GunsAmerica supports TR law suit against the Hide

#2
I doubt the facts are "confused." Modern litigators understand the importance of the media and the value of feeding false information to any outlet that will publish and G/A is a big forum. There is a modern concept among the Plaintiff's bar called "reptiling" and the use of the media in litigation is an intentional effort to sway opinions of the public and the jury pool. I think research on the Plaintiff's lawyers and their past lawsuits and trials, in a publication like "Jury Verdicts" and communicating with their prior opponents will yield some valuable information. Do research on "The Reptile" for Plaintiff's lawyers and see if Frank and Marc are being "reptiled." Best to know NOW.

A common theme with the reptile plaintiff lawyers in this situation . . . "TR.net is the victim of a bullying forum and the public and other reputable people in the industry need to be protected against people who run the Hide. If this could happen to TR, then it could happen to you. . . ."

My 2 cents. Just opinion.
 
#3
Make them pay, gentlemen. Those that support rooney, should be made to suffer as a result of their choices. Voting with our wallets has worked in every instance prior to this. Do everything you can to make sure that anyone that backs rooney is listed on every forum and blog you have access to.

Internet bullying? Who is gunsamerica kidding? They clearly operate under the same method as tacticalrifles does. Yell it from the mountain tops, and see to it they suffer.
 
#4
orkan said:
Make them pay, gentlemen. Those that support rooney, should be made to suffer as a result of their choices. Voting with our wallets has worked in every instance prior to this. Do everything you can to make sure that anyone that backs rooney is listed on every forum and blog you have access to.

Internet bullying? Who is gunsamerica kidding? They clearly operate under the same method as tacticalrifles does. Yell it from the mountain tops, and see to it they suffer.
Click to expand...

Great post. I agree.
 
#5
I just don't understand it. Do this few people actually understand what a proper rifle build should look like?

Forget snipershide, forget all the people here, forget spartan, forget everything else. Just look at that one video where the TR rifle is being repaired. If that rifle in the video truly was delivered to that customer in that state... the bed job alone is incriminating enough to warrant a COMPLETE refund for that customer.

How can people at gunsamerica see that and ACTUALLY back TR?
 
#6
Before choosing sides have you contacted the owner of said forum in question to see what his side of the story is? It seems as though you chose the side of a friend and used your platform to push your opinion without taking in the facts and are asking readers to do the same. In the interest of full disclosure if you’re going to cover a story like this it would appear much more neutral and genuine if you at least looked at the examples and incidents which are in direct contradiction of tacticalrifles.net claims. Reviewing the claims of both sides it seems this wasn’t an isolated incident regarding the quality of a tacticalrifles.net rifle. I have no dog in this fight and have been following this objectively, as such you paint a different picture with your article than what actual facts portray.
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This was my response to the article, its currently awaiting moderation so we'll see if its actually posted. It would be ironic if it is not as that would mean GA practices the same actions tactical rifles is falsely alledging the hide of doing.


Disclaimer: I didn't make that comment to stir the pot or instigate. My intent is that after reading my response people will google the incident and let the facts speak for themselves rather than just take this putz's word for it.
 
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#12
I will be responding to this trash, whether they actually do or not, this is not over.

He makes the veiled claim I was on the video... false. No where near it.

He claims David Rooney's account was deleted, false. He never made one and deleting an account does not block. In fact since 2008 when I protected Tactical Rifles on here against a disgruntled worker, David Rooney has NEVER made any attempt to contact me. Unless you count the letter from his attorney in 2010 threatening to sue the site then. He knows how to reach me and in fact was standing 3ft from me at SHOT last year. David Rooney is playing the victim and this will back fire as the system doesn't work like he thinks.

Paul calls me a Parasite, that is not gonna end well, he refers to me as an arm chair expert, well I will put my resume against his any day.

This opens up the door. I am crafting a response and don't be surprised Mr Helinski if your deposition is not taken as well. See how you like it.

Nope, we're on it...
 
#13
Was that a setting the record askew/straight blog post, or an NRA add?

Lots of accusations in that blog though and many of them I would think could be clarified in discovery.
 
#14
as someone else pointed out,

bit of libel printed by Paul Helinski against me, he falsely attacks my character in this situation while he knowingly failed to get my side of the story as a true writer would have.

In fact most of the other blogs out there asked our side of thing and even contacted TR's lawyer... this might get interesting
 
#17
Lowlight said:
as someone else pointed out,

bit of libel printed by Paul Helinski against me, he falsely attacks my character in this situation while he knowingly failed to get my side of the story as a true writer would have.

In fact most of the other blogs out there asked our side of thing and even contacted TR's lawyer... this might get interesting
Click to expand...


