Yes, because that is the entire premise of holding Gold. A tangible asset in times of need to convert to whatever currency wherever you are in the world. I once read an very plausible statement that said, "an ounce of gold or a Rolex is the most reliable transactional currency anywhere in the world"
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Along the same lines of converting oil to the petrodollar. In a matter of seconds that ship of crude is converted to fiat currency. Other countries have wised up to holding fiat currency. As the fiat currency of all nations loses purchasing power and security..... Look for that tanker of oil to be purchased with physical gold or currency backed by gold.
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The stablecoin giant Tether announced a service that lets users deposit a surplus of its existing gold-backed token, XAUT, in order to "mint" a new type of $1 stablecoin called a USDT. Got that? If not, you can watch a 40 second video the company posted on X that shows an A-for-Alloy symbol spinning around a bar of gold, a marble figure on a laptop, and an oily voice whose closing pitch is "Let's redefine the concept of stability together."
I guess "redefining stability together" is one way to put it. Another is to say "come along as Tether adds new layers of synthetic assets to its black box of an operation and hope for the best." I don't know about you, but this makes me nervous.
BRICS Gold-Backed Crypto Threatens U.S. Dollar: Is Bitcoin the Safe Haven?
BRICS Gold-Backed Crypto Threatens U.S. Dollar: Is Bitcoin the Safe Haven?
Per assessment, the US Dollar could face another decline when the BRICS capture the oil sector and settle trade in local currencies.
www.crypto-news-flash.com
While I do like my physical gold (jewelry), I do see a time in the not to distant future where digital currency becomes the standard. That’s when gold or silver will be useful for buying things under the radar.
I have tried to sell my wife's beautiful like new Omega style necklace 14k that she never wears(we're talking 30 years ago style which nobody likes apparently) A jewelry store and a local gold dealer won't even give me "melt" price on it pretty much chastising me and saying BS such as "melting costs money" "all gold has to be assayed" which is total BS. Now they have jewelry in the case that they want retail for, but mine is valued at under melt. Word to the wise, NEVER buy gold jewelry and expect to get gold value for it, because you won't..........
14k scrap value today is $41.02 per gram
24k is $72.76 per gram
Mostly true. Jewelry does have very high markups. The first buyer always pays the most very much like cars. Buy higher karat jewelry since the markup for more pure gold is similar or less than for 10k-14k.
14k scrap value today is $41.02 per gram
24k is $72.76 per gram
A buyer only interested in it for the metal will likely offer $35 or less per gram.
You’ll do better selling it on EBay or to a vintage jewelry store.
I use 3 Jewelers for my jewelry. 1 in India and 2 in Thailand. I pay less mark-up for higher karat gold at similar weights and designs. I don’t buy it as an investment. It’s a large amount of value I have on me at all times instead of shiny coins or bars sitting in a safe.
Nobody “Invests” in gold, well I’m sure some do but they have the wrong idea. People store money in gold.
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Purchased from without issue
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If you walk into some store to sell your gold they are going to treat you like pawn shop owners treat customers.
How bad can we rip you off.
It pays to buy your gold and silver from a trusted, honest local dealer that buys and sells and you have a good relationship with.
They of course have to be able to make a living and a profit and that is where the spread from buy to sell comes in.
They will probably give you a better price on the jewelry than anyone else.
If it's nice stuff, they would probably give you spot price (just understand 14K is way less valuable than 99.9999% gold coins) and sell it at a markup.
If it's junk jewelry, then well I mean it is what it is and they will tell you, they'll probably sell it at spot so you'd get less.
The problem is when you buy jewelry you are paying a big premium often for the "artistry" which you might not get back.
For fun try going back to a store to sell them back the diamond jewelry they just sold you...
Of course, I get the concept but to insinuate they are going to melt a beautiful piece of jewelry is clearly a deception. You know and I know they are going to put it in the case and put a retail price on it. I won't be buying jewelry ever again those days are over. Personally I don't even see how they keep their doors open.
