Garmin Xero C1 Pro chronograph

[JAS-SH]

How is everyone’s battery life? I feel like I am having to recharge it every other range outing. I expected much better.

I can do two 4 hour sessions with my Garmin before recharging, but those are bolt action sessions and include 10-minute cease fires every half hour or so. That is pushing the battery limit though. For a radar the size smaller than a cigarette pack that is amazing, The battery must be very small.

The caveat comes with semi autos - ARs. I fire my AR much faster than my bolt gun. The unit has to turn the radar on much more often and although I have not seen huge battery drain differences I'm sure more frequent firing has to have an effect on battery life.

 

[G1Grandeur]

sure they could have used higher capacity batteries, but then price increases as well.

 

[ocabj]

I charge maybe every 6-8 range sessions, but I don't leave my Garmin on in radar mode for long periods of time. I will shoot a string and end the string, or I pause the string if I'm idling about.

 

[Shoots 700's]

I just charge before going to the range

 

[Conqueror]

The caveat comes with semi autos - ARs. I fire my AR much faster than my bolt gun. The unit has to turn the radar on much more often and although I have not seen huge battery drain differences I'm sure more frequent firing has to have an effect on battery life.

To the best of my knowledge the Xero does not turn off the radar between shots, it’s always on, that’s why it doesn’t need a microphone or recoil trigger to know when you’ve fired. Any change in battery life with a semi-auto would just be from it having to compute velocities more frequently, and presumably that is far less power-hungry than the radar system.

 

[carbonbased]

Pro tip: Never charge a rechargeable battery when it’s cold. Seriously degrades them (including those in tools like Milwaukee etc).

Let them warm up to room temp. (Edit: at least above freezing)

 

[chevy_man]

sure they could have used higher capacity batteries, but then price increases as well.

It's as big as the size allows. If they put a massive battery in it everyone would complain about how big it is.

I plug mine into the truck since I already have 8 USB cords in there. I just hit it anytime it is getting low, and it easily lasts all day.

 

[G1Grandeur]

I know, I was referring to post above me.

Can't wait to get mine shipped out.

 

[Holliday]

Pro tip: Never charge a rechargeable battery when it’s cold. Seriously degrades them (including those in tools like Milwaukee etc).

Let them warm up to room temp.

I like to let them cooldown after use before charging too. Not sure if it matters but it seems like a good idea. I did not know about the cold.

 

[Baron23]

sure they could have used higher capacity batteries, but then price increases as well.

Weight and size more likely. Batteries aren’t that much, are they?

 

[Baron23]

To the best of my knowledge the Xero does not turn off the radar between shots, it’s always on, that’s why it doesn’t need a microphone or recoil trigger to know when you’ve fired. Any change in battery life with a semi-auto would just be from it having to compute velocities more frequently, and presumably that is far less power-hungry than the radar system.

I agree. Good points.

 

[carbonbased]

I like to let them cooldown after use before charging too. Not sure if it matters but it seems like a good idea. I did not know about the cold.

Yeah. I murdered a new Ryobi battery in one year by leaving it plugged in over the winter in MN.

The rechargeables tend to be able to withstand sitting in the cold, but as mentioned, charging in the cold (under 32°F) is tough on them. I think you’re right about the heat too, like charging them in a hot truck during AZ summer (but don’t quote me).

As far as 18650 rechargeables for thermals and headlamps etc, I have read that just using them in sub-32°F is hard on them too. Not sure about other rechargeables…but that’s not going to stop me from simply using them in the cold.

Obviously batteries are ultimately disposable, but I try not to hasten their eventual demise by cold-charging.

 

[TheOE800]

Yeah. I murdered a new Ryobi battery in one year by leaving it plugged in over the winter in MN.

The rechargeables tend to be able to withstand sitting in the cold, but as mentioned, charging in the cold (under 32°F) is tough on them. I think you’re right about the heat too, like charging them in a hot truck during AZ summer (but don’t quote me).