Hey that is perfectly acceptable in the world of journalism! Well that is if you are in Putins Russia.
 
#19
When you depose Mr Helinski I hope you can ask him how much add revenue GA gets or hopes to get from TR. I also hope you ask him to site his specific examples of when his publication has ever said anything bad about an advertiser.
 
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#21
So, wait....

They want to sue SH because they think the voice on the video is Frank's, yet TR.net named Mark Souley (sp?) on their initial lawsuit because he was the voice/gunsmith from the video?

What?

Either way, no purchase EVER from GunsAmerica. All this is doing is showing people with a lot of disposable income (if I told you what I spent a year in rifles/ammo/components you'd fucking faint) where not to spend it.
 
#22
The commenter, Wayne Anderson is pretty smart and old Paul is completely blindsided by these facts of the matter and has to completely avoid them.

He is doing the exact same thing he is accusing me of and even writes as much in his blog post,
As many of you know, at GunsAmerica we don’t allow a “free flow of ideas” from armchair experts who comment negatively on every story.
Click to expand...

Do as I say, not as I do... then tries to say it will cost me LOL

They'll figure it out the hard way and he clearly admits that they are hoping to find an "ah ha" moment through discovery / deposition, the idea is they can throw a bunch of nonsense against the wall hoping something will stick.

Clearly David Rooney loaded his lip and lucky I have the unedited version saved where he accuses me of being the voice on the video. Conspiracy much...
 
#23
The BBB gives them a "C" rating now, however when I was researching custom gun makers in early January the rating was a "F". Dave must have resolved some issues, or threatened to sue them. It was that rating that first made me suspicious and doing a little more research I found the Hide and the reviews. Those reviews only served to confirm my original suspicions. You have to try pretty hard to get a "F" from the BBB.

Lowlight, you may want to get a rating history from the BBB, if that is possible. Could help make the point that TR was not singled out by the Hide.
 
#24
Hmmm, where to start?

I've know Frank since late 2001, when we had member numbers mine was in the low 300s.

He's been to my home, we shot the Carlos Hathcock Match together numerous times and I made the first 3 runs of SH Kopfjaeger Team shirts.

Frank has always been open to helping new guys get started.

2 young active duty members of SH were the first recipients of care packages generated from the sale of the Kopfjaeger Team shirts.

I consider Frank a friend and when I was actively shooting I found Snipers Hide to be a great place to learn and share information.

Frank has come a long way from his days of fast roping out of the helicopter ride in front of Walmart and I'm happy to have been able to watch his success in his chosen field.

That's all I got,
Pete
 
#26
Parrot! I'm insulted. Is that the best he can do? HA HA!
Just wanted to say Thanks to Snippers Hide and the wealth of info available here.
I made a donation to Mr. Soulie today and will donate to Snipers Hide if more funds are needed.
 
#28
Lowlight said:
"As for David’s products, the internet is full of “bad reviews” from disgruntled customers just like this guy who have unreasonable expectations from a manufacturer."
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This cat over at Guns America has some serious stones.
For $8,000 (I don't know if that is right or not, just read that total somewhere) that rifle had better be as close to perfect as a human can make it.....hell, it had better be nearly perfect for half that amount.
That's a sack full of money in my book. We all work hard for our money and we try to get the best for our money that we can.

For someone to insinuate that whoever paid ANYTHING for that piece of crap (much less multiple thousands of dollars) had unrealistic expectations really burns me up. That is complete BS and he ought to be ashamed for even entertaining that thought for one second in his brain before he typed it on that website.
 
#31
Hey helinski...

stopit.jpg
 
#32
So, Mr Rooney plays the victim card then exploits the media to proclaim a one sided story to the brainless masses..........sounds remarkably similar to a groups tactics trying to abolish gun rights. Hypocrisy at its finest. It's a denial of personal responsibility and an absolute outrage to a group of people that hold personal responsibility to the highest regards.
 
#33
Lowlight said:
You're all parrots and as for the unhappy customers

"As for David’s products, the internet is full of “bad reviews” from disgruntled customers just like this guy who have unreasonable expectations from a manufacturer."
Click to expand...
I guess they think its unreasonable after sinking 8 grand on a rifle that it should look new and perform new!
 
#35
No one is ever going to go and buy a TR.net rifle because of anything GunsAmerica says or does.

However, droves of people will NOT buy a TR.net rifle because of what TR.net and GA say and do.

Great marketing plan there geniuses.
 
#39
bdubb said:
Was that a setting the record askew/straight blog post, or an NRA add?

