EIC Brown Bess help needed

[MK20]

I am working on an East India Musket I brought back from Afghanistan. It is basically a Brown Bess that was made in percussion vs flintlock.

I am trying to get the last piece out which is the trigger pack that sits under the trigger guard assembly. I can get it to wiggle but it refuses to come out. A pic is attached below. Am I missing another of those stupid little pins somewhere that they used to hold things in the stock?

I appreciate your help.

@sirhrmechanic for unparalleled expertise in all things vintage.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

I am working on an East India Musket I brought back from Afghanistan. It is basically a Brown Bess that was made in percussion vs flintlock.

I am trying to get the last piece out which is the trigger pack that sits under the trigger guard assembly. I can get it to wiggle but it refuses to come out. A pic is attached below. Am I missing another of those stupid little pins somewhere that they used to hold things in the stock?

I appreciate your help.

@sirhrmechanic for unparalleled expertise in all things vintage.


View attachment 8001245

More likely the piece is just stuck in there with old oil and swelled wood. Very carefully clean the wood and metal. Sharp chisel or even a sharpened wood dowel (like a chisel).

And clean the edges. Then worry it out.

I don't think it has any horizontal pins onit. Just... crud! And more crud! Fine Indian Crud!

Cool piece. Keep going!

Sirhr

 

[MK20]

Thanks sirhr.

I just got it. Screwed the top tang screw back in and used that to push it out.

I am trying to be very careful as this one is an excellent specimen vs the IMA ones. This one spent more time in the hands of some tribesman and less time sitting in an armory.

Some Afghan lacquered the stock but Citristrip will cure that. It appears they did not bother to sand the stock prior to lacquered it so that is actually excellent as the lacquer preserved the stock quite well.

The stock does have an "E.BAKER" stamp still visible at the toe of the stock.

Some research indicates that this is an East India Company model F musket.

Not a bad 300 dollar project rifle
Pics when it is all back together.

 

[MK20]

Also, any recommendation on how to clean the brass @sirhrmechanic ?

I have an ultrasonic and thought about giving that a try.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Also, any recommendation on how to clean the brass @sirhrmechanic ?

I have an ultrasonic and thought about giving that a try.

Ultrasonic works... but tooth brushes and kerosene... followed by burnishing. Depends on whether you want high polish or just sort of a... burnish. Brass toothbrushes (from hardware store... they taste like crap!)... work great. But keep lubricated wtih kero or WD 40 or similar.

If you want a high polish, after cleaning, get some Brasso or Muthas on it.

But I tend to prefer a sort of burnished yellow look. But if you polish, it will fade back to that fairly quickly.

Cheers and keep up the photos and updates!

Sirhr

 

[ewoaf]

There should be a pin which was sometimes under the lock plate if not just a hair below it. No reason to remove the trigger really unless it's broken. Is just leave it on and do what you have to do around it. Steel wool and brasso for the mountings.

 

[Flint62a1]

Can we see some photos of the percussion adaptation? Just curious.
Thanks Kevin

 

[camocorvette]

Yeah man.. you can't say you've got this sweet piece and not show pictures. Even if it's torn down.

Still jealous of your bring backs. Our commander wouldn't sign anyone's paperwork to bring back shit

 

[MK20]

I have been working on getting my emt cert and am almost done. Once I have finished that I plan to get back to working on it.

Pics likely after Christmas.

 

[camocorvette]

Sweet man!
That sounds great. Get that Cert!

 

[MK20]

Parts are in the ultrasonic to get 2 centuries of tallow, sweat, dirt, goat jizz, and other sundry goo off.

Now the brass stock hardware needs to come off.

 

[MK20]

Trigger cleaned up nice.

 

[MK20]

Lock cleaned up nice too.

 

[MK20]

Into the diesel they go.

 

[MK20]

Brass is cleaning up well.

 

[6.5SH]

View attachment 8103176View attachment 8103175
View attachment 8103178
Lock cleaned up nice too.