As far as 18650 rechargeables for thermals and headlamps etc, I have read that just using them in sub-32°F is hard on them too. Not sure about other rechargeables…but that’s not going to stop me from simply using them in the cold.

Obviously batteries are ultimately disposable, but I try not to hasten their eventual demise by cold-charging.

This reminds me of my rage against 12Ah Milwaukee M18 packs that died just outside the warranty. Fucking hosers.

 

[Steel+Killer]

My magneto is still on the same 9v for several years now.

Thats because every time you went to use it you were like "fuck it it's not worth the hassle".

 

[D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷]

Thats because every time you went to use it you were like "fuck it it's not worth the hassle".

This whole time I thought I was because no one here ever goes shooting. Lol

 

[carbonbased]

This reminds me of my rage against 12Ah Milwaukee M18 packs that died just outside the warranty. Fucking hosers.

Don’t know if cold-charging was involved, but I forgot to mention that I take all of my chargers inside for winter charging.

 

[TheOE800]

Don’t know if cold-charging was involved, but I forgot to mention that I take all of my chargers inside for winter charging.

It wasn’t they’re just shit.

 

[JAS-SH]

Don’t know if c
Attach files
old-charging was involved, but I forgot to mention that I take all of my chargers inside for winter charging.

I use my Makita

It wasn’t they’re just shit.

I use a Makita 3-amp, 18-volt cordless 2 maybe 3 times a month and I can't remember how long it's been since I charged batteries. It' incredible at holding a charge. The box lives in the garage which unlike further north it only sees winter temperatures in the mid to high 40-50's every year. Just yesterday I took down the flourecents (pain in the ass changing tubes) an installed all new ELD ceiling lights in the garage. Brightest damn room in the house now! Used same battery I've been using since July.

Best cordless drill I've ever used. I've never had to buy a new battery in over 8-years. Buy once cry once.

Pic:

 

[Garmin]

To the best of my knowledge the Xero does not turn off the radar between shots, it’s always on, that’s why it doesn’t need a microphone or recoil trigger to know when you’ve fired. Any change in battery life with a semi-auto would just be from it having to compute velocities more frequently, and presumably that is far less power-hungry than the radar system.

The radar DOES turn off if you're not in an active session. If you start a session and let it run all day that would be worst case battery life. If you shoot and then end or pause the session until you need it again it will greatly extend the battery life.

 

[SupressYourself]

I saw a few references in this thread about use at indoor ranges, mostly short pistol ranges. What is the likelihood it would work well at a 100 yard indoor rifle range where the walls, ceiling, and floor are concrete, and you may have another shooter within 5 or 6 feet on each side of you?

 

[Inline6]

I saw a few references in this thread about use at indoor ranges, mostly short pistol ranges. What is the likelihood it would work well at a 100 yard indoor rifle range where the walls, ceiling, and floor are concrete, and you may have another shooter within 5 or 6 feet on each side of you?

View attachment 8572814
View attachment 8572815

Should work just fine, at matches with people on both sides of me. It only reads my shots.

 

[SupressYourself]

Should work just fine, at matches with people on both sides of me. It only reads my shots.

I'm not so much concerned about it reading neighbors shots as not reading at all, due to reflection off of concrete walls, ceiling, etc.

 

[Inline6]

I'm not so much concerned about it reading neighbors shots as not reading at all, due to reflection off of concrete walls, ceiling, etc.

As long as you are clear for 20-30 yards in front of you. Should be good to go.

 

[Conqueror]

The radar DOES turn off if you're not in an active session. If you start a session and let it run all day that would be worst case battery life. If you shoot and then end or pause the session until you need it again it will greatly extend the battery life.

Yeah I did not mean the radar is on at ALL times, I thought that was obvious. I was just correcting the previous poster who said the radar turned off after every shot in a string.

 

[1911Shootist]

I'm not so much concerned about it reading neighbors shots as not reading at all, due to reflection off of concrete walls, ceiling, etc.