I read a posting of a retired guy that used to run a shop for many years.
He said he did save up a bunch of jewelry and send it off for mass melt down.
He said some jewelry wasn't fully 14K depending on origin and so he'd have to haircut the price some to account for it in bulk.
Seemed legit.
He said he did save up a bunch of jewelry and send it off for mass melt down.
He said some jewelry wasn't fully 14K depending on origin and so he'd have to haircut the price some to account for it in bulk.
Seemed legit.
This is how I like to get my PMs. I had just checked out at the grocery store and I hear the young lady (She’s a sweetheart) tell a co-worker “I don’t think is a real quarter.” I asked if I could see it, gave her a “new” quarter, and walked out. I’ll buy junk at face value all day everyday!
Into the bag it goes!
Into the bag it goes!
I’m seeing an uptick of owners trying to offload, selling for under spot to move their gold.
For all of you that think PM's are the answer to collapse, I've come to the conclusion that maybe that ain't the case.
Given doomsday and that the l.c.s. will be swamped with people trying to sell their PM's, what do you think will happen? At some point the coin shop has to dump the excess back to the wholesaler. The wholesaler then has to send it back to the refiner, and it is at the refiner level that the buck stops. The refiner can refuse to take in additional PM's. According to one coin shop, the Canadian mint has already stopped taking additional consignments for 6 months. Your l.c.s. only has so much capital to buy back your PM's.
Here is one good example of an actual situation where there isn't panic. Just some guys trying to make it work in Argentina. Imagine what happens with panic:
Cause I don’t know : IF the value of the dollar were to crash, what metric is used to place a value on Gold??
A flaw in that thinking, being it is a doomsday event what makes you believe the coin shop and refinery still exists?
First you need to be a survivor, then you need to maintain. Gold and silver will serve a purpose.
Folks are starting to see the APRs on their credit cards, or, they did a 3-2-1 mortgage buyback rate, etc. eating their lunch. Selling gold won't save them, sir. It will just slow the band aid pulling. I sold my silver under spot but the conditions (and the deal) were right! It is amazing the jackasses that don't understand cost basis and capital gains. Maybe they will and maybe they won't see a 1099-B but I bet we will be able to hear the screaming from here (except for the bag holders) if and when they do! BTW, getting spot is nigh on impossible to get these days. I'm seeing pull backs of $0.90/oz to $3.00/oz on silver based on the exchange. And God forbid you bought at $30.00/oz after seeing the $32.50/oz high thinking it was gonna run. I kind of did but I'm all in for $15.44/ounce "cost basis" so I can take a little hit.
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In a eotwawki situation it will go like this….if you can’t eat it, drink it, shoot it or fuck it, it will be worthless…….
That’s why my end of world plan is call ‘Ass for Beans’ and not ‘Ass for gold’
My plan is called beans for ass but you do you…….
And that is the trillion $$$ question. I don't think anyone will know the answer until it happens. The above video is in a non-shtf situation, and it looks like the PM's/ bc crashed and burned for just simple inflation problems in Argentina.
I could see the PM's working where a state accepts PM's as a means of paying taxes/fees. Several states have already done this and there are more that have pending legislation......Utah and Texas have it in the law now.
I agree Iron and I'm just trying to get newbie's to think this stuff through before they may be taken in by outfits that have PM IRA'S. The Argentina video is a good practical illustration of what can happen in a relatively high inflation country. Not the shtf scenarios where PM shops paint a rosey picture.
Absolutely agree with you in that shtf scenario, shops will close down and you'll need to protect family/property. So few have PM's and that means you would have a tough time with barter.
I think PM's have a place in the portfolio,,,,,,,,,,,,Fiat is going to come crashing down......Too many banks, as pointed out a couple of days ago in the wsj, that are too highly leveraged. Just like the GFC that happened in 2007-2008.
If you are not in a big hurry and know a good local dealer that you work with, you'll be able to get spot on your silver if it's in perfect condition minted coins.
