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George Floyd's Autopsy Report
- Thread starter Rlandry
- Start date
It basically says he had a bunch of scrapes and superficial damage, but no actual trauma. He died of severe heart disease, coupled with severe high blood pressure, coupled with Sickle Cell Anemia.
He was high on Fentanyl, Norfentanyl, Methamphetamine, and had THC in his system.
These alone could have easily killed him. Couple all that with wrestling with the cops for ten minutes, and he dead.
Unfortunately it does not change the fact he was pleading he couldn't breath for ten minutes and the cop stayed on-top of him. I get he was winded from fighting the huge Floyd, but once the cuffs were on he needed to get off and render aid. Not "murder", but still negligent homicide and dereliction of duty to render aid.
I will say that everyone who said he was being choked or that his neck was being damaged are proven wrong by this autopsy.
He was high on Fentanyl, Norfentanyl, Methamphetamine, and had THC in his system.
These alone could have easily killed him. Couple all that with wrestling with the cops for ten minutes, and he dead.
Unfortunately it does not change the fact he was pleading he couldn't breath for ten minutes and the cop stayed on-top of him. I get he was winded from fighting the huge Floyd, but once the cuffs were on he needed to get off and render aid. Not "murder", but still negligent homicide and dereliction of duty to render aid.
I will say that everyone who said he was being choked or that his neck was being damaged are proven wrong by this autopsy.
........and all of it will fall on deaf ears. They don’t care a single bit about GF, his demise is nothing more than a very weak excuse to act like animals.
@Fig - I dont disagree.
I do remember from the body cam videos they did call for EMS 2x.
And while not a cop, having been in many a wrasslin match where my safety was on the line with folks on meth, its not always so cut and dry.
By easing restraint on their body, the high person often becomeS crazy and violent again.
Coupled with a couple of the cops on scene being brand new and not having a clue, perhaps the officer wasnt comfortable they could control him if he went ballistic again.
And yes, a prone and cuffed strong person on meth can inflict major damage to people.
Im not saying it was all right, just seeing the other side with some experience of what its like.
I do remember from the body cam videos they did call for EMS 2x.
And while not a cop, having been in many a wrasslin match where my safety was on the line with folks on meth, its not always so cut and dry.
By easing restraint on their body, the high person often becomeS crazy and violent again.
Coupled with a couple of the cops on scene being brand new and not having a clue, perhaps the officer wasnt comfortable they could control him if he went ballistic again.
And yes, a prone and cuffed strong person on meth can inflict major damage to people.
Im not saying it was all right, just seeing the other side with some experience of what its like.
Cop power-tripped, screwed up, and now his life is toast. No excuses. Good riddance.
Unfortunately, we’re all paying the price for his abuse of power and now it’s open-season on cops who use necessary force.
Good cops are a necessary component of a civil society. If they’d police and purge their own ranks, we wouldn’t be in this mess.
Unfortunately, we’re all paying the price for his abuse of power and now it’s open-season on cops who use necessary force.
Good cops are a necessary component of a civil society. If they’d police and purge their own ranks, we wouldn’t be in this mess.
I remember taking Cornell crisis intervention, and gurney and restraints. The instructor told the three girls in the class. Using these techniques properly you three can subdue and restrain the biggest strongest person in here. Being he looked at me when he said that, I laughed. He said he would prove it. Well after the three of them failed to get me off me feet, with me only providing passive resistance.{I.E I held my arms out so they could try to drag me to the floor, while trying to stay upright}
He said once they had me on the floor. My goose would be cooked. So, I laid on the floor. Let them all get their holds in and brace for the rodeo. Nope, tossed them all about 10 times before he grabbed a couple men. They couldn't last an 8 second bull ride either.
Most of the women in that class took it as a valuable lesson. Your training does not make you Rambo. The laws of nature still apply. One I still saw get rolled trying to do a one person physical management, on a kid i would have only tried to do single person management on in an emergency. {I.E to stop an assault or self harm} And she didn't even do it right. She was lucky he threw her down instead of punching her into next week. There were many kids that would not have missed that opportunity because she was a stupid bitch. there were a few that would have just because she was "staff."
Now take a Violent felon, 6’5”, hopped up on the meth.
Derek Chauvin doesnt look like a big dude to me.
Anyways, Im not saying right or wrong. Just that there is another view to see it from.
I will ask @TheHorta and @Fig if they have ever went a round with a big homie on meth?
