Read an article about a rape victim's own DNA being used against her. So many thoughts have gone through my head regarding this subject. Would enjoy others thoughts on this.
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Evidence used both ways
- Thread starter Bullfrog08
- Start date
Is this it? She broke the law, she got caught. Why should she be protected?
3 hours ago — SAN FRANCISCO — A rape victim whose DNA from her sexual assault case was used by San Francisco police to arrest her in an unrelated property ...
A woman whose rape DNA led to her arrest sues the ... - NPR
https://www.npr.org › rape-dna-san-francisco-lawsuit3 hours ago — SAN FRANCISCO — A rape victim whose DNA from her sexual assault case was used by San Francisco police to arrest her in an unrelated property ...
Definitely a problem to be sorted out. I’ve heard of the FBI having access to the sites that do genealogy testing as well.
In this case a potential victim could be coerced not to report a rape if she had any inkling dna had been left at another crime scene. What about evidence tampering and statute of limitations implications.
If allowed to be used unchecked, simply gathering dna at any crime scene could put many innocent individuals at risk of being guilty until proven innocent and the implications for abuse would be incredible.
In this case a potential victim could be coerced not to report a rape if she had any inkling dna had been left at another crime scene. What about evidence tampering and statute of limitations implications.
If allowed to be used unchecked, simply gathering dna at any crime scene could put many innocent individuals at risk of being guilty until proven innocent and the implications for abuse would be incredible.
They can't use the DNA collected from one case for an arrest in another.
What they CAN use it for is probable cause for a search warrant to collect DNA for the other case.
It was likely a CODIS hit, which you can use for probable cause to get a search warrant.
ANY DNA collected in criminal investigations is entered into CODIS. It helps to identify both suspects and victims.
What they CAN use it for is probable cause for a search warrant to collect DNA for the other case.
It was likely a CODIS hit, which you can use for probable cause to get a search warrant.
ANY DNA collected in criminal investigations is entered into CODIS. It helps to identify both suspects and victims.
But if the woman would have been murdered - they would have been able to identify her through the DNA - and nobody would have bitched about it.
Face it.
Once our DNA is in the system for any reason - it's in it to stay.
Just like our picture.
Just like our fingerprints.
Good or bad.
Just wait until we have those chips imbedded in us all in order to buy groceries or bank...
Face it.
Once our DNA is in the system for any reason - it's in it to stay.
Just like our picture.
Just like our fingerprints.
Good or bad.
Just wait until we have those chips imbedded in us all in order to buy groceries or bank...
Not sure that is correct... though it may take a SCOTUS case to decide.
If the sample was given voluntarily as part of a rape case... then it may well be admissable in another case.
Then again, is the rape sample covered under HIPA? Healthcare privacy?
It's all very convoluted. Is it considered a 'plain sight' search. Since her DNA was in plain sight when the perp's DNA was being isolated or viewed?
I'd not write it off one way or another. But sure as hell it's going to be a long, convoluted path to decide this one.
And as for the DNA sites... If you send in a swab, you can assume that the Feds and, by extension, local PD have access to it. Period. Moreover... if your RELATIVES go get themselves a DNA test for geneaology or whatever reason.... then you are on the radar screen as well. Because the DNA match will come up with a brother, cousin, parent, uncle... whatever. And the circle will close in very, very close within a short period. They can eliminate damn near everyone 'except' you. Based on the sample your relative gave. And that puts you in the crosshairs.
There is a lot of good that DNA/genome science can do. But it can also put you in the Hoosegow in a hurry if even a semi-distant relative decided they wanted to know how much of an Indian, Eskimo or Paddy they were.
Big brother... hell, Orwell never even came close to imaging this stuff. This makes 1984 look like Romper Room.
Decades of SCOTUS cases ahead on this stuff.
Sirhr
Solid reply.
We are building a new world that makes a prison seem like freedom personified.
Thats it. Seems like a way to discourage reporting of crimes. Not so much that case, but just the implications of other evidence and not just DNA.
For instance, taking in video evidence of a crime, just to implicate yourself or others in a lessor crime.
Im all for the DNA being used against her, just worried of the implications that come with that.
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Maybe so, just speaking from my experience that one case, unrelated to another case typically cannot share evidence like that.
We had to apply for a search warrant.
She did not give the sample by consent for the burglary case.
Of course. it's Cali, the constitution and bill of rights don't apply.