There is a plenty big enough spread for them to make a good living if you don't need a big pile of cash at once.
Fair point, sir but trust me when I say the deal was right! And I am not in a hurry but I do want the last of my debit gone as soon as possible!
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Anyone that thinks "paper" metal is a good idea is, well, not thinking things through. I believe I posted where silver is leverage 1 oz. of physical to 379 ozs. of paper. Not a good ratio in my mind but I'm sure those PM IRAs will do just fine?
I’m not gay, but a can of beans is a can of beans.
This. Exactly.
At least in ‘normal’ times. I’ve actually used gold and silver coins for higher value transactions with builders, expensive repairs/services, etc., but only with people that I know and trust.
Having an extended network of friends and professionals in the trades (including doctors, dentists, etc.) to barter with is helpful, and will be critical to surviving (thriving?) in a post-dollar US economy.
If you’re anywhere near San Antonio I’ll buy any silver you have remaining for $25(ish) per ounce.
Seriously.
What's old is new all over again.
The original "paper silver" and "paper gold" was the US currency bills (and other major western government currency bills).
No need to worry about all that pesky gold or silver, it's safe you can get it anytime you want.
Now the issue is very few traders could actually take delivery of silver even if they wanted to.
Where are they going to store it?
How are they going to provide security for it?
How much will all that cost in lost profits?
That part hasn't changed which is why most folks who are "actively investing" in gold / silver for regular trades and profits all do paper.
Physical gold is there for folks that need guaranteed stability like governments, central banks and folks that understand how quick the whole paper house of cards can fall.
Very kind of you, sir and I do mean that but I'm going to hold for now.
I think he is trying to low ball you, ask for $27. hope for $26. 
Well my “guy” is giving me $28.50 so…I think he is trying to low ball you, ask for $27. hope for $26.
Well my “guy” is giving me $28.50 so…
Spot seems to be $28.xx depending on the time of day, so that's pretty much essentially spot which isn't bad.
Where I would disagree, provided I understand what you are getting at, are those IRA's that "store" the actual physical metals, not paper. Most are a complete rip off and I caution anyone approaching this route.
You are correct on the leverage of paper to physical....... Though I suspect that it is actually much more on the paper side. The derivative side of this is very hidden.
Here's a follow up to the above video. He points out what I have feared coming here.....Lack of liquidity. The people have to spend the pesos as soon as they get them and the banks only allow 40 pesos withdrawal per day Maximum!! Check out the lines at the ATM's and the fact that they have actually lost most of their life savings. This is the catch 22 that the WEF and IMF will use to trap all of us............They just steal your savings using inflation:
Cash vs. Gold/Silver; how many in North America never touch these because everything is a form of plastic?
Although I can appreciate his Argentina test, he has to reflect and he mentions it briefly that he was trying to sell gold
In a cash restricted country. Think he needed to expand his test group size, also it would have been interesting to see if he could have cashed out from the hotel using bullion or at least made the effort to barter. Banks are not our friends.
Although I can appreciate his Argentina test, he has to reflect and he mentions it briefly that he was trying to sell gold
In a cash restricted country. Think he needed to expand his test group size, also it would have been interesting to see if he could have cashed out from the hotel using bullion or at least made the effort to barter. Banks are not our friends.
True but if the metal is only worth spot why would I let them hold it when I can hold it and convert it to cash, barter with it, or whatever I want whenever I want. I can hold it as spot goes up just as easily as they can.
With an IRA you cannot physically hold the PM until you reach the age for withdrawal ( age 69 1/2 I believe) and then you pay the taxes as regular income. Vaults located thru out the world store this stuff and get huge storage fees and the companies pitching the IRA's reap huge profits. Think selling numismatic stuff to the uneducated/ignorant (big premiums). Also, for the elites and wealthy, the vaults are used for security since their holdings can be in the millions. Try stuffing that under the mattress.
