit a UNS or MUNS in front of the dayscope, however just so you know the smaller optics kind of suck on a precision rifle.
frown.gif
I like the NF 3.5-15x FF on my covert demo gun.
 
#23
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

Thanks for the reply.

Have you set up an in-line system yet on the Covert? I searched the pages suggested to find the set-up and I guess I'm just blind (or the post just started to blend together LOL!) but I couldnt find it in the DTA sticky thread.
If you all have messed around with an in-line system there, please by all means share
smile.gif

If its gonna be to much of an issue I cant always just go with the SRS "standard". But its better to know now then after the purchase.

Thanks so much sr90
 
#25
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: nobbie333actual</div><div class="ubbcode-body">has anyone tried to shoot DTA left hand </div></div>

Yes and like all other skills it just takes time.
 
#27
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know of at least one Lefty who uses a DTA, he hasn't an issue, and I think there is a video from DTA shooting it left handed. </div></div>

<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/JWVaK7k-0k8"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/JWVaK7k-0k8" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>
 
#28
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

i have a nemesis arms vanquish, and it isn't what i would call a gun.

it is a work of art!

the gun is absolutely amazing, and is obviously capable of more precision than i am capable of. the brake on the .308 makes it feel like a .223.

i have the backpack only because i am still not sure what optic will finally end up on the gun. the one i have now is a good scope, but this gun deserves hensoldt quality.

i only wish i could buy two more, so i have one to hand down to each of my three children.

you can get the vanquish with a 16" barrel in you want, but the 20" still makes the gun fairly compact. i do wish that the extendable stock had about another 1"-2" on it, but it still works well. and the vanquish breaks down to a smaller size than the DTA SRS. makes it easier to lug around.

i wouldn't consider using this or any other bolt gun for clearing a house. that's what ARs are for.
 
#29
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SvarturSkuggi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well;

I have decided to go with the DTA SRS Covert. Will be paying for it come pay day ( cant kill my "nest egg" in these times LOL ).
I would like to ask one more question.
The DTA Covert doesnt look like it will support an inline night system mounted to the front rail along with a full size scope. Does anyone know of a work around for this w/o having to invest in a night/day scope as I havent found one with the Horus sights? Maybe some links if possible?

Thanks for ALL the GREAT input;
Shane</div></div>

You chose well. I love my DTA. crazy accurate.
 
#31
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nemesis</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Looks fun lifting your head every time. Wonder what the target looks like.</div></div>
Clearly that is a disadvantage that one would consider choosing a platform. For me and others, the advantages of the platform outweighed this disadvantage. I can imagine a user for who it would be a deal-breaker. Thankfully, AWM and AX rifles are around to provide 338LM capability to those who must have a more convenient way of shooting left-handed at the cost of other disadvantages (for there is no perfect platform so far - each one has its pluses and minuses).
 
#33
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

People lift their heads with every rifle. Does that make the rifle any less accurate? No. Bolt action bullpups take a bit of familiarization to get comfortable cycling without lifting your head. Is that a roadblock to having a good rifle? I doubt it. If you want to make it a fair contest, you need to make a .338LM conversion kit because at this point that's one of the biggest advantages over your rifle (as nice as it is).
 
#34
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

DTA definitely seems solid. The only thing that has kept me from one is the price of the barrels. I shoot enough that at $1600 a pop it just isn't worth it to me when I can get a schneider barrel for significantly less.
 
#35
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

I reciently had the pleasure to fire a DTA in 338LM. We were hitting 8x metal plates at 600yds with Federal Gold Medal Match 250gr bthp. The platform preformed admirably until the front of the receiver cracked. Im not posting this to to speak negatively about anyone or the product. Im just sharing my experience. I've done my time in the military and have put many rounds down range in the service of our country. I am currently L.E. and looking for That "perfect" long gun that can accomplish several roles with the least amount of cost to the public. Firing the DTA I could not get comfortable with the bullpup design. Every time I had to cycle the bolt I would loose cheekweld and sight of the target. This system seems to work better in a semi-auto platform.
 
#36
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nemesis</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You don't have to lift your head with a Nemesis Arms Vanquish!

No disavantage, oops.</div></div>
You meant to say "Vanquish does not have this disadvantage".

On the other hand, some users want heavier calibers than 308-based. And some need a shorter <span style="text-decoration: underline">operating</span> overall length, not just compact packing.

As I said, every platform has its advantages and disadvantages.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dirty diaper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Firing the DTA I could not get comfortable with the bullpup design. </div></div>
From my experience, people tend to love or hate bullpups. Much more "polarization" in opinions than with the conventional design.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dirty diaper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Every time I had to cycle the bolt I would loose cheekweld and sight of the target. This system seems to work better in a semi-auto platform.</div></div>
Interesting, because this never happened in my experience - unless I tried to fire left-handed (in which case it was exactly as on the video). Firing configured-for-right-hand semi-auto bullpups left-handed is an experience in itself.
smile.gif


And I'm sorry to hear about your experience with cracked receiver - absolutely no fun.