Just because it gives a different perspective.
and I dont believe for one darn second we are suffering because of this. We are suffering because spoiled entitled brats want more crap for free and are willing to become terrorists to try to make it happen.
its happening because it is fueled by those with billions who want to destroy this republic.
if it wasnt george floyd, it would be something else. Or nothing.
remember the riots over the giant kid who just robbed a store and tried to take a cops gun while the cop was in his car? I know @Fig does as it was in his AO.
no reason, except an excuse to act like the POS’s they are.
“they” refers to anyone who participates in a riot/looting/etc.
not their race. Lots of pale faces in these riots. Like the 3 shot in the Kenosha Hat Trick.
Derek Chauvin doesnt look like a big dude to me.
Anyways, Im not saying right or wrong. Just that there is another view to see it from.
I will ask @TheHorta and @Fig if they have ever went a round with a big homie on meth?
Just because it gives a different perspective.
and I dont believe for one darn second we are suffering because of this. We are suffering because spoiled entitled brats want more crap for free and are willing to become terrorists to try to make it happen.
its happening because it is fueled by those with billions who want to destroy this republic.
if it wasnt george floyd, it would be something else. Or nothing.
remember the riots over the giant kid who just robbed a store and tried to take a cops gun while the cop was in his car? I know @Fig does as it was in his AO.
no reason, except an excuse to act like the POS’s they are.
“they” refers to anyone who participates in a riot/looting/etc.
not their race. Lots of pale faces in these riots. Like the 3 shot in the Kenosha Hat Trick.
Saw a screen shot of a police training slide for that department where they train that officers exact positioning for someone having drug induced psychosis......
This will get ugly in a court of law.
People know it. People know more innocent will die. The false narrative will be pushed because its not about police reform.
This will get ugly in a court of law.
People know it. People know more innocent will die. The false narrative will be pushed because its not about police reform.
Part of the problem is that "defund" does the exact opposite of what's needed to fix many policing problems. It doesn't let you hire better officers through a more stringent process, it doesn't let you hire more officers to reduce stress within the department and it doesn't let you increase training to help prevent errors.
There's been a lot of bad shoot videos up in the last few years. If you actually watch them in most cases it's not really malice involved. You can see where the officers fucked up tactically and then they shot someone when time became too compressed for them to do anything about it.
I think a lot of people are ignorant about how restrained most LEOs act. If they went by legal authority there'd be a lot of people with bullets floating around in protest land. Any of those people with lasers causing permanent blindness (maiming people) or throwing objects/fireworks could theoretically have lethal force applied based on many if not most department's force policies. At the very least the cops would be well in their authority to dispense a severe ass beating. Here's the CPD's force protocol. It's something worth examination when you're looking at one of these incidents.
Seems like cases where they intentionally with hold much of the video, and create their own narrative, might start getting them sued by more of the victims of their truth bending. When you settle out of court is there a precedence set?
I think defamation reform would be an interesting thing and may be required at a point considering how many "creatively cut" videos are out there to make an image seem a certain way.
I read somewhere else that he had lethal doses of drugs in his system, which I tend to believe because it's not unheard of for perps to down their drugs before interacting with the police and then self induce vomitting after the event is over. They do it to not get caught with them on their person.
Fentanyl 11 ng/mL seems like a fucking lot of fentanyl, not that I'm a doctor or anything but I understand nanograms per millilitre of blood.
Methamphetamine 19 ng/mL also seems like a fucking lot of meth, again not a doctor though.
I did find this though:
"Overdose results in respiratory depression which is reversible with naloxone. Sudden death can also occur because of cardiac arrest or severe anaphylactic reaction. The estimated lethal dose of fentanyl in humans is 2 mg. The recommended serum concentration for analgesia is 1–2 ng/ml and for anaesthesia it is 10–20 ng/ml. Blood concentrations of approximately 7 ng/ml or greater have been associated with fatalities where poly-substance use was involved. While fatalities have been reported after therapeutic use, many deaths have occurred as a result of the misuse of pharmaceutical products. Both used and unused fentanyl patches have been injected, smoked, snorted or taken orally with fatal consequences."
www.emcdda.europa.eu
Fentanyl 11 ng/mL seems like a fucking lot of fentanyl, not that I'm a doctor or anything but I understand nanograms per millilitre of blood.
Methamphetamine 19 ng/mL also seems like a fucking lot of meth, again not a doctor though.
I did find this though:
"Overdose results in respiratory depression which is reversible with naloxone. Sudden death can also occur because of cardiac arrest or severe anaphylactic reaction. The estimated lethal dose of fentanyl in humans is 2 mg. The recommended serum concentration for analgesia is 1–2 ng/ml and for anaesthesia it is 10–20 ng/ml. Blood concentrations of approximately 7 ng/ml or greater have been associated with fatalities where poly-substance use was involved. While fatalities have been reported after therapeutic use, many deaths have occurred as a result of the misuse of pharmaceutical products. Both used and unused fentanyl patches have been injected, smoked, snorted or taken orally with fatal consequences."
