Hard Use Rifle Made in USA?

[sea2summit]

Aluminum is actually a poor conductor of heat (ex: Al decking, bleachers, etc), so it's never been an issue for me (own an ATR), and I live in the hill country of TX.

I don't think that's correct. Put an icecube on one end of a chasis system and I bet you can feel it at the other end.

 

[Baddog 0302]

View attachment 7351974

Just because something does cost $$$$$$$, that's 3 shit pots full of money, dosen't mean it won't meet the needs of 95% of all shooters.

 

[Ledzep]

Oh God here we go.

 

[srt-4_uk]

This thread is about hard use rifles. Not rifles that sometimes extract and eject from a bench.

 

[Kamerad]

Just because something does cost $$$$$$$, that's 3 shit pots full of money, dosen't mean it won't meet the needs of 95% of all shooters.

There are a wealth of options all up and down the price scale. @Steelhead may not have been referring to your Savage. Or he was!

 

[Dthomas3523]

Just because something does cost $$$$$$$, that's 3 shit pots full of money, dosen't mean it won't meet the needs of 95% of all shooters.

It doesn’t meet the criteria of this thread though.

 

[striped1]

GAP Precision?

 

[Matt in Virginia]

Very nice rifle! Shot and handled both KRG and AI. Each has pros and cons but I liked the SOTIC the best. Personal choice only.

FWIW & IMHO,
I also like the SOTIC. I have two. Too few have a chance to see one much less shoot one... It's my favorite rifle since my AI AW 2.0. Just a LOT lighter...

Regards, Matt.

 

[GBMaryland]

I like the TRG, and the KRG is really a clone of it. Great option...

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

Looks like the thread is starting to gain a little more traction so maybe time is good for me to ask the question.

What is "Hard Use" in your individual opinions and thoughts?
Just trying to get a threshold for discussion.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[308pirate]

Those facts are true, so it conducts well, and I misused the term. I guess what I was trying to say is that it does not hold its heat very well due to its lower mass, so relative to other metals it is able to cool much quicker.

Aluminum's thermal and electrical conductivity has nothing to do with mass or its density

JFC.............next thing you'll tell us is that nitriding is a coating that makes steel black and slick

 

[Eric32]

@THEIS

I would say a good baseline line of hard use. Would be the ability to conduct a mammoth OR Competition Dynamics or someother event along those lines with out cleaning any part of the action. And trigger.

 

[deersniper]

Hard use and somewhat proven US made? MRAD

Even though you know you should buy the OG of hard use rifles

 

[TacticalPlinker]

I have the Whiskey3 Gen6 Chassis. Took the whole thing apart . I'm sure it's durable. It's well made and quality. That being said , in my opinion, designs like the MRAD "MAY" be more resistant to getting beat up during real hard use. There's just two halves . The KRG is a design with more parts bolted together . I'm not military , just taking into account the two platforms design. I have not heard of any issues with the SOTIC not holding up. I happen to love mine wrapped around my T3X

 

[Krob95]

AI has AINA in VA, that’s American. Buy an AI

 

[THEIS]

@THEIS

I would say a good baseline line of hard use. Would be the ability to conduct a mammoth OR Competition Dynamics or someother event along those lines with out cleaning any part of the action. And trigger.

Hi Eric,

What makes one of those type of competitions "Hard Use"?

I completely understand what you are saying but what I am trying to get people to speak of is exactly what they see as "Hard Use" down to the molecular level instead of generalization level.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Eric32]

Fair enough, my brain automatically pairs the term "hard use" to practical events. But giving it more thought "Hard Use" really doesn't give a whole lot of definition it's more based on a single person's definition of level of abuse towards the product. And that correlates directly levels of experience in difficult enviorments.

Basically you right.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

I do not think there is a right of wrong.

I think it is just so easy for use to give REAL practice examples as you did but for some reason putting our finger on exact "things" is when the subject gets daunting, lol.

Would be nice to see this thread morph into a lot of exact things we all can put our fingers on.

Example..
1. At what height of dropping rifle is the threshold?
2. At what surface should that drop be onto?

Nothing is wrong or right, just dots on a data map.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[deersniper]

Hard use for me = military track record.


For all the problems with mil solicitations, use and abuse of systems does bring up shortcomings/problems and fixes to those.

 

[Matt in Virginia]

Hard Use?

I've heard that slogan for years and it's generally in the form of ad copy... My grandfather used to remind us that "you can destroy an anvil if you beat on it long enough". Personally I go out of my way to shield my rifle. Granted, I'm just another shooter not an operator... Though the trip from the bench to your rifle case, and then to the back of your SUV can be murder...

Regards, Matt.