To summarize, the choice between DTA Covert and Nemesis Vanquish seems to be:
<ul style="list-style-type: disc">[*]Packing Vanquish into a standard-size backpack (20") and carrying it inconspicuously, vs.[*]Having a shorter <span style="text-decoration: underline">operating</span> rifle (DTA) with caliber choices extending to 338LM.[*]Vanquish is better if you need to take multiple shots left-handed and don't want to lift your head off the rifle after each shot.[/list]
 
#37
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

Dirty Diaper,
Please provide me information to the rifle owner of which you speak as we have never had a receiver crack at DTA. By the way welcome to Snipershide
 
#38
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<span style="font-weight: bold">Nemesis Arms .....</span>

<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Designed
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Materials
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Parts
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Manufacturer
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Workers
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Owned Business
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Pride in Workmanship

That is why I used my <span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Money to buy my <span style="font-weight: bold">Vanquish</span> and shoot <span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> made cartridges down range.

cool.gif
 
#39
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NF1986</div><div class="ubbcode-body">DTA definitely seems solid. The only thing that has kept me from one is the price of the barrels. I shoot enough that at $1600 a pop it just isn't worth it to me when I can get a schneider barrel for significantly less. </div></div>
You are confusing Conversion cost to barrel cost.
buying just the barrel can be the same price as you pay.
When your barrel is shot out just send the barrel to Jon Beanland have him rebarrel it.
He can use your barrel extension off of your" shot out barrel."
You can order the correct contour from many barrel makers.
 
#41
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

You couldn't give me one of the Nemesis rifles. They really aren't good for any shooting position that you can't use the bipod. There's no place to support it with your hand or by a tripod. You certainly aren't going to be clearing any buildings with it with no way to support the thing. Definitely not a very thought through rifle. IMO its just a conversation piece since it will fit in a briefcase.

I would go with the DTA and never look back.
 
#42
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

Just got a covert a week or 2 ago. Excellent rifle.

Balanced very well. Off hand shooting is wonderful.

Carries better than any other rifle I own. I carry it on my 4-wheeler and dirt bike all day with no problems while chasing cows and just riding around.

I have it in my pickup at all times or in the tractor. sits on the seat and I can get it out very easily. Try that with a standard hunting rifle.

Didn't have binos while in the semi getting bales one time. Used the scope. I could put the rifle on top of the steering wheel and look at antelope in front of the truck. Didn't hit the windshield.

With the monopod it felt just as stable or more stable than my 308 with manners stock.

It is a diffrent setup. I have had mine with me everyday and it hasn't taken long to not want to grab my old 308. Just need a suppressor for it.

Never used a nemesis arms, can't say. Neat looking rifle.
 
#43
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lunetist</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-weight: bold">Nemesis Arms .....</span>

<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Designed
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Materials
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Parts
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Manufacturer
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Workers
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Owned Business
<span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Pride in Workmanship

That is why I used my <span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Money to buy my <span style="font-weight: bold">Vanquish</span> and shoot <span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> made cartridges down range.

cool.gif
</div></div>

Uhhh...isn't the DTA made in the USA, too?
 
#44
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redneckbmxer24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You couldn't give me one of the Nemesis rifles. They really aren't good for any shooting position that you can't use the bipod. There's no place to support it with your hand or by a tripod. You certainly aren't going to be clearing any buildings with it with no way to support the thing. Definitely not a very thought through rifle. IMO its just a conversation piece since it will fit in a briefcase.

I would go with the DTA and never look back. </div></div>
IF ..I was to get one ? I would have a slip on type stock made that would fit in the backpack also , drop the bipod , slip the mini-stock over the bipod post ....it would have 2 "ears" that slid up both sides of the reciever to hold it steady and straight & I would fab some sort of spring detent or plunger type mechanism to keep it secured on the post
is Nemesis listening ???
 
#45
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Uhhh...isn't the DTA made in the USA, too?</div></div>
I believe it's made right in Salt Lake City, Utah (USA
smile.gif
).
 
#46
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Twisted .308</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redneckbmxer24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You couldn't give me one of the Nemesis rifles. They really aren't good for any shooting position that you can't use the bipod. There's no place to support it with your hand or by a tripod. You certainly aren't going to be clearing any buildings with it with no way to support the thing. Definitely not a very thought through rifle. IMO its just a conversation piece since it will fit in a briefcase.

I would go with the DTA and never look back. </div></div>
IF ..I was to get one ? I would have a slip on type stock made that would fit in the backpack also , drop the bipod , slip the mini-stock over the bipod post ....it would have 2 "ears" that slid up both sides of the reciever to hold it steady and straight & I would fab some sort of spring detent or plunger type mechanism to keep it secured on the post
is Nemesis listening ???

</div></div>

Then you would have one more item to keep with you. Unless they can find a way to incorporate it into the rifle without having to add/remove parts then I wouldn't consider it. I also won't consider it until they make it so you could use a bipod other than the POS versa-pod and they redesign the buttstock to either give you a better support for you non firing hand and a place to use a bean bag. Right now to me the gun just screams hollywood, where the guy runs to the top of the building, assembles his rifle, and takes a shot. The rifle isn't well designed at all, it's missing many key features a precision rifle should have. I mean the thing doesn't even have a place to attach a carrying strap for crying out loud, let alone a shooting sling. Are you supposed to be super tacticool and completely disassemble your rifle after every firing position? I guy I know had one and he said he had to rezero every time he shot it because disassembly caused a 1-2MOA POI shift every time. It wasn't becase he was using cheap mounts either because he was using a NF with NF hardware.

I just don't understand the concept of the rifle other than a hollywood "cool" gun. The DTA is very compact, compact enough to fit in small cases or bags and can be pulled right out ready to shoot. It can also be used with a shooting sling and can be fire from any position a full sized rifle stock can. You can also put any bipod on it so you aren't limited to one and one of the worst at that. Nemesis would basically have to design and build another rifle to get me to even consider it.
 
#47
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

I just don't understand the pissing contest here - both are tack drivers and will appeal to different needs because they have different features/capabilities. As I said in my first post in this thread, I don't think you can go wrong with either.
 
#49
Re: DTA SRS Covert Rifle VS. Nemesis ArmsTactical 308

I have nothing bad to say about Desert Tactical Arms(DTA).

I grew up just South of their location.

I am sure they have the same <span style="font-weight: bold">American</span> Pride as Nemesis Arms.

The post was not intended to suggest anything negative at all.

blush.gif
 
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