Fentanyl drug profile | www.euda.europa.eu
Fentanyl drug profile Chemistry Physical form Pharmacology Non-pharmaceutical fentanyls Synthesis Mode of use Other names Analysis
He had 3x a lethal dose of fent.
It is routine in an ER to give 50-100 mcg IV push for severe pain.
These patients are on oxygen, on a pulse oximeter, and a cardiac monitor.
monitored by experienced RNs, Paramedics, and EMTs. For each patient, an RN knows what was up and was responsible.
(the above is my experience in a badass level 1 trauma center, may vary by place)
Also, fentanyl has a VERY short half life. So if he had that much in system by the blood drawn (who knows exactly when), what was it before???
facts about the science of fentanyl arent really debatable.
his dose tolerance is, but is Pure speculation.
It is routine in an ER to give 50-100 mcg IV push for severe pain.
These patients are on oxygen, on a pulse oximeter, and a cardiac monitor.
monitored by experienced RNs, Paramedics, and EMTs. For each patient, an RN knows what was up and was responsible.
(the above is my experience in a badass level 1 trauma center, may vary by place)
Also, fentanyl has a VERY short half life. So if he had that much in system by the blood drawn (who knows exactly when), what was it before???
facts about the science of fentanyl arent really debatable.
his dose tolerance is, but is Pure speculation.
So what I'm hearing is he died of covid
Edit: i said that as a joke but turned out he actually tested positive.
Edit: i said that as a joke but turned out he actually tested positive.
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When we trained K9 SOP with depts from all over the country, we always stressed the the handlers. If cuffs aren't on the perp, the dog stays on the grip. Let that mf'r eat. As soon as cuffs are on, dog and hands come off. Im as sure as i am sitting here, Floyd had everything under the sun in his system and probably enough to kill a horse, but I still have a hard time believing that if Floyd was on the ground, and 1 officers had a foot on his rear end/small of his back, Floyd wouldn't have been able to get up, but would also be alive. Maybe dead later in the day from OD but that wouldn't be the cops fault. Bottom line is, "cuffs on, hands off."
He might be alive. no way to tell. By not having the knee othough, it removes all doubt as to what killed him.
Im of the thought he would still have went into respiratory failure and cardiac arrest prior to EMS arrival. And I could be wrong.
its all just an educated guess at this point.
I think this is where the lawyers yell “conjecture” or something.....
Im of the thought he would still have went into respiratory failure and cardiac arrest prior to EMS arrival. And I could be wrong.
its all just an educated guess at this point.
I think this is where the lawyers yell “conjecture” or something.....
I read somewhere else that he had lethal doses of drugs in his system, which I tend to believe because it's not unheard of for perps to down their drugs before interacting with the police and then self induce vomitting after the event is over. They do it to not get caught with them on their person.
Fentanyl 11 ng/mL seems like a fucking lot of fentanyl, not that I'm a doctor or anything but I understand nanograms per millilitre of blood.
Methamphetamine 19 ng/mL also seems like a fucking lot of meth, again not a doctor though.
I did find this though:
"Overdose results in respiratory depression which is reversible with naloxone. Sudden death can also occur because of cardiac arrest or severe anaphylactic reaction. The estimated lethal dose of fentanyl in humans is 2 mg. The recommended serum concentration for analgesia is 1–2 ng/ml and for anaesthesia it is 10–20 ng/ml. Blood concentrations of approximately 7 ng/ml or greater have been associated with fatalities where poly-substance use was involved. While fatalities have been reported after therapeutic use, many deaths have occurred as a result of the misuse of pharmaceutical products. Both used and unused fentanyl patches have been injected, smoked, snorted or taken orally with fatal consequences."
Fentanyl drug profile | www.euda.europa.eu
Fentanyl drug profile Chemistry Physical form Pharmacology Non-pharmaceutical fentanyls Synthesis Mode of use Other names Analysis
Watch the bodycam video. He has the drugs in his mouth when they approach him.
The party of science will never state these facts with any sense of authority. Much like the Michael Brown scenario.
That is a modern take on John Belushi's death. Fentanyl speed balls
Two wrongs got us here. First was Floyd. Second was the cop. Bpth fucked up. If Floyd had not passed the bad check, no police would have been needed. And if the cop wasn't a power tripping asshat, Floyd would likely still have died, but not the way he was filmed.