 

[Winny94]

People will bitch regardless. Look how many people complained because the TriggerTech 2 stage took so long to hit the market. As far as I know, they didnt take pre orders and still catch shit for it.
Bottom line, people suck.

The lesson here is to not "release" a product until it's released if possible.
The tradeshow release schedule is antiquated and unnecessary now.

 

[Jeremy45]

Hi,

Looks like the thread is starting to gain a little more traction so maybe time is good for me to ask the question.

What is "Hard Use" in your individual opinions and thoughts?
Just trying to get a threshold for discussion.

Sincerely,
Theis

Hard use for me would be the following:
Rides around a ranch in a buggy without a case. (wedged between the seat and plastic dash for quick access). It gets climbed over by kids/dogs in this position frequently along with whatever is on them.
In and out of vehicles frequently
Drops from 3-4ft are to be expected and not rezeroed - onto dirt/grass/mesquite/county roads etc.
Drops from 6-12ft may happen but should not expected - ok to rezero at this point
Will run in fine dust blown around by 30+ mph winds
Will run wet
Will run cold (15deg and up, not below zero)
Will run in hot weather (120deg)
Will run in moderate amounts of mud
Capable of going 300+ rounds between cleanings
Will be shot from unconventional positions
Will be shot slung unsupported
Will be shot off a bipod
Will ruck in rough terrain, high desert, rocky areas, wet and damp areas and may not be cleaned or completely dry for days.

I'm sure this isn't true "hard use" but I've seen a lot of stuff go down in these conditions or break or get locked up. It's unforgiving in that you can always get it clean or dry or wiped down and if you do it's nasty again in 5 min.

Thanks,
Jeremy

 

[Jeremy45]

Hard Use?

I've heard that slogan for years and it's generally in the form of ad copy... My grandfather used to remind us that "you can destroy an anvil if you beat on it long enough". Personally I go out of my way to shield my rifle. Granted, I'm just another shooter not an operator... Though the trip from the bench to your rifle case, and then to the back of your SUV can be murder...

Regards, Matt.

I would be the total opposite. I'm not an operation but I don't want to have to treat my rifle any different than the rest of the gear/tools I am using at a given time. I want to close the scope caps and go. I don't intentionally bang stuff around and I secure it when I can but it's not a priority for me by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[BufordTJustice]

Hard use for me would be the following:
Rides around a ranch in a buggy without a case. (wedged between the seat and plastic dash for quick access). It gets climbed over by kids/dogs in this position frequently along with whatever is on them.
In and out of vehicles frequently
Drops from 3-4ft are to be expected and not rezeroed - onto dirt/grass/mesquite/county roads etc.
Drops from 6-12ft may happen but should not expected - ok to rezero at this point
Will run in fine dust blown around by 30+ mph winds
Will run wet
Will run cold (15deg and up, not below zero)
Will run in hot weather (120deg)
Will run in moderate amounts of mud
Capable of going 300+ rounds between cleanings
Will be shot from unconventional positions
Will be shot slung unsupported
Will be shot off a bipod
Will ruck in rough terrain, high desert, rocky areas, wet and damp areas and may not be cleaned or completely dry for days.

I'm sure this isn't true "hard use" but I've seen a lot of stuff go down in these conditions or break or get locked up. It's unforgiving in that you can always get it clean or dry or wiped down and if you do it's nasty again in 5 min.

Thanks,
Jeremy

This is my rifles almost exactly! Except maybe longer Rd count between cleanings

 

[Deleted member 113831]

Hard use for me would be the following:
Rides around a ranch in a buggy without a case. (wedged between the seat and plastic dash for quick access). It gets climbed over by kids/dogs in this position frequently along with whatever is on them.
In and out of vehicles frequently
Drops from 3-4ft are to be expected and not rezeroed - onto dirt/grass/mesquite/county roads etc.
Drops from 6-12ft may happen but should not expected - ok to rezero at this point
Will run in fine dust blown around by 30+ mph winds
Will run wet
Will run cold (15deg and up, not below zero)
Will run in hot weather (120deg)
Will run in moderate amounts of mud
Capable of going 300+ rounds between cleanings
Will be shot from unconventional positions
Will be shot slung unsupported
Will be shot off a bipod
Will ruck in rough terrain, high desert, rocky areas, wet and damp areas and may not be cleaned or completely dry for days.

I'm sure this isn't true "hard use" but I've seen a lot of stuff go down in these conditions or break or get locked up. It's unforgiving in that you can always get it clean or dry or wiped down and if you do it's nasty again in 5 min.

Thanks,
Jeremy

Rifles that meet your exact definition have existed for over 100 years. It is a Marlin 336.