Mine works fine shooting through ~5’ diameter concrete culverts that are ~20’ long. I’d expect it to work great at that indoor range.

 

[Andielouroo]

https://a.co/d/aeT0TM5

 

[G1Grandeur]

quick question, is it normal that when I plug charging cable, it automatically turns on?

 

[Guns&WhiteWater]

Another quick question… does anybody else's Xero create duplicates of a shot series when it downloads to your phone? Mine has had up to 7 duplicates with one duplicate being the norm.

 

[opeagle]

I have never had that issue.

 

[straightshooter1]

quick question, is it normal that when I plug charging cable, it automatically turns on?

Yes, but only when the cable is plugged into a power source.

 

[G1Grandeur]

Yes, but only with the cable is plugged into a power source.

thanks.

I don't know why they set it up like that, that's odd.

 

[straightshooter1]

Another quick question… does anybody else's Xero create duplicates of a shot series when it downloads to your phone? Mine has had up to 7 duplicates with one duplicate being the norm.

No. When the Zero finishes connecting to my phone, it downloads each undownloaded series with no duplicates.

 

[Guns&WhiteWater]

No. When the Zero finishes connecting to my phone, it downloads each undownloaded series with no duplicates.

This only started happening recently. Just a minor inconvenience to have to delete a dozen or so duplicates every now and then, so no complaints here.

 

[straightshooter1]

This only started happening recently. Just a minor inconvenience to have to delete a dozen or so duplicates every now and then, so no complaints here.

Have you tried a factory reset?

1. Turn off the chronograph
2. Press and hold OK and XeroC1DownArrow
3. Press PWR to turn on the device
4. Release OK when the Xero logo appears
5. Continue to hold XeroC1DownArrow until the device starts

 

[Guns&WhiteWater]

Have you tried a factory reset?

1. Turn off the chronograph
2. Press and hold OK and XeroC1DownArrow
3. Press PWR to turn on the device
4. Release OK when the Xero logo appears
5. Continue to hold XeroC1DownArrow until the device starts

I have not, but thank you for that information. I will definitely try it.

 

[G1Grandeur]

and I am assuming firmware is up to date?

 

[Ichi]

Received emails today from Area 419, Brownells and MK Machining. All have the Xero C1 on sale for $549.99. A google search shows that almost everyone is selling at $549.99 now.

I wonder if this is because the Athlon Rangecraft is about to hit the streets. Or perhaps they're trying to dump inventory before a new release...

 

[Soulezoo]

Received emails today from Area 419, Brownells and MK Machining. All have the Xero C1 on sale for $549.99. A google search shows that almost everyone is selling at $549.99 now.

I wonder if this is because the Athlon Rangecraft is about to hit the streets. Or perhaps they're trying to dump inventory before a new release...

That's a very good question.

 

[USP45]

They will have to lower the price even more when the Athlon comes out unless it has issues. Good for the consumer (unless like all of us here, you already bought one), and not so good for Garmin.

 

[NiteQwill]

Garmin has a market cap of $47 billion. I seriously doubt they will care.

 

[BigJimFish]

Put my review of the Garmin Chrono up today after a year of use. It's been a lifesaver I never would have gotten some of the data I ended up needing on the 350L without it and I am certain I would not have gone down some of the investigative paths that have been fruitful without that data. It is really nice having a chrono that is easy and reliable even if I don't love some of their design decisions.

 

[LRCampos]

I searched but could not find the answer...

What is the distance the Garmin Xero C1 measures a rifle bullet from the muzzle of the barrel?

Many ballistic solvers ask this question about how far awar the velocity was measured from the muzzle. Any idea?

 

[DocUSMCRetired]

Great question. I wonder if @DocUSMCRetired would know.

This would be a question better answered by Garmin.