Lots of accusations in that blog though and many of them I would think could be clarified in discovery.
Click to expand...

It felt to me like the typical cheerleading style of NRA advertisement we see so much of these days, mixed with some sour-grapes cry-babying about Sniper's Hide. Honestly, other than my love for this site on a personal level, I really have no dog in this fight. The Internet is full of opinions: some good, some bad; some true, some fictitious; some necessary, and some that are relatively pointless.

The way I see it, if this plaintiff from Tactical Rifles (who I know little of, including his products, for good or bad) has some issue with opinions that are given on the internet (and apparently this site in particular), then that's just the way things are. If he wants his company to have a good reputation, he'll have to work for it (which doesn't even always mean bending over backwards to satisfy an unsatisfiable customer). If his company doesn't have a good reputation, there's also probably a reason for it. Regardless, a few opinions one way or another won't likely sway most users toward/away from his products. There are plenty of products I've purchased (and been satisfied with) that have received negative reviews on one site or another. For example, Chuckhawks website did a really derogatory article on the Tikka rifles, and I love the Tikka I own. The smart consumer always looks to multiple sources for information before making a major purchase.

I may not be seeing the whole picture here, but from what I see it seems kind of petty to file a lawsuit over the fact that you don't like the opinions about your products that were expressed on a web forum… that's just the nature of things in the technology age!
 
#40
Lowlight said:
You're all parrots and as for the unhappy customers

"As for David’s products, the internet is full of “bad reviews” from disgruntled customers just like this guy who have unreasonable expectations from a manufacturer."
Click to expand...
After having read the lengthy "article" published by GA, I'm convinced the GA's writer went to the same school most of our politico's go to, they can say a lot of words, but really don't say anything-quite and art, lawyers and criminals usually attend the same school. Their claim [GA] that the hide issues a number of screen names to vendors to shill their products-and attack competitors would have more teeth if they would actually state the screen names and who they were issued to. I have a feeling if they actually had this knowledge they would be screaming it at the top of their lungs! It would be like saying you took a 100 photos of Big Foot, but fail to produce even one for examination. I challenge them to give examples of the "shills" screen names, or examples of those threatened for saying something good about TR's products, etc. Otherwise they are just making noise, with nothing at all to back up their claims! I challenge GA or TR to publish the list of the shills screen names, who these people are "shilling" for, the name or screen name of those threated for saying something good about TR, without doing this , 'you got nothing'.
 
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#41
A very emotion-filled article that has little to do with the actual issue. Apparently donating an undisclosed amount of money to the NRA gives you a hall pass for providing the goods and services that your customers are paying you for?
 
#42
Aside from knowingly levying a false attack on me, what they claim on a legal level is the equivalent of

me walking out MY front door, spitting on MY sidewalk towards the mailbox. Getting out my mail and finding a check from a vendor along with a handful of junk mail. Then, jay walking across MY driveway towards the garbage can throwing away the junk mail but keeping the check.

They are suing cause they saw me spit on the sidewalk and jaywalk and then adding in I threw away the junk mail because the vendor who sent the check asked me too.

As if it's some ah ha moment
 
#46
pawprint2 said:
Their claim [GA] that the hide issues a number of screen names to vendors to shill their products-and attack competitors would have more teeth if they would actually state the screen names and who they were issued to. I have a feeling if they actually had this knowledge they would be screaming it at the top of their lungs! ...give examples of the "shills" screen names, or examples of those threatened for saying something good about TR's products, etc. Otherwise they are just making noise, with nothing at all to back up their claims! I challenge GA or TR to publish the list of the shills screen names, who these people are "shilling" for, the name or screen name of those threated for saying something good about TR, without doing this , 'you got nothing'.
Click to expand...

shankster is really Kenny Lin.
 
#50
Support

Owner of 1911.com here (down right now, so no I'm not pimping myself), for those familiar with us, we are down right now to do frivolous litigation ourselves but coming back in the next few months with some massive development.

Frank has our full support.

I've got a hell of a lot of experience in civil litigation - and thus far have won every case they have thrown at me.

So long as SH takes this to the end, TR will get their ass handed to them. It may take a lot longer than anyone anticipates, but see it to the end.

As for GunsAmerica - I highly, highly recommend you contact the sponsors.

I already have, inquiring from an official position to Springfield and FNH why their products are being promoted and they are paying organizations that support frivolous litigation against firearm companies. If I get a response from either, I will post it here as well as elsewhere.

I tried posting on GA as well as others here knowing it would never get published. Ironic, isn't it?

I fully encourage GA to try to sue me when they start to lose sponsors.
Not my first rodeo and I wouldn't mind bankrupting the company...
 
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