 

[z7.jled]

If I were to have “1 bolt gun to take into battle” I’d probably want an AI.

if i wanted a bolt gun that would not fail me, mrad, and ai come to mind, but I also bet you could call LRI and describe the need and never be disappointed, a M40 clone on a
Mausingfield or something similar with the bedding treatment would probably not fail any more than an AI.
Honestly, who has broken a rifle and thought it was because it wasn’t a hard use rifle?

 

[Graywolf.260]

 

[scharfschutze762]

I know of several well known commercial "sniper rifles" that could'nt pass the the minimum TOP 3-2-045 mil testing to even qualify for a submission.
One of them rhymes with Salvage.

 

[carbonbased]

Love the gold AK. I’ll never get why my boys love skins in COD.

 

[carbonbased]

If you wanted a “cold hard-use” rifle made anywhere (I know you don’t but others might), maybe this: T3x ARCTIC (wiki)

“The rifles are mainly used for self-defence against large North American carnivores like polar bears, and for personal survival as regional surveillance missions are often conducted for extended periods in remote areas, requiring the Rangers to hunt for food. Further the rifles are expected to operate in temperatures ranging from −51 to 39 °C (−60 to 102 °F) with moderate to high humidity and be resistant to corrosion from long-term exposure to salt laden air and water.”

I have no personal experience with this rifle. I do know extreme cold breaks all kinds of “tough” things (I’ve lived in ND/MN, record low in MN is -60F). I’ve dealt with -92F windchills; in these conditions the less exposed metal on a tool, the better.

People keep bringing up AI, and now me, so I’ll shut up now. Back to reg sch programming.

Edit: for polar bear & grizzly, I’d sure want more than a .308/6.5CM/7.62x51!!! Shot placement be damned. But shooting a rabbit/deer with a .375 H&H would sure make MOAR of a mess of things. Trade offs…

 

[scharfschutze762]

If you wanted a “cold hard-use” rifle made anywhere (I know you don’t but others might), maybe this: T3x ARCTIC (wiki)

“The rifles are mainly used for self-defence against large North American carnivores like polar bears, and for personal survival as regional surveillance missions are often conducted for extended periods in remote areas, requiring the Rangers to hunt for food. Further the rifles are expected to operate in temperatures ranging from −51 to 39 °C (−60 to 102 °F) with moderate to high humidity and be resistant to corrosion from long-term exposure to salt laden air and water.”

I have no personal experience with this rifle. I do know extreme cold breaks all kinds of “tough” things (I’ve lived in ND/MN, record low in MN is -60F). I’ve dealt with -92F windchills; in these conditions the less exposed metal on a tool, the better.

People keep bringing up AI, and now me, so I’ll shut up now. Back to reg sch programming.

Thats a cool looking rifle.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

If you wanted a “cold hard-use” rifle made anywhere (I know you don’t but others might), maybe this: T3x ARCTIC (wiki)

“The rifles are mainly used for self-defence against large North American carnivores like polar bears, and for personal survival as regional surveillance missions are often conducted for extended periods in remote areas, requiring the Rangers to hunt for food. Further the rifles are expected to operate in temperatures ranging from −51 to 39 °C (−60 to 102 °F) with moderate to high humidity and be resistant to corrosion from long-term exposure to salt laden air and water.”

I have no personal experience with this rifle. I do know extreme cold breaks all kinds of “tough” things (I’ve lived in ND/MN, record low in MN is -60F). I’ve dealt with -92F windchills; in these conditions the less exposed metal on a tool, the better.

People keep bringing up AI, and now me, so I’ll shut up now. Back to reg sch programming.

Edit: for polar bear & grizzly, I’d sure want more than a .308/6.5CM/7.62x51!!! Shot placement be damned. But shooting a rabbit/deer with a .375 H&H would sure make MOAR of a mess of things. Trade offs…

When have you shot a bear with a 308 and thought it wasn’t enough?

 

[carbonbased]

When have you shot a bear with a 308 and thought it wasn’t enough?

One of the largest bears ever shot was killed by a single shot .22LR. When have you shot a bear with a .22LR and thought it wasn’t enough?

I jest.

Some people think the 30-06 is sort of the floor for 1500lbs+ brown bear & polars, but the Alaska Fish & Game think that a 270/7mm-08/308/30-06 are just fine. One reads some natives use my favorite caliber, the .204, for this activity.

I have never shot any bear. I was going by what my elderly father used on a hunt in AK. I should have remembered reading that Walter D.M. Bell shot about 800 elephants with Rigby-made 7x57mm (.275 Rigby) rifles and round nose 173 grain military ammo.

So I am wrong, and thanks for pointing that out. I learned something today, which makes this a good day. I guess I’ve heard one too many scary brown bear stories from my dad and that made me think I need a TOW missile launcher or something for AK bear.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

Not too hard to kill grizz

Natives use whatever they have

Never seen a 275 rigby