 

[javemtr]

Just for comparison: the manual for the new AndiScan A3 states:
"The device measures a true V0 velocity with the measurement window roughly from 0 to 2 meters downrange from the muzzle"

 

[DocUSMCRetired]

Just for comparison: the manual for the new AndiScan A3 states:
"The device measures a true V0 velocity with the measurement window roughly from 0 to 2 meters downrange from the muzzle"

That's not a true V0. https://appliedballisticsllc.com/wp...city-Decay-between-Muzzle-and-Chronograph.pdf

At 2 meters you could lose as much as 11 fps or as little as 2 fps. Also, I won't share how we do it, but RADAR Position offset is important to understand and calculate for.

 

[ToddM]

Hard to say how many measurements and what calc/averaging they are doing to back out muzzle velocity, but Garmin states that their unit needs ~20 yards for faster projectiles and ~7 yards for slower stuff like arrows. I'd be willing to bet they are doing calculations to try and back out true muzzle velocity.

https://support.garmin.com/en-US/?faq=lUHEZtJsvn0WleviVnMnT7#:~:text=The%20Xero%C2%AE%20C1%20Pro,example%20an%20indoor%20archery%20range.

I'd have to assume they are doing something with multiple measurements over that distance to back calculate estimated muzzle velocity. Otherwise if it was velocity at say 15-20m we'd be seeing way larger deltas compared to Labradar/Magnetospeed etc. Just using a random 308 ballistic calc you could easily see 40+ fps drop off at 20m. My guess is they can probably take quite a few extremely accurate time/distance measurements by 20m and back out a speed curve. A radar at the end of the day is just measuring extremely accurate distances at time intervals.

 

[Buford Boone]

Best I can tell, the Garmins do as good a job of measuring muzzle velocity as most anything. I believe they interpolate a MV from measuring in front of the muzzle because they can't measure right at the muzzle.

To investigate, I ran a 20 round test on an Oehler 35P with a 9' spacing. That gives velocity at the middle screen. I sandwiched the middle screen with a couple of Garmins.

I put the setup and data below.

I don't trust any chronograph for better than about .1% - 3 fps on a 3,000 fps shot. I think even that is optimistic. That is my one gripe with the Garmin, it reports to the 1/10 of a fps. I don't think it is that accurate so why not have the option to round to the nearest whole fps?

So, one could argue the point is "if the Garmin measures at it's location and they tell you to place it 5" - 15" behind the muzzle, how much velocity would be lost in that distance from the muzzle?

Personally, I don't think it matters.

 

[Terry Cross]

With the 35P being the gold standard for accuracy, it is amazing that the Garmin is generating statistically the same number. Also something to be said for consistency of data output by Garmin when two units generate the same numbers.
Very cool test/comparison.

 

[Holliday]

I don't trust any chronograph for better than about .1% - 3 fps on a 3,000 fps shot. I think even that is optimistic. That is my one gripe with the Garmin, it reports to the 1/10 of a fps. I don't think it is that accurate so why not have the option to round to the nearest whole fps?

I could not agree more.

Awesome testing. Well done!

Would like to have seen this same test but with one Garmins back at the specified location by the rifle, to see what the differential is.

 

[LRCampos]

Best I can tell, the Garmins do as good a job of measuring muzzle velocity as most anything. I believe they interpolate a MV from measuring in front of the muzzle because they can't measure right at the muzzle.

To investigate, I ran a 20 round test on an Oehler 35P with a 9' spacing. That gives velocity at the middle screen. I sandwiched the middle screen with a couple of Garmins.

I put the setup and data below.

I don't trust any chronograph for better than about .1% - 3 fps on a 3,000 fps shot. I think even that is optimistic. That is my one gripe with the Garmin, it reports to the 1/10 of a fps. I don't think it is that accurate so why not have the option to round to the nearest whole fps?

So, one could argue the point is "if the Garmin measures at it's location and they tell you to place it 5" - 15" behind the muzzle, how much velocity would be lost in that distance from the muzzle?

Personally, I don't think it matters.


View attachment 8631634


View attachment 8631635

Nice test!
What was the distance the Oehler Cronograph was from the muzzle?
It is dificult to say from the picture, but it seems like around 6 feet (2 meters)?