I think here in VT, it would also be 'protected' from search. But not sure that is true in all states.
The thing is that in the burglary case, she probably left the DNA in commission of a crime. In other words, it's 'abandoned.' Like trash at roadside. Which is open to be used as evidence when discarded. We had a case here using 'discarded' cigarette butts that solved a years-old murder case.
But the sample given with the 'rape kit' was voluntary. So she gave it freely as part of the proscecution of a different perp. And then her DNA is in "Plain sight" as a result.
I am not saying what is or isn't legally 'right.' That will take court cases to decide.
As I said... there will be 'decades' of legal precedents set off this stuff. So I have no idea what is right/wrong. But real legal beagels will decide. For right or wrong. But in the interim... don't assume that you can't be busted.
Heck, a flake of dandruf on a crime scene... and your second cousin who wants to know if he is related to Sitting Bull... could put you in jeopardy.
Good, bad, indifferent. Well, it will be CourtTV worth watching.
Sirhr
Sadly by then OGAs will have their lists and databases. Just like the chicken pox virus that info will by stored somewhere to give you the shingles when you least need/want/expect it.
How did this play out?
Around here, when you report a burglary the police come by when they feel like it, ask you what was stolen and its approximate value, then tell you “we’ll let you know if we find anything, but the odds of you getting your shit back is on par with your chances of landing a threesome with Blake Lively and Margot Robbie”
Nobody’s dusting for prints, never mind taking DNA samples.
Plus, this is Cali anyway. Don’t they politely suggest that you stop stealing and then set you free, anyway?
None of this adds up. She must have been at the capital on 1/6 or something.
Around here, when you report a burglary the police come by when they feel like it, ask you what was stolen and its approximate value, then tell you “we’ll let you know if we find anything, but the odds of you getting your shit back is on par with your chances of landing a threesome with Blake Lively and Margot Robbie”
Nobody’s dusting for prints, never mind taking DNA samples.
Plus, this is Cali anyway. Don’t they politely suggest that you stop stealing and then set you free, anyway?
None of this adds up. She must have been at the capital on 1/6 or something.
I would never send my DNA to one of these private genealogy websites. I don't get the fucking fascination with it. Millions of people sending their genetic code to a private company that you know will sell that information at a profit or it will be stolen. Yeah, I know they have privacy protocols. So do the credit bureaus and the countless companies that are hacked every year. Plus I'm not cool with the fact that apparently law enforcement can just poke around and help themselves to the data from these sites. Fuck that, I value my privacy too much. And I don't care enough to find out who my ancestors were 100+ years ago to risk it.
IIRC the court ruled that inadmissible evidence can be used to single out a suspect. They would need other evidence to bring charges.
So as @sirhrmechanic stated. They could set up surveillance and follow the person and collect DNA from something discarded (cigarettes, drinks, trash) or get phone tracking that places them at the scene or some other detective work to use in court. But the original is tainted and can't be used to convict.
I may be wrong but as I said. If I remember correctly.
So as @sirhrmechanic stated. They could set up surveillance and follow the person and collect DNA from something discarded (cigarettes, drinks, trash) or get phone tracking that places them at the scene or some other detective work to use in court. But the original is tainted and can't be used to convict.
I may be wrong but as I said. If I remember correctly.
^^^ I think it depends on the state and not sure what the fed regs are.
Some states have very high bars (VT being one of them). Others it's game on.
Not sure anyone really knows what the legalities are... at least when it comes to admissability or use in convictions. That's why it's a huge legal grey area that one probably does not want to get caught up in.
As I said... it will be CourtTV worth watching.
Sirhr
You guys are hilarious. Warrant this. Inadmissible that. Supreme court decision. Wake up already and understand you live in a surveillance state run by the most digusting examples of human beings who give orders that are carried out by statists that live all around you. Worst of all, you either fund the whole damn thing or they imprison or kill you. It’s really this simple.
They dropped the case already.
Anyways,
You have fingerprint/photographs, social security number, it's only a matter of time before a national DNA database is instituted.
Plus you have commercial genealogy websites. Police can access them and then look for DNA hits that point to relatives of the perpetrator to narrow it down.
Anyways,
You have fingerprint/photographs, social security number, it's only a matter of time before a national DNA database is instituted.
Plus you have commercial genealogy websites. Police can access them and then look for DNA hits that point to relatives of the perpetrator to narrow it down.
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