I will say that Floyd and this officer may have been wrong about their actions but this whole thing was a madlib. Throw a few names in the blanks, generate outrage via demogougery and profit/repeat.
These are the same people who stand on the graves of children to push gun control. Keep that in mind.
These are the same people who stand on the graves of children to push gun control. Keep that in mind.
Just curious and not trying to start conflict, I have a question. Did you watch the bodycam video? I don't know anyone that watches it and still has that viewpoint. You can see GF is already wacked out when they approach, says he can't breathe from the beginning, and asks to be put on the ground.
When watching from police POV, I'm not seeing anything done wrong. Just a suggestion but it would be wise to watch it to understand why Chauvin won't get convicted because that is likely the outcome and there will be another round of chaos.
Chauvin had a history with Floyd. It is reported they had recently got into it when Floyd worked at a nightclub and Chauvin was police security at said club and Floyd was fired over it. A smart police officer would have let another officer take lead. Fuzzy memory but IIRC Chauvin even recognized Floyd and seemed to be enjoying arresting him.
I have as of yet to see the whole video. What ultimately interests me is if they could have narcaned him had they been paying attention and he would have come back? That could be a key determinant of a negligent homicide/manslaughter charge sticking.
I ain’t a medical expert but I’ve seen 5 opioid OD’s up close and personal. In 2 instances no 911 was even needed due to me bringing em back myself with mouth to mouth and keeping them awake thereafter.
What happened to Floyd, I’m quite confident, was not OD-induced respiratory depression. If you’re conscious, you can always force yourself to breathe. It’s only when the person nods out/goes unconscious that the respiratory depression comes into play and kills them...at least in my experience.
I suppose other health conditions can change things...looks to me like Floyd worked himself up into a heart attack.
Just because he had fent in his system don’t mean he OD’d. Back when the patches were popular, I knew a dude that had to wear 3 100mcg patches at a time just to not be sick. And had to put on 5-6 to feel anything approaching a buzz. Tolerance exists, it’s a huge factor and from what I’ve seen doesn’t really have a limit to how high it can go if you keep your foot on the pedal. Although there is a phenomenon known as receptor internalization? But you’d have to be IV’ing grams of carfentanyl to see the results of receptor internalization most likely.
From a doctor of nurse anesthesia who watched the bodycam footage of the GF arrest: there's a point early in the video where Floyd turns his head and seems to place something in his mouth. I.e he had fentynal on him and didn't want to be caught with it so he ingested it. Right after, he turns back towards the bodycam and it can be seen on his tongue. 2 milligrams of fentynal on his tongue! The most a patient in surgery is given is 200 MICROgrams. 2 milligrams of fentynal is about a 1000x the lethal dose? George Floyd killed himself. Chauvin just got the blame for it.
2 mg wont even stop withdrawals from occurring in some people. Ive known or talked to some of these people. Nobody knows what Floyd's tolerance was except Floyd himself. And you might be surprised how high tolerance can go. Knew of a guy who fraudulently made his own company, and then ordered beta-hydroxy-4-methyl fentanyl(4-methyl not 3-methyl, it hadnt been made before) from a chemical supply company. Even gave it his own name. He got up to doing 20mg/day of the stuff before getting busted... said the w/d's were like a horrendous constant bath of electrified icy hot LOL.
If youre conscious you can always force yourself to breathe. Like I said other med conditions could change things. Or having a dude sit on your neck. But Floyds death didnt look anything like a opioid OD and ive seen several. The respiraotry depression from opioids dont become a problem until the person nods out/goes unconscious. Potentially a very very big problem when alcohol or benzos is in their system(those cant be brought back from mouth to mouth IME).
I think the blood pressure was a big factor. Dude looked like he worked himself into a damn heart attack. Opioid OD deaths are peaceful in comparison, probably one of the better ways to go honestly...
Read this and learn something...
www.lawofficer.com
The Big Lie: The Acquittal Of Chauvin, Lane, Kueng & Thao
"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie
www.lawofficer.com
It was reported they did both work as security at some club and its assumed they knew each other.
Looks like they did know each other and butted heads. A professional would have asked one of the other three officers to take point and arrest the guy.
www.revolt.tv
George Floyd and Derek Chauvin knew each other and “bumped heads,” reveals former colleague
A former colleague of theirs breaks his silence and reveals Derek Chauvin and George Floyd not only knew each other, but did not get along.
www.revolt.tv
The total results of my comments are that I think “justice” would be a counseling chit ought be stuck in Chauvin’s jacket, and send him back out on the job. Murder charges are outrageous, and civil unrest needs to be hammered with lethal force or we will get more of it.