With an IRA you cannot physically hold the PM until you reach the age for withdrawal ( age 69 1/2 I believe) and then you pay the taxes as regular income. Vaults located thru out the world store this stuff and get huge storage fees and the companies pitching the IRA's reap huge profits. Think selling numismatic stuff to the uneducated/ignorant (big premiums). Also, for the elites and wealthy, the vaults are used for security since their holdings can be in the millions. Try stuffing that under the mattress.
59 1/2
Most of my paper gold is in Sprott Physical Gold Trust but for this fund, in order to withdraw it as physical gold, you have to pull it in increments = to a standard London gold trade bar, so 400 troy ounces minimum, which is going for ~$930K today.
Yeah, my pockets aren’t that deep… I have a significant investment there, well, significant to me, but nowhere near that much. My plan is to slowly start pulling out from my various investments (3-5% per year) starting next year when I can do so without penalty, and coincidentally I’ll be unemployed for the first time since the early ‘80s, so the tax penalty on withdrawals from my non-Roth investments will be lower as well.
We’re trying really hard to live just on my retirement checks, including any leisure activities and travel, so the plan is to use those draws from our IRAs, my 401K, and my TSP account for home improvements/repairs and to purchase more physical assets such as physical gold, silver, etc.
I’m gonna start looking into other paper gold funds to see if any allow physical gold withdrawals as something smaller than 400 oz at a time, LoL. Hell, even 1 kilo bars would be doable.
Edit: Looks like Goldco allows IRA distributions as cash or as precious metals…Would save the transaction fees on both sides. Anyone here use them as a Precious Metal fund/IRA? May call them mañana to see how their fees work and how their physical gold storage works; might be worth swapping some over.
One thing that I like about Sprott is that they only buy physical gold, silver, etc. No certificates at all, just physical precious metals stored alongside Canada’s reserve bullion. The fact that it’s not stored in the US is a bit of a concern to me though.
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Technically...
I created a solo401K. Bought a shitload of Canadian gold coins, and put them in a bank vault a few miles away leased by the 401K. I have the only key. $35/year storage fee.
I can touch them any time the bank is open for business. All IRS (sic) approved.
And now I need to research how to convert some of my investments to a solo401K.
I love that idea.
Edit: looks like it’s limited to self-employed folks… So, as a retiree, I guess I could create a business, probably an S-Corp, and pay myself from my retirement distributions, then put the annual limit into my solo 401K every year in any form I choose…including precious metals.
Not sure if a company that literally makes no money will be kosher w/the IRS though; I’d put 100% of my “salary”…up to $76.5K for 2024 with employer contributions…into the solo 401K. Beauty of it is, since I’ll be 59 1/2, I can withdraw it immediately with no penalty.
Researching to see if I could also roll other IRA or 401K/TSP funds in as well. Looks like I’d want to keep it under $250K though to avoid annual filings. If I can figure out a way to make this work, I’d roll all my paper gold and silver (have both PHYS and PSLV accounts in my 401K) into the solo 401K as physical gold and silver.
One Participant 401k Plans | Internal Revenue Service
Get answers to commonly asked questions about One Participant 401(k) plans (also known as Solo 401(k), Solo-k, Uni-k and One-participant k).
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That bank situation for storage would cause me many sleepless nights. Great that you can physically see the PM, but my concern would be what happened in 1933. In 33 that fucker fdr, thru executive order, confiscated peoples gold. Those that were wise to what was about to happen, shipped their pm's to Europe and offshore vaults. Others told fdr to fuck off and hid their gold. But those that had gold or other securities in U.S. bank safety deposit boxes had to have an irs agent present if they wanted to get into the boxes. If gold was found, it was confiscated.
That is one reason I don't like the idea of PM IRA's that are stored in vaults. If they decide to pull a roosevelt again, those vaults are a prime target.
Sprott has some interesting paper plays and that would be the route I would go if it all comes crashing down. Hell, just place some puts if you are sharp investor.
GDX, GDXJ have many benefits as etfs. Mining and energy are the plays that I am waiting for.