Looks amazing compared to your first pics of it.

 

[MK20]

Yeah.

0.004 wire carding wheel. Won't even touch bluing but takes rust and crap off.

 

[MK20]

3 minutes with the carding wheel.

Before

After

 

[MK20]

Before on the underside of the barrel.

 

[MK20]

After a trip to the carding wheel, very interesting marks start to show up.

 

[MK20]

Many marks near the breech. Mostly proofing marks, I assume.

 

[MK20]

I would very much like to pull the breechplug as it would make inspecting and cleaning the barrel much easier.
@buffalowinter
@sirhrmechanic

For ideas of how to go about this.

Heat and penetrating oil then barrel vise and wrench or something different?

 

[buffalowinter]

I would very much like to pull the breechplug as it would make inspecting and cleaning the barrel much easier.
@buffalowinter
@sirhrmechanic

For ideas of how to go about this.

Heat and penetrating oil then barrel vise and wrench or something different?

First just give it a shot with a vise and wrench, you might get lucky. Then soak in kroil or penetrating oil for a day and try again. Use a sturdy vise and wrench with an extended breaker bar. I use a piece of water pipe slipped over the wrench...like two feet long. Then try heat. If all else fails, throw it in a freezer overnight and try again....I actually had this work last week after all other attempts failed. I guess if its a brown bess it has a round barrel. You will need a barrel vise to grip that round barrel. You will need to coat the barrel with rosin or use lead sheets between the barrel and barrel clamps. You can make the clamps out of two pieces of wood. You can use a bottle jack to make a vise. There are two methods for applying pressure...just steady constant pressure is best when using a long breaker bar. Filing that, take a short bar, about 8", and try sharp impact with a hammer. The bad news is, with an older piece like this, the parts may have succumbed to chemical welding and will never come apart.

 

[MK20]

Thanks. I thought those would be the steps but have never pulled an old plug like this before. This one looks to have been coated in tallow for 2 centuries though and is in remarkably good shape.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Don’t pull it. If it must be pulled… take to a conservation specialist.

Use ram rod for length… buy one of those bore inspection thingies. Don’t pull a BB breech plug with home tools chemicals and fixtures.

Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

^^^ btw, Buffalo winter’s stuff is “not” home stuff. If you have his stuff and skills…. Pull it.

Or ship It to him! BW-willing!!

Sirhr

 

[camocorvette]

Are you boiling it to convert the rust before carding? Looks like it's cleaning up well.

 

[MK20]

I am not boiling it. These guns were originally in the white from my understanding therefore this is a more correct restoration.

 

[MK20]

A lot of what I thought was rust was mostly dried grease/tallow, so it is much better than I thought.

 

[MK20]

Set up the barrel in the vise.

Enough leverage solves any problem. And it's made in Germany, not China.

 

[MK20]

Applied a bit of heat to get it warm.

And then.....

Presto, plug popped right out. Still had grease on the threads from almost 200 years ago.

Glad I popped the plug out. There is a rust/fouling plug in the bottom of the barrel.

 

[MK20]

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Brave man.. but well done!

Who dares wins!

Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

So what is bore looking like?

 

[camocorvette]

Thank goodness you got it off. Definitely needed some attention. Now it will be way easier to clean.

 

[MK20]

Brave man.. but well done!

Who dares wins!

Sirhr

It was a calculated risk. The amount of tallow type goo I was scraping off the breech and the condition of the underlying metal led me to believe that the goo in the threads would still be soft.

The bore has rust in it but it appears to be in remarkably good shape for it's age and spending 200 years in India/Pakistan/Afghanistan.

I plan to plug the bore and soak in CLR for several hours. Then brush and I'll get a truly good look.

But it is shootable. I can tell that right now.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Outstanding!!!!

 

[MK20]

Soaked the bore in CLR and then wire brushed it.

Bore is excellent for any vintage muzzleloader.

I might try some muriatic acid if I feel the need to really clean the bore at any point.