A professional would not need to do what you suggest is the correct course of action because he would have acted professionally with someone he had history with.Looks like they did know each other and butted heads. A professional would have asked one of the other three officers to take point and arrest the guy.
George Floyd and Derek Chauvin knew each other and “bumped heads,” reveals former colleague
A former colleague of theirs breaks his silence and reveals Derek Chauvin and George Floyd not only knew each other, but did not get along.
By the way, did you read the posted transcript of the encounter from beginning to end? You seem to have a hard-on for Derek Chauvin regardless of facts.
@Forgetful Coyote - anecdotal evidence of use of drugs on the street is a lot different that many years of difficult education, boards, and prior nursing experience required to be a CRNA.
also the purity of street fentanyl is always in question.
only a high end lab or a tox screen such as Floyds can really say how much fentanyl is in a guys system.
most tox screens ran just have a threshold and the person is pos or neg. costs a lot More to run the test to determine just how much was in a persons blood.
And dont forget, dude also did meth. Had it in him. So his state would not be the same as the average junky.
also the purity of street fentanyl is always in question.
only a high end lab or a tox screen such as Floyds can really say how much fentanyl is in a guys system.
most tox screens ran just have a threshold and the person is pos or neg. costs a lot More to run the test to determine just how much was in a persons blood.
And dont forget, dude also did meth. Had it in him. So his state would not be the same as the average junky.
I've worked in Law Enforcement for over 20 years and have a large network of cop friends. I have yet to find one that agreed with what this officer did. Completely against it. Did this officer wake up, decide to kill a human being that morning? I doubt it, but he kinda buddy fucked us all as did his fellow officers for sitting there doing nothing.
Thats kinda my point. Just because he had fentanyl in his system doesnt mean he OD'd. Even if it was “3x the lethal dose” determined mathematically from its therapeutic dosage, or extrapolated from tests on rats...not even counting that he likely had a decent tolerance. He likely was using it daily.
And if he ate it to destroy evidence, bioavailability of fent orally is quite low. Wouldn't have had as much effect as you might think. Fentanyl has quite the potency, but also a nice safe therapeutic index, hence its wide usage in medicine.
It could've played a factor, but I can tell you it wasn't opioid overdose induced death.
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unfortunately misleading reporting wins cause its reported First
I am going to sound like a dick, but how many opiate induced deaths have you been a part of?
Or watched the respiratory depression or respiratory arrest in person and did something about it?
You are a nice guy. I enjoy you on the forum.
Speaking with authority those of us that have done this hundreds or thousands of times will not because we know we dont know everything seems strange.
The least significant part of political will is history, true or false.
It's not the last thing that's important for them, it's the next thing.
The more disgusting and outrageous, the better.
Until they start suffering for the evil they do, it will all continue to escalate.
These days, we are the only ones who get to suffer from their insanity.
Time for change. Big change.
It's not the last thing that's important for them, it's the next thing.
The more disgusting and outrageous, the better.
Until they start suffering for the evil they do, it will all continue to escalate.
These days, we are the only ones who get to suffer from their insanity.
Time for change. Big change.
I think this was proven to be less than reliable information. The co-owner of the nightclub recanted his story about the two having a run-in.
Man who claimed George Floyd and Derek Chauvin "bumped heads" changes story
In interview with Jeff Pegues, a club worker talks about Floyd and Chauvin.
www.cbsnews.com
Did you read the full transcript or not?
Are you going to admit you were wrong when your angle didn't pan out?
Are you, or have you ever been, a police officer?
5 OD's. None died. Brought back 2 of them myself, personally... The 3 that I couldnt, had alcohol/benzos to go along with it.
May not be hundreds of thousands, but Ive literally watched the process in detail multiple times. Only once unconscious did the danger come.
My point is this: how many people have ever died from drug induced respiratory depression WHILE CONSCIOUS? How many folks have you seen that needed a ventilator due to drug induced respiratory depression WHILE CONSCIOUS? With no lung damage otherwise, or other physical impediment?
Its just a very hard path for me to believe. Opioid overdoses aint opioid overdoses if the person never goes unconscious. They would just be holding their breath. Unconsciousness is a necessary component. Followed by a more labored/shallower and shallower breathing, with more and more time between breaths.
This dude was squirming and wrestling until they put him out on the ground, and then pleading with the officer that he couldnt breathe.. almost as if his chest muscles were getting more and more tired from inhaling with all the weight on him?
Opioids dont make you delusional, or physically block you from inhaling air. If you're awake, you will breathe
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He said he couldn't breathe early on while sitting upright and asked to be put on the ground. The facts are easy to see on the bodycam video. That meth head was having serious issues way before he asked them to put him on the ground.