Look into a SEP (Simplifed Employee Pension). This is the peapod simple version but You start and own a company and You are employed by the company. Company pays you a fair wage (pay taxes, etc.) and at the end of the year any profit "made" can be bonused to you as a pension contribution. At least that's how my little brother (actually did it) explained it.And now I need to research how to convert some of my investments to a solo401K.
I love that idea.
Edit: looks like it’s limited to self-employed folks… So, as a retiree, I guess I could create a business, probably an S-Corp, and pay myself from my retirement distributions, then put the annual limit into my solo 401K every year in any form I choose…including precious metals.
Not sure if a company that literally makes no money will be kosher w/the IRS though; I’d put 100% of my “salary”…up to $76.5K for 2024 with employer contributions…into the solo 401K. Beauty of it is, since I’ll be 59 1/2, I can withdraw it immediately with no penalty.
Researching to see if I could also roll other IRA or 401K/TSP funds in as well. Looks like I’d want to keep it under $250K though to avoid annual filings. If I can figure out a way to make this work, I’d roll all my paper gold and silver (have both PHYS and PSLV accounts in my 401K) into the solo 401K as physical gold and silver.
One Participant 401k Plans | Internal Revenue Service
Get answers to commonly asked questions about One Participant 401(k) plans (also known as Solo 401(k), Solo-k, Uni-k and One-participant k).www.irs.gov
Here is the issue = The US GovernmentLook into a SEP (Simplifed Employee Pension). This is the peapod simple version but You start and own a company and You are employed by the company. Company pays you a fair wage (pay taxes, etc.) and at the end of the year any profit "made" can be bonused to you as a pension contribution. At least that's how my little brother (actually did it) explained it.
When the SEP IRA first came out, the benefits were terrific..... As time went on and the Government figured out a self employed person could make more $$$ with a SEP than with government offered paper.... The rules began to change.
No different than the Government confiscating gold.
The more the government knows about your money / finances / gold........ The more you stand to lose.
I transferred $700K of my old 401K into the Solo401K. You can also buy real estate with it, but you can't be involved in the maint/management of it.. purely "investment property". You could buy rentals and allow a management company to take care of it.
You can also make loans from it, just not IMMEDIATE family, parents/children.
You can just have a sole proprietorship, no "company" needed. But, you can only contribute NEW money into based on earnings from that business. Since you can transfer existing retirement funds into, you hopefully wouldn't need the contribution portion. I did only $2000 contribution last year into mine. You can sell canned beans for a few hundred dollars and that would count as a business.
I think our "government" seizing gold again is highly unlikely. Then again, I didn't think they would openly steal an election either and lock up all the peaceful protesters in prison.
I agree, storing gold in a bank deposit box isn't ideal, but it's the only other valid IRS option remaining tax preferred than these "Gold Vault" companies that are all either outright shams or have massive fees/costs for transactions and/or storage. I believe that GoldCo was offering 10% bonus for setting up a new account there, up to $100,000. How the fuck could the afford that unless they were fucking you on the back-end.
You can also make loans from it, just not IMMEDIATE family, parents/children.
You can just have a sole proprietorship, no "company" needed. But, you can only contribute NEW money into based on earnings from that business. Since you can transfer existing retirement funds into, you hopefully wouldn't need the contribution portion. I did only $2000 contribution last year into mine. You can sell canned beans for a few hundred dollars and that would count as a business.
I think our "government" seizing gold again is highly unlikely. Then again, I didn't think they would openly steal an election either and lock up all the peaceful protesters in prison.
I agree, storing gold in a bank deposit box isn't ideal, but it's the only other valid IRS option remaining tax preferred than these "Gold Vault" companies that are all either outright shams or have massive fees/costs for transactions and/or storage. I believe that GoldCo was offering 10% bonus for setting up a new account there, up to $100,000. How the fuck could the afford that unless they were fucking you on the back-end.
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Beans are for trading for ass. Gold is for buying the beans during the time period right before it’s bad enough to trade ass